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Halo 4 Story Spoilers and Speculations

Was not sold at all on the Didact's shift in character and the change in relationship between the Librarian and Didact.
Kind of breaks the whole villian and threat for me.

Why they went with the Didact and not the Master Builder as the villian is beyond me.
 

Flipyap

Member
I FIND IT REALLY WEIRD how people are saying that the game should have spent more time in cutscenes, or how they didn't understand things, or how you have to read the novels to "get it." Of the Reclaimer Saga, I've read one novel--the first Greg Bear one. I did not get all the terminals, nor did I watch any of them. I had no problems understanding anything.
Yeah... you've read the only really relevant book, the one that provides backstory to all of this.
People who haven't read Cryptum don't know any of the Forerunner characters, the alternate history of Halo's humanity, yet the game introduces all of this matter-of-factly, like you're supposed to know this already.
The characters don't seem to be all that bothered by these universe-shaking revelations. The Didact is just some dude, Captain Generic Military Anger has bigger fish to fry. The Master Chief sees a vision of ancient humans engaged in space war with Forerunners and his reaction to this is "So... the robots are humans? That's pretty weird, huh?"

Forerunner planet picks up Chief, Chief is tricked into releasing the Didact, the Librarian saves Chief by making him immune (And who cares HOW it works? It's advanced science by one of the most brilliant minds in the universe--why not just accept that she can do crazy things rather than have a disappointing bullshit explanation?)
Because it was supposed to be science fiction, not Harry Goddamned Potter.

Why they went with the Didact and not the Master Builder as the villian is beyond me.
Because then the game would feature a "The Master Chief versus The Master Builder" QTE and that sounds like the single worst thing ever.
 
I was surprised to see that it was the Bornsteller Didact the whole time and not the Ur-Didact. I wonder what happens to the Ur-Didact in Silentium.

Also if the Didact was in Requiem who activated the Halos? 343 please stop with the retcons.
 

NekoFever

Member
Well the Precursors were Tier 0, so I guess there would be some interesting lore behind that. I also hope the Arbiter returns at some point.
I think it's going to be difficult if they turn up. I'll find it hard to believe that a civilisation that can pretty much transcend the physical universe and create life will still be vulnerable to Master Chief's pistol.

I also thought that the Didact activated the halos while the Librarian was on Earth? How could he do that when he was on Requiem?
Activate Halos from the Ark, wait for Flood to die and species to be reseeded, go to Requiem and lock himself away in his Cryptum to atone. He considered activating the Halos a "sin beyond measure", and we know that Cryptums were where Forerunner warriors went to atone for their sins, so it makes sense that he'd do that.
 

Korosenai

Member
Flood returning seems like an inevitability with the Anniversary terminals and the whole thing with UNSC exploring remaining Halo rings.

Precursors could be really cool. There's some hints in Cryptum, though a stretch I'll admit, that the Flood actually somehow are the Precursors. Could be a cool twist.

Well, IIRC, the precursors created the flood to punish the forerunners or something like that, and the last precursor on charum hakkor was actually a flood gravemind.

There is no doubt in my mind that the flood or the precursors will show up at the end of Halo 5 or Halo 6.
 
I think it's going to be difficult if they turn up. I'll find it hard to believe that a civilisation that can pretty much transcend the physical universe and create life will still be vulnerable to Master Chief's pistol.


Activate Halos from the Ark, wait for Flood to die and species to be reseeded, go to Requiem and lock himself away in his Cryptum to atone. He considered activating the Halos a "sin beyond measure", and we know that Cryptums were where Forerunner warriors went to atone for their sins, so it makes sense that he'd do that.

Yeah but in the terminals the Librarian shot him and locked him up
 

Darkmakaimura

Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
I think it's going to be difficult if they turn up. I'll find it hard to believe that a civilisation that can pretty much transcend the physical universe and create life will still be vulnerable to Master Chief's pistol.
I'm not sure it is stated anywhere they can transcend the physical universe, which is common for most sci-fi. Rather it states Tier 0 is trans-galactic so they probably left to another galaxy. The Primordial was all that was left of them and it was a Gravemind and was killed by reversing it's stasis chamber.
 
Activate Halos from the Ark, wait for Flood to die and species to be reseeded, go to Requiem and lock himself away in his Cryptum to atone. He considered activating the Halos a "sin beyond measure", and we know that Cryptums were where Forerunner warriors went to atone for their sins, so it makes sense that he'd do that.
Nope, watch the terminals.
 
So, question, did Truth genuinely know what the Halo rings did, or was he just a delusional omnicidal maniac who *actually* believed the bullshit he was spewing? I can't imagine him wanting to commit murder-suicide on a galactic level.
 

LastNac

Member
Being told by all my friends to read the books to get the story. I'm sorry, that is just bullsh*t. The supplemental(expanded story) story is not the story.
 
