Dead Rising - "Save and Quit" as a menu option that deletes your current save and restarts the game. It should go in the Misleading UI hall of shame. (I was never tricked by it, as I'd heard something vague about it before, but other people who'd borrowed the game from me found out the hard way.)
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Good games with surprising bad design choices
- Thread starter ronito
- Start date
MisterHero
Super Member
any game that has death from water
polyh3dron
Banned
Street Fighter IV - Not giving every character their own stage and theme song. WTF
MisterHero
Super Member
it makes sense for him since he's electricProudClod said:
but yes a certain sandbox game was plagued by that problem, among others
I hate it when games (especially fighting games) cause the screen to flash white during hits. A lot of SNK games and all three of the Marvel VS games before MvC2 do this. Can't stand that shit. Watching someone get hit by Chun Li or Gambit's supers makes my eyes hurt.
matrix-cat
Member
GTA IV: Oh Gawd...
- Hold a button to jog. Tap it madly to run. Why? They never pulled that crap in the old GTAs, you could always move at a speed above 'crawl' without having to hold a button. And it's a face button, which means you can't jog and aim, or jog and use your phone, or jog and switch weapons.
- Speaking of, this game desperately needed a weapon wheel. Having to cycle through all ten weapons you're carrying, one by one, using the D-pad was awful. Forget busting out a Sniper Rifle when you see a car speeding past you, it'll be out of the game's memory by the time you've selected it.
- OK, so Hidden Packages were a breeze in Vice City Stories. Only 50 of them, fairly easy to find, rewards for every 10 you find, and they appear on your in-game map when you've found them so you can check them off on a map from the internet. In GTA IV there are now 200 tiny grey pigeons in a gargantuan grey city, impossible to find without a map, no way of knowing which ones you've done, and now you get no reward at all. Great, I'll get right on that.
- No checkpoints in missions, but you get different dialogue when you fail a mission and try it again. So is failing the mission supposed to be canon to the story? You can fail the Bank Heist mission right at the last second, and when you retry it the NPCs will mention that you failed it, so we're supposed to believe Niko actually robbed the bank four times before he succeeded?
- When shooting from a car, the reticule only appears while you're shooting.
- Fucking scripted unwinnable-until-a-certain-point chase missions.
- Hold a button to jog. Tap it madly to run. Why? They never pulled that crap in the old GTAs, you could always move at a speed above 'crawl' without having to hold a button. And it's a face button, which means you can't jog and aim, or jog and use your phone, or jog and switch weapons.
- Speaking of, this game desperately needed a weapon wheel. Having to cycle through all ten weapons you're carrying, one by one, using the D-pad was awful. Forget busting out a Sniper Rifle when you see a car speeding past you, it'll be out of the game's memory by the time you've selected it.
- OK, so Hidden Packages were a breeze in Vice City Stories. Only 50 of them, fairly easy to find, rewards for every 10 you find, and they appear on your in-game map when you've found them so you can check them off on a map from the internet. In GTA IV there are now 200 tiny grey pigeons in a gargantuan grey city, impossible to find without a map, no way of knowing which ones you've done, and now you get no reward at all. Great, I'll get right on that.
- No checkpoints in missions, but you get different dialogue when you fail a mission and try it again. So is failing the mission supposed to be canon to the story? You can fail the Bank Heist mission right at the last second, and when you retry it the NPCs will mention that you failed it, so we're supposed to believe Niko actually robbed the bank four times before he succeeded?
- When shooting from a car, the reticule only appears while you're shooting.
- Fucking scripted unwinnable-until-a-certain-point chase missions.
Almost any third-person game where the right stick does not control the camera. I say almost any because there are a few exceptions where the right stick was used in a neat way and the camera wasn't much of an issue, like the Ape Escape games, Mark of Kri, Pikmin... and that's all I can think of, actually.
Some particularly awful uses of the right stick, off the top of my head:
Ninja Gaiden - The first version, anyway. Tilting the right stick sends you into first-person mode. Horrible idea. I hear Manhunt did this as well.
