No, it isn't. Even if you are a tipped employee, your employer cannot pay you less than the minimum wage. They can credit a portion of your tips against your wage, but that does not reduce their obligation to pay you at least minimum wage.
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Forced to pay 25% tip at a restaurant
- Thread starter gaming_noob
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No, it isn't. Even if you are a tipped employee, your employer cannot pay you less than the minimum wage. They can credit a portion of your tips against your wage, but that does not reduce their obligation to pay you at least minimum wage.
I think that most usages of credit cards on those terminals result in a ~5-7% fee for the management for use, which is why you don't see corner stores allow the use of credit. It's in bad faith to mandate a charge for credit card use in a restaurant, however, and to insist upon a 18% gratuity plus 7% credit fee is downright dodgy shit for a 2-person party.
8+ people party? Absolutely include a mandatory 15% gratuity. It's there to make up for shortcomings and lengthy "Wait, who forgot to pay...?" bullshit lollygagging that stops service and could usually result in actual lost wages. 18% is the standard, even though I think it's too much (and that's from someone who used to bus tables). Anything higher is bullshit.
(Also, for Non-tarians in the thread, minimum wage in Ontario is $10.25, with server minimum being $8.90. The disparity between the two worlds is quite low, and bartenders and waitresses can rake on busy weekends. Meanwhile, bussers have to wade through tirades of people and get tipped out on %age of retail sales. Harder work = less pay.)
ScottSullivan
Member
I'm a server, I thrive on always being able to get 20% + from my guests. I earn it.
An automatic 25% gratuity would anger me, and it's probably illegal.
An automatic 25% gratuity would anger me, and it's probably illegal.
Charles Foster Kane
Rosebud
It's times like this I'm glad we don't fucking tip in my country. I'll never tip.
-MD-
Member
Third world?
You think tipping is a sign of progress? Lol
OverBlood 3
Banned
Being paid enough not to have to live off tips, so backwards right?
I would of kicked off literal hell.
The customer decides if they want to tip and how much. Always.
I would of immediately demanded the money back. If they refused to give it to me I would of gone straight to Trading Standards.
And yes I know all about America's crazy backwards wage robbing employers.
But the customer is always in the right in this situation.
The customer decides if they want to tip and how much. Always.
I would of immediately demanded the money back. If they refused to give it to me I would of gone straight to Trading Standards.
And yes I know all about America's crazy backwards wage robbing employers.
But the customer is always in the right in this situation.
BossLackey
Gold Member
I was under the impression that this was not the case at all.
Zoe
Member
It is the case, by law.
phillipgessert
Member
I like how in tipping threads, Americans are constantly bombarded with reminders that not everyplace is the US. Yet in this case, which did not take place in the US, no one is missing a chance to point out that America specifically is dumb re: tipping.
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
I tip 10% or 15% when I get amazing service, 25% sounds excessive.
Daniel Jackson
Member
Now that we're on the subject, is this actually a common thing in the US?
Room on the receipt for a tip?
Room on the receipt for a tip?
phillipgessert
Member
Now that we're on the subject, is this actually a common thing in the US?
Room on the receipt for a tip?
Very common.
Zoe
Member
Now that we're on the subject, is this actually a common thing in the US?
Room on the receipt for a tip?
That is almost always what you will get. The only time I've seen something different is when they have iPads to use Square.
Legally, it is. Though due to the relative complexity of the law and the administration thereof, it's an area ripe for abuse by employers.
EDIT: It's also worth noting that (a) the amount of tips an employer can credit against a tipped employee's wages varies by state (with some states banning the practice entirely), and (b) the kind of "mandatory tips" described in the OP are not considered "tips" for the purpose of calculating the wages owed to an employee.
That's federal cash minimum wage with the maximum tip credit allowed under federal law.
Walter Matthau
Member
Federal wage for these employees is $2.13 an hour.
stufte
Member
but if tips don't equal federal minimum wage ($7.25), it's automatically adjusted to that.
Daniel Jackson
Member
Interesting. They really are gently pushing you into tipping that way. Funny to see how different it is across the world.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
Toronto is in Canada
Zoe
Member
It's been the standard for so long, I don't think there's really any pressure there. Nothing stopping you from putting down a zero.
The ones that are pressuring you are the counter-service places where you have to pay up front before receiving any food/service.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
Canada is not America? Sorry about that, Canada.
Another tipping thread and another opportunity for entitled waiters to push their beliefs that anything less than 20% is a poor joke. It has to stop. 15% is standard and anything more is something to be grateful for.
