• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

Hey NeoGaffer, you could be a rapist

Status
Not open for further replies.
Untitled.png


Really disturbing in a cartoon when you hear Batman was raped.

Man, this is bullshit. I read that comic, "Son of the Demon," and Bats willingly laid that sweet sweet pipe.

Edit: Oh, and the Experiment thing is awful too.
 
Its like they don't know the symbolism of using a mirror. You use a mirror = it refers to you directly. You don't look into a mirror with that message and think "oh gee anybody could be a rapist! I should revise my perceptions of a rapist." And this is evident from the makers having to follow-up with the people opening the door to make the message clearer. Something like this should be more direct, less artsy, and leave less room for interpretation.
 
Yeah, but you get the gist of it.
I'm also a bit off on the exact percentage (I think it might be 3%), but my point still stands - someone in this thread is a potential sexual assaulter.
Nice job assuming those stats you pulled out of who knows where are even for every possible demographic.

I think this video hurts the cause it's trying to bring awareness about much more than it helps. I feel like it's blaming the people who rushed in to defend the woman by saying they are potential rapists. Not to mention that every person mentioned there is a man, like that's the only gender that can commit such atrocity.
 
Rapists are not monstrous "others" who are noticeably different from everyone else, they're ordinary people, even star athletes and acclaimed directors. Understanding this can help people internalize that sexual assault is a serious problem that's closer than they realize.


To go along with this, it is also important to remember that rapists themselves are a serious problem. As I mentioned earlier, the statistics say that 3% of college men commit more than 90% of college rapes and already have an average of 6 crimes each.

Most rapists are not ordinary people who made a mistake, and do you really want to hurt them, and they've never done it before. Most rapists are serial rapists who planned and targeted their victim, and they have probably done it before, and will probably do it again, and if you can get them off the streets you are helping humanity.

They can be anyone. But not just anyone can be them.
 
They can be anyone. But not just anyone can be them.

I think this is a good point too, which is completely botched by the whole "Looking in a mirror: You could be a rapist" thing.

The logical thought for most people is "No, I'm not a rapist."
And, for most people, it's probably true - they're not, and never would be.

So as opposed to getting the point across that a rapist could be "anyone," "even someone like you," it's being presented as "you are a rapist."
 
I don't understand why it's such a big deal to lump the two together when people can't even fucking agree what 'rape-rape' is. Both come from the same motivations. Both are mentally and physically damaging. Both are horrible and occur far to often in modern society. A lot of states, as I said, treat them as the same thing with varying degrees. Just because someone doesn't think it's rape if there is no violence involved doesn't make it any less damaging to the person that was raped.

Here's my problem with the conflation. Many men such as myself who have never sexually assaulted anyone, even under the the most all-encompassing definitions of sexual assault available -- e.g. "Sexual assault can be verbal, visual, or anything that forces you to join in unwanted sexual contact or attention." taken from http://www.womenslaw.org/laws_state_type.php?id=13048&state_code=PG -- sense something wrong when statistics that account for all sexual assault across a spectrum of definitions are presented as though they are tracking rape alone, and when serial offenses by the same perpetrators are counted individually against the entire male population. Surely, rapists are not an extraordinarily rare breed, but nor are they as abundant as some massaged statistics suggest. And if say 15 percent of the male population (still a frightening figure), is responsible for more than 50 percent of all sexual assault, surely it would be worthwhile to seek to identify risk indicators among that set. I'm not suggesting that we identify the shifty-eyed rapist stereotype or that such a thing exists. Anyhow, when incidents of a man saying something sexually offensive to a woman (included in the womenslaw.org definition of sexual assault) are counted in rape statistics, you actually afford skeptics ammunition. (The MRA fucknuts see this as proof that the agenda is to malign men as a whole.) An asshole's verbal sexual innuendo is shitty, evil, and in certain circumstances criminal, and I understand that it can cause damage, but I disagree with you that this, for instance, is the same as physical sexual violation. And the conflation damages the cause. Because when those with one category of problem (there's no shortage of such people) who casually say shitty things and are accused of sexual assault, see those conflated statistics, they're more likely to dismiss the severity of the problem. And these are the people it's important to reach, right?
 
Husband is on that list, but Wife isn't?
Same deal with Brother but not Sister, and Father but not Mother

Me: Duh, you need a penis to ignore consent and if you have a penis you pretty much already consented in the womb when you chose your male accessories, along with everything else you chose. Ahem.