Oddworld: Munch's Oddyssey - In the rare instances in which you actually have use of a weapon, the right stick aims the weapon in the direction you tilt it (something like Geometry Wars), and clicking it fires. I might be able to understand this design decision if you were frequently using a weapon (though clicking to fire is still a bit odd), but these are pretty rare instances. So throughout most of the game, the right stick is just sitting there, unused, and you have to take your thumb off the left stick and move it to the d-pad to move the camera.
Rogue Squadron 3 - So you hop out of the ship and start running around with your blaster. Naturally, the right stick is used to aim your gun, right? Wrong! The right stick sits there unused for the most part while you rely on an iffy lock-on and a crappy auto-camera. The only time the right stick is used in the on-foot parts is essentially as a context-sensitive button.
Some particularly awful uses of the right stick, off the top of my head:
Ninja Gaiden - The first version, anyway. Tilting the right stick sends you into first-person mode. Horrible idea. I hear Manhunt did this as well.
Oddworld: Munch's Oddyssey - In the rare instances in which you actually have use of a weapon, the right stick aims the weapon in the direction you tilt it (something like Geometry Wars), and clicking it fires. I might be able to understand this design decision if you were frequently using a weapon (though clicking to fire is still a bit odd), but these are pretty rare instances. So throughout most of the game, the right stick is just sitting there, unused, and you have to take your thumb off the left stick and move it to the d-pad to move the camera.
Rogue Squadron 3 - So you hop out of the ship and start running around with your blaster. Naturally, the right stick is used to aim your gun, right? Wrong! The right stick sits there unused for the most part while you rely on an iffy lock-on and a crappy auto-camera. The only time the right stick is used in the on-foot parts is essentially as a context-sensitive button.
ResidentDante
Member
scitek said:
OMG, I had forgot that one :lol
I hated that place in the end too, I think I can retell the dialogue by heart now.
a Master Ninja said:
I agree.
And:
Halo 1 - Flood. Made me think it was Doom 1 all over again.
GTAIV - no checkpoints in missions. Having to drive to a point on the other side of town to start a chase gets real annoying real fast
Ninja Gaiden 2 - Having to block against a boss explosion
turtleboss
PepsimanVsJoe
Member
Tiny Toons Adventures: Buster's Hidden Treasure
Throughout each stage there are carrots everywhere that behave like coins. You collect 50 and you get a 1up...okay no wait you don't get a 1up. Instead you get some useless powerup that destroys all of the enemies on screen. Oh well they also add to your score but I don't see the point in that since you can just retry stages anyway.
The jumping mechanics are outright odd as well. Basically if you release the jump button at any time before Buster reaches the full height of his jump he'll drop like a rock. I guess this was done to make it easier to jump on enemy's heads but in actuality it just makes it easier to jump on insta-death spikes that are freaking everywhere late in the game(and in places where you'd least expect them).
Oh and it's a non-linear platformer with unlimited continues and passwords but when you reach the end of the game they actually take the continues away. The hell?
Speaking of Konami games on the Genesis...
Castlevania Bloodlines had a password system with limited lives and continues. How it works is when you beat the stage the password actually keeps track of your remaining lives and continues. Basically it got to the point that if I died once in a stage I'd just reset and put the password so I'd have a fresh stock. It reminds me of all of the herbs I never used in Resident Evil 4(partly cause even if I get rocked by a boss I'd just kill myself and start fresh rather than use the herbs).
Then again at least Bloodlines has the simple icon-based passwords. In Buster's game the passwords are freaking huge and ridiculous. Oh and Bloodlines at least made an attempt to create a good arcade-style action-platformer. I'm not even sure if I can call Buster's dumbass game a decent platformer.
Nevermind.
Throughout each stage there are carrots everywhere that behave like coins. You collect 50 and you get a 1up...okay no wait you don't get a 1up. Instead you get some useless powerup that destroys all of the enemies on screen. Oh well they also add to your score but I don't see the point in that since you can just retry stages anyway.
