For one, true happiness isn't necessarily a real thing, nor is it the 'end goal' of anything. And there's nothing arbitrary about emotions we experience when immersing ourselves in digital experiences. VR is a more powerful digital experience of course, but the general premise of achieving any sort of happiness through digital means isn't a new concept.
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Former Valve VR dev: "I think VR is bad news"
- Thread starter Man
- Start date
R
Retro_
Unconfirmed Member
It completely shuts off your senses to the world around you
Get a phone call or the baby starts crying or someone comes in your house and you probably will drop the game to react to those things and interact with the people causing them. The goal of Vr is to shut out all of that and only let you perceive what's in the game
It's not about social elements in game, but about how it shuts you off to the everyday ones around you. And I think that's interesting to think about
plagiarize
Banned
No it doesn't. I have one. I've had it over a year.
R
Retro_
Unconfirmed Member
Hes not talking about now. He's talking about where the tech is going
Thats not where its going. In fact, I would expect cv1 to have a pass through camera. Samsung gear vr already does.
Clockwork5
Member
He is not really blaming the tech but the weakness of humankind and our tendecy to over indulge. And yes there will be some who allow it to impact their lives...
I'm looking forward to it as a peripheral. But it really doesn't appeal to me in a way that it would take over my television gaming.
I'm looking forward to it as a peripheral. But it really doesn't appeal to me in a way that it would take over my television gaming.
lukeskymac
Member
No, he's not. Two people sitting in the same room, reading different books, can still have meaningful interaction with each. My wife and I often put on some music, sit together and read, and it's a much more social experience than it would be if we were wearing headsets. We are seeing the same things, hearing the same things, can see each other's expressions.
The reading itself is a solitary experience, but it's an experience that's conducive to quick social interactions.
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
We're already in a VR world though. Some gods got tired of their responsibilities and decided to plug in for 70 or 80 years as a simple human. It's just a necessary cycle, brahs.
CosmicQueso
Member
I dunno, the widespread adoption of google glass, smart watches, etc is far from a given.
Plus...
Brought. The. Noise. Nailed it.
I dunno, the widespread adoption of google glass, smart watches, etc is far from a given.
Plus...
Counter: (NSFW) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCL_fByftBg
and yet Bluetooth headsets are still a thing.
Turin Turambar
Member
Some of this hubub of the fears of VR because it's going to be TOO GOOD and therefore we are going to give up real life in favor of a virtual MMO game or some experience like that, it's all so exaggerated.
I predict VR games are going to be like normal video games, just one step more immersive. But you know, at the end of the day it's not like the Matrix or the Holodeck, I'm going to be seating on my home pressing a button while a character is running around in the game slashing a sword, it's not like I'm really going to believe I'm the character. And of course, VR doesn't do anything to improve the limits that current video games have like limited interaction (there is only a few ways you can interact in a game, because it has to be coded beforehand), limited dumb AI, etc. You are still going to have a npc with an exclamation point above him and three dialog options with VR.
In other words, again: no, not like Matrix. Not even like SAO. Much, much more like the actual video games we play every day.
I predict VR games are going to be like normal video games, just one step more immersive. But you know, at the end of the day it's not like the Matrix or the Holodeck, I'm going to be seating on my home pressing a button while a character is running around in the game slashing a sword, it's not like I'm really going to believe I'm the character. And of course, VR doesn't do anything to improve the limits that current video games have like limited interaction (there is only a few ways you can interact in a game, because it has to be coded beforehand), limited dumb AI, etc. You are still going to have a npc with an exclamation point above him and three dialog options with VR.
In other words, again: no, not like Matrix. Not even like SAO. Much, much more like the actual video games we play every day.
PanicFreak
Member
I've seen my favorite band play 30 plus times, streamed their shows live over the Internet but I've never once purchased a pay-per-view.
What you're talking about is a big fancy pay-per-view and I seriously doubt you would plunk down the cash necessary to watch the band and sit by yourself in a room to watch.
The people I know that run pay-per-views at their house always invite friends over to watch with them.
Nexus Zero
Member
I've had one for over a year and are you high? Or not high enough? You stick one of these on, with a pair of headphones, and as far as I'm concerned the only thing that's keeping me tethered, conceptually, to the real world, is the wire I have to keep passing over my head as I turn round. And that's DK1. Just imagine.
Alx
Member
I dunno, the widespread adoption of google glass, smart watches, etc is far from a given.
Plus...
