Icyflamez96
Member
Yeah probably, and some more substantial interactions.
Because honestly I don't even enjoy that fighting that much (most of the time) in this show. It's stuff around the fighting itself that I most enjoy.
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Dragon Ball Super |OT7| Please wait for Tien to be cool.
- Thread starter ArchedThunder
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Yeah probably, and some more substantial interactions.
Because honestly I don't even enjoy that fighting that much (most of the time) in this show. It's stuff around the fighting itself that I most enjoy.
MiguelMexMIstery
Member
This will be the first episode of the tournament with some good 17 action, right? I'm excited for that. The first episode he fought two troopers for like 2 seconds, and this one he kicked someone I guess.
I remember the Krillin episode "WE HAVE INFINITE ENERGY LET'S GO!" disappears for the rest of the episode
It's good to be back
Idk If Its garbage but sure is ugly
It's always been a garbage transformation. There's never been a moment it wasn't, except maybe early Buu saga when we didn't see how draining it was when Goku wasn't dead.
Gotenks is really the only one who can use it effectively.
This episode kinda exposed King Ryu. I feel like most his episodes are loved because they have great production values, with great spectacle to make up for extremely shallow and convenient writing.
But here, there's nothing to mask the flaws of his script, and it's kind of painful. The episode isn't liked very much it seems.
Anyway, next week looks great, so I'm excited. I like that all the episodes have been giving something entirely different each time, and mad respect to them to provide non stop action week after week. That's not something I thought we'd see, even if that means some episodes are going to be really bad due to the staff rotation.
Speaking of which, are there any One Piece specials coming up ? I thought I saw that in an AD but I could be 100% wrong.
But here, there's nothing to mask the flaws of his script, and it's kind of painful. The episode isn't liked very much it seems.
Anyway, next week looks great, so I'm excited. I like that all the episodes have been giving something entirely different each time, and mad respect to them to provide non stop action week after week. That's not something I thought we'd see, even if that means some episodes are going to be really bad due to the staff rotation.
Speaking of which, are there any One Piece specials coming up ? I thought I saw that in an AD but I could be 100% wrong.
How many teams there is for super?
It was his choice against kid buu and beerus when he was alive. (And buutenks but that was filler)
shrug.
Fulminator
Member
When are we gonna see what Freeza is up to though
He's torturing people until they agree to hold his hand willingly.
Well, why not during the One piece Special week ? Hope you missed the galactic overlord Blobza from Super FnF.
I liked this episode a lot:
-Goku and Caulifla dynamic was great and believable.
-We only knew him as a tremendous fighter, but Hit's scenes also showed him as a team player and tactician like Gohan.
-Kale's transformation was a little meh to me but her fight scenes were pretty much a love letter to fans of movie 8.
The way Agumon from U11 elimination, Cabba's badass scene, and Vegeta's comments about LSSJ, this episode had a lot of cool moments.
-Goku and Caulifla dynamic was great and believable.
-We only knew him as a tremendous fighter, but Hit's scenes also showed him as a team player and tactician like Gohan.
-Kale's transformation was a little meh to me but her fight scenes were pretty much a love letter to fans of movie 8.
The way Agumon from U11 elimination, Cabba's badass scene, and Vegeta's comments about LSSJ, this episode had a lot of cool moments.
The other two U6 Saiyans are fine, but Kale is fucking terrible, just the worst character archetypes both in and out of transformation.
Answering myself, if Anyone wants to know more from the staff of dbsuper, this kazenshuu thread IS Very good:
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=32434
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=32434
No, it isn't
It definitely isn't true, lol
I actually like Super now, so i'm not bagging on it, but OG DBZ is on a whole different level when it comes to arc set up and progression, writing, etc.
Black-Wind
Member
With in the series it's confirmed a trash transformation, a mistake.
I'm shocked Goku even suggested she go for it. You don't need that shit to go Blue and it's a waste a time learning.
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Edit: oops double post.
I didn't think they could ever make female saiyan's and have it work, but they miraculously managed to pull it off. The female saiyan's feel goofy and distinct enough to fit into the DB world (instead of overly sexy or generic like the average female saiyan fanart). Even Caulifa's incredibly shonen-esque desire of wanting to get stronger sets her apart from your typical DBZ female character as well.