The jumping mechanics are outright odd as well. Basically if you release the jump button at any time before Buster reaches the full height of his jump he'll drop like a rock. I guess this was done to make it easier to jump on enemy's heads but in actuality it just makes it easier to jump on insta-death spikes that are freaking everywhere late in the game(and in places where you'd least expect them).
Oh and it's a non-linear platformer with unlimited continues and passwords but when you reach the end of the game they actually take the continues away. The hell?
Speaking of Konami games on the Genesis...
Castlevania Bloodlines had a password system with limited lives and continues. How it works is when you beat the stage the password actually keeps track of your remaining lives and continues. Basically it got to the point that if I died once in a stage I'd just reset and put the password so I'd have a fresh stock. It reminds me of all of the herbs I never used in Resident Evil 4(partly cause even if I get rocked by a boss I'd just kill myself and start fresh rather than use the herbs).
Then again at least Bloodlines has the simple icon-based passwords. In Buster's game the passwords are freaking huge and ridiculous. Oh and Bloodlines at least made an attempt to create a good arcade-style action-platformer. I'm not even sure if I can call Buster's dumbass game a decent platformer.
Nevermind.
boiled goose
good with gravy
ResidentDante said:
a worse one:
gear of war two:
when you are riding on the truck? and the reapers? are shooting at you along the roadside cliff. if you lose you have to watch over a minute of pre scripted scene and dialogue. terrible idea, since in the harder difficulties it only takes two hits to die, meaning you have to restart often. and sit through the whole thing again... :S
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
Oh, I forgot one in my last post.
Power Stone Collection: Now, this may not really be a bad design choice, per se, but it's REALLY hard on my eyes. Like, it's zoomed out too far or something. I literally have to squint at times to tell what's going on onscreen.
Power Stone Collection: Now, this may not really be a bad design choice, per se, but it's REALLY hard on my eyes. Like, it's zoomed out too far or something. I literally have to squint at times to tell what's going on onscreen.
PepsimanVsJoe
Member
Oh that reminds me.
I don't think I ever got around to discussing everything that sucked about Gears of War 2's campaign.
-Vehicle sections. None of them were any good.
-Far too many scripted sequences where if you don't do this and this you die. These really were not in the first game and I guess that's part of the reason why I instantly fell in love with the original. Here I'm not sure why these scenarios were created but they really didn't do anything for me.
-Campaign AI partners still suck. Actually with this installment it's even worse since if one runs out and gets wasted you can't just sit back and hold your own while he bitches. Instead you gotta rush in there and revive him or else he'll die and you have to restart the checkpoint.
-Speaking of that why do I have to babysit their asses when they aren't willing to extend a hand if I got shot up? Sure I can't say having luck play a factor in my survival if I get taken down is a good idea but throw me a bone here.
-Way too much unnecessary variety. I actually didn't find the original game repetitive. Between the level designs and the placement/types of enemies I thought the campaign did a fine job of staying entertaining. The sequel gives the finger to that and in exchange throws in like a dozen or so unique scenarios that would fit in better if I was playing Half-Life with all of the other pansy dorkwad losers. Okay there were a few of those in the original game but never to the point where it took away from the combat.
-Checkpoints before cutscenes instead of after them. I thought Epic learned something after the juice fiasco.
Probably some other things as well but damned if I can remember. I sold the game shortly after it came out(which is why I didn't mention the really stupid stuff like the god-tier chainsaw and smoke grenades that I assume were patched).
I don't think I ever got around to discussing everything that sucked about Gears of War 2's campaign.
-Vehicle sections. None of them were any good.
-Far too many scripted sequences where if you don't do this and this you die. These really were not in the first game and I guess that's part of the reason why I instantly fell in love with the original. Here I'm not sure why these scenarios were created but they really didn't do anything for me.
