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Games Journalism! Wainwright/Florence/Tomb Raider/Eurogamer/Libel Threats/Doritos

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T

TheBaronOfNA

Banned
endresults said:
p6SWL.png



He's our Ebert.
Click to expand...

He is the hero that games journalism deserve...
 
J

Jake Tower

Banned
By the way, this needs to be turned into a .gif of the transformation

gkd0kn2.jpg


(I don't think the situation with Geoff is a big deal, but the pic is still hilarious)
 
D

Dawg

Member
ElectricBlue187 said:
It occours to me that the thread title is missing the delicious taste of the Dew, a taste no gamer should ever be without.
Click to expand...

Mountain Dew has only been available in my country since a few weeks, I have to admit that this thread made me want to buy a few bottles.

...Along with some doritos.

He's in my head, GAF. Muffin Geoff is in my head.
 
P

params7

Banned
Read on /v/ Wainright claimed on twitter she never wrote any reviews for SE games (as she gets freebies from them) but apparently that was a blatant lie, and she later deleted the tweet. True?
 
D

Dawg

Member
params7 said:
Read on /v/ Wainright claimed on twitter she never wrote any reviews for SE games (as she gets freebies from them) but apparently that was a blatant lie, and she later deleted the tweet. True?
Click to expand...

I linked the Tomb Raider: Guardian Of Light review earlier (which is apparently deleted too) and there's a photo out there with a Deus Ex review (The Sun) which she wrote.
 
Z

zaxon

Member
params7 said:
Read on /v/ Wainright claimed on twitter she never wrote any reviews for SE games (as she gets freebies from them) but apparently that was a blatant lie, and she later deleted the tweet. True?
Click to expand...

Wrong. She said she never reviewed the games she "consulted" on.

Edit: Here's the image.

hpTAU.png
 
C

CambriaRising

Member
zaxon said:
Wrong. She said she never reviewed the games she "consulted" on.
Click to expand...

That isn't what she said. It could be argued that she implied that, but it is irrelevant beings the pieces she wrote have been taken down. The absence of evidence is evidence enough at this point.
 
I

I H8 Memes

Member
People aren't seeing the forest for the trees here. This woman is a very small separate issue. What the writer was saying in the Eurogamer article was that this is industry wide. We all know this, and that should be the focus of our attention. She may have been the person he mentioned by name, but nearly every other pretenda-journalist in the gaming industry does this.
 
Surface of Me

Surface of Me

I'm not an NPC. And neither are we.
Can someone do some sort of recap? I knew what happened initially in this thread, but now have no idea what the fuck is going on.
 
D

Dawg

Member
TheSeks said:
Dew and Doritos' cupcake image.jpg that someone posted earlier in this thread here.
Click to expand...

I was the original creator, but then someone (can't remember who at the moment) changed it by adding the eyes and the green hands.

As the creator of Muffin Geoff™ I have to admit the current version is (much) better.
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
I H8 Memes said:
People aren't seeing the forest for the trees here. This woman is a very small separate issue. What the writer was saying in the Eurogamer article was that this is industry wide. We all know this, and that should be the focus of our attention. She may have been the person he mentioned by name, but nearly every other pretenda-journalist in the gaming industry does this.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it's an epidemic. But I don't see it ever changing, frankly. Too many complicit, incestuous parties and a chilling effect on those who dare to speak out.
 
Z

zaxon

Member
Rez said:
She later clarified this, but it certainly wasn't the initial statement.
Click to expand...

She said "the products", referring specifically to her consulting work in the previous sentence, not "their products", meaning their games in general.
 
Evolved1

Evolved1

make sure the pudding isn't too soggy but that just ruins everything
CambriaRising said:
That isn't what she said. It could be argued that she implied that, but it is irrelevant beings the pieces she wrote have been taken down. The absence of evidence is evidence enough at this point.
Click to expand...

No they haven't, this was debunked too.
 