So, question, did Truth genuinely know what the Halo rings did, or was he just a delusional omnicidal maniac who *actually* believed the bullshit he was spewing? I can't imagine him wanting to commit murder-suicide on a galactic level.

It's supposed to be a parallel to how some uber-religious will keep taking their scriptures literally even in the face of nigh undeniable scientific fact (not trying to start a debate here, that's just what's in the game)

Truth knows the Halos are gonna kill him and everybody, but he's gone so far and invested himself mentally so much that he can't back down now and just works it out in his head that it'll all be ok if he just keeps his faith in the Great Journey.

Being told by all my friends to read the books to get the story. I'm sorry, that is just bullsh*t. The supplemental(expanded story) story is not the story.

You can understand the story just fine if you just play the games, (maybe not as much Halo 4) but you get much, much more out of them if you've read the books. That's what they mean by that.
 

Darkmakaimura

Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
So...are humans the bad guys? im so confused.
Yes and no. In Prehistoric times, they were relentlessly killing Forerunners and whatnot but because of Flood infestation. They were trying to protect the galaxy, but by doing so were mercilessly eradicating life. Librarian finds this out later and sympathizes with the humans a bit. Didact doesn't care if the humans were trying to "act as caretakers" because the humans were slaughtering billions of Forerunners in trying to protect the galaxy from the Flood. Humans are stripped of their technology and 'devolved' by the Forerunners are punishment but for the Didact this is not punishment enough and he makes them into robots using The Composer. He feels even that fate is too good for them but at least he can now use these humans-turned-robots as a defense against the Flood.
 
I still have yet to watch all the terminal videos and read up on the Forerunner backstory, but I really feel like I shouldn't have to in order to understand what the heck is going on. Supplemental material should only enhance your experience and not bar other people out of important information. To that end, I really wish the execution of the story was a lot better. I was pretty confused during the exposition with the Librarian for example, as it was basically the whole backstory of the Didact and the Librarian and their motivations condensed into one artistically blurry CG cutscene.

On a more problematic level, the game doesn't feel like it happens on a scale of any consequence. You show up, this Didact guy pops in out of nowhere, you chase him around, and then you push him off a bridge in a QTE. For some reason the game doesn't really get across how big of a deal this all is. He's incredibly powerful, he's got a giant spaceship and he can turn people into ash, but he just feels so distant and removed as a threat that I couldn't bring myself to care all that much. I read that he shows up in one of the books, so this is probably a big deal (?) for people who read it, but, well, you know. I have no problem if he's from the books or anything like that, but I need to see him, to understand him as a villain.

For all of that I enjoyed campaign, but execution definitely needs some work. I'll look forward to Halo 5, and hopefully reading some wiki stuff will allow me to appreciate this all a little better.
 
How do we know it's the Bornstellar Didact?

Well using knowledge from the terminals in Halo 4, Crytum, and Primordium, here are my thoughts.

I honestly believe that it was a combination of the Ur-Didacts experience with the Captive and the Bornstellar Didact's meetings with the Primordial that drove the Bornstellar Didact over the edge. How is one supposed to accept the fact that his race, which he believes to be the true inheritor of the Mantle, was never supposed to be? How is he supposed to accept that the possibility of all life in the Galaxy being assimilated into the Flood is his only destiny? Shit like that must have drove him mad. It is easy to see why he did the things he did. He turned all of his Prometheans into the Artificial Promethean Knights to prevent their assimilation into the Flood, despite the consequences of the Composer's imperfect process. He used Ancient Humans, which his wife loved so dearly, as his own army using the Composer. He wanted to fight for the Mantle, and the fate of his kind, and it warped his mind.

He saw humanity as the reason that The Primordial's revelations were beginning to take place. He was truly scared of losing the Mantle which he believed was theirs, and losing everything, and everyone he fought so long to defend.
 

L1NETT

Member
For all 343's confidence pre release that it would be a self contained and understandable piece of sci-fi that required no knowledge of the series and wouldn't need extra reading, it was a confusing mess of a story.

Didact given little/no explanation. Did they even say who he actually was?
How many average Halo fans know about the Librarian?
How many average Halo fans know about the forerunners?? Reading Cryptum is vital to understanding Halo 4. Little background was given about the forerunners, the Didact's motivation, Librarian etc.....

Also, I really thought this https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GflJB-aM0wI#t=116s was going to be in the game.

Not the dogs lol, but the catch up piece. (Previously in Halo....)
 
So the Librarian that was in Halo 4 wasn't the actual Librarian because she's dead right? It was just a recording or something.

The terminals said that Didact activated the Halos at the Ark while the Librarian was on earth, so she would have died from the halos firing. Are the terminals being retconned now?

What confuses me is that at the end of Primordium, 343 GS (which confuses me even more) says that he knows where the Librarian is along with his ancient friends? How could he know where she is if she's dead? Did the halo array not kill her?