My only issue with them is Kale's SSB design (because fuck Broly), but everything about her character is great. She is almost unfathomably entertaining.
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Well, I really enjoyed the episode, if only for Cabba and Caulifla getting into the fray. Fun to see those two being pretty badass.
U6 is super stacked for supposedly being underdogs, with U11 being the only other meaningful threat. U6 and U7 have all but 1 of the eliminations so far. It'll still be fun continuing seeing the jobbers from U2, U3, U4, and U10 get eliminated.
Wonder if U10 can even get one elimination before their sure to be soon erasure. Zamasu was right to be disappointed in his universe's mortals after all.
U6 is super stacked for supposedly being underdogs, with U11 being the only other meaningful threat. U6 and U7 have all but 1 of the eliminations so far. It'll still be fun continuing seeing the jobbers from U2, U3, U4, and U10 get eliminated.
Wonder if U10 can even get one elimination before their sure to be soon erasure. Zamasu was right to be disappointed in his universe's mortals after all.
I feel like Kale works best when she isn't going psycho. Like when she was telling Caulifla that beating Goku up isn't a way to thank him.
Kale's character is a crazy stalker saiyan right now.
How did she survive being in a gang? What stopped them from beating her up everyday? Unrealistic gang.
They deserved a win against Kale. Gowasu deserved something to put on his tombstone.
Kale's character is a crazy stalker saiyan right now.
How did she survive being in a gang? What stopped them from beating her up everyday? Unrealistic gang.
They deserved a win against Kale. Gowasu deserved something to put on his tombstone.
GuessMyUserName
Member
It's really bizarre seeing as how she's supposed to be Cauli's "protege" when we see nothing at all about it. Everything about her is just afraid of anything, afraid of trying. I wanna see Cauli/Kale alone to maybe get SOME sense of this "protege" relationship and hopefully see Kale actually train as this fighter she's supposed to be.
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Is there any way U7 doesn't win?
I am hoping Goku can convince Zen-Oh to undo all the destruction at the end. I don't want U6 and U11 gone from the fiction for good.
2 i Can imagine
1- Zen-oh Changes mind when he's about to erase Goku
2- jiren asks sheng long the universes back
Edit: 3-nobody was erased but teleported
GuessMyUserName
Member
The Pride Troopers seem pretty settled to the idea of U7 being evil an a threat to their world. So far at least I don't see them wishing U7 back.
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Maybe Zen-oh just gets sad that they can't do the tournament again until they realise they can as long as they rebuild all the universes.
Orochinagis
Member
Both females dont even have a signature attack or tactics or synergy or huh...anything at all.
Cabba too, like did he even trained?
I'm assuming it's like Piccolo and Gohan during the Saiyan saga.
Caulifla beats her up. Kale doesn't make any progress because she's getting beat up by the only person she has an attachment to. She doesn't improve because of that.
In terms of teamwork. I doubt Caulifla sent Kale out to do any fighting, giving them little opportunities to work as a team.
Caulifla has one, but she didn't used it on the tournament so far:
And kale used some cool moves as broly
Caulifla has one, but she didn't used it on the tournament so far:
And kale used some cool moves as broly
She hasn't used one move that wasn't in Broly's arsenal though.
Besides generic ki blast #52 when Goku insulted her.
At least Cabba has something new. and never seen before. The Galick Gun.
I wouldn't count that red attack as a ki attack/ signature attack. She's only used it once and it doesn't have a name. Champa's slacking. Rule of thumb, if they didn't give it a name, then the GoD has to.
I think Goku's comment about SSJ3 was taken too seriously , i mean he saw Cauli going SSJ2 easily so imo it was kinda obvious to react with a "You might reach SSJ3 too at this point!".
Btw, the Goku-Caulifla interaction was the best thing of the episode, they're fun to watch together and i hope to see more of that in the future.
Btw, the Goku-Caulifla interaction was the best thing of the episode, they're fun to watch together and i hope to see more of that in the future.