-Campaign AI partners still suck. Actually with this installment it's even worse since if one runs out and gets wasted you can't just sit back and hold your own while he bitches. Instead you gotta rush in there and revive him or else he'll die and you have to restart the checkpoint.
-Speaking of that why do I have to babysit their asses when they aren't willing to extend a hand if I got shot up? Sure I can't say having luck play a factor in my survival if I get taken down is a good idea but throw me a bone here.
-Way too much unnecessary variety. I actually didn't find the original game repetitive. Between the level designs and the placement/types of enemies I thought the campaign did a fine job of staying entertaining. The sequel gives the finger to that and in exchange throws in like a dozen or so unique scenarios that would fit in better if I was playing Half-Life with all of the other pansy dorkwad losers. Okay there were a few of those in the original game but never to the point where it took away from the combat.
-Checkpoints before cutscenes instead of after them. I thought Epic learned something after the juice fiasco.
Probably some other things as well but damned if I can remember. I sold the game shortly after it came out(which is why I didn't mention the really stupid stuff like the god-tier chainsaw and smoke grenades that I assume were patched).
disappeared said:
Fucking this damnit!
One of the reasons I hate booting up Bioshock (which otherwise is a great game).
2KGames
*Slow zoom into an old-school recordplayer* 2K Boston
2K Australia
2K Marin
Digital Extremes
*loading screen for menu*
And none of it is skippable.
rainking187
Member
Both Resistance games-Respawning in online multiplayer. Same shit happened over and over again. I try to situate myself somewhere with my back to the wall, and someone respawns directly behind me and kills me before I even have the chance to turn around.
8-Bit Soul
Member
Neuromancer said:
agree
Mass Effect: combat system in parkinson mode and the exploration of locations and planets is too poor and linear.
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
disappeared said:
Ghostbusters is particularly bad about this. I think there's something like seven or eight logos that come up before the title screen.
But at least those are skippable, to the game's credit.
The_Reckoning
Member
Trauma Center on the Wii. That god damned GUILT? disease that spread.
Man, a lot of good points in this thread.
FFCC on the Gamecube - the use of GBAs as controllers. I know there was nearly no way around it as the game was designed with that functionality in mind, but even a haphazard hacked-on GC controller option would have been extremely awesome - even if the resulting playing area on the TV would have been tiny. The game is beautiful, but playing through it with others was nigh impossible for me because it's hard to get three guys on conflicting schedules with non-shitty GBAs and an inclination to play the game... the odds are clearly stacked against it. So yes, either the GBA link-in or the GBA link-in requirement are bad choices in an otherwise beautiful and awesome game.
Children of Mana - only six(?) dungeon maps? Are you kidding me, a dungeon crawler with that amount of rather small maps is an outright stupid design decision. Shame, because the rest of the game was rather good. Goodbye, Mana franchise.
FFCC on the Gamecube - the use of GBAs as controllers. I know there was nearly no way around it as the game was designed with that functionality in mind, but even a haphazard hacked-on GC controller option would have been extremely awesome - even if the resulting playing area on the TV would have been tiny. The game is beautiful, but playing through it with others was nigh impossible for me because it's hard to get three guys on conflicting schedules with non-shitty GBAs and an inclination to play the game... the odds are clearly stacked against it. So yes, either the GBA link-in or the GBA link-in requirement are bad choices in an otherwise beautiful and awesome game.
Children of Mana - only six(?) dungeon maps? Are you kidding me, a dungeon crawler with that amount of rather small maps is an outright stupid design decision. Shame, because the rest of the game was rather good. Goodbye, Mana franchise.
Dr Frasier Crane
Member
Top ones for me this year:
Far Cry 2 - Respawning guard posts. Honestly, fuck you Ubisoft. I kept getting to the stage of almost enjoying the game then have to blow through a guard post I just cleared out five minutes ago. And even if I tried to just drive straight through the fuckers would chase me. So I'd stop, get out to take them down, and get run over and insta-killed. The last 30 mins of driving across the map is gone.
