crooked spin
Member
Aw leave Vaan alone. Pretty sure the poster was talking about Larsa. 
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Final Fantasy XII Zodiac Age trailer (2017, PS4 REMASTER!!!!!!)
- Thread starter raven777
- Start date
Spiritwalker
Member
Larsa is cool tho
decoyplatypus
Member
Matsuno's stories almost always get less interesting as they go along. The two exceptions that come to mind are Vagrant Story, which had a narrower focus than most of Matsuno's games, and FF12, which didn't even start that well.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I'd watch a GOT anime tbh.
Aw leave Vaan alone. Pretty sure the poster was talking about Larsa.
yeah is this one, i think how both are kids i'm confusing Hope and Larsa
this is a signal i must re-play ffxii
and vaan its like the guy who does the three on a theater play
Well let me go through it step by step. Your saying that i am biased because i have a Japanese avatar based on a character from a visual novel, and yeah, i'd say i was biased to some degree, but by that same token, your also saying that those who don't sport anime avatars are 'unbiased' on what the description of an anime story is.
But the fact of the matter is that 'anime' has essentially become short hand in many threads for vague allegory that are not actually specifically tied to anime in any way.
For example, your example was 'a lot of modern FF fall into the melodramatic 'fight for my friends and never give up animeish storylines'.
Uh, which ones?. FFX? No...FF11 or FF12? no...FF8? No..FF7? i can't say that's true either.
"Fight for my friends and never give up"
I don't recall ever seeing that in Final Fantasy outside of Lighting Returns FF13's god beating power of friendship circle of terrible, but that's only one game in general, not 'a lot of modern FF's'.
So what is it do you mean? Are you referring to the more character based story lines of FF7-10? But that's not particularly 'anime based' in itself, so much as fantastical.
If we're talking about FF12, the story is more about the overt political drama and less about character interactions, but i would not particularly say that was any more realistic considering the setting. Its just a straight fantasy tale instead of a more out there tale. I've seen settings portrayed far more seriously than say, FFX, while being set in the same sort of fantastical setting and dealing with the same character driven themes, so i would not say its any more particularly anime based than anything else.
Lost Odyssey for example is a lot like FFX, but with a lot less corny humor and a more serious tonal approach. Would not in particular say it was any more realistic.
What about Tactics Ogre?
The problem is that any one of the other party members (besides Penelo) would've made a much better protagonist.
Transistor
Banned
FFT stayed strong until the very end
toythatkills
Member
The mistake you're making is believing him to be the protag, but it's easily done.
What makes him the protagonist? You don't have to control him and he has less story presence than anyone else so why not just consider Balthier or Ashe or Basch the protag?
Vaan is the protagonist, just a shitty one.
"But Ashe is the focus of the narrative, therefor the true protagonist!!" seems just a way to deflect the criticisms throw at the game. (A character being the focus of the narrative doesn't make him or her the protagonist, Yuna is not the protagonist of X despite how many stakes she has in the story)
It very clear who the writers meant for the player to identity and align with, the game starts with him, he's the focus for 10 hours or so and he's the only character you can control in town. (And XII representative in Dissidia, eh)
They just failed to develop him a character. (Like they failed with many things in FFXII story)
"But Ashe is the focus of the narrative, therefor the true protagonist!!" seems just a way to deflect the criticisms throw at the game. (A character being the focus of the narrative doesn't make him or her the protagonist, Yuna is not the protagonist of X despite how many stakes she has in the story)
It very clear who the writers meant for the player to identity and align with, the game starts with him, he's the focus for 10 hours or so and he's the only character you can control in town. (And XII representative in Dissidia, eh)
They just failed to develop him a character. (Like they failed with many things in FFXII story)
Lee Chaolan
Member
Yup. One of my absolute favorites.
potatohead
Member
I've no shame in saying this but....
I feel completely happy rebuying FF XII just to know at least this generation I will have purchased one good Final Fantasy game.
Actually I bought FF X/X-2 remaster for PS4 too. So that makes 2 then.
I feel completely happy rebuying FF XII just to know at least this generation I will have purchased one good Final Fantasy game.
Actually I bought FF X/X-2 remaster for PS4 too. So that makes 2 then.
Yeah, I feel quite confident in assuming this will be my favourite Final Fantasy game this gen. Please announce a limited edition.
I'd rather be pleasantly surprised with XV/XVI than deeply disappointed.
Wasn't Basch canned as the main character because they thought he was too old? It's funny because bearded middle aged men went on to dominant the following generation.
is it like how connor in assassin's creed 3 'just so happened' to be involved in every major historical event in the american revolution
potatohead
Member
Yea I remember that. I think I read that here actually, he was scrapped as main for being old AF.
But honestly he was the coolest character besides Balthier.
Damn age-ism yo.
Starlightmuse
Member
Yeah, Connor is essentialy the Forrest Gump of Assassins Creed.
Vaan's brother would've been much easier and more sensible to include as protag.It should've been about Rex following his captain Basch around and getting involved in grand events.
Then as the story progresses his role and rank becomes increasingly important,from lowly soldier to elite knight.
SPOILERS
"we're twins!" plot twist was really ridiculous. and never grabbed me.
Then as the story progresses his role and rank becomes increasingly important,from lowly soldier to elite knight.
SPOILERS
Bach and Gabranth
Crankshaft
Member
I thought that I had read years ago that Bathier was meant to be the main character and that Vaan was thrown in to appease Square because they needed the "fresh face youth" to try and get younger consumers sales.
