I'm still waiting for a game that can top this in terms of story, dialogue, and lore. (the latter two especially, the plot wasn't intrinsically brilliant)
I would argue that dialogue has moved on from what Torment did. It took 11 years but Alpha Protocol has evolved how dialogue works. And a year later Deus Ex Human Revolution came up with its own ingenious mechanic.
The personality inventory systems in Silent Hill: Shattered Memories are ahead of their time, I think.
In particular, the simulated optometrics used to gauge player attention to in-game elements is something that will eventually be done with real eye-tracking hardware, maybe even becoming a standard. It's easy to imagine developers creating more efficient graphics engines when they know exactly where the player is looking at all times, to give a more mundane example of a possible use.
But Shattered Memories uses player feedback, especially subconcsious feedback, to influence its scenarios with a level of depth that will be rare even in the future.
I was going to mention Ico for its storytelling. The only other game I've played that let the player piece together the story and become invested without being told they what they should notice/care about to a similar degree was Journey.
I haven't been so floored by a game's ending in years. I played the HD version of Ico a few months ago, more than 11 years after the original's release, and its final act had more if an impact on me than just about anything during that time span.
Silent Storm. Still no other turn-based game comes even remotely close to that engine and it's destructability. Maybe XCOM: EU might, but from what I've played..it's doubtful.
i still think there are lessons people aren't learning from beyond good & evil. it does the whole cinematic movie-game thing exactly how it should be done- by giving you the most control possible.
Wind Waker for it's generation bending visuals.
Final Fantasy IX for having the best RPG spell effects to date still.
MGS2 for just about everything and a definition for "a generational leap".
Super Mario World for it's organic and seemingly seamless world, yet to be matched in a platformer.
Resident Evil 4 foresaw and entire generation of (inferior) shooter clones and has the best pacing in a videogame to date.
definitely agree with Red Faction. I can't believe that no other game has implemented destructible terrain on such a level. blowing through a wall to snipe your friend in multiplayer was funny
Gameplay was the one of the weakest I've seen. Otherwise, it does live up to the great graphics and physics at that time. Usage of the suit powers felt very archiac and could not be used transitionally in a fluid-like manner. The fact that your sprint could easily drain a perfectly good energy resources and the poor charge-rate prevents the player from utilizing it to it's full potential. For instance, I really wanted to run head first in the middle of the base, punch a few guys, initiate armor when hit, then run towards them at super-speed and leap over their houses than stealth to get behind their flank than shoot in a single chained event. Instead, I'm forced to use ONE and then make the best of it in micro-scenarios that ended up getting myself killed due to the unbelievable hit detection from AI, which results with me utilizing stealth to charge-refill all the way through.
In any case, it's mostly a mediocre shooter. Nathan Drake could easily do the things (without the suit modes) with much flexibility and take out these guys relativity easily due to the less complex nature of the mechanics. This is what is missing from Crysis, not even the streamlined mode of Crysis 2 saved that. Playing it in hard mode only made it more apparent. In fact, most hard mode in games tend to show the weakness of most game mechanics relying only low-health and high-hit detection from enemies.
Wait what? I loved the gameplay in this game, it's my favourite shooter this gen (along with S.T.A.L.K.E.R). It's got good guns (and I loved the real-time customization), lots of way to approach any scenario, and the suit was a game changer. It made the combat a lot more dynamic, making it possible to play the game in even more different ways. For example I finished the whole game by using almost exclusively my fists (punching a throwing stuff at people in strength mode never gets old)... I had heaps of fun during my 7 play throughs, moreso than any other shooter released this gen.
I don't want to sound arrogant or something, but you probably don't really know how to play well if you can't use the suit powers properly, I had absolutely no problem doing so. The most important thing to do is to know how to utilize your energy bar efficiently. Also, using the keyboard shortcuts is essential to swap between the different modes quickly (tap 2 x space bar = strength jump, 2 x T = strength punch, 2 x shift = cloak...).
Also, the only way to play this game is to play in Delta, I don't even see why you would play in any of the lower difficulties, since Delta mode changes the balance of the game, you have less health but the enemies as well, you have a lot less stuff on the HUD (no crosshair, no grenade indicator), you can't fire while driving around, the enemies speak Korean instead of English... It just adds so much to the experience.
I'm still waiting for a FPS to match the pure fun I've had with this game, so I think it definitely fits in this topic for more than just its graphics. Crysis, FPS evolved.