Audience member#4: "But what if both parties lack that accessory"

Me: ....

46398-jack-sparrow-run-gif-BXS6.gif
 
I'm not entirely sure that's the message. I think it's more "rapists fit no particular demographic."

You have an interesting take. I don't really agree. Rape isn't a villainous act? I get what you mean but I personally think it is. A rapist could otherwise be someone who doesn't appear villainous or unstable, but the act is.

Let me rephrase. I mean to say, rape is something anyone can be capable of, not some extraordinary act that only people of a certain type do. A rapist isn't like some job or hobby. The labelling detracts from the cause because it triggers people's emotional response in their amygdala rather than focusing on the rape act which should be more universally vilified. I think we're in agreement.
 
Here's my problem with the conflation. Many men such as myself who have never sexually assaulted anyone, even under the the most all-encompassing definitions of sexual assault available -- e.g. "Sexual assault can be verbal, visual, or anything that forces you to join in unwanted sexual contact or attention." taken from http://www.womenslaw.org/laws_state_type.php?id=13048&state_code=PG -- sense something wrong when statistics that account for all sexual assault across a spectrum of definitions are presented as though they are tracking rape alone, and when serial offenses by the same perpetrators are counted individually against the entire male population. Surely, rapists are not an extraordinarily rare breed, but nor are they as abundant as some massaged statistics suggest. And if say 15 percent of the male population (still a frightening figure), is responsible for more than 50 percent of all sexual assault, surely it would be worthwhile to seek to identify risk indicators among that set. I'm not suggesting that we identify the shifty-eyed rapist stereotype or that such a thing exists. Anyhow, when incidents of a man saying something sexually offensive to a woman (included in the womenslaw.org definition of sexual assault) are counted in rape statistics, you actually afford skeptics ammunition. An asshole's verbal sexual innuendo is shitty, evil, and in certain circumstances criminal, and I understand that it can cause damage, but I disagree with you that this, for instance, is the same as physical sexual violation. And the conflation damages the cause. Because when those with one category of problem (there's no shortage of such people) who casually say shitty things and are accused of sexual assault, see those conflated statistics, they're more likely to dismiss the severity of the problem. And these are the people it's important to reach, right?

I understand what your saying, but I am pretty sure most of the stats I know (the one in six one, for example) lists sexual assault as 'unwanted sexual contact' and doesn't count just people saying horrible things when you walk down the street. I think if that were the case, closer to 100% of women would be listed as having been sexually assaulted, because every women I know has been subject to street harassment at some point in their lives.

And honestly, I think education would start to help in cracking down on some stuff, because it really seems like a ton of young men/women don't know that 'having sex with a person who's so drunk she/he can't move/is unconscious' is rape. We need to start having serious conversations about consent with kids, not just the whole 'if they say no, don't go there'.
 
GAF has a total of 130,000 members.
Approximately 30% of them will at some point in their life commit either rape or sexual assault.

That's close to 40 thousand gaffers.
It is guaranteed that someone in this thread has or will at some point sexually assault or rape a fellow human being.

Where are you getting that number?

Current estimates for lifetime rates of sexual assault among women is around 1/6th, or significantly less than almost 1/3. And there are a few early studies of rapists which appear to suggest that a very large proportion of rapes are committed by a rather small subset - 4% in one study, 8.5% in another - of the population.

So I'm curious where you're getting such large estimates from.
 
And honestly, I think education would start to help in cracking down on some stuff, because it really seems like a ton of young men/women don't know that 'having sex with a person who's so drunk she/he can't move/is unconscious' is rape. We need to start having serious conversations about consent with kids, not just the whole 'if they say no, don't go there'.

I totally concur.
 
To go along with this, it is also important to remember that rapists themselves are a serious problem. As I mentioned earlier, the statistics say that 3% of college men commit more than 90% of college rapes and already have an average of 6 crimes each.

Most rapists are not ordinary people who made a mistake, and do you really want to hurt them, and they've never done it before. Most rapists are serial rapists who planned and targeted their victim, and they have probably done it before, and will probably do it again, and if you can get them off the streets you are helping humanity.

They can be anyone. But not just anyone can be them.

Don't forget the rest of the tail, though. From the same study, total number of rapists was found to be approximately twice that.

Might as well throw this in as a visual aid.