R

reptilescorpio

Member
I H8 Memes said:
People aren't seeing the forest for the trees here. This woman is a very small separate issue. What the writer was saying in the Eurogamer article was that this is industry wide. We all know this, and that should be the focus of our attention. She may have been the person he mentioned by name, but nearly every other pretenda-journalist in the gaming industry does this.
Click to expand...

What do we do aside from call out journalists who do the wrong thing? I am genuinely asking, I would be irritated if nothing changes in the industry once the heat dies down. All I can see is that journalists will be more careful with what opinions they let the public in on from here on out.
 
O

Oersted

Member
I'll do a short recap:
Keighley surrounded by doritos followed by gaming bloggers retweeting a hashtag for advertising to win a PS3 makes Florence of Eurogamer curious.
Florence writes an article saying how things are shady and some sound like straight up PR e.g. Wainright orgasms for everything Squenix.
Eurogamer/Wainwright send libel threats to Eurogamer, at which the article was edited to remove mentioning of Wainright.
Wainwright responds in twitter "Apology accepted" and something in the vain of applying her law classes to use.
Florence either steps down or is forced to resign to avoid any libel threat.
Both sides deny any threat or are not talking about it directly, but twitter posts hint that such threat existed. Florence is not confirming or denying whether he was fired or he stepped down.
"GAF and 4chan combine forces to see this standalone complex issue" alongside digital protest from Penny Arcade and more, showing what happened.
Wainwright's profile shows she is a freelancer for Square Enix. She admitted it and denied doing any reviews for Square Enix or shilling (she is wrong. She reviewed Deus Ex, Tomb Raider and did countless previews).
All this fiasco is too much for her and she privatize her twitter account. Next thing you know, she starts deleting tweets, videos and articles, and edits her profile to remove any mention of Square Enix freelancing.
People find some comments of her thanking someone called Korina that used to work at Ubisoft.
Korina Abbot used to work at Ubisoft and is currently the marketing executive at...Square-Enix.
David Jaffe offers Keighley Mountain Dew.
Gaming journalism.
Click to expand...

Credits to JSDN and Shagg
 
S

SlasherJPC

Banned
Hell I even made a video about this topic on my youtube (I barely cover news on my channel) . I can't really believe this story and how it all panned out. :( Writer who left Eurogamer had balls! Big balls!
 
I

I H8 Memes

Member
reptilescorpio said:
What do we do aside from call out journalists who do the wrong thing? I am genuinely asking, I would be irritated if nothing changes in the industry once the heat dies down. All I can see is that journalists will be more careful with what opinions they let the public in on from here on out.
Click to expand...


Take them for what they are worth, 2nd rate PR. That's really what they are. Not good enough to get the PR job, but a decent enough writer or spokesman to repeat the PR releases.

Watch them for the trailers and video clips, the magazines for the early info if you want. But never take what they say as to the quality of a game seriously. And never buy a game based on their opinions or ratings. You cant trust those at all. Judge a game based on your own instincts when you see the trailers combined with the impressions of your fellow gamers.
 
Evolved1

Evolved1

make sure the pudding isn't too soggy but that just ruins everything
I H8 Memes said:
Take them for what they are worth, 2nd rate PR. That's really what they are. Not good enough to get the PR job, but a decent enough writer or spokesman to repeat the PR releases.

Watch them for the trailers and video clips, the magazines for the early info if you want. But never take what they say as to the quality of a game seriously. And never buy a game based on their opinions or ratings. You cant trust those at all. Judge a game based on your own instincts when you see the trailers combined with the impressions of your fellow gamers.
Click to expand...

Wise words.
 
H

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
reptilescorpio said:
What do we do aside from call out journalists who do the wrong thing? I am genuinely asking, I would be irritated if nothing changes in the industry once the heat dies down. All I can see is that journalists will be more careful with what opinions they let the public in on from here on out.
Click to expand...

Because it turns into a public shaming of one individual and internet detectives tripping over themselves to continue the pile on instead of discussing the bigger issues.
 
R

reptilescorpio

Member
I H8 Memes said:
Take them for what they are worth, 2nd rate PR. That's really what they are. Not good enough to get the PR job, but a decent enough writer or spokesman to repeat the PR releases.

