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Fighting Games Weekly | Feb 24 - Mar 2 | Play Seriously

Is the Hadouken ultra really better for Gouken? I mean it seems to me they have the same combos to ultra but the Shoryuken one does way more damage. The Hadouken one brings them to the corner? Velociraptor is an okay player, but the corner, or any kind of positive position doesn't seem to be his strong point. I don't get it. Just get the more damage
 
Lazyslob said:
Is the Hadouken ultra really better for Gouken? I mean it seems to me they have the same combos to ultra but the Shoryuken one does way more damage. The Hadouken one brings them to the corner? Velociraptor is an okay player, but the corner, or any kind of positive position doesn't seem to be his strong point. I don't get it. Just get the more damage
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Denjin Hadouken does decent to high stun as well. I'm guessing it just works for his style.
 
Lazyslob said:
Is the Hadouken ultra really better for Gouken? I mean it seems to me they have the same combos to ultra but the Shoryuken one does way more damage. The Hadouken one brings them to the corner? Velociraptor is an okay player, but the corner, or any kind of positive position doesn't seem to be his strong point. I don't get it. Just get the more damage
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Their are more ways to land Ultra 2. With Ultra 1 the most common ways are back throw and EX palm, FADC which cost 3 bars. With Ultra 2 you can land it from a EX palm by itself, back throw, regular palms in the corner, and angled fireballs catching people jumping.

Sometimes you have to take utility over damage especially when you're not as likely to land the more damaging Ultra. Plus Gouken's U2 does a lot of stun so if you hit a nice combo ending in Ultra 2 leaves your opponent probably one or two hits before stun and then that normally means death.
 
K.Sabot said:
Denjin Hadouken does decent to high stun as well. I'm guessing it just works for his style.
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I don't think it's that good. Personally. If you need to rely on stun or something, that means you have to have that character on lock, be really good with such character and I don't think Gouken is a strong enough character to take advantage of something like that.
 
kirblar said:
Everyone gets hit by that once. Then you learn.

You shouldn't be learning that when you play with Chris weekly, lol.
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I'm not talking about when Super came out and Ken's U2 was new. Sometimes people are just way too anxious to start their punish and they stop blocking before their opponents ultra ends. This is not about unfamiliarity, and more about making a flat out bone headed decision. I think that's what happened there.
 
Rice-Eater said:
Their are more ways to land Ultra 2. With Ultra 1 the most common ways are back throw and EX palm, FADC which cost 3 bars. With Ultra 2 you can land it from a EX palm by itself, back throw, and angled fireballs catching people jumping.

Sometimes you have to take utility over damage especially when you're not as likely to land the more damaging Ultra. Plus Gouken's U2 does a lot of stun so if you a nice combo ending in Ultra 2 leaves your opponent probably one or two hits before stun and then that normally means death.
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The problem I see with it is Goukens mix ups are garbage. There really is no reason to use u2. Sure, it may have high stun but the chances of actually stunning any character are low, and I've never actually seen it it. Maybe it would work on scrubs. I just think it's useless and better to use U1.
 
You have a lot of Gouken players to convince then because the majority uses U2. The top, good, or average players. Gouken doesn't have a deadly mix up game, but he can safely pressure with demon flip dive kick which stuffs or dodges most invincible reversals and then try to work his frame trap game. I think U2 is a little better for most of his match ups.
 
Rice-Eater said:
You have a lot of Gouken players to convince then because the majority uses U2. The top, good, or average players. Gouken doesn't have a deadly mix up game, but he can safely pressure with demon flip dive kick which stuffs or dodges most invincible reversals and then try to work his frame trap game. I think U2 is a little better for most of his match ups.
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Maybe that's why there are really no notable Gouken? I think U1 is also a good footsy tool, as well. The fear of grabs and such.
 
vocab said:
Damn I want some guitly gear buttons.
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This is my desktop background now.
t0P9RBB.png
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AnneIFrank said:
In Vanilla she's "I have no tools but I'm made of damage" tier. She's considered the worst character in the game. She's actually not all that horrible, she has decent neutral and so much damage, but she has no real pressure in a game where you want that in. On top of that, she has 2 7-3s in Narukami and Mitsuru staring her down, and struggles in too many MUs. In P4U2 she's about the same so far except they took away all of her damage, the only thing she had that made her anywhere near useable.

I'm pretty close to Bace(From NY, best NA Liz easy, probably the world cause Japan sucks at Liz) and he's yelled at me many times why she's bad. You can literally see it at NEC where he got to Winners finals without dealing with too many bad MUs, then ran into 2 Narukamis and got slaughtered. Eventually she's just going to shut down. He's probably dropping her in P4U2 unless he can find something redeeming. Okusan(Japan's best Liz) dropped her immediately for Sho in P4U2, and there are only 4 Liz players above 700 PSR currently.
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A bit late on that, but wow is that demoralizing. :(
I main Liz in vanilla, and I really like the character: she doesn't have much tools, but she's all about gimmicks and bullshit mindgames that can lead to half or more of your bar gone -- those are the type of characters I love to play.
But hearing she lost all of her damage is kinda sad... Didn't follow P4U2 all that much because it's still a bit far away for the console release, but I remember something about all of her damaging options / combos being moved to her awakening state, is that right? I suppose the match-up is to now just bully her so that she can't put herself in awakening mode with enough life to do anything...
 
Man I hate seeing Viper win. Michael should have just done a slightly delayed EX DP'd on Viper's wake up. Nothing can save her from that. EX seismo doesn't have enough invincibility, EX burn kick trades at best, and Ultra passes through it and of course she recovers much later.
 
Shito said:
A bit late on that, but wow is that demoralizing. :(
I main Liz in vanilla, and I really like the character: she doesn't have much tools, but she's all about gimmicks and bullshit mindgames that can lead to half or more of your bar gone -- those are the type of characters I love to play.
But hearing she lost all of her damage is kinda sad... Didn't follow P4U2 all that much because it's still a bit far away for the console release, but I remember something about all of her damaging options / combos being moved to her awakening state, is that right? I suppose the match-up is to now just bully her so that she can't put herself in awakening mode with enough life to do anything...
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Wow I just woke up, good timing. They moved a lot of tools to awakening state, but they still don't amount to a lot of damage outside of big stupid starters into Garu, and it's still not all that much. The awakened Zio beam is hella nice, but still not the game changer she needs. It's really sad because in Vanilla she would've been playable if Narukami/Mits didn't exist, and her problems were really fixable. Now she just struggles in everything. No defensive options, no damage, still no real pressure.

It's unfortunate, the game looks really solid but Liz got the super short end and Narukami is a bit too good, which is definitely going to turn people off. Everything else is looking relatively balanced.
 
Horseress said:
I hope Wao was sandbagging
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I don't think either are sand bagging, their comp is just that good. Part of that is also the match ups they had to deal with. Wao made some really poor decisions to try to anti air a Gouken who kept doing demon flip parry. That shit pisses me off so much when I play my friend who is a Gouken player. It really makes you doubt yourself and make you just want to sit back and block. Gouken can't spam it, but using it strategically really helps.
 
Rice-Eater said:
I don't think either are sand bagging, their comp is just that good. Part of that is also the match ups they had to deal with. Wao made some really poor decisions to try to anti air a Gouken who kept doing demon flip parry. That shit pisses me off so much when I play my friend who is a Gouken player. It really makes you doubt yourself and make you just want to sit back and block. Gouken can't spam it, but using it strategically really helps.
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Yeah the comp is great there, no doubt, but I felt some nerves there, maybe for playing an international tourney for the first time
 
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