Dragon Ball Super |OT6| Put your back into it.

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Alone and training in a place with no special conditions like King Ka's or the time chamber?

Yes.
Tien was able to stay, somewhat, relevant the whole series doing just that.Piccolo and Goku got a lot stronger between the end of Dragon Ball and the start of Z with regular training. At least in terms of techniques. Everyone had a huge leap between Radditz and the arrival of the other Saiyans while doing regular training as well and they were on Earth.
 
Did we know 17 started a family prior to this episode?

It had been mentioned by Toriyama in an interview. This is the first confirmation that it's actual canon though, considering how some of Toriyama's comments from interviews have been contradicted by later material or other later interviews, so they aren't that reliable.
 
Well Slaythe you finally got that Android 17 episode you've been wanting and it was a damn good one too.

Honestly I'm glad to see his GT appearance finally abolished for good, no more do we have to have our last memory of 17 being what he was in GT.
 
I don't longer care about it. This retarded episode ruined the arc for me and possibility the show as well.

It breaks every single arc after the Cell one.
I don't know what the fuck were they thinking.
17 has been training for 10 fucking years. In terms of DBZ logic 10 years is a long fucking time. 17 was young and already pretty goddamned powerful...remember Uub is just a kid and yet equal to Majin Buu.
 
so 17's not convinced yet, Vegeta hasn't been convinced yet, we haven't even seen Tien or Roshi yet, and there's still gotta be the Gohan/Piccolo episode(s)...
so it's looking like there will be 30+ episodes between the defeat of Zamasu and the start of this tournament. jeez.

Why goku out here lying about prize money lol
it's what convinced 18, I guess he figured he'd give it a shot.
easier than saying "everything gets erased by some child god if we lose"
 
I like this version of 17's personality a lot more than the OG Z version.

Cool episode. The fight was fairly fluid, though the models were kinda hit & miss for a bit.
 
so 17's not convinced yet, Vegeta hasn't been convinced yet, we haven't even seen Tien or Roshi yet, and there's still gotta be the Gohan/Piccolo episode(s)...
so it's looking like there will be 30+ episodes between the defeat of Zamasu and the start of this tournament. jeez.


it's what convinced 18, I guess he figured he'd give it a shot.
easier than saying "everything gets erased by some child god if we lose"
I think it's best we'll split this arc up in "The tournament recruitment arc" and the actual tournament. It's fine by me though, I like these recruitment episodes.

Also, we're absolutely getting a timeskip if Uub is mentioned.
 
Derp, didn't realise a new thread for DB Super had started. Subbed!

Here's hoping they continue to build other universes. That glimpse into Universe 11 really brought the series to another level.
 
Tien was able to stay, somewhat, relevant the whole series doing just that.Piccolo and Goku got a lot stronger between the end of Dragon Ball and the start of Z with regular training. At least in terms of techniques. Everyone had a huge leap between Radditz and the arrival of the other Saiyans while doing regular training as well and they were on Earth.
Those gains pale in comparison to 17's. They are not even comparable.
 
Just watched, what an episode! This had heart and personality. 17 was so compelling. His disinterest in showing off his family then finally showing Goku. Goku punching as he described his tough son. Bringing up Trunks and Goten was smart use of characters who aren't participating in the tournament. 17's fight scenes. The secluded forest spot with the Minotarous reminded me of that adventure feel you get exploring the overworld in Dragon Quest games. This episode was SO GOOD

I'm so hyped for 17's potential!
 
I like this version of 17's personality a lot more than the OG Z version.

Cool episode. The fight was fairly fluid, though the models were kinda hit & miss for a bit.
He's somewhat humble now compared to his Z appearance but can still bring it if he needs to. Seems he has found his place and i'm glad both himself and his sis have moved on from their shitty ordeal and are back in society.
 
Android 17 is the ultimate lifeform. Dr. Gero really knew his stuff.

I'm suprised at 17's indifference to the Tournament of Power. Very interesting stance considering his power. Really hard to get a read on him right now. I'm liking where this is going. Really can't wait to see how Goku compels him to fight now.
 
Good episode but
I'm really surprised by 17's strength, it's absolutely shocking. SSG isn't special at all, saiyan transformations are overrated, that's one problem with Super. I mean they did it right with Frieza turning gold and Rose Goku Black, that's special, but man it is what it is. I gotta adapt to that.
 
Yeah SSBlue has been pretty lame overall if even 17 surpassed it. Like what the hell lol. Supers power jumps and scaling are ridiculous but hey lets see how it goes.
 
I think it's best we'll split this arc up in "The tournament recruitment arc" and the actual tournament. It's fine by me though, I like these recruitment episodes.
yeah, I guess. the way the tournament initially came about though, it seemed like it was gonna just be a dumb little filler arc till the next big villain came into the picture. the series is going down a whole new weird path now, which I'm digging, but I just want the tournament to start already :\
 
I really don't see the problem with SSBlue getting trivialized. Vegeta thought SSJ1 was hot shit at the start of the Cell arc before 18 destroyed his dignity. This just reinforces the theory that Goku is getting a new form this arc.
 
I really don't see the problem with SSBlue getting trivialized. Vegeta thought SSJ1 was hot shit at the start of the Cell arc before 18 destroyed his dignity. This just reinforces the theory that Goku is getting a new form this arc.
Also "Ascended SSJ" (with Refined SSJ1 and SSJ2) and SSJ2 (SSJ3). Plus Trunks and Goten trivializing the entire Transformation.

Yea i'm still on the new form train especially when he showed Super Saiyan Blue with Kaioken already.
 
I'm honestly pretty happy with power levels and forms mattering less in Super. They were always the least fun part of DBZ.

Anywho, this was a fun episode, and people fighting at sundown is my jam.