8ix5G.jpg


Source: http://www.davidlisak.com/wp-content/uploads/pdf/RepeatRapeinUndetectedRapists.pdf
 
Where are you getting that number?

Current estimates for lifetime rates of sexual assault among women is around 1/6th, or significantly less than almost 1/3. And there are a few early studies of rapists which appear to suggest that a very large proportion of rapes are committed by a rather small subset - 4% in one study, 8.5% in another - of the population.

So I'm curious where you're getting such large estimates from.

I confused the percentage of women getting sexually assaulted with the percentage of males who commit sexual assault, my apologies.
It's probably not that far off though, as sexual assault in its varying degrees is probably not considered a sex criminal act by many men and women.
 
Where are you getting that number?

Current estimates for lifetime rates of sexual assault among women is around 1/6th, or significantly less than almost 1/3. And there are a few early studies of rapists which appear to suggest that a very large proportion of rapes are committed by a rather small subset - 4% in one study, 8.5% in another - of the population.

So I'm curious where you're getting such large estimates from.

Squiddy confused numbers.

Yeah, but you get the gist of it.
I'm also a bit off on the exact percentage (I think it might be 3%), but my point still stands - someone in this thread is a potential sexual assaulter.

Statistics is tough.
 
I was almost in the clear except friend and cousin got me. I could get rid of the friend tag, but cousin is not really feasible.

Oh and I forgot about neighbor... that's a tough one too.
 
He forgot priest. Athiests.

I was almost in the clear except friend and cousin got me. I could get rid of the friend tag, but cousin is not really feasible.

Oh and I forgot about neighbor... that's a tough one too.

Hey, if anyone can be a rapist, anyone can be a murderer, too!
 
I understand what your saying, but I am pretty sure most of the stats I know (the one in six one, for example) lists sexual assault as 'unwanted sexual contact' and doesn't count just people saying horrible things when you walk down the street. I think if that were the case, closer to 100% of women would be listed as having been sexually assaulted, because every women I know has been subject to street harassment at some point in their lives.

And honestly, I think education would start to help in cracking down on some stuff, because it really seems like a ton of young men/women don't know that 'having sex with a person who's so drunk she/he can't move/is unconscious' is rape. We need to start having serious conversations about consent with kids, not just the whole 'if they say no, don't go there'.

I like the "no means no" posters they had plastered in my highschool. It specifically "under the influence means NO", "silence means NO".

But obviously they need to do more than plaster posters but it caught my eye back then. Especially when I would take a piss. I mean the poster is right, eventually I had to use the 30 seconds I was going to grasp what it was trying to convey.

Side note; Correct me if I'm wrong herr guys but don't most of these stats and graph models cover reported sexual assaults. And doesn't consider the cases where the victim does come forward or where the report getd dismissed. Again correct me if I'm wrong(probably)
 
The outtake in the beginning pissed me off for some reason, he seems to be full of himself.

Sometimes it's better to be clear and concise, then be overly dramatic, especially when one is dealing with a serious subject matter like rape.
 
I confused the percentage of women getting sexually assaulted with the percentage of males who commit sexual assault, my apologies.
It's probably not that far off though, as sexual assault in its varying degrees is probably not considered a sex criminal act by many men and women.

This exemplifies how I think some here assume too much about me. I too tend to challenge statistics, both sourced and unsourced (such as this). I suspect that some people who might mean well are accustomed to tossing unsubstantiated claims around and then turn to attacking the motivation of anyone who challenges them as immoral. "What does it matter what the actual figures are? Rape is wrong, and if you aren't supporting every statement I make you must have some hidden agenda." I believe that bad stats are bad stats, though, whatever they want to track. And no argument, no matter how morally just, benefits from them. Not picking on you or anyone in particular -- this is something that I've seen in other threads. It seems these conversations are often dominated by extremists on either end of the spectrum, by people accustomed to reducing one another's arguments to bromides, to the bingo cards of MRA buffoons and the high-minded but batshit Tumblr blogs.
 
Side note; Correct me if I'm wrong herr guys but don't most of these stats and graph models cover reported sexual assaults. And doesn't consider the cases where the victim does come forward or where the report getd dismissed. Again correct me if I'm wrong(probably)

The ones I cited was based on anonymous admissions from men.
 
Where are you getting that number?

