• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

Heavenly Sword - PS3. Not quite 120 fps...

Status
Not open for further replies.
PSINext: As previously discussed, beyond it's high quality one of the primary reasons for the use of NAO32 is that it saves bandwidth in a bandwidth-hungry environment. In the future do you feel RSX will be at a disadvantage to Xenos when it comes to framebuffer effects due to the 128-bit bus and lack of eDRAM?

Marco: Not at all; in fact for many framebuffer effects I believe RSX will have an edge over Xenos. Don't want to go into details, but let me just point out that RSX is connected to two seperate buses, not just one
Click to expand...

Interesting so the rsx have two bus 128 and xenos one..
 
Amir0x said:
I stopped doing drugs years ago - been mostly clean for nearly 3 1/2 years now.

600 dollars is too large an investment for me. That's a HUGE amount of money. That's not including the taxes or at least one game. That's not including that I'm getting Wii, and probably 2 games for that. And that's not including the remaining PS2 games I need and Zelda:TP for Gamecube.

I'm on a very tight budget as it is this year, this fall is so crowded i've saved up all my 'extra' spending money for the time of year. And there's no way i could do anything to fit PS3 in, unless I starve. Sony priced their system waaaaaaay too high.



I have an HDTV. I made that jump early last year when I still was doing quite well financially.
Click to expand...

Don't worry my friend, I will convince you to get one before too long.
Indifferent2.gif
 
Skilotonn said:
I'm talking about IF the Heavenly Sword guys were to be beaten in the technical department (and I'm sure they will be) and respond in the petty way that you suggested, instead of, say, responding with a technically better game the next time around...
Click to expand...

I'm not sure how its a sure thing they'll be beat by Team Ninja if we're going by what they've already done. They definetly are moving at the same speed they were in the current gen with their next gen projects.

As for the response, I was just pointing out why Itagaki talks the way he does about NAMCO. It has nothing to do with him just taking a company and picking on them as was suggested, he has a reason for saying that stuff. He has no reason to suddenly go after HS.
 
Dante said:
Seems like all the best looking games next gen are all @ 30 fps though. GOW, Heavenly Sword, PGR, etc....
Click to expand...

For obvious reasons. It's not easy to push 60 FPS will all the effects. I think Kojima did it in MGS2 by using lower poly models and amazing texturing.

And PGR wasn't even rendered at a full 720p!
 
wow - what an awesome thread.

I'm pretty sure everyone given the choice prefers 60fps, 30fps isn't going to kill me to be honest but this thread is comedy for SSX's posts.
 
PSINext: As previously discussed, beyond it's high quality one of the primary reasons for the use of NAO32 is that it saves bandwidth in a bandwidth-hungry environment. In the future do you feel RSX will be at a disadvantage to Xenos when it comes to framebuffer effects due to the 128-bit bus and lack of eDRAM?

Marco: Not at all; in fact for many framebuffer effects I believe RSX will have an edge over Xenos. Don't want to go into details, but let me just point out that RSX is connected to two seperate buses, not just one
Click to expand...

Rsx have 2 bus 128 xenos one.. i think this quotes is the best from the interview

One bus:

So, for a framebuffer effect example, traditionally you may have all your source textures and destination buffer in VRAM.
Reads from your source buffers and writes to your destination buffers all take place over the 128-bit bus to VRAM, so you may potentially end up being bandwidth limited.

Two bus:

with 2 bus, if you moved one or more of your source textures over into XDR, you might end up with a more balanced system that uses both XDR bandwidth and VRAM bandwidth, and as such is possibly able to transfer more.
 
Amir0x said:
Yes sir! But seriously, I was just wondering if there was any actual specific reason for it. I wasn't expecting 'well, uh, it just seems more natural!'
Click to expand...
Well, Angelus said it better than me.

That's because the effects are implemented that way. A 60fps game can look just as warm and fuzzy as a 30fps game if the hardware allows for the same graphical eyecandy.
Click to expand...
It doesn't have to do with the effects used, just the framerate itself. At least to me.
 