Caulifla has one, but she didn't used it on the tournament so far:
And kale used some cool moves as broly
It actually annoyed me that her ki blasts didn't turn out to be red or some shit lol
Shame Chichi wasnt there, I bet she'd tear a new onde into Cauli as soon as she started giving him the fangirl eyes
She'll bring back the Dragon Quest armor.
Sony
Nintendo
No, it's not somehow. You can't even question that sequence as Raditz was established as Goku's brother, from a Warrior race who actually acts upon being from a warrior race by being a spacepirate, plundering planets and Shit. Besides, when this more powerful enemy appeared, Goku or Piccolo didn't get an asspul powerboost to defeat him, they has to do it together and barely managed.
Sure, the near death power up do get large and you make like or dislike the idea behind this Powerup. However, there was an idea behind it. It was established that a near death experience gives you a power boost. The boost didn't come out of nowhere. So again, you might like or dislike this, but at least there is a thought behind it. It happened according to the rules.
So the issue here is Piccolo being too weak rather than other character getting an inexplicable power boost? Fair point, but it out of the scope that we're discussing.
This isn't true. When Frieza was revived, Sorbet told him that Goku defeated Majin Buu. Frieza then told Sorbet that he would train for 4 months to reach new heights. He announced it. However, his Golden Form is orders of magnitude more power powerful than Majin Buu, like, it's equivalent the jump from SS3 to SSB. And then to think that Frieza at that point was equivalent to SS1, making the jump of 4 month equivalent to a jump Frieza arc SS1 to RoF arc SSB. It's ridiculously stupid.
Nowhere is it established that base strength correlates with the ease of going SSJ. Also, nowhere is it established that any emotional stress leads to SS. If so, Goku would have been SS much earlier in his fight against Frieza.
The reason why Kale's transformation is asinine is the difference in power from base to LSS. Broly was already a monster in base form. Goku and Vegeta could barely scratch his base. His LSS form was thus a much more natural transformation. For Kale it makes no sense because her base is crazy weak.
Bro, your hate boner for DBS needs to calm down
Saiyan Saga
Piccolo & co went from not being able to do jack shit to Raditz to being able kill Raditz's in the form of the Saibamen. Well, except Yamcha because life is pain when you're Yamcha.
There was 1 year between Raditz and Vegeta and the power boost can easily be explained as training in that year.
Krillin decides to not kill the person who was, in part, responsible for the death of his friends and the reason why he had trained in the first place. Why? Because Goku wanted a better fight!
What does this have to do with power boost?
Not sure what you're criticism is? He's stronger because he trained? Ehh..
Wrong again. Frieza's power boost in DBS is equivalent to going from Frieza arc SS1 to RoF arc SSB. Are you telling me the jump in power that much?
Again you're completely missing the point. You're again telling me: "he's stronger because he trained! BS!". you're not making any sense.
What. Are. You. Trying. To. Say.
Also, Krilling dying in DB didn't cause a transformation. I wonder why....
Because you don't know what you're talking about.
Again, what are you trying to say? We are discussing power BOOSTS here. The power DELTA. Character X becoming much stronger. The Androids were spawned as strong. And the power boost needed to defeat them can logically be explained due to the Z Fighters being warned about them coming so they could train. This is different from a very strong character appearing, which isn't new in DB, and then getting a power boost pulled from the ass to match or beat that person, which seems to be DBS' signature move.
Because he has Saiyan cells and considers himself the strongest. Who else would do something like this? Oh yeah Goku, and Cell has his cells. What does this have to do with power boosts again? You have no clue what you're talking about.
Gohan's potential has been established since the first couple of episodes of DBZ and were re emphasizes when he fought Frieza's second form. So throughout the series, breadcrumbs were layed out to finally get to that moment of Gohan harnessing that potential. Again, there is no controversy here. You, again, have no clue what you're talking about.
Yes, a lot of the Fighters were stronger than Frieza. But, and holy Shit AGAIN, the Fighters have increased in power because of TRAINING. Caulifla's power boost is pulled from the ass, Kale's power boost is pulled from the ass, even 17's is pulled from the ass (sorry Slaythe). The once instance where they do say that someone trained for his power boost - Frieza - the magnituse of his power boost is pulled from the ass.