I swear before the game came out I thought that the Master Chief would be at odds with the Didact, but then eventually form an uneasy partnership with him sort of like MC and Arbiter. I also thought that the real ancient evil would end up being the Master Builder or the Precursors. Maybe this will be talked about more in Halo 5.

The only similarity I can draw is between this and Halo CE and it's really stretching it. In CE Guilty Spark was the antagonist, but in the later games (before going rampant again), was an ally. Maybe they are doing something similar with Didact with establishing him as an enemy first then as an ally, but they killed him off already, so unless Ur-Didact survives in Silientium, nevermind anything I just said.

I think I have a pretty good understanding of halo lore, but lately it's been getting really fuzzy.
 

Darkmakaimura

Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
Damn, the ancient humans looked badass. It sucks that they devolved us like that. We could have joined forces and taken out the Flood!
I love the main ship design of that the Lord of Admirals was in.

bul2F.jpg


hMBAe.jpg
 
How do we know it's the Bornstellar Didact?

The first couple terminals are the Ur and then his appearance changes and he says "In my new form" referring to the fact that he is the Bornsteller Didact. It also fits with how the Bornsteller Didact is described as ugly compared to the original.
 

DocSeuss

Member
(I want to apologize; I'm currently quite ill, so this might not come out formatted flawlessly, and for that I'm sorry. I do feel I've communicated the problems and solution adequately, however)

Before I respond to Flipyap's thought-provoking post, I should probably explain that I feel that Halo 4 needs another act. I thought about it quite a bit last night, slept on it, and thought about it a lot more today, and now I think I can see how it would have created a lot more compelling experience.

Alright, first, the act is needed because the game has two major elements that are introduced and inadequately explained. I should note that nearly everything the game should introduce and explain is introduced and explained within the context of the game, but not these two things. Not even the terminals, just the cutscenes themselves. Some of you guys are wanting a lot of detail that really isn't relevant to the story's drama, pacing, or even basic understanding. Watch the cutscenes, pay attention, and you should be fine.

Alright, the two things that aren't explained:

  • The game opens with a cutscene showing Halsey in chains, being interrogated, and we hear that they might be making more Spartans. Much later in the game, we're kind of told "oh, by the way, these guys are Spartans but you wouldn't know them," and that's really about it.
  • The Mantle is never properly explained. As such, we don't really understand why The Didact is such a threat beyond "he has a machine that he wants to kill humans with." It's not nearly as compelling as "he believes it is the Forerunner's duty to care for the Galaxy, but as a result of the war with humanity, he feels it's fair to turn them into a race of insane digital intelligences."

Second, the act is needed because Halo 4 makes the mistake of assumed empathy. That is, it assumes we understand the emotions and motivations of various characters within the plot without actually expressing them itself. There is no reason for Del Rio to act the way he does, for instance, other than, apparently, the fact that he's supposed to fit the role of "Generic Human Authority figure." Maybe there's some personal motivation, but it's never explained. Likewise, the game treats Didact simplistically: "we were attacked by humans a long time ago, Didact lost his head, I had to imprison him." And all it seems he wants to do are to put humans in computer space jail.

A fundamental storytelling rule is that the audience, if they're paying attention to the story, should be able to follow it, empathize with the characters, and understand their motivations. That is ultimately why these two areas needed to be expounded on within the game.

SO, WITH ALL THAT SAID, THIS IS THE ACT HALO 4 NEEDS TO HAVE A GREAT STORY:

The act should take place right between after the game's first act--that is to say, it should take place right after the Infinity's MAC cannon scares him off. The game's first act is really all about finding Requiem, crash landing on it, and discovering the threat.

Using a traditional five-act structure, the next step would be for us to explore the threat--that is, try to find out who the Didact is and what he wants. In Halo 4, once the first act is complete, we jump right to Del Rio being a total jerk and forcing the Infinity off the planet. As such, we never really truly explore The Didact's motivations or his character, nor do we really see Del Rio's motivations explained. They just kind of happen.

Likewise, we don't really know much about these Spartan IVs. An act where we spend more time on Requiem would be a great opportunity for us to get to know the Spartan IVs, explore the idea of the Chief as 'fundamentally broken,' and maybe get some of that inter-human 'conflict' going. I've been told that one of the themes of Glasslands is that Halsey is treated with much less sympathy and more like a criminal--having the Spartan IVs react to Chief as if he's some aberration, or, perhaps, treat him with some sympathy, because he's Halsey's 'victim' (though realistically, the characters would likely treat him with a mix of both).