 
Good episode but
I'm really surprised by 17's strength, it's absolutely shocking. SSG isn't special at all, saiyan transformations are overrated, that's one problem with Super. I mean they did it right with Frieza turning gold and Rose Goku Black, that's special, but man it is what it is. I gotta adapt to that.
That makes little sense since 17 was stronger than Frieza, the original strongest being in the universe, and curb stomped Super Saiyan Vegeta after three years of training. So saying Super makes Super Saiyan transformations less special is just strange since Z did that decades ago. Even then, 17 is still lower than a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan.

Yeah SSBlue has been pretty lame overall if even 17 surpassed it. Like what the hell lol. Supers power jumps and scaling are ridiculous but hey lets see how it goes.
He didn't surpassed it, or did you missed the part when 17 said that Goku could beat him at any time.

I really don't see the problem with SSBlue getting trivialized. Vegeta thought SSJ1 was hot shit at the start of the Cell arc before 18 destroyed his dignity. This just reinforces the theory that Goku is getting a new form this arc.
It's really isn't being trivial since 17 admitted that Goku could have beaten him at any time. Are people purposely ignoring this or Goku saying he was going to hold back so he doesn't kill 17?
 
I really don't see the problem with SSBlue getting trivialized. Vegeta thought SSJ1 was hot shit at the start of the Cell arc before 18 destroyed his dignity. This just reinforces the theory that Goku is getting a new form this arc.
Every accomplishment becomes common after an arc or two. From doing the kamehameha to climbing Korin's tower to training with Kami to super saiyan 1-3. In a year you had Goku go from a power level of less than 400 to defeating Frieza and a chapter later Trunks made that look like nothing.

Those gains pale in comparison to 17's. They are not even comparable.
There are also jumps like Trunks going from SSJ2 level to SSJ blue level in a couple of fights in Super. Characters are as strong as they need to be for the fights to make sense.
 
Man if they keep up some of this crap in Super it may get rated worse than GT by me.


17 in no way should be even close to SSJ2 levels and I could care less what any 17 fans think. At least GT is consistent.
 
Man if they keep up some of this crap in Super it may get rated worse than GT by me.


17 in no way should be even close to SSJ2 levels and I could care less what any 17 fans think. At least GT is consistent.
Insane power levels have been more damaging than beneficial to the world of Dragon Ball. It's good non-Saiyans can be important. I hope 17 has no transformation at all. I'm glad he
can hang with Goku without any transformations


It is weird how uneventful SSJG and SSJBlue ended up being, but an arc where 17, 18, Krillin, Tien and Piccolo can be relevant is more important to me than an arc where SSJ Blue set Goku and Vegeta miles upon miles ahead of all characters except for the Big Bad of the arc
 
Insane power levels have been more damaging than beneficial to the world of Dragon Ball. It's good non-Saiyans can be important. I hope 17 has no transformation at all. I'm glad he can hang with Goku


It is weird how uneventful SSJG and SSJBlue ended up being, but an arc where 17, 18, Krillin, Tien and Piccolo can be relevant is more important to me than an arc where SSJ Blue set Goku and Vegeta miles upon miles ahead of all characters except for the Big Bad of the arc
seriously. It's not like consistent storylines or worldbuilding have ever been a strength of DB anyways
 
Insane power levels have been more damaging than beneficial to the world of Dragon Ball. It's good non-Saiyans can be important. I hope 17 has no transformation at all. I'm glad he can hang with Goku


It is weird how uneventful SSJG and SSJBlue ended up being, but an arc where 17, 18, Krillin, Tien and Piccolo can be relevant is more important to me than an arc where SSJ Blue set Goku and Vegeta miles upon miles ahead of all characters except for the Big Bad of the arc
The problem is it's completely unbelievable at this point that those characters could ever get that strong. Introducing new characters is something they have always done in order to keep it going.


Just like in Super outside of Golden Frieza we've had pretty much all new characters as far as fighters. It's basically been how it's gone forever and there is no reason for them to change it up now. They have the tools to make the old characters relevant without needing them to be all-powerful but going the opposite route doesn't make the show more interesting. It does the opposite and damages it.


The best example being that even though Krillin being substantially weaker than Gohan beat him with a technique since the rules didn't need you to physically destroy your opponent, rather knock them off the stage making it objective based. Going that route would have been far far more interesting and instead it just makes it a chore and painful to watch. Even GT didn't make that mistake.



Blue never really felt like (to me anyway) a well defined scale to begin with, due to how nebulous its introduction was in the first place.
It's been fairly substantiated and has only been made a joke during this arc. Trunks wasn't able to even touch Vegeta when he was SSB, the Gods of Destruction and Kais were literally shitting themselves that Goku had that power. The only people up until now that have been able to withstand it are extremely powerful foes. Hit for example has been an assassin that kills for over a thousand years, even if not as strong knows how to fight. Black was the same being as Goku.
 
The problem is it's completely unbelievable at this point that those characters could ever get that strong. Introducing new characters is something they have always done in order to keep it going.


Just like in Super outside of Golden Frieza we've had pretty much all new characters as far as fighters. It's basically been how it's gone forever and there is no reason for them to change it up now. They have the tools to make the old characters relevant without needing them to be all-powerful but going the opposite route doesn't make the show more interesting. It does the opposite and damages it.


The best example being that even though Krillin being substantially weaker than Gohan beat him with a technique since the rules didn't need you to physically destroy your opponent, rather knock them off the stage making it objective based. Going that route would have been far far more interesting and instead it just makes it a chore and painful to watch. Even GT didn't make that mistake.
I mean, GT had Super 17 being an SSj4 level opponent who was just a fusion of 2 android 17s (and Hell fighter 17 makes no sense in the first place when you consider what 17 is). I don't really agree that this is that much more egregious than that
 
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