You're seriously getting annoying in how incoherent your rants are. Vegeta wanted nothing more than to fight Goku, even before Majin Buu was mentioned. Then, he witnessed is Babidi's chamber that Goku was much stronger than him and he let himself go Majin to get a power boost similar to Spopovic, to beat Goku. Vegeta has always been arrogant. He let Cell become perfect Cell because he thought "Super Vegeta" could beat him. He didn't care for Buu's awakening because he thought Buu was weak and he could have him. Again, there is no controversy here. You're grasping at straws.
RocknRola, you have no clue what you're talking about. Not only did you manage to sway from the discussion about power boosts (and not understand it) but the jabs you tried to take at Z are easily deflected. It's crazy how uninformed you are. That you even attempt to normalize DBS' shenanigans by pointing to something in DBZ is ludicrous. DBZ shits on DBS from orbit in terms of consistency and buildup. I haven't come across anyone in any Dragonball discussion who was so wrong about everything like you, and so incoherent.
NeonZ
Member
But Gohan got one. And why is beating up weaklings better than training with God and absorb the power of Oozaru? And then Saiyan Saga itself then goes on to completely contradict itself when suddenly god's training allows the humans to reach powers around Raditz level in a single year (which only gets more problematic when the Cell Saga goes and retcons how he still kept secrets from them, like the Room of Space and Time).
The boost did come out of nowhere. Goku had almost died against Piccolo Daimao and didn't notice any boosts when he recovered. The series in Namek throws a comment about Kuririn noticing Goku always got stronger after recovering, but it's basically a lie which was never mentioned before. And, in spite of introducing this power up out of nowhere, the Freeza Saga itself goes on to vastly increase the power Saiyans get from it during the very same arc. It was an inconsistent and broken mess, which is why Toriyama had to basically shelve it as a plot device for the heroes as soon as Namek as over.
It's all relative. Either way, we suddenly get Goku, Gohan and Vegeta in base being treated as stronger than Piccolo for no reason at all.
I mean, yes, he announced it, but what I said is still true. He came back as soon as he unlocked his new form, which resulted in him controlling it poorly.
The Namek Saga had various lines about surpassing the wall of the Saiyans, being stronger enough to be a SSJ by lacking the heart and a pure furious heart. There isn't a clear definition, but it has to be basically a mix of power and strength, otherwise the events there wouldn't make sense (It wasn't the first time Goku was enraged, and his rage there wasn't especially greater than in previous cases).
She suffers from the same issue as Kid Gohan in the first half of the Saiyan Saga, being unwilling to fight due to her personality.
Monochromaticx
Member
That would be a neat twist
intheinbetween
Member
Well, so far my only hope for this arc is something "unexpected" really happens, otherwise Super will still feel dull to me.
Still no sense of danger, terror or desperatiom like any other arc in Z: Raditz, Nappa and Vegeta did quite well, Freeza was scary and a real threat to the group, so was the Androids / Cell arc in which there was a feeling of desperation when the andoids were beating the hell of everyone while looking for Goku, or Cell looking for the androids.. even the Majin Buu saga had its scary moments because of how powerful and evil was Buu kid.
Right now Super is just a tournament, with no additions other than "the last universe standing will the only survivor and will get the super dragon balls", which doesn't appeal to me, so I just hope any new villain appears and things get interesting.
Still no sense of danger, terror or desperatiom like any other arc in Z: Raditz, Nappa and Vegeta did quite well, Freeza was scary and a real threat to the group, so was the Androids / Cell arc in which there was a feeling of desperation when the andoids were beating the hell of everyone while looking for Goku, or Cell looking for the androids.. even the Majin Buu saga had its scary moments because of how powerful and evil was Buu kid.
Right now Super is just a tournament, with no additions other than "the last universe standing will the only survivor and will get the super dragon balls", which doesn't appeal to me, so I just hope any new villain appears and things get interesting.
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Would Goku being eliminated at some point fairly early on count as unexpected? I feel that's pretty possible but would be a large departure from the path you would typically expect.
I do admit it would be boring if Goku just powers his way through the tournament while all the side characters do the same jobbing we've become accustomed to by this point.