Lagaff said:
Interesting so the rsx have two bus 128 and xenos one..
Click to expand...

What does this mean in practice?

Amir0x said:
i've heard people say worse here to other forum members, so you never know
Click to expand...

For politics maybe I could understand it, if the one guy is a fascist and the other is really really angry. But for gaming? Wow it seems I've missed great GAF moments.
 
fortified_concept said:
What does this mean in practice?
Click to expand...

One bus:

So, for a framebuffer effect example, traditionally you may have all your source textures and destination buffer in VRAM.
Reads from your source buffers and writes to your destination buffers all take place over the 128-bit bus to VRAM, so you may potentially end up being bandwidth limited.

Two bus:

with 2 bus, if you moved one or more of your source textures over into XDR, you might end up with a more balanced system that uses both XDR bandwidth and VRAM bandwidth, and as such is possibly able to transfer more
 
Lagaff said:
One bus:

So, for a framebuffer effect example, traditionally you may have all your source textures and destination buffer in VRAM.
Reads from your source buffers and writes to your destination buffers all take place over the 128-bit bus to VRAM, so you may potentially end up being bandwidth limited.

Two bus:

with 2 bus, if you moved one or more of your source textures over into XDR, you might end up with a more balanced system that uses both XDR bandwidth and VRAM bandwidth, and as such is possibly able to transfer more
Click to expand...

thanks man :)
 
Amir0x said:
Usually by budget is at 2000 a year for games/entertainment. That's what i try to squeeze everything into.

but THIS year, my budget is at 900 dollars max. I already spent a great deal of that pre-ordering certain PS2 games this fall, and pre-ordering Wii.
Click to expand...

Awesome :p just squeeze it into your next year budget!

Seriously, why do you feel the need to constantly harp on about the higher prices?

Sony aren't going to have trouble selling at this price this year. And when it does start to slow down, they'll just drop the price to bump up sales again. It's always been Sony's game, and there's no indication that it won't be again.
 
Zaptruder said:
Awesome :p just squeeze it into your next year budget!

Seriously, why do you feel the need to constantly harp on about the higher prices?

Sony aren't going to have trouble selling at this price this year. And when it does start to slow down, they'll just drop the price to bump up sales again. It's always been Sony's game, and there's no indication that it won't be again.
Click to expand...

Why not? it's a forum message board. To me, $600 dollars was the ultimate sword to the heart of Sony's plans - and totally disconnected me from where they are heading. I'm a pretty big and content sony fan, PSOne and PS2 were easily the best of their respective gens, but it makes sense to me to complain about a company that you like making a really crappy decision.
 
Wow, this thread is truly insane :lol
The funny thing is that I'm a 60 fps whore!
BTW every engine has costant and variable rendering costs, having more or less stuff
on screen does not change our engine costant costs and in some cases (especially when you're working on a first gen game..) these costs are so high that hitting 60 fps all the time
is impossible, on the other hand I think our game looks stunning compared to many other games on the same or other platforms and obviously there's a reason for that.. nothing is ifree!
With time we'll learn how to do more with less as we get a deeper knowledge about the hw..
 
Nostromo said:
Wow, this thread is truly insane :lol
The funny thing is that I'm a 60 fps whore!
BTW every engine has costant and variable rendering costs, having more or less stuff
on screen does not change our engine costant costs and in some cases (especially when you're working on a first gen game..) these costs are so high that hitting 60 fps all the time
is impossible, on the other hand I think our game looks stunning compared to many other games on the same or other platforms and obviously there's a reason for that.. nothing is ifree!
With time we'll learn how to do more with less as we get a deeper knowledge about the hw..
Click to expand...