If Del Rio shares this point of view, we can see why he might be somewhat antagonistic towards Chief. He doesn't need to be the bad guy the game paints him as, however. Instead of having him "relieved of command," a moment which had no emotional resonance in the game itself, having his character grow, getting players to come to like him, and then having the Didact kill him would make things a bit more emotionally engaging. This is, of course, just one way to do things. There are a lot of things that could be done with Del Rio, and even the "relieved of command" thing might work, but we simply need to know more about the guy and his relationship with the Chief if we want to have any sort of emotional resonance.

Basically, this second act should comprise of between one and three missions. On the first, Chief should go on a mission with the Spartan IVs. They should be fleshed out; as it was, only Palmer had a face or personality.

That said, it's important to note that Halo's always at its best when the player is alone (most great shooters are this way--System Shock 2, No One Lives Forever, Deus Ex, Half-Life, Halo, Aliens vs Predator 2, etc), so the time Chief spends with the other Spartans should be spent via radio contact, rather than actual in-game behavior. Basically, the Spartans could operate as audio feedback for player actions; as the player, through Chief, progresses through the level, the Spartans could come to appreciate Chief (and provide audio feedback to the player that makes the player feel increasingly more badass).

One of Half-Life's greatest moments is after a long, exhausting stretch of the game, this guy goes "You can trust me. You can trust all of us." It's a moment that expresses to the player that their efforts are valued by someone, and really helps relieve the tension of the game, making the player feel pretty great. So this theoretical level could do that.

This level should end with the player beginning to understand The Didact a lot better. The next two levels should help this understanding evolve, introducing the mantle, having Chief remind everyone why he's awesome, and, by extension, making the player feel awesome, which sets up a nice big emotional gut punch. Perhaps it culminates in a personal confrontation with him, perhaps Del Rio dies, whatever. The point is, this section of the game should end with the player feeling that they HAVE to get off the planet. After this, the motivation to play the level Goliath is a lot stronger.

As it stands, Halo 4's pacing and the character motivations are a bit weird. We don't spend enough time on Requiem, we don't learn ANYTHING about Spartan IVs, Del Rio's motivations are senseless, and we don't really understand the gravity behind Didact's motivations other than "people are going to die." The Flood, at least, had a motivation--to turn people into a hive mind. That's what made them interesting. Didact is just "I want to kill you."

A second act just after Didact is scared off and just before Goliath begins would vastly strengthen the game. Plus, that apparent plot hole I mentioned last night, where the people at Installation 03 are expecting Chief with no way of knowing that he's coming, could be closed during this act.

Whew. That was fun. It's a single-drafted, headache-fueled mess, but it was fun to write, and I hope it makes sense.

Now on to Flipyap.

Yeah... you've read the only really relevant book, the one that provides backstory to all of this.

Um... no? There's a lot--the Composer, the Didact's drastically altered relationship with the Librarian, and other things--that I had no idea about.

The one thing that Halo 4 failed to do that Cryptum did was explain the Mantle and its significance. As a result, the Didact's personal motivations didn't have any inherent meaning, so it just seemed like "there is a thing humans are getting [that I won't explain] that I want."

That was a mistake on 343's part. The other elements, like the Composer, the Didact's relationship with the Librarian, and so forth, were adequately explained in the game, even though I gather there's probably more detail in Primordium.

People who haven't read Cryptum don't know any of the Forerunner characters, the alternate history of Halo's humanity, yet the game introduces all of this matter-of-factly, like you're supposed to know this already.

The game introduces A Guy. He says Vague Things, but it is clear He Is A Threat. Then, The Librarian is introduced. She explains the alternate history of Halo's humanity, how The Flood took out the Forerunner, and what The Forerunner did to humanity.

She COULD have said more, but it would have annihilated the pacing and flow to do it. Introducing the Precursors, explaining the importance of the Mantle, the rebellion of the Forerunner, and their jealousy of humanity, and all that stuff... it SHOULD have been in the game, absolutely. ALL this stuff is Mantle related.

We didn't need bigger cutscenes--what was there was great. We simply needed an additional section of the game explaining the Mantle and the Didact's response. I've already discussed it above.

The characters don't seem to be all that bothered by these universe-shaking revelations. The Didact is just some dude, Captain Generic Military Anger has bigger fish to fry.

This is a result of them failing to explain the Mantle. The Mantle is the key to all forerunner related stuff.

The Master Chief sees a vision of ancient humans engaged in space war with Forerunners and his reaction to this is "So... the robots are humans? That's pretty weird, huh?"

Explained by the game that Master Chief is rather sociopathic; even then, you're simplifying his reaction. Cortana should have had one or two lines expressing the horror that the Chief cannot.

Because it was supposed to be science fiction, not Harry Goddamned Potter.

And it is science fiction. Master Chief has no reason to know--or even want to know--how she did what she did. She made him immune. That's really all that matters. A cutscene explaining just what she did would actually make no sense in the story's context, and what's worse, it would dissolve the game's dramatic flow. Explaining doesn't serve any purpose at all whatsoever and actually works to the detriment of the dramatic tension in the film. Nothing benefits by receiving an explanation of the minutae of the Librarian's modifications.

