GitarooMan
Member
soundwave05 said:
So the 16-bit gen didn't start when Genesis launched? 32/64 era didn't start when PSX/Saturn launched?
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So the 16-bit gen didn't start when Genesis launched? 32/64 era didn't start when PSX/Saturn launched?
Kabuki Waq
Member
soundwave05 said:
that would mean the 32/64 bit Gen didnt start until nintendo entered.
There is a difference, you know...GitarooMan said:
Technology has changed so much. A lot of the early 360 titles are based upon games still being created for current generation machines. That kind of thinking wouldn't have worked with those generations you mentioned.
As I said, different situation.
Moving from the 16-bit generation to the 32/64-bit generation represented a rather large shift in the way game visuals were drawn. Very few games were based upon 16-bit titles and a lot of new engines and content were created. The nature of 3D graphics lends itself well to upgrading technology.
This generation shift is very much the same as when we moved from the 32/64-bit period to the current generation.
BTW, I'm not actually suggesting that a new generation doesn't "truly begin" until the market leader enters the fray...
Beer Monkey
Member
True.
soundwave05
Member
Dr_Cogent said:
Why is that really a controversial statement?
Looking back it at it now, most people would say the 32-bit/64-bit generation really didn't get going until the N64 arrived (even though the PSOne beat it) in 1996.
Does anyone mark the start of this generation from the Dreamcast launch?
For most people the 16-bit era didn't really get going until the SNES arrived in 1991.
Those are the perks of being the market leader, you earn that right that people are waiting to see what you got and waiting to see your machine lead the industry. No two ways around it.
soundwave05 said:
I don't consider it controversial at all.
I just think it's completely and utterly false is all.
Dude, that's like saying 64 bit X86 compatible PC chips didn't start until Intel entered the fray. AMD had one out first, does that mean 64 bit PC computing didn't start because Intel (the leader) wasn't in the game yet? Hell no.
Kabuki Waq
Member
dark10x said:
wow man your true colours are showing.
Except for EA games and Amped 3 i dont really see much that looks even close to current gen. There is no way anyone can justify "next gen starts with PS3" without being tongue in cheek.
Try to remember DC games looked on par with ps2 launch titles an yet alot of ppl act as if DC was in a past gen
Kameo
PD0
GRAW
CoD2
DOA4
PGr3
all look next gen to me.
soundwave05
Member
AniHawk said:
That's basically the same thing as what I'm saying.
The real transition from the end of a console generation to a new one doesn't truly happen until the existing market leader makes that transition.
It has nothing to do with preferring one hardware manufacturer over another, that's just the respect you get as a market leader. Everyone in the industry and most consumers will wait to see how you tackle the next-generation before hedging their bets.
Kabuki Waq
Member
soundwave05 said:
do you remember how ps2 launch games didnt look much better than the DC games at the time?
Kabuki Waq said:
You missed my edit...
I don't agree with soundwave, but was noting a difference...
I do feel that a lot of developers are not really approaching the 360 hardware as they should. They are sticking with tried and true rendering techniques and simply adding more detail.
Kabuki Waq
Member
AniHawk said:
I see it more like a genesis launch.
anyone who thinks the 32/64 bit era started with the n64 is borderline retarded IMO.
soundwave05
Member
Dr_Cogent said:
To each his own. For the vast majority of gamers, the next-generation won't begin until next year.
Anyone can come out with a system with a certain hardware spec and say "OK, its next gen now", but that doesn't magically make it so.
This is an industry that operates very much on branding and momenteum (always has) and right now Sony is the king of the hill. Nothing really changes until they step into the ring.
Kabuki Waq
Member
soundwave05 said:
you honestly think 32/64bit era started with the n64?
X360 is Current GEN?
GitarooMan
Member
AniHawk said:
I don't see the similarity in a launch sense, but Xbox and likely 360 are both similar to Saturn in the way that they suceeded (or will likely succeed) in one market while being irrelevent in another.
soundwave05
Member
Kabuki Waq said:
I do think the 32-bit/64-bit era really did not get going until 1996. That was the beginning of the real transition over from the old consoles to the new ones. Prior to 1996, the "next-generation" market was purely niche with little relevance to the average gamer of the time.
WHOAguitarninja
Member
soundwave05 said:
I think what you're trying to say is that the full rumbling of a new generation of systems doesn't start until there is actually some competition in the arena. It just happens that the market leader has been the last to market the last several generations. I would kindof agree with this point, but I would think it would be more accurate to say the next gen starts when the first new system hits, and that's what starts the decling of the old gen.
To put it in somewhat mathematical terms, cuz i'm weird like that, if each gen has a peak value of one, when machine A enters the fray, the "next gen" takes on a small, but present value, while the previous gen dies down a little. This happens even more so when the next system enters.
It's like one gen is growing while the other is decaying, they each have a maximum of one, however gen A + gen B is equal to one as well.