Dead Space - The asteroid bit. I was massively enjoying the game then this bit popped up. I thought, "Nice, a little bit of gameplay variety". No, no. Just a rock solid shooting bit where the guns had weird momentum/lag. If they'd made the guns a touch more responsive I wouldn't have bitten my dualshock.
Far Cry 2 - Respawning guard posts. Honestly, fuck you Ubisoft. I kept getting to the stage of almost enjoying the game then have to blow through a guard post I just cleared out five minutes ago. And even if I tried to just drive straight through the fuckers would chase me. So I'd stop, get out to take them down, and get run over and insta-killed. The last 30 mins of driving across the map is gone.
Dead Space - The asteroid bit. I was massively enjoying the game then this bit popped up. I thought, "Nice, a little bit of gameplay variety". No, no. Just a rock solid shooting bit where the guns had weird momentum/lag. If they'd made the guns a touch more responsive I wouldn't have bitten my dualshock.
The secret stars
go for them
secret stars
Mr. Blow, if you want to tell me something through your game, why do you make it invisible? Like reading a novel by Dostojewski and then somebody tells you the most important part was written with invisible ink on the last page...
mysticstylez
Banned
ichinisan said:
If you were smart, first off you would always drive a vehicle with a machine gun on the back. Second, if you were smart, when they start to chase you, you do not get out of your vehicle instead you man the gun and shoot them all down. Finally if you are doing "30 mins of driving across the map", you should have found more than one safe house to save your progress.
Jive Turkey
Unconfirmed Member
No...I meant that as "Holy crap he got me too!" Maybe if I used all caps?viciouskillersquirrel said:
WHA...?!
I had the same thought process. "Why is fortified_concept talking about a Nintendo game?" I never bothered to look at his name.
BothBarsOn
Member
Drake's ludicrous ability to jump UP from a hand-hold drives me nuts in Uncharted. Seems to be present and incorrect in the sequel too.
mysticstylez
Banned
BothBarsOn said:
Even worse is how his hands have some god-like grip. How any human being can jump up ledge to ledge made of ice is beyond me.
I'm posting spoiler tags because I can.
Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest:
The Bouncer: It may be a 3D Beat 'Em Up, but the game also advertised itself as a movie and because of that, it didn't know what it was. I still enjoyed it, but the cutscenes felt out of place and the game's length fell shore (even if you played through it with each character and maxed them out).
Devil May Cry 4:
Ridge Racer 7: It was essentially Ridge Racer 6 repackaged for the PS3. How thoughtful Namco...
Dead Space: New Game+ sort of takes out the horror in Dead Space. Yes it's important to max out everything, but I should be able to change the difficulty for a better challenge.
Everyone else got my complaints with Dead Rising, GTA IV, and other games as well.
Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest:
The Doom Dungeon was just a rehash of all four dungeons combined into one and having the player fight each boss again (except with a new ability and a different color). It might be a beginner RPG, but Square could've put more effort into the final dungeon
The Bouncer: It may be a 3D Beat 'Em Up, but the game also advertised itself as a movie and because of that, it didn't know what it was. I still enjoyed it, but the cutscenes felt out of place and the game's length fell shore (even if you played through it with each character and maxed them out).
Devil May Cry 4:
Backtracking as Dante and fighting the same bosses again as Dante (and Nero)
Ridge Racer 7: It was essentially Ridge Racer 6 repackaged for the PS3. How thoughtful Namco...
Dead Space: New Game+ sort of takes out the horror in Dead Space. Yes it's important to max out everything, but I should be able to change the difficulty for a better challenge.
Everyone else got my complaints with Dead Rising, GTA IV, and other games as well.
IrishNinja
Member
Aeris130 said:
this is brilliant. where are you people finding these?
yeah, repeating bosses is so mega man on NES, only at least it was fun there, unlike uh, Aztec Adventure on the SMS.
for me, anytime a game does that thing where you die right after a checkpoint, or say a boss fight, and you're left looking at an unskippable cutscene - way too long to think "mebbe the game's showing me this while it loads?" - god, i cant believe titles still do that shit these days.
also, handhelds and emulators have taught me the beauty of save states. 20 years of JRPG grinding feels even more archaic when save points feel hours apart.