Here's an excellent essay that does a far better job than I could explaining why it doesn't matter.

Yes and no. In Prehistoric times, they were relentlessly killing Forerunners and whatnot but because of Flood infestation. They were trying to protect the galaxy, but by doing so were mercilessly eradicating life. Librarian finds this out later and sympathizes with the humans a bit. Didact doesn't care if the humans were trying to "act as caretakers" because the humans were slaughtering billions of Forerunners in trying to protect the galaxy from the Flood. Humans are stripped of their technology and 'devolved' by the Forerunners are punishment but for the Didact this is not punishment enough and he makes them into robots using The Composer. He feels even that fate is too good for them but at least he can now use these humans-turned-robots as a defense against the Flood.

My understanding, judging by Cryptum and the Wiki, was that the humans were a lot more sympathetic than that. They were fleeing the Flood, colonizing worlds closer to Forerunner territory. The Forerunner got uppity about this because they felt it was their duty to run things, and the humans were all "lol, what? No thanks." This angered the Forerunner, who believed that the Mantle was theirs. At some point, they also discovered that it was the humans, not they, who were to possess the Mantle. Both of these things resulted in Forerunner genocide/dehumanizing of humanity.

Halo 4's cutscene indicates that the humans were a lot more violent than that, and this doesn't really work for me, because usually, refugees don't resort to slaughtering an advanced potential ally when fleeing from an enemy. They usually go "please give us shelter and help us fight our foes." That their first instinct was 'war' doesn't strike me as something genuine or believable.

Now, it could be that The Librarian was misrepresenting things because she is, after all, a Forerunner, but I doubt it.

The lack of explanation in Halo 4 is sad, do we even know which Didact it is? I mean 100%?

And I really hope he isn'T dead or finished, that would be more than idiotic.


And what happenend now on Earth, were all humans on earth burned down to ash or just the ones in the area?

1. Um, didn't the first Didact die in Cryptum?

2. Actually, he fell into the digitizer beam. Considering that he is speaking at the end of the game, it's reasonable to assume that he has been composed.

3. Just the ones in the area, as demonstrated by the video at the end of the credits.
 
why was del rio so fucking pissed at master chief? ever since he came aboard, hes been shitting on chief left and right. i expected some kind of resolution to this but nothing.

i also thought it was annoying how everyone treated chief like some has-been at first but at the end he ended up getting everyones respect like he deserved.

the campaign was great but the story was definitely a clusterfuck and had i not read up on the forerunners on halo wiki earlier, i would have been even more confused.

and what the hell, no major last battle or anything. the installation fight was much larger in scope than the final level in this. i guess we will also see master chiefs "evolution" or something on the next game? i imagined you unlocking it and then wrecking shit left and right at the end but none of that either.
 
So I think I just figured out what happened with Cortana saving Chief at the end.

Right when you get into the main last chamber/room of Midnight, Cortana says something along the lines of "The window to escape will be pretty slim once you prime the nuke", implying that the nuke won't go off instantly. I think that when Chief hits the button, Cortana teleports him to a hardlight shield/box she generated near the ship and they have their conversation.

Then after she backs up into the hardlight, you hear the rumble of a muffled explosion. I assume that's the nuke going off then, because that's the first time you see the debris in the background, behind Chief, and you also see a bunch of light above Chief, in the direction the debris are flowing from. From there, the destruction of the ship kills the hardlight bunker he is in, then he is left floating in space.

This makes way more sense to me.
 

Darkmakaimura

Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
My understanding, judging by Cryptum and the Wiki, was that the humans were a lot more sympathetic than that. They were fleeing the Flood, colonizing worlds closer to Forerunner territory. The Forerunner got uppity about this because they felt it was their duty to run things, and the humans were all "lol, what? No thanks." This angered the Forerunner, who believed that the Mantle was theirs. At some point, they also discovered that it was the humans, not they, who were to possess the Mantle. Both of these things resulted in Forerunner genocide/dehumanizing of humanity.

Halo 4's cutscene indicates that the humans were a lot more violent than that, and this doesn't really work for me, because usually, refugees don't resort to slaughtering an advanced potential ally when fleeing from an enemy. They usually go "please give us shelter and help us fight our foes." That their first instinct was 'war' doesn't strike me as something genuine or believable.

Now, it could be that The Librarian was misrepresenting things because she is, after all, a Forerunner, but I doubt it.
I haven't read the books. Only going by the Halopedia and terminals but yeah makes sense what you're saying.

Actually, he fell into the digitizer beam. Considering that he is speaking at the end of the game, it's reasonable to assume that he has been composed.
I remember it was a vortex or something. Gonna YouSchloob that ending again but yeah if that vortex or portal looking thing was part of the beam this makes sense. He would be Composed so now he's a Promethean or some machine entity? I hadn't thought of this before until you brought it up but great observation.