Oh nA0, now you have REALLY sent this thread into overdrive!!! :lol
 
Amir0x said:
Why not? it's a forum message board. To me, $600 dollars was the ultimate sword to the heart of Sony's plans - and totally disconnected me from where they are heading. I'm a pretty big and content sony fan, PSOne and PS2 were easily the best of their respective gens, but it makes sense to me to complain about a company that you like making a really crappy decision.
Click to expand...

Maybe a crappy decision for you.

But you honestly think they've killed themselves for this gen? We don't know when they'll drop their prices, just like we don't really know how many units they'll sell at $500-600. Right now its mostly just bitterly complaining that you can't afford to join the party, rather than any sort of strong reasoning against Sony's business plans.
We'll be able to tell in retrospect where Sony made mis-steps, but for now, it seems far from unreasonable to sell to people that will buy at those prices. It may become more unreasonable when they hold to those prices but have run out of people willing to buy at those prices. Then we can discuss really crappy decisions.
 
how fast did the DVD player prices drop? it might give some insight on seeing how fast the blu-ray players can drop, and make it cheaper for the blu-ray drive in ps3 at the same time.
 
Nostromo said:
Wow, this thread is truly insane :lol
The funny thing is that I'm a 60 fps whore!
BTW every engine has costant and variable rendering costs, having more or less stuff
on screen does not change our engine costant costs and in some cases (especially when you're working on a first gen game..) these costs are so high that hitting 60 fps all the time
is impossible, on the other hand I think our game looks stunning compared to many other games on the same or other platforms and obviously there's a reason for that.. nothing is ifree!
With time we'll learn how to do more with less as we get a deeper knowledge about the hw..
Click to expand...
Congratulations on having the best PS3 game at E3.
 
davepoobond said:
how fast did the DVD player prices drop? it might give some insight on seeing how fast the blu-ray players can drop, and make it cheaper for the blu-ray drive in ps3 at the same time.
Click to expand...

years i think? launched in 1996 and in '99 DVD players were just hitting $300.
 
if sony constantly sell out what PS3's they ship, i don't see the price dropping until demand tapers off a little this time. we shall see.

I find it odd that $600 (ignoring the $500 pack) is seen by some as almost a trivial cost. I earn decent coin, and $600 (actually more like $800) _isn't_ trivial. So either i'm not earning as much as everyone else or i'm just not that hardcore any more.

I'm guessing the last of those too?
 
Amir0x said:
yup.
Click to expand...

$600 is too much for you?

Damn wuss Ken told you to get another job... weren't you paying attention? ;)

DCharlie said:
if sony constantly sell out what PS3's they ship, i don't see the price dropping until demand tapers off a little this time. we shall see.

I find it odd that $600 (ignoring the $500 pack) is seen by some as almost a trivial cost. I earn decent coin, and $600 (actually more like $800) _isn't_ trivial. So either i'm not earning as much as everyone else or i'm just not that hardcore any more.

I'm guessing the last of those too?
Click to expand...

I'm of two minds on it DC I mean on the one hand yeah $600-$800 is still a decent amt of money for alot of folks, but I just can't get worked up about it... shit we just spent more than that as a downpayment for our second timeshare... and we'll only use that twice a year... love the avatar BTW. Then.... when you go back and think about all the folks buying high def gear these days HDTV's, surround entertainment systems.. well then no another $600-$800 isn't that much... so it's really how you approach the purchase I guess.
 
Things I have learned today:

1. Price of a console doesn't matter because eventually it will have a price drop!

2. Framerate doesn't hurt a game unless it's under 24 because Pixar uses 24!

:lol
 
DCharlie said:
if sony constantly sell out what PS3's they ship, i don't see the price dropping until demand tapers off a little this time. we shall see.

I find it odd that $600 (ignoring the $500 pack) is seen by some as almost a trivial cost. I earn decent coin, and $600 (actually more like $800) _isn't_ trivial. So either i'm not earning as much as everyone else or i'm just not that hardcore any more.

I'm guessing the last of those too?
Click to expand...