RocknRola
Member
First of all, chill my dude. If you wanna throw around insults we're gonna have a fun old time and get banned
Secondly the point was and still is: POWER LEVELS ARE BULLSHIT + THE SHOW(S) IS(ARE) FILLED WITH LOOPHOLES AND INCONSISTENCIES. Literally. Trying to blame DBS for going crazy with them while pretending Z (heck, even the OG DB) did everything rigth is beyond laughable. Trying to justify all the dumb shit that happens in Z as a positive or as "logical" and then turn around and call out the dumb shit in Super is just hypocritical.
You're upholding a show that literally said "fuck it" after the Freeza saga in regards to power levels. The gains started to become exponential and not related to the lenght of time taken to train or even how one trained. Hell, Gohan got his potential unlocked twice in the show and it was all for nothing in the exact same sagas it happened. The series is full of massive powerups literally from nothing because it serves the plot. Like every other show.
There is not amount of logic to explain how power boosts work in Z. Case in point: Goku made more progress training on his own at x100 gravity than a full year with King Kai. Gohan made more progress in one year with Goku than in three years with Piccolo AND Goku. Vegeta made less progress than Goku during the Namek saga, despite all the Zenkai boosts, than Goku made during his trip to Namek. Vegeta then made more progress on his own, in space, than with Zenkai boosts and fighting powerful foes. Goten and Trunks are SSJ from day 1. They're stronger as kids than the character that has been branded with the most potential of all (Gohan) all while neither facing any real adversity or heavy combat, just basic training.
There are NO rules. There is NO logic. The power boosts happened when the story wanted them to happen and only then did it try to explain, if at all. We never learned, for example, what kind of training Goku did to reach SSJ3 (remember, he couldn't even go SSJ2 when he died) or how he achieved it. He just gets it. We never know how the Androids were so strong from the get go, despite their creator not knowing about any similar power level before creating them.
Your argument is that Androids were just that strong naturally, by creation. Cool. Then what's the problem with Kale, Cauli or literally anyone else being as strong as they are from the get go? What's different? What makes one better and one worse? What is so unbeliable in Freeza training and getting as strong as he did (with severe limitations to the form as well)? If Buu bothered to train seriously he'd likely get ridiculously more powerful than anyone else in the series since his base was ridiculous from the get go (which, again, in this instance doesn't seem to bother you one bit).
What exactly is wrong with a character, whom the show declared a genius, having a strong base power and learning how to use her Ki in such a way that she can achieve multiple forms? Vegeta learned how to use God Ki on his own all while being much weaker than Goku and not having access to the SSG ritual either.
I'm sorry dude, we know your hate boner for this show is Super (ha) strong, but pointing out Z and it's power boosts as a counter example is just dumb.
Solid Sora
Member
I thought the episode had a very strong storyboard and choreography, but the production didn't do them justice most of the time.
Overall, I feel this was the strongest episode in the tournament so far. It felt dense with lots of stuff happening, it had 0 reused animation, it got an amazing cut with Kale wiping the floor with Goku, and the interactions between Goku and Cauli were a delight to watch. They work so well together.
I'm glad that the next episode seems to continue focusing on Cauli and Kale, but with better production this time around. So far they are my favorite new characters in the arc, and I'm curious to see what they will do with Kale when she stops being Broly.
Overall, I feel this was the strongest episode in the tournament so far. It felt dense with lots of stuff happening, it had 0 reused animation, it got an amazing cut with Kale wiping the floor with Goku, and the interactions between Goku and Cauli were a delight to watch. They work so well together.
I'm glad that the next episode seems to continue focusing on Cauli and Kale, but with better production this time around. So far they are my favorite new characters in the arc, and I'm curious to see what they will do with Kale when she stops being Broly.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
I dunno how you can argue that there's no sense of danger in an arc whose premise is literally "win or your universe is erased; also Freeza is going to screw everyone over at the first opportunity."
I will say that Z's more dramatic moments had better atmosphere on average. The five minutes of Namek are still my favorite stretch of episodes in the whole series despite their padding, almost entirely because of how the planet starkly decayed up until the last moments.
I will say that Z's more dramatic moments had better atmosphere on average. The five minutes of Namek are still my favorite stretch of episodes in the whole series despite their padding, almost entirely because of how the planet starkly decayed up until the last moments.
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