I really do hope we see some of those Forerunner vehicles that were mentioned in books. I forgot what they're called but they were huge and looked like scorpions with a Forerunner "head" on the front. I think we've ever seen one yet in the series.

Edit: They were called War Sphinx. I hope we get to see some of these in the upcoming games.

yz3y5.png


Mysterious Terminal image

XnvFq.jpg


Someone's concept art
 

Havok

Member
why was del rio so fucking pissed at master chief? ever since he came aboard, hes been shitting on chief left and right. i expected some kind of resolution to this but nothing.
A few reasons. 343 needed a humanizing comparison figure for Lasky, to make him look like a standup guy since his uncomfortable nature with command wouldn't be believable if he were like that from the outset and he's one of 343's darling creations (as evidenced by the focus on him in Forward Unto Dawn and his continued appearances in Spartan Ops), Cortana needed an antagonistic figure to rebel against and showcase her mental state, and Chief needed a superior officer to disobey and make him look like the bigger man morally, doing what they refused to.

Del Rio is, unfortunately, very much a one-note character, but he does serve some important purposes (I don't think that excuses his lack of depth, for the record).
 
A few reasons. 343 needed a humanizing comparison figure for Lasky, to make him look like a standup guy since his uncomfortable nature with command wouldn't be believable if he were like that from the outset and he's one of 343's darling creations (as evidenced by the focus on him in Forward Unto Dawn and his continued appearances in Spartan Ops), Cortana needed an antagonistic figure to rebel against and showcase her mental state, and Chief needed a superior officer to disobey and make him look like the bigger man morally, doing what they refused to.

Del Rio is, unfortunately, very much a one-note character, but he does serve some important purposes (I don't think that excuses his lack of depth, for the record).

yeah i figured as much, he definitely was a catalyst for other characters' development but there wasnt much if anything on him. no motive, nothing. i really thought he held a grudge against him or something from his pre-covenant war days. maybe killed some rebel family members or something *shrug*.

i would have liked to see him give his respects to the chief much like the way the rest of the spartans and everyone on UNSC at the end. loved the part where the spartan fell on the treadmill when the chief entered.

by the way, i havent started spartan ops yet but is it a continuation of the campaign storyline or something completely different? do they refer to MC at all?
 

Flipyap

Member
Um... no? There's a lot--the Composer, the Didact's drastically altered relationship with the Librarian, and other things--that I had no idea about.
Um... yes! All Primordium adds is a few mentions of the Composer, described in fairly misleading ways, and that's about it.
All of the stuff covered in the terminal motion comics is Silentium material, but that book isn't out yet, so you knew about as much as anyone who has read all four Reclaimer Saga books.

And it is science fiction. Master Chief has no reason to know--or even want to know--how she did what she did. She made him immune. That's really all that matters. A cutscene explaining just what she did would actually make no sense in the story's context, and what's worse, it would dissolve the game's dramatic flow.
It's space magic. It's the kind of an "evolutionary journey" a Pokémon would take.
Regardless, not knowing what a space ghost of space Hitler's wife is going to do to his body and blindly agreeing to it simply doesn't sound like a great idea to me.
The dramatic pacing argument only works when there's some drama to speak of, but this is a scene in which the Master Chief walks into the set of Assassin's Creed 2's ending, gets hit over the head with a backstory info dump and informed of his magical destiny. It's already "explaining" too much, too fast and in the least elegant way possible.
 

Havok

Member
yeah i figured as much, he definitely was a catalyst for other characters' development but there wasnt much if anything on him. no motive, nothing. i really thought he held a grudge against him or something from his pre-covenant war days. maybe killed some rebel family members or something *shrug*.

i would have liked to see him give his respects to the chief much like the way the rest of the spartans and everyone on UNSC at the end. loved the part where the spartan fell on the treadmill when the chief entered.

by the way, i havent started spartan ops yet but is it a continuation of the campaign storyline or something completely different? do they refer to MC at all?
Spartan Ops takes place six months after the events of the game, and isn't necessarily super directly tied into what actually happens at the end of 4, not yet at least. The first episode doesn't mention the Chief, no, but Palmer, the female Spartan commander, is heavily involved and Lasky makes an appearance. It follows a couple of Spartan-IV squads as they investigate Requiem. Be sure to hit Y in the Spartan Ops lobby to view the episode before you start playing the mission. It's a very promising concept.

Honestly, I don't think 343 ever had any plans to make Del Rio interesting. Even in The Thursday War, the most recent novel, they painted him as a completely unlikable, bland character. As for him giving his respect...well, he was relieved of command after HIGHCOM learned that he left Requiem without the Chief, so I dunno that he'd change after those events. A shame.
 