And who's saying that the price isn't a big deal? All that was pointed out is that atleast initially they aren't going struggle to sell out of the system. There are enough hardcore gamers and others out there to make sure it sells out for awhile. That's not to say the price isn't a big deal its just to say for some while it is its not enough to make the shy away from buying it.

And there's no reason to ignore the 500 model.
 
Amir0x said:
yup.
Click to expand...

Based on what? Don't say $600, because not only is there a $500 option, it's obvious that the console won't be those prices for the entire lifetime of the console. That is one of the safer assumptions you can make.

So you don't think they'll sell out on release and christmas?

Or do you think they just can't afford to drop their prices ever?

Is there a condition on which you're so definite that is the cause of their failure?

What is it?

Or are you just bitter that you're too poor to buy one at launch?
 
SolidSnakex said:
I'm not sure how its a sure thing they'll be beat by Team Ninja if we're going by what they've already done. They definetly are moving at the same speed they were in the current gen with their next gen projects.

As for the response, I was just pointing out why Itagaki talks the way he does about NAMCO. It has nothing to do with him just taking a company and picking on them as was suggested, he has a reason for saying that stuff. He has no reason to suddenly go after HS.
Click to expand...

Dunno what you mean by that, the fact that take their time and finish their games instead of rushing to meet deadlines is one of the many things that ranks them above many other devs out there...

And no, I don't see them going after these HS guys, but I'd like to hear his opinion about it when it's done...
 
Amir0x said:
Why not? it's a forum message board. To me, $600 dollars was the ultimate sword to the heart of Sony's plans - and totally disconnected me from where they are heading. I'm a pretty big and content sony fan, PSOne and PS2 were easily the best of their respective gens, but it makes sense to me to complain about a company that you like making a really crappy decision.
Click to expand...

I propose we raise $600 for ami so he can finally stop bitching about the PS3 price. I'll start with ten bucks. Just give me a PayPal link.
 
pcostabel said:
I propose we raise $600 for ami so he can finally stop bitching about the PS3 price. I'll start with ten bucks. Just give me a PayPal link.
Click to expand...

How about we raise $200 for him? He can cover the deficit that he was willing to pay in the first place.

If he'll agree to that, I'll throw in $20.
 
Skilotonn said:
Dunno what you mean by that, the fact that take their time and finish their games instead of rushing to meet deadlines is one of the many things that ranks them above many other devs out there...
Click to expand...

Who says they're rushing for a deadline? Just because its not running at 60fps doesn't mean they are rushing to get to a deadline. And what I mean by that is the way their next gen games look. When you saw DoA2 the first time it was a huge leap over DoA, there was no comparisons between it and other versions of that game. The same can't be said for the first time DoA4 was unveiled and people actually thought it was a Xbox game (and that includes Xbox fans). As has been said all along, next gen will be when we see who were the good developers technically this gen and whow ere the great developers.

Skilotonn said:
And no, I don't see them going after these HS guys, but I'd like to hear his opinion about it when it's done...
Click to expand...

"Their game (nor anyone elses) is as good as mine."
 
Being a pc gamer with ever changing hardware and games that push current stuff to the limit, im pretty lenient when it comes to console framerate. 15 FPS is where i draw the line, anything under is unplayable for me. Hell I beat Doom 3 with like an average for 24+..15 at the really shitty/zomg moments.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Sword Of The Sea is quite delightful.
26
863
Humdinger replied
Marathon is the best FPS I've ever played. Takes me back to PS3/360 era.
Opinion  2 3 4 5
207
873
Mattdaddy replied
MLID: With its current specs, the PS6 will easily saturate 4K/120 FPS with ray tracing and is still tracking for a late 2027–early 2028 launch.
Opinion Rumor Hardware  2 3 4
176
2K
ShakenG replied
FPS Quest Trailer
2
215
March Climber replied
WarDogs Early Access Video (MP FPS)
3
146
TwinB242 replied
Top Bottom