I wasn't completely in agreement with the suggestions that Majora's Mask is still ahead of its time but the "real time" feature of the game, the way time elapses, makes it a one of its kind.
like " this very second is happening something somewhere, for real, you are not the center of the universe anymore, wanna progress? search for stuff in real time "
has that been emulated or replicated in any other game?? I'd like to see a game using that again.
How is Wind Waker still ahead of it's time? Visuals were great back then and many years since but these days not so much other then that it was normal (boring) open world game, with some of the worse dungeons in the series.
edit. visuals still look good but there are games that have surpassed them.
There's been no MP game like it still, and I honestly feel it's still the best "zombie" coop game out there. If only Capcom would bring a HD collection with online play back.
There's been no MP game like it still, and I honestly feel it's still the best "zombie" coop game out there. If only Capcom would bring a HD collection with online play back.
Gameplay was the one of the weakest I've seen. Otherwise, it does live up to the great graphics and physics at that time. Usage of the suit powers felt very archiac and could not be used transitionally in a fluid-like manner. The fact that your sprint could easily drain a perfectly good energy resources and the poor charge-rate prevents the player from utilizing it to it's full potential. For instance, I really wanted to run head first in the middle of the base, punch a few guys, initiate armor when hit, then run towards them at super-speed and leap over their houses than stealth to get behind their flank than shoot in a single chained event. Instead, I'm forced to use ONE and then make the best of it in micro-scenarios that ended up getting myself killed due to the unbelievable hit detection from AI, which results with me utilizing stealth to charge-refill all the way through.
In any case, it's mostly a mediocre shooter. Nathan Drake could easily do the things (without the suit modes) with much flexibility and take out these guys relativity easily due to the less complex nature of the mechanics. This is what is missing from Crysis, not even the streamlined mode of Crysis 2 saved that. Playing it in hard mode only made it more apparent. In fact, most hard mode in games tend to show the weakness of most game mechanics relying only low-health and high-hit detection from enemies.
It does have a Single Player which will let you get a taste of how great it could be with today's online standards.
But since the online is off, a lot of the time you'll be playing it and going
"Man this is pretty great, it would be even more amazing if I could actually be playing with friends right now"
Seriously though, whoever mentioned Exile has to be given a gold star. I had almost forgotten that game but yeah, that was mindblowing on the Amiga. Speaking of awesome Amiga games (don't mind the box)...
Only the X* games and the Space Rangers series have even tried to do what this game did.
Majora's Mask was my first thought. It's mostly to do with the 'finite' time span, which has been echoed very few times since and, to my knowledge, never as successfully. It was ahead of its time, and were it released today I think it would still be ahead of its time in that regard.
MGS2 was a very... courageous move. I don't know how far ahead of its time it would be now because its progressive narrative has been attempted by other games, though arguably it's more successful than most. In that same regard for successful direct communication with the player; even MGS1 is still ahead of its time in terms of execution.
With the exception of its successors, Halo 3 is still ahead of its time in terms of online balancing and match-making. I've not played every online shooter, of course, but not much, if anything, could have surpassed it.
And yeah, Shenmue. It got about as close to living every day life as any other game before getting boring. Such a detailed adventure is still quite difficult to find in modern games, and I don't mean Elder Scrolls or whatever where there's just loads of irrelevant stuff filling up the world. Shenmue's details felt conducive to the main story, and Ryo's journey - forklift adventures included!
There's been no MP game like it still, and I honestly feel it's still the best "zombie" coop game out there. If only Capcom would bring a HD collection with online play back.
I can't agree with the OP on MGS 2's fantastically detailed environments. The ship was, sure, but big shell was as sparse as sparse can get. "Oh look, another orange hexagon, the joy."
It was a first person pseudo 3D space dogfighting game before such games existed. Long before Wing Commander. It also featured a pseudo 3D galactic map, starbase docking and repairs, and a bevvy of keyboard and joystick ship controls including hyperspace flight. I loved the game back in the day, and it was definitely ahead of its time. I wonder how many GAF'ers can say they played it back in the day? (I am that old)
Keep in mind what most games were like in 1979. Star Raiders was not merely ahead of its time, it was light years ahead.
I can't agree with the OP on MGS 2's fantastically detailed environments. The ship was, sure, but big shell was as sparse as sparse can get. "Oh look, another orange hexagon, the joy."