Spartan Ops takes place six months after the events of the game, and isn't necessarily super tied into what actually happens at the end of 4, not yet at least. The first episode doesn't mention the Chief, no, but Palmer, the female Spartan commander, is heavily involved and Lasky makes an appearance. It follows a couple of Spartan-IV squads as they investigate Requiem.

Honestly, I don't think 343 ever had any plans to make Del Rio interesting. Even in The Thursday War, the most recent novel, they painted him as a completely unlikable, bland character. As for him giving his respect...well, he was relieved of command after HIGHCOM learned that he left Requiem without the Chief, so I dunno that he'd change after those events. A shame.

sounds great. the spartan IVs barely had any presence in the game but i can understand they wanted to make the main game about chief. its cool how they will be fleshed out during spartan ops, or at least thats my hope.

regarding the bolded, where do you find this out? in the books or did i miss something in the game. either way, screw that guy.

i hope in the future games, chief is reunited with kelly and fred. arent they trapped in some other shield world? maybe we will explore those in the next two games.
 

Havok

Member
sounds great. the spartan IVs barely had any presence in the game but i can understand they wanted to make the main game about chief. its cool how they will be fleshed out during spartan ops, or at least thats my hope.

regarding the bolded, where do you find this out? in the books or did i miss something in the game. either way, screw that guy.

i hope in the future games, chief is reunited with kelly and fred. arent they trapped in some other shield world? maybe we will explore those in the next two games.
Lasky mentions it in the final level over the radio, saying that the higher ups weren't happy with Del Rio when he came back without the Chief.

Kelly and Fred, along with Linda, Mendez, and Halsey escaped the Onyx shield world (now named Trevelyan) in Glasslands, the direct sequel to Ghosts of Onyx, so they've been out for a while. Last we heard, they (apart from Halsey, who is now a prisoner for war crimes, and I'm not certain that Mendez was included in the following) were offered a place in the Spartan operation on the Infinity, so it's entirely possible that they show up at some point.
 

spootime

Member
I hope that they flesh out the spartan IV program more, I know absolutely nothing about them. Furthermore, how tall are they supposed to be? Waypoint says that Palmer is 6'9, which is a few inches shorter than chief, and then in the final cinematic shes like two feet shorter then him.
 

Snowdrift

Member
A lot of necessary back story could have been filled in with Cortana. One of the major things Halo:CE got right was the use of Cortana to flesh out the narrative, without excessive use of cutscenes. For instance, if you read Thursday War, you understand why Jul and the Covenant are at Requiem, but in the game, an explanation is virtually non-existent. A few lines of dialogue by Cortana could have easily fixed this. Did she magically lose her ability to hack into the Covenant battle net like in every other game? Simply stating that this group of Covenant is more fanatical isn't sufficient. She also never really provides an answer to the Chief's confusion from the beginning of the game about having a truce with the Covenant.

Better use of Cortana probably would have served a dual purpose in showing how important they are to each other as a functioning combat unit, as well as increasing any emotional attachment for the build up to her death. Cortana's use as a tool to push the narrative ahead was underused in my opinion. Why not take advantage of something that can push the narrative ahead without excessive cutscenes?

I think 343 also missed a major opportunity to introduce Infinity as a key character moving forward. In the Kilo-Five trilogy, Infinity is a game changer, but in Halo 4, players aren't given detail on why the ship is so important.

Also, why wasn't the relationship between the MC and Lasky expanded upon? If you watched the live action series, you know what the connection is, but in the game all that Lasky says is "I thought I would never see you again". This could have been expanded on with a line or two if dialogue, thus giving some background as to why Lasky sides with the Chief and why he was so willing to prep a fully loaded Pelican against orders.

I just started Cryptum, but someone who has read the book, can you explain to me what the chances are that the Forerunner didn't devolve all the human species? That perhaps a small portion escaped beyond the Forerunners reach and are hiding somewhere else in the universe and may return some point in the future.
 
I really liked the Chief/Cortana stuff, as cliche as it may have been (Promise me... you'll figure out which one of us is the machine gag gag eurgh wretch). The rest of the story, though...

Dude, I know Halo has a rich backstory and all but this game assumes far too much of the player. I really don't give a rat's ass about the transmedia Halo phenomenon, I just like the Halo games, and I feel like 4's story is written purely for people who have absorbed every product ever put out with the word "Halo" on it. It was incredibly confusing. I have no idea who the Didact is (other than an ugly man that the Covenant... hate? I think?) or what his motivations are, other than firing his big laser at Earth. I gather that he hates humans because they're gross, and the Librarian doesn't think they're gross, and that humans were apparently in space a long time ago, or something. And Master Chief was given anti-Didact powers by the space lady.