Watch them for the trailers and video clips, the magazines for the early info if you want. But never take what they say as to the quality of a game seriously. And never buy a game based on their opinions or ratings. You cant trust those at all. Judge a game based on your own instincts when you see the trailers combined with the impressions of your fellow gamers.
Click to expand...

Well I guess I could just accept the majority will never get better. At least we still have RPS, Idle Thumbs, etc.

Just a bit depressing :(
 
I

IdreamofHIME

Member
TheGreatDivide said:
People are only calling her a victim because she's female.
Click to expand...

Problem is, some people are victimising her. There's individuals spamming her with sexist comments on steam while encouraging others to do so and others spamming her website's comments section calling her a bitch.

I was called a white knight earlier for pointing those out, but it's true.

She's dirty and clearly corrupt, but thanks to the mindless few out-there the true story of her failures and shortcomings can clouded easily by the personal attacks.

It's our responsibility to keep those idiots in check during this, or we'll ending up in another "Tropes Vs" situation where the argument was lost due to these idiots.

So far it seems to be working.
 
A

Antiwhippy

the holder of the trombone
I H8 Memes said:
Take them for what they are worth, 2nd rate PR. That's really what they are. Not good enough to get the PR job, but a decent enough writer or spokesman to repeat the PR releases.

Watch them for the trailers and video clips, the magazines for the early info if you want. But never take what they say as to the quality of a game seriously. And never buy a game based on their opinions or ratings. You cant trust those at all. Judge a game based on your own instincts when you see the trailers combined with the impressions of your fellow gamers.
Click to expand...

You know it is perfectly possible to enjoy editorial content about gaming, and they are not all PR pieces.

Generalising everyone doing gaming "journalism" isn't really wise either. You're discrediting alot of people who do genuinely interesting stuff.
 
A

antikythera

Banned
I H8 Memes said:
Take them for what they are worth, 2nd rate PR. That's really what they are. Not good enough to get the PR job, but a decent enough writer or spokesman to repeat the PR releases.

Watch them for the trailers and video clips, the magazines for the early info if you want. But never take what they say as to the quality of a game seriously. And never buy a game based on their opinions or ratings. You cant trust those at all. Judge a game based on your own instincts when you see the trailers combined with the impressions of your fellow gamers.
Click to expand...

It's not 2nd rate PR, it's PR that comes with an illusion of impartiality, which can be even better. Why else would publishers go to them when they could just put the early info on their own websites or youtube accounts?
 
T

TheGreatDivide

Banned
IdreamofHIME said:
Problem is, some people are victimising her. There's individuals spamming her with sexist comments on steam while encouraging others to do so and others spamming her website's comments section calling her a bitch.

I was called a white knight earlier for pointing those out, but it's true.

She's dirty and clearly corrupt, but thanks to the mindless few out-there the true story of her failures and shortcomings can clouded easily by the personal attacks.

It's our responsibility to keep those idiots in check during this, or we'll ending up in another "Tropes Vs" situation where the argument was lost due to these idiots.

So far it seems to be working.
Click to expand...

People are far too eager to make the woman a victim. It's patronising. Words are meaningless on the Internet.
 
Y

yn-neko hates a cat

Banned
I'll do a short recap:
Keighley surrounded by doritos followed by gaming bloggers retweeting a hashtag for advertising to win a PS3 makes Florence of Eurogamer curious.
Florence writes an article saying how things are shady and some sound like straight up PR e.g. Wainright orgasms for everything Squenix.
Eurogamer/Wainwright send libel threats to Eurogamer, at which the article was edited to remove mentioning of Wainright.
Wainwright responds in twitter "Apology accepted" and something in the vain of applying her law classes to use.
Florence either steps down or is forced to resign to avoid any libel threat.
Both sides deny any threat or are not talking about it directly, but twitter posts hint that such threat existed. Florence is not confirming or denying whether he was fired or he stepped down.
"GAF and 4chan combine forces to see this standalone complex issue" alongside digital protest from Penny Arcade and more, showing what happened.
Wainwright's profile shows she is a freelancer for Square Enix. She admitted it and denied doing any reviews for Square Enix or shilling (she is wrong. She reviewed Deus Ex, Tomb Raider and did countless previews).
All this fiasco is too much for her and she privatize her twitter account. Next thing you know, she starts deleting tweets, videos and articles, and edits her profile to remove any mention of Square Enix freelancing.
People find some comments of her thanking someone called Korina that used to work at Ubisoft.
Korina Abbot used to work at Ubisoft and is currently the marketing executive at...Square-Enix.
David Jaffe offers Keighley Mountain Dew.
Gaming journalism.
Click to expand...