I agree that the current model of Glasses will face the hurdle of aesthetics and crowd perception. Still, it shouldn't be too hard to see more fashionable models appear in the future. I think they even had partnership with big designers on that topic. Of course it will be expensive at first, but in 10-20 years, who can tell.
I don't agree with that. First I think almost all of the Gaf crowd has its introvert moments, by the very activity of playing videogames. That doesn't mean we can't see the risks of such activity. I am myself interested in VR and may probably own such devices in the future, just like I do have a smartphone that I use daily. I'm even the perfect audience (no wife, no kid, disposable income). But I can be conscious of some of the side effects of such technology, and I don't think it would be safe for our society to befull of introverts.
Cool, the people I know who buy pay-per-views do so just about every night at about $7 a movie from comcast and watch it alone in their house because they can't be bothered to go to the redbox down the street.
The only physical album I've bought in the last decade was a nine-inch-nails release because it came with video footage of their concerts.
See how anecdotal evidence works?
PanicFreak
Member
I'm sorry but a pay-per-view of a concert with 360 degree cameras won't cost 7 bucks. It will cost 100 or more.
And you can always go to YouTube and watch Nine-Inch-Nails concert videos.
thekiddfran
Member
Amazing that people on here are saying this guy is wrong and neogaf is right. This guy is actually involved with VR in Valve, if he is worried then so am I.
Well if you say so, it must be true!
I'm working with VR. And I could post other valve employees who think VR is a great thing. So....
jackissocool
Member
It's certainly not a future I'm looking forward to.
thekiddfran
Member
Then do it please. The more I hear about the VR the better
Start with this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-2dQoeqVVo
If you'd like a philosophical overview of what this can do for society:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShVcN1HPzUw
Want some concrete benefits of VR?
Oculus enables dying grandmother to walk outside one last time
Oculus Rift cures lazy eye, enables people to see stereoscopy for first time in their life
Forming your own opinion using available information is too hard, I guess.
LittleNemoNES
Banned
The real problem with VR is that it is in the hands of Facebook.
I can't even begin to express how terrible that is. Pretty much everything that there is no explicit law against can be expected to occur.
Add to that secret handshakes between facebook and NSA and you've got pre-crime detection in your GTA 7 + Occulus Rift.
I can't even begin to express how terrible that is. Pretty much everything that there is no explicit law against can be expected to occur.
Add to that secret handshakes between facebook and NSA and you've got pre-crime detection in your GTA 7 + Occulus Rift.
Oculus is in the hands of facebook. Oculus is not the only player in VR anymore. In about 2 months Samsung enters the game, and Sony is waiting in the wings, and Oculus themselves holds 0 patents on their headset. There will be many, many VR headsets to choose from, just as there are many TV manufacturers. They'll all work under the same API that unifies them, being created right now by Valve.
I personally find it more odd when people suggest we need to be connected/around people 24/7 socially more than those who want "alone time". Those who don't have time to themselves, who can't just "get away" tend to get burnt out. There is a reason why many psych's suggest we should have our alone time.
The push for us being socially connected 24/7 is far more scary than anything else tbh. Seeing you, seeing what you're doing every second of the day is creepy.
Unfortunately for this person his tech lost for now. VR is dominate, the holy grail, in a medium which strives to create alternative, immersive world. AR has it's uses, but it's not the end all be all until we can design it with the power to have real feel in an environment, for example picking up an item, seeing it, holding it in our hands and running around using it in our true environment for sporting purposes as an example.
The push for us being socially connected 24/7 is far more scary than anything else tbh. Seeing you, seeing what you're doing every second of the day is creepy.
Unfortunately for this person his tech lost for now. VR is dominate, the holy grail, in a medium which strives to create alternative, immersive world. AR has it's uses, but it's not the end all be all until we can design it with the power to have real feel in an environment, for example picking up an item, seeing it, holding it in our hands and running around using it in our true environment for sporting purposes as an example.
D
Deleted member 752119
Unconfirmed Member
I don't think anyone has suggested a need to be 24/7 connected. Just that it's unhealthy to not have a balanced life. Personally, I just live my life and don't worry about how others are living theirs, as long as they're not hurting others or impacting my life negatively of course.
But that said, someone that spends most of their time completely shut off from social contact has something wrong with them. But so do the people who constantly have to be connected to others and are always calling people, texting, facebooking etc. etc. every waking moment. Just polar opposite personality disorders. But hey, neither is hurting others, so why should I care?