Overall I was impressed with the presentation of the story, but I felt like I was left entirely in the dark. There is no point in the game - unless you go digging around for hidden stuff, which shouldn't be required to piece together the story in a story driven linear shooter - where any of the characters say "ok let's back the fuck up, what's actually going on here?" for the sake of the audience, which is admirable in some stories but here I just felt completely in the dark. Master Chief is entirely unphased when the Librarian appears and tells him that humans have been in space forever and that she's given him evolutionary powers (how, exactly? Was she mind-controlling Halsey all those years ago?) that mean he can't get zapped by the Didact's space gun, which is a rather specific evolutionary trait.

Really annoyed at that stuff, but I did really like the Chief/Cortana chemistry and the military stuff. I just hope that for Halo 5 they write a script that can stand on its own and doesn't require outside knowledge to be comprehensible.

I also found it hilarious when Del Rio got up in Master Chief's grill. THE MASTER CHIEF. What are you gonna do, punk? The acting was great but the scene was a little tough to swallow.
 
Lasky mentions it in the final level over the radio, saying that the higher ups weren't happy with Del Rio when he came back without the Chief.

Kelly and Fred, along with Linda, Mendez, and Halsey escaped the Onyx shield world (now named Trevelyan) in Glasslands, the direct sequel to Ghosts of Onyx, so they've been out for a while. Last we heard, they (apart from Halsey, who is now a prisoner for war crimes, and I'm not certain that Mendez was included in the following) were offered a place in the Spartan operation on the Infinity, so it's entirely possible that they show up at some point.

niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice :D i saw that on the spartan ops, the third mission is related to dr. halsey. maybe down the line we will see something from those spartans and even a MC cameo or something.

i just rewatched the opening cinematic. what amazing CG work. when dr. halsey says "you want to replace him?", is she talking about ONI starting the spartan IV program? or is it something more metaphorical?

speaking of spartan IVs, on the ending they show a MASSIVE facility of spartans being trained. probably hundreds if not thousands of them. are these guys going through the same augmentations and training as MC? i know this program is supposed to be volunteer only and more "humane". but i guess theyre not in the same "power levels" so-to-speak as the IIs? or do we just not know anything yet about them?

I also found it hilarious when Del Rio got up in Master Chief's grill. THE MASTER CHIEF. What are you gonna do, punk? The acting was great but the scene was a little tough to swallow.

hell yeah. i got so mad at the disrespect. like, bitch, he just saved you and your whole crew. you should be on your knees cleaning his boots. same with that dr tillson or whatever on that installation. saved their ass but suddenly decides to get uppity with john. GTFO, i cheered when she died lol. though it was cool to see the marines surprised and happy seeing master chief return, most noticeably early on when youre securing the LZ for lasky and when installation 03 was being attacked.

ending really made me sad. i really really hope they find a way to bring back cortana. i dont care, retcon something if you have to :(
 

KdoubleA

Member
I'm not sure why this isn't being brought up, but I believe the man interrogating Dr. Halsey in the intro is the Master Chief. I'm thinking this is actually a scene after the events of Halo 4. He is back on Earth and takes off his armor...is going to see Halsey on his way?

And sure, Dr. Halsey knows what he looks like but he's kinda in the shadows and who knows how the Librarian's mutation affected John's appearance. The voice and tone is very much like John's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1rYHczBMtE

Anyway, loved the campaign but I agree with the consensus that 343i should really flesh out the story in the game and not have us rely on the outside material. Having terminals viewable on waypoint only was really a stupid decision, imo (unless there wasn't disc space?) I love the books; and really enjoyed Cryptum so having the terminals show us bits and pieces of the forerunner history was great. It's a lot more than what Bungie did with their lore in the game. So props for that. The potential to have an incredible campaign story within the game is there, and sometimes exposition dumps aren't a bad thing if it's the only way to present it; like the librarian scene with MC.
 

LiK

Member
so the ex-Gaffer spoiled Halo 4 for me but the story was great anyway. Cortana is dead but for some reason, i think she'll be back. Maybe we'll need to deal with a copy of her for the next game but we will find the original somehow. DO IT FOR ME 343!
 

Retro

Member
2. Actually, he fell into the digitizer beam. Considering that he is speaking at the end of the game, it's reasonable to assume that he has been composed.

I thought that whatever he had done to himself (and the Librarian did to MC) made him unable to be digitized by the Composer. He even says as much in one of the Terminals. I don't think the beam would have killed or composed him, but who knows what getting yanked around by Cortana did to him.

I still want to put money on Cortana as a Villain. Maybe we'll fight a Cortana / Didact hybrid baddie in H5. I was thinking before the game came out that if she went rampant, she could basically take over all of Requiem and use it to do very bad things. And if something happens to Halsey (like being executed for war crimes) then she would completely flip her shit.
 
didact was a pretty ugly dude but he looked so awesome with full armor. the sequence in the beginning when he first puts it on is great.
 
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