I blame this for the development, it's like they wanted the whole game on a ship and then they decided to make big shell at the end. Which was far less detailed imo. The ship seemed to have endless stuff to check out and I played that part so many times.
Anybody shoot the jar of icecubes in the bare, watch the cubes fall out and melt away?! That's amazing detail.
Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri. Not only was it a great Civ game, it was a great science fiction universe and dug deep into ideology, philosophy and ethics with its future world as its template. The voice-acted technology quotes still ring in my head today:
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." - Commissioner Pravin Lal
Destructible terrain, I mean really destructible terrain. You could mine rock forever. A single player campaign leagues better than Halo's
Multiple vehicle sequences that aren't ass
There was a sequence in the game where you have one real life hour to arm a bomb and then beat the game, arming the bomb too early meant you would have to replay the entire campaign over again, very awesome sequence thinking back.
Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri. Not only was it a great Civ game, it was a great science fiction universe and dug deep into ideology, philosophy and ethics with is future world as its template. The voice-acted technology quotes still ring in my head today:
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." - Commissioner Pravin Lal
I want to expand the Perfect Dark list since some people seem to agree with me.
- Counter Co Op
- Custom tagging based on your behavior during competitive play
- Full stat log with many granular information regarding your performance, both global and per match.
- Customizable multiplayer character model (almost using face mapping)
- Every weapon had 2 fire mods which were really inventive (knife becomes throwing knife, some guns become mines, sentry guns)
- Tons of multiplayer modes
- Fully customizable weapon spawns for multiplayer (only mines and pistols games, etc)
- Target practice mode
- Crazy amount of weapons that actually behave differently than other games (Ping pong grenade, laptop gun)
- Main menu runs on top of the actual game
- Best weapon cycling mechanism in any console FPS game ever (the expanding wheel)
And im probably forgetting so much more, last time I played this game was in 2002 and this is just the stuff I remember.
I'll add to this having just played the XBLA version a bit the other day.
-You could shoot out lights, to create cover of darkness.
-Shoot the weapons out of enemy hands, which they could then retrieve or use a sidearm.
-Wound enemies, who would then limp away bleeding and warn other enemies.
-Wounded enemies left blood trails you could follow.
-Higher difficulties actually added new objectives, boss fights, and encounters rather than just modified health/damage etc.
-You could command AI bots in multi to do your bidding, defend positions, attack certain people, etc.
-You could move around furniture to block doors and provide cover, etc.
-You could make AI surrender to you if they were wounded or you snuck up on them
-It had a hub world in the Carrington Institute that provided mini games and exploration as well as tutorials.
(Not to mention was brought into the actual game proper later on)
-The game had a ton of unlockables attainable by in game achievements, characters, weapons, coop AI partners, even entire missions and levels were unlockable as a bonus.
-game had some awesome lens flare effects for back in the day.
What about the widescreen mod, hi-res mode, surround sound, mp3 playback implementation, extremely vertical levels, see through walls with that one aimbot gun.
And so much more, the feature list in this game would make any developer sweat just thinking about implementing, testing and balancing all this stuff.
I came to say Perfect Dark, but.... yeah... Perfect Dark man, theres just to much to list. Games like PD earned their replay value the hard way man, packed the game to the brim with content options and neat stuff. Nowadays you just tack some sort of online on to it and call it a day.
Embarrassing how so many shooters these days ship without content even close to what PD had.
Ahead of it's time? The only games that have surpassed it have been other Halo games. The few offerings by other developers are pathetic in comparison.
-Massive world map
-Eight campaigns with totally unique stories and variations on boss fights
-3D battles, real time strategy
-Recruitment of enemy generals
-Base & soldier management
I can still view a (partial) list of stats from my first game 8 years ago, though a lot of the really innovative stuff such as the game viewer has had the data purged.
Compare that to something like Battlefield 3 that remembers something like the last 10 games and at its most detailed has a fraction of the information.
I can't help but feel that successive/modern JRPGs and WRPGs are still lacking when compared to the masterpiece that is Ultima VII.
That said, I've also recently played Chrono Trigger - OMG why aren't more JRPGs like this game - brilliant story, graphics, characters, combat, localisation ... I understand now why it's so beloved. I just wish that more people could experience Ultima VII Parts 1 and 2 and hopefully understand our love for it.
edit: so heartening to see mentions of 'Ultima' throughout the thread
I'm still waiting for a game that can top this in terms of story, dialogue, and lore. (the latter two especially, the plot wasn't intrinsically brilliant)
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