I mean, dude worked for a PC developer. The only social interaction that platform has EVER had has been the "limited, abstracted, ultimately alienated" world of online gaming.
Why playing an MP game, with VR and voice chat, is any less social than playing with a controller and a headset, I can't fathom.
Why playing an MP game, with VR and voice chat, is any less social than playing with a controller and a headset, I can't fathom.
plagiarize
Banned
Not high. Married. My wife has no problem attracting my attention when I'm using my rift. I love it, but you are not completely isolated. There are ways to make it more isolating I guess, but I don't think those changes are going to be standard.
Exploding8
Member
You think Facebook, Samsung, and sony are all going to cede control of the API to valve? That seems vanishingly unlikely.
That's a good question. I don't actually know the answer. What does local multiplayer VR feel like? If you both want to play the same thing, does two headsets turn VR into the same sort of shared experience as watching TV together?
CosmicQueso
Member
Society would benefit from its members spending more moments alone, reflecting on themselves and the world around them, or in meaningful one on one conversation and interaction. My goodness, if the world were full of only extroverts. what a nightmare world it would be.
So it's a good thing that there are both types of people out there to varying degrees, and that reasonable people will be able to use this technology in a safe way.
Alx
Member
Of course the opposite extreme would be just as bad. But the current trends are generating introversion, so that's where the issue currently is.
Either there is a lack of reasonable people, or reasonable people already proved they are not able to use technology in a safe way. It is basically impossible today to have a group meeting without having people ignoring each other to browse their phone. Even for 5 minutes, that would have been extremely rude a few years ago, now it's just common practice. That's how reasonable people are.
And I'm not even mentioning people killing each other on the road because they answered the phone while driving.
KnockOneOff
Banned
Have to say I'm agreeing with this guy
For the past 15 years I have always pushed technology forward and I have always wanted to be in with the latest tech
Where we are going with the Internet and VR scares me
The social network seems to be killing socialism in the real world
It's everywhere in a cafe, in a bar, first dates etc etc everyone sits with there face in there phones
Even talking through Facebook rather than face to face
Me too am starting to push away from driving this technology forward and I'm starting to become resistant to it
I'm an IT contractor with a school that houses 50 children with autism and I'm so much more resistant now than ever about putting more tech and introducing more in to the school and there daily environment
Ahhhh where to head and in which direction.....
For the past 15 years I have always pushed technology forward and I have always wanted to be in with the latest tech
Where we are going with the Internet and VR scares me
The social network seems to be killing socialism in the real world
It's everywhere in a cafe, in a bar, first dates etc etc everyone sits with there face in there phones
Even talking through Facebook rather than face to face
Me too am starting to push away from driving this technology forward and I'm starting to become resistant to it
I'm an IT contractor with a school that houses 50 children with autism and I'm so much more resistant now than ever about putting more tech and introducing more in to the school and there daily environment
Ahhhh where to head and in which direction.....
You realize the hypocrisy in announcing you're pulling away from this... online, on a message board, via electronically sent text, to a bunch of strangers. Right?
KnockOneOff
Banned
Who else can I tell? There all looking at screens?
And I also have a problem, I'm just in the virtual world as you and everyone else reading this
Do you never become a little frustrated?
That type of gaming tickles peoples social needs, which is what helps people stick with it and be addicted and such (I'm speaking from YEARS of eperience) but ultimately tends to leave people isolated and unsocialized.
No. I view my body as a conduit for my mind. My physical self is nothing but a husk for input. One permanently wired to our brains, sure, but a conduit none the less.
This might tie into my religious beliefs, however. Which are to say I hold none. I don't think there is anything beyond our life. When I've told people this, I've had them take it to extremes and ask if I could place my brain into a robotic body that would live forever, would I? To which I answer: "Absolutely!"
I see no real difference speaking to someone in front of me as I do communicating through a computer beyond the amount of information I can transmit at once (with real life offering me far more forms of communication). I think the beauty in life comes from transmitting ideas and thoughts from one individual to another, regardless of medium. It's not the kind of interaction that matters to me, just the interaction at all.
Let me ask you this: Do you believe people can fall in love long distance? If so, what are they falling in love with? Physicality is just a small part of my existence.
I get annoyed when people are out and spend too much time on their phones too, but I do feel that its hard to say they are being anti-social when they are at least out and about with friends.
Take that, Obama!
Isn't myspace owned by Rupert Murdock...