I mean in the game you are introduced to Vaan first but then his story goes no where and he has nothing to do with anything. Where as Bathier is attached to Cid's story line. Cid\Vayne\Occuria are the main point of the whole story line with Ashe\Bache\Judges thrown in for flavoring. Vaan and Pennelo are just there for the ride. If you took them out nothing about the story would have changed.
The protagonist was intended to be Basch, actually, from what I recall.
Vaan is one of the most important characters in the story! Without him, the party wouldn't have met, without him Ashe wouldn't have given up her revenge, without him there would be no voice of the common people in a conflict between royalty! I swear, most of the people who hate on Vaan or the story are just parroting others' opinions. I doubt most people here have played the game from start to finish in a recent enough time to even remember specific plot details, and yet they speak on the game as if they had!
The common people suck. They're just so... common.
vainglorious
Member
I love this game. I just wish Venat was in it more. I love Venat.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Vaan and Penelo are a pair of Poochies. They serve no purpose other than to tick marketing boxes.
Here's a prime example of the people I was talking about.
LegendofLex
Member
There's a sequence in Pandemonium in FFIX where Zidane is ready to die and gets snapped out of it when his friends show up. The track title for that sequence is, if I'm remembering correctly, "Not Alone."
That's pretty on the nose.
There are also numerous sequences like this in FFX, where the party gets split up and you don't get to move on until you console everyone and/or your other party members show up again to save the day.
potatohead
Member
I think most people hate how he looks and thus start hating everything about him as well lol. Only cool looking perfect-ish characters are likeable I guess to some people... first complaint 99% of the time is "no shirt" and "look at his abs" lmao XD
Not that he is terribly deep or anything. But he's not as terrible as some people exaggerate a little too much.
Obviously overall the story of Penelo and Vaan wasn't deeply expanded upon as was probably originally intended. And for other characters too.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Just because the plot was retrofitted to include them, it doesn't make them necessary to the meat of the story. As it stands they are just a distraction who become less and less relevant the deeper we get in.
I like Penelo. She's my favorite in this game, she's strong, clever and very charismatic.
Van is great too, I like his VA, I like how he is a naive but very talented, smart and pragmatic person.
Character development isn't really important in this game, it's all about the journey and how the political intrigue unfolds.
Van is great too, I like his VA, I like how he is a naive but very talented, smart and pragmatic person.
Character development isn't really important in this game, it's all about the journey and how the political intrigue unfolds.
-_- You know I had hoped that with an hd remaster they would maybe fix (or rather, change) Vaan's horrible horrible ab and muscle textures (seriously they look like tatoos more than actual muscles), but alas, they have not.
-_-
Darkstorne
Member
This. Vaan and Penelo were added because Matsuno's cast didn't fill the FF teen angst requirement. Any of the other characters could have filled the minor contributions those two kids provided. 99% of the time I was wondering why they were still following Ashe around, and why she was putting up with them.
Teletraan1
Banned
I do too but I want someone to actually expand on it rather than the constant streamlining, more like dumbing down.
This is the pinnacle of this style of combat system and executed much better than Xenoblade and its successor. The ability to basically code what your party members were going to do while you were not in control of them (yes you could control them too) was very advanced for a 2006 game. It has only been simplified and dumbed down since. In 2016 we have Mass Effect style "party" members that we can tell to do shit once in a while and no party switching cause its too hard. Xenoblade and what has come since is like playing with Duplos after you got a taste for Lego. Put those systems in the game but have an auto setting for people who don't want to futz around with that shit.
The only thing I didn't care for was how the gambits were made available to you. Too slow of a trickle. I wanted all the options available right from the start. Just limit how many different conditions I could set up through the story rather than having to troll around for all the various status effects etc. I haven't played the Zodiac releases, have they changed that?
jasminlovesyoux
Banned
I'm commander baassshh!!!!
That's all I remember about Vaan at this point. I hate his attire too.
I want to hear the new soundtrack. Sucks.
Yeah, would be nice to hear the new soundtrack too.
Dat Pec vest
The only bad thing about Vaan's design is his inward abs. Otherwise he's basically a slightly fancier FF-version of Aladdin. Nothing too outrageous about his attire.
Basch was changed due to Square meddling. It's readily apparent with some of the things FF12 has, especially toward the end when they were rushing to finish it after Matsuno got sick due to the schedule of them wanting it out the door (but hey at least it isn't a FF15 situation!).
DiipuSurotu
Banned
It did but I always thought the political intrigue and social commentary of the first half of the game was more interesting than the usual "save the world from evil demons" trope that emerged towards the end.
The reason Vagrant Story stayed strong is because they had to cut half of the story to meet the deadline and budget, lol
Imagine Final Fantasy 12 without Vaan.
It's not hard to do.
Nothing to get in the way of the plot,
No Penelo too,
Imagine all the others,
Telling their story in peace...
SoulUnison
Banned
XII is my favorite Final Fantasy, but I always laugh when I think back over the bullet points of the plot.
It's basically Aladdin meets Skies of Arcadia with a dash of Game of Thrones.
It's basically Aladdin meets Skies of Arcadia with a dash of Game of Thrones.
Shadowheart
Member
Just don't open the first box you see in the game or you won't get the Zodiac spear- the strongest weapon in the game. That's a shitty move from the designer.
And now, maybe I can finish all the hunting quests. I liked those. I can't remember if I got all of them or not, but I do remember some of them were difficult.
And now, maybe I can finish all the hunting quests. I liked those. I can't remember if I got all of them or not, but I do remember some of them were difficult.