Another tipping thread and another opportunity for entitled waiters to push their beliefs that anything less than 20% is a poor joke. It has to stop. 15% is standard and anything more is something to be grateful for.
For those who don't know, the OP/Toronto is in Canada, specifically Ontario.
I think the server minimum wage law is that it is 2 dollars less than minimum? So it would be 9 dollars. Even then, I can't think of any restaurants that pay their servers minimum wage, let alone server minimum wage - this is from half a year working in an employment centre, so it's not like I'm an expert
I think the server minimum wage law is that it is 2 dollars less than minimum? So it would be 9 dollars. Even then, I can't think of any restaurants that pay their servers minimum wage, let alone server minimum wage - this is from half a year working in an employment centre, so it's not like I'm an expert
Servers get paid half of what minimum wage is, at least that is how it is here in Maryland where servers get paid $3.63/hour. And they only get reinbursed if all their tips for the entire pay period don't equal minimum wage.
joeygreco1985
Member
Usually when I go to a restaurant in the GTA and they add an automatic gratuity because you're in a party larger than 6, its 18%. 25% is stupidly high. Was it mentioned on the menu?
FindMyFarms
Member
bwahaha, genius. I hope i'm not the only one that caught this... i applaud u sir
For Ontario minimum wage law
http://www.labour.gov.on.ca/english/es/pubs/guide/minwage.php
As of June 1st, it'll be 9.55 for servers who handle alcohol. 11 for everyone else.
http://www.labour.gov.on.ca/english/es/pubs/guide/minwage.php
As of June 1st, it'll be 9.55 for servers who handle alcohol. 11 for everyone else.
BurnOutBrighter
Banned
New Zealander here, I'm glad I don't have to deal with this. I understand that waiters and service staff are paid really low otherwise, but that just shows that it's a cultural byproduct of a shitty sytem.
phillipgessert
Member
Yes, fight back against those brats! Who haven't even set foot in this thread, and regarding a subject no one is talking about!
stufte
Member
Yep, if the total pay including tips at the end of the pay period is less than federal minimum wage, it has to be offset to match minimum wage by the employer.
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
Almost as crazy as me getting charged automatic tip at a fucking bar the other night. It was me and like five of my friends. We all had separate checks. We all got an automatic tip. The funny thing is I would have rounded it up to $20 ($16-something bill) and left almost a $4 tip. Instead the automatic tip put it at $2.91.
Zoe
Member
Few people advocate 25%. And that's beside the fact given there was no warning.
Parties of 6 or more usually get automatic gratuity. That's just the way the system works, and sometimes it doesn't work out in the best interest of the server, as your scenario illustrates.
Also, go to restaurants in that large a group, expect automatic grat.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Nah, Im from Spain, and the majority of people usually leave a small tip if its a normal service (basically the change), and a good tip if the service was really good. If the service was bad, no tip at all, goodbye and have a nice day.
It's true that waiters are paid much more than american ones, and our food is usually more expensive though.
Now that we're on the subject, is this actually a common thing in the US?
Room on the receipt for a tip?
Pretty much common at every restaurant.
hmmm food is not more expensive. i mean, you pay in euros but the food that we can eat for low prices is very good.
and people don't tip here. i don't know where in spain do you live but here in madrid the majority of people don't tip. and if they tip they leave like 1 or 2 euros, even if the bill is big.
AlphaTwo00
Member
Average Toronto tipping is 15-18%. TOGaf meetups have averaged 30% usually, but forced 25%? You'll never see us visit for sure.
I would make sure to NEVER go to that restaurant again + write their name on GAF and their reviews on the net to make sure other people beware.
I was once at a restaurant just with my mom and I was forced 18%. I would have tipped the same anyways, but the fact it's forced made me never go there again.
I was once at a restaurant just with my mom and I was forced 18%. I would have tipped the same anyways, but the fact it's forced made me never go there again.
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
Im all for tipping well, but don't dare impose a tip on me of 25%...I understand the usual 18% on a big party, but its a GRATUITY, not a tax, its paid when you make me happy with service and food that is very good. You cannot TELL me what to tip...and again, Im a pretty decent tipper...and I'll even usually still tip good even if the food sucks, cause the wait staff isn't cooking. But, be a crap waiter, and I'll probably come in a little under 15% (still good considering)
I'd have probably politely offered 20% in that situation.
I'd have probably politely offered 20% in that situation.
Well, actually, when you're a large group that gratuity is a tax and, yes, you have to pay it.
If you don't like that, you can find an establishment that doesn't auto grat large groups or fire up the grill and have a cookout at home.
JzeroT1437
Member
If it was a line item in the receipt, it was probably published somewhere in the restaurant, like on the menu.
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