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[Bizarro Sun Yat-sen]

Square's always had a thing about creating each new game from the ground up, though. Until recently they've reused very little code or concept from project to project (for example FF8, FF9 and Chrono Cross all had completely separate engines, despite being fairly similar in setup)

 

[Diablos]

Why are we talking about a game that came years ago? Those engines were simple; something on PS2 is more complex. PS3 engine is going to be even more complex with cloth dynamics, high polygons, large environments, etc.

Not if it's intended to be multiplatform. It'll still be there, but not nearly as detailed if the XBox 360 is intended to have it it too. Then you have to factor in storage limitations because the 360 still uses dual layer DVD's... FFXIII on 360 will ruin the game's potential.

 

[Jonnyram]

Square's always had a thing about creating each new game from the ground up, though. Until recently they've reused very little code or concept from project to project (for example FF8, FF9 and Chrono Cross all had completely separate engines, despite being fairly similar in setup)

Wait, I thought FF9 used FF8's engine.

Mrbob, what do you think about Lost Odyssey? Sakaguchi is using UE3 for that.

 

[Drek]

Square's always had a thing about creating each new game from the ground up, though. Until recently they've reused very little code or concept from project to project (for example FF8, FF9 and Chrono Cross all had completely separate engines, despite being fairly similar in setup)

Which is why their costs per game are astronomical.

Not if it's intended to be multiplatform. It'll still be there, but not nearly as detailed if the XBox 360 is intended to have it it too. Then you have to factor in storage limitations because the 360 still uses dual layer DVD's... FFXIII on 360 will ruin the game's potential.

True, system format could play a major role in Square Enix' decisions for next generation. If they really take advantage of BRD they'd need to use several X360 disks, and that only ups the publishing and distro costs further. I don't think its a deal breaker though.

 

[Lo-Volt]

Wait, I thought FF9 used FF8's engine.

Mrbob, what do you think about Lost Odyssey? Sakaguchi is using UE3 for that.

You mean that game is still coming out? Thank you, Jesus! I haven't seen an update on that game in the longest time, so even the implicit suggestion that there will be more to come pleases me on a lousy day.

 

[Diablos]

True, system format could play a major role in Square Enix' decisions for next generation. If they really take advantage of BRD they'd need to use several X360 disks, and that only ups the publishing and distro costs further. I don't think its a deal breaker though.

But even then they're gonna have to build the game with the 360 in mind; they'll have to limit the amount of polys and texture detail even from the PS3 level SO that it can be ported to 360 successfully... 1 disc or 10.

 

[Bizarro Sun Yat-sen]

Wait, I thought FF9 used FF8's engine.

It didn't. They were developed in parallel (FF8 in Japan and FF9 in Hawaii) and programmed separately. Incidentally, if you try playing FF8 and 9 on one of those enhanced PS emulators that render in high resolution, you can really see the difference. FF8 looks a little better, but 9 looks a LOT better. There's a lot of texture and animation detail in that game that just doesn't show up very well at 320x240.

 

[Bizarro Sun Yat-sen]

You mean that game is still coming out? Thank you, Jesus! I haven't seen an update on that game in the longest time, so even the implicit suggestion that there will be more to come pleases me on a lousy day.

It won't be released till 2007, so it's no surprise they haven't opened the PR floodgates just yet.

 

[Srider]

Square Enix actually released comments today denying the previous report. Saying they still haven't decided on which platform to use for the next FF or DQ, and that they will announce their decision when they have made up their minds.

Sorry xbox fans.

 

[Doom_Bringer]

Square Enix actually released comments today denying the previous report. Saying they still haven't decided on which platform to use for the next FF or DQ, and that they will announce their decision when they have made up their minds.

Sorry xbox fans.

they annouced FF for PS3 at E3. Have they changed their minds about that?

 

[Mrbob]

Wait, I thought FF9 used FF8's engine.

Mrbob, what do you think about Lost Odyssey? Sakaguchi is using UE3 for that.

Well it does't have the plastic sheen which is nice. On the other hand, the game isn't one of the most visually appealing next gen titles.

 

[kaching]

As for squares engines ... i'm not seeing anything technically stunning, so i don't see the point of slaving away at their own engine. Art direction is what square do well, they could cut out the middle man.

Whether Square's work is technically stunning, art direction extends into coding. Going with middleware next gen is potentially a trade-off in this regard but it's possible to that next gen middleware gives fine enough control over the coding to still allow Square to distinguish themselves as they have in the past.

 

[DCharlie]

Both look awesome! Why do people want the Unreal 3.0 engine? The X360 tech demo is doing crazy ass geometry that I have not seen in any title using the Unreal 3.0 engine and the FF7 demo is doing crazy non-normal mapped characters and awesome cloth dynamics.

because there is a massive difference between doing a demo and having an engine handle a game. I used Unreal 3 as an example, there are other solutions out there.

The fact that the tech demos are doing crazy stuff doesn't matter - in game with everything else factored in isn't the same.

Ontop of that , the tech demo for UE3 city thing (game name i forget) looks every bit as good as the bottom shot artistically, and i didn't see anything in the FF7 demo that looked beyond UE3 either (big city scape, cloth physics, swooping 3d camera... seems to be all covered). And again, if the engine is lacking something (cloth physics not up to scratch) then surely it's easier to take something that exists and retool it that do it from zero?

*shrug*

Whether Square's work is technically stunning, art direction extends into coding. Going with middleware next gen is potentially a trade-off in this regard but it's possible to that next gen middleware gives fine enough control over the coding to still allow Square to distinguish themselves as they have in the past.

I'd agree that if there is some limit in the middleware that forces certain decissions on the art directors then , yeah, it would extend into the coding. Again, it's down to developers/budgets to make the call.

 

[Izzy]

because there is a massive difference between doing a demo and having an engine handle a game. I used Unreal 3 as an example, there are other solutions out there.

The fact that the tech demos are doing crazy stuff doesn't matter - in game with everything else factored in isn't the same.

Ontop of that , the tech demo for UE3 city thing (game name i forget) looks every bit as good as the bottom shot artistically, and i didn't see anything in the FF7 demo that looked beyond UE3 either (big city scape, cloth physics, swooping 3d camera... seems to be all covered). And again, if the engine is lacking something (cloth physics not up to scratch) then surely it's easier to take something that exists and retool it that do it from zero?

*shrug*



I'd agree that if there is some limit in the middleware that forces certain decissions on the art directors then , yeah, it would extend into the coding. Again, it's down to developers/budgets to make the call.

A bit OT but,

UE3 lacks the feature called 'sub-surface scattering' - and that's why everything looks a bit plastic. I've been told that the engine actually supports a form of 'fake SSF'; sadly, I have yet to see it implemented in a single UE3 game.