I think you're confusing people by not specifically stating the the next gen not really starting yet doesn't mean that no next gen systems are out yet. I think people are interpreting what you're saying as saying that X360 isn't next gen.
krypt0nian
Banned
soundwave05 said:
Are you fucking high? So what gen would the 360 belong to? Some mythical quasi-gen that only you see?
Your tag is perfection.
krypt0nian said:
They'll be early, simple as that.
Isn't being early one of the things MS has been hyping in all their interviews? I rarely hear them say they are entering just in time, or right when next gen start.
It's always, "we are before PS3, we will win!"
Yea, I think MS agrees too, next gen starts with PS3.
krypt0nian
Banned
littlewig said:
Early..late...still the same gen.
Next gen starts when the 1st next gen console comes out. Only fools think that means PS3. Naturally you posted.
soundwave05
Member
morbidaza said:
Yeah you got it. They're getting their panties in a wad because they're not really reading what I'm saying.
Has nothing to do with specs. Otherwise someone could say the 32-bit/64-bit era began with the friggin' Atari Jaguar or 3DO or the 16-bit era began in 1989 (launch of the Genesis), when really in actuality that's considered to be the peak of the NES era. If go purely on processing power you could draw that conclusion, but history doesn't bear that out at all.
Too many people insecure about the XBox 360 that they'll jump all over any type of statement that could even be remotely negative. It's not negative, that's just the reality of the business, 360 is a next-gen console, but the next-gen in its earnest will not begin until Sony enters the fray.
Not because they're Sony, they could be Honda for all I care, but because they're the existing market leader.
krypt0nian
Banned
soundwave05 said:
I can hear you clapping wildly that one person got what you were trying to say.
And you're still wrong.
soundwave05
Member
krypt0nian said:
So you would say the 8-bit generation ended in 1989 (Genesis launch)?
Or the 16-bit generation ended in 1993 (3DO/Jaguar launch)?
Just because hardware is released that has advanced "next-generation" technology doesn't mean the industry as a whole has moved on to a new generation.
That doesn't generally happen until the market leader makes the transition to its next-generation platform. *Then* the next-generation truly begins. That's not a shot at Microsoft or Nintendo at all, it's just part of the advantage you earn (and derserve) as market leader. Even if you don't like Sony, even if you wear undies with green "Xs" all over them, you just gotta give them that. Microsoft is not the reigning market leader, they can release a new console, but they don't decide when one generation begins and another ends. That's Sony's privelege and one they earned by kicking MS' ass and Nintendo's ass.
You can show up at a bar at 10 o'clock, but the party doesn't start until 11/11:30 pm. If you disagree, that's your opinion. I just don't share it, so get over it.
krypt0nian
Banned
soundwave05 said:
Over and over and over
soundwave05
Member
krypt0nian said:
And over and over. And you're wrong on top of that.
krypt0nian
Banned
Angelus said:Its called stealth trolling,and the ones claiming this gen. doesn't start till 2006 are living in their own little Matrix.
At least he sticks to his guns. No matter how insane they are.
soundwave05
Member
Angelus said:Its called stealth trolling,and the ones claiming this gen. doesn't start till 2006 are living in their own little Matrix.
:lol Yeah I live in this "crazy" Twilight Zone world where Sony actually won the console race and based on every single prior generation, should then set the pace for when industry-wide shift to the next-generation.
There are other common sense reasons like the existing market leading console (PS2) will continue to be an active platform until the market leader (Sony) releases their next-gen console (PS3). So the current gen really can't end until that happens. But I guess grasping that notion is a bit too complex for some people.
krypt0nian
Banned
soundwave05 said:
QFT
soundwave05
Member
Redbeard said:
I'd love to, as long as some people get off my balls for making a simple comment. I wasn't friggin' raggin on the XBox 360.
Some people are just so damn sensitive, jeebus, I even said the XBox 360 launch lineup was pretty good.
Sheesh. Maybe some of the PS3 fans on this board are right.
Do most people consider DC 'this-gen'?
I've never considered it as part of the current generation since it came and went before most of the major players even arrived on the market. To me, DC is like in it's own gen between the 32-bit and the PS2/Xbox/GC.
But I do think X360 is in the same gen as PS3/Rev because they'll be out around the same time and at similar specs. I just wanted to say that I think there can be machines that don't really fit within a generation group like the DC.
I've never considered it as part of the current generation since it came and went before most of the major players even arrived on the market. To me, DC is like in it's own gen between the 32-bit and the PS2/Xbox/GC.
But I do think X360 is in the same gen as PS3/Rev because they'll be out around the same time and at similar specs. I just wanted to say that I think there can be machines that don't really fit within a generation group like the DC.
krypt0nian
Banned
soundwave05 said:
Your motives aren't the issue. You're just wrong. And cannot shut up about it.
Lunar Aura
Banned
i like my eggs scrambled. what about u guys?
krypt0nian
Banned
Dr_Cogent said:kryp, dude, just let it go. Laugh. Less stress that way
All is well.