IrishNinja
Member
The_Reckoning said:
wait, could you pass the part with the bomb around that guy's heart or whatever? i remember it being doable on DS, but fuck, i had friends try that level and none of us could pass it.
lots of RPGs: lack of a "continue" option paired with ridiculous save point placement and overpowered boss mechanics. after 2 hours of progressing through a dungeon (without a save point in sight) you die to the 2nd or in some games even 3rd boss you encounter because you did not know that when he does "skill a" he follows up with "skill b" which will annihilate you unless you have "buff c" on your whole party.
Zeona said:
Most RPGs for awhile now usually will let you know in combat if a boss has a big attack coming up or gives you a hint on what or what not to do.
Like with as far back as FF IV, it would warn you not to attack the Mist Dragon when she was in mist form. Just last night when playing Wild Arms 3 and a boss hit me with his big attack, the game said something along the lines of Oh, he looks drained, doesnt appear he will be able to do that attack consecutively. Or, the game may have some kind of countdown to let you know when the big attack is coming.
As for putting buffs up to counter them, well, that is pretty logical. I mean if you get hit with a big attack, maybe you might want to put up a Protect/Shell (or whatever it is called in the game you are playing).
Most will probably disagree with me, but I think Alone in the Dark was a really great game, dragged down by a ton of little annoying things here and there. It had some wonky first person gameplay, a somewhat irritating inventory, an annoying driving section, and the last two levels and ending were terrible.
That being said, it was still probably one of my favourite games from last year. I really need to pick up the PS3 version, seeing as they kept pimping how they'd fixed a ton of stuff.
Ohh God, this a thousand times. The food, backpack, recovery and camo system were all horrible. I'm sure they sounded cool on paper, but in practise they were unbelievably annoying.
That being said, it was still probably one of my favourite games from last year. I really need to pick up the PS3 version, seeing as they kept pimping how they'd fixed a ton of stuff.
Snoodaard said:
Ohh God, this a thousand times. The food, backpack, recovery and camo system were all horrible. I'm sure they sounded cool on paper, but in practise they were unbelievably annoying.
Kestastrophe
Member
I just finished Infamous and I really did not care for the platforming. Too many times I grabbed onto the wrong object, jumped into my death, or didn't grab the object that Cole was facing. If you are going to make a game with automatic platforming, it should be impossible for your character to autojump to your death. I would have preferred open platforming, as the current system feels very unpolished
BriareosGAF
Member
Magemasher13 said:
Ha ha, too true. The Port Prospect one is so terrible, too, IIRC you have to either stop and restart talking to her and/or go through a few dialog trees for each character. It's a complete mess. Luckily the game is old school enough in every way that I didn't find this too jarring.
Scuba Steve
Member
Resident Evil 5 and it's co-op
I hate sharing items in a "survival horror" game
I hate sharing items in a "survival horror" game
Dawn Of War II - anti-vehice weapons should not have such piss poor accuracy vs infantry
Too many JRPGs - I shouldn't have to reset the game to Load a save. You put Save in the menu, so adding Load should be a no-brainer, right?
Some PC Games - 'Changing this setting requires the game to be restarted.' Okay, well REBOOT YOURSELF! Some games do restart hemselves, but some devs force me to exit the entire game, then restart it. Annoying as hell.
Too many JRPGs - I shouldn't have to reset the game to Load a save. You put Save in the menu, so adding Load should be a no-brainer, right?
Some PC Games - 'Changing this setting requires the game to be restarted.' Okay, well REBOOT YOURSELF! Some games do restart hemselves, but some devs force me to exit the entire game, then restart it. Annoying as hell.
makingmusic476
Member
Damn lazy devs.fily said:You guys are missing the absolutely worst design choice ever made!
The clouds and the bushes are the same sprite!