I'm late to all of this... This seems like (from the summary at least) it had fuckall to do with Keighley so why is he being dragged through the mud for doing what he always does: Work with publishers to get exclusive coverage for his channel? Who the fuck watches his programing being unable to distinguish hype from news? So because he has product placement in his stage act, you'll never watch another exclusive trailer from him because he has no integrity as a games journalist?

Not really trying to call YOU out (whoever YOU is) but I feel like I'm either missing a big part of this story or someone really jumped the shark.
 
D

DTKT

Member
yn-neko hates a cat said:
I'm late to all of this... This seems like (from the summary at least) it had fuckall to do with Keighley so why is he being dragged through the mud for doing what he always does: Work with publishers to get exclusive coverage for his channel? Who the fuck watches his programing being unable to distinguish hype from news? So because he has product placement in his stage act, you'll never watch another exclusive trailer from him because he has no integrity as a games journalist?

Not really trying to call YOU out (whoever YOU is) but I feel like I'm either missing a big part of this story or someone really jumped the shark.
Click to expand...

There shouldn't be any need to distinguish hype from journalism. The two need to be completely separate. You either work in PR or as a journalist, you can't do both. If anything, both jobs are opposites of each other.
 
J

JABEE

Member
IdreamofHIME said:
Problem is, some people are victimising her. There's individuals spamming her with sexist comments on steam while encouraging others to do so and others spamming her website's comments section calling her a bitch.

I was called a white knight earlier for pointing those out, but it's true.

She's dirty and clearly corrupt, but thanks to the mindless few out-there the true story of her failures and shortcomings can clouded easily by the personal attacks.

It's our responsibility to keep those idiots in check during this, or we'll ending up in another "Tropes Vs" situation where the argument was lost due to these idiots.

So far it seems to be working.
Click to expand...

This can't really be controlled. Whenever any of these incidents happen, the "bad guy" gets inundated with hate messages or random anonymous users post comments on someone's YouTube channel or public twitter account. What does this have to do with this have to do with what happened up to the point of the law suit? Bringing up hate speech that is inevitable with these kinds of story only serve the purpose of redirecting the discussion away from the wrong-doing of the controversial person onto an amorphous blob of random hatred that everyone can agree is bad.

This story can expand outside of this specific incident if outlets were more open about their editorial process and ethical standards. All we can really talk about are the names that are clearly in murky ethical waters. I feel that the dishonesty and defensiveness from the outset has created most of the suspicion that lead to digging into the public works of Wainwright and her relationship with the PR executive at Square.
 
Y

yn-neko hates a cat

Banned
DTKT said:
There shouldn't be any need to distinguish hype from journalism. The two need to be completely separate. You either work in PR or as a journalist, you can't do both. If anything, both jobs are opposites of each other.
Click to expand...

Jobs and roles and things that are done and aren't is all there but I'm guessing I don't understand the connection to him and what he does.
 
M

Mutanthands

Member
TheGreatDivide said:
People are far too eager to make the woman a victim. It's patronising. Words are meaningless on the Internet.
Click to expand...
This is a pretty long thread over "words on the Internet."

Bullying is bulling, and cyber-bullying is just as bad. Replace the face to face humiliation with shear volume and anonymity. It has no place in discussing what she did wrong, which was quite a bit, to say the least.
 
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