Current estimates for lifetime rates of sexual assault among women is around 1/6th, or significantly less than almost 1/3. And there are a few early studies of rapists which appear to suggest that a very large proportion of rapes are committed by a rather small subset - 4% in one study, 8.5% in another - of the population.

So I'm curious where you're getting such large estimates from.

I think he means inactive posters, right? You could say 15 non active users went on to rape someone. It's not factual or something you could literally look into. But I could very well assume 1 out of all the users on GAF is sitting in jail right now for raping someone. It's dirty, mean, and it's not right to assume it.

It's like starting your freshman year at high school and trying to determine who or will not be sexually assaulted in the next four years. There's no way to tell.

Either that or you're starting a witch hunt. Which I won't be any part of. I sound like Morgan Freeman from the Dark Knight.
 
I think the thing that no one wants to admit is that the video probably accurately shows how they feel, for at least some of the people here. Everyone seems to say it was "poorly made." I don't know why people are saying that. There's not a whole lot wrong with the production values. Why is it poorly made? I think there's definitely some people here that agree with the point he's making, but just don't feel comfortable admitting it publicly.

Personally, I don't think it's "poorly made." I think it's extremely sexist and it paints 50% of the entire population with a broad brush; accusing them of subtle complicity in violent crime.

The video is well made. What's wrong with it is that the belief it is promoting is massively sexist. People should focus on that, or admit they agree with it.
 

Is the link a follow up to this?

This sort of idiocy sabotages authentic efforts to combat sexual violence. Portraying all men as potential rapists is in the same ugly vein as the idea that all women invite rape by "provoking" their potential or actual attackers. How vile.

I agree, the artist threw away any hopes of providing a proper commentary on the subject with such a ham handed and broad stroked handling of the subject matter. I find the painting of those who were actually trying to help as rapists especially awful.
 
*holds up a broken bottle, waving it around*

Back!! Back all of you!! No one with a penis can be trusted

*turns around to run.. but there's a mirror*

I was the rapist all along

NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
 
A rapist isn't like some job or hobby. The labelling detracts from the cause because it triggers people's emotional response in their amygdala rather than focusing on the rape act which should be more universally vilified.


I disagree. Think about all the times you hear the media lamenting the lucrative future lost by a rapist.

It doesn't seem like the "rapist" label is triggering a vilification response. On the contrary, it seems like the media is treating rape as something ordinary, something anyone could do, and it just happened to be these kids, and it's so sad for them.

But the statistics contradict this. From the study Orayn cited, nearly 2/3 of rapists are repeat offenders, and those repeat offenders had committed more than 90% of rapes.

That means, given a rape has occurred, there is a greater than 90% chance that the rapist is a repeat offender. Rather than "so tragic for these kids future" it should be "they've probably committed sexual assault before, and will do so again, and it would be tragic if they were left free to do so".
 
Here's what the video creator had to say about the message/intent:

it's insane how i can't even get myself to promote the public rape experiment anymore. not because people didn't agree with it but because of how much it is being misunderstood. allow me to explain why. going into this production i knew how sensitive the topic was and how difficult it would be to translate the issue onto film and give it justice. i felt like no matter what the end product was, i was in a losing situation because there was going to be a group of people who weren't satisfied with the execution. that really messed with my head and my vision.

the original vision: place the speakers into the bathroom and see reactions of individuals who walked into the bathroom and heard the sounds previously recorded. it was going to be filmed in men and women bathrooms. we scrapped the women idea after talking about how outraged people would have become. "OMG I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU INVADED THEIR PRIVACY BY PUTTING CAMERAS IN A BATHROOM! YOU'RE DISGUSTING." for the people who did bust in, they would see a sign on the wall that said, "YOU JUST SAVED A LIFE."

the problem: if i had executed the experiment that way, (the way all the people not happy with the finished product now wanted it to be) all i would have done is create another experiment on the "bystander effect." it would have completely derailed the topic from "rape" / "rape culture" and made it into a "what would society do if they were put in an uncomfortable position." i had done enough of those with my previous experiments. i had to think of another way.

upon releasing the trailer, i got tons and tons and tons of different opinions thrown my way. typically, i never allow my vision to be swayed by the opinions of others but because in this case, it wasn't necessarily about "me" but about an issue greater than us all and one we all deserved to be a part of if we wanted to work together towards change i listened. i spent a lot of time reading through emails, tweets, messages about what people felt the experiment should be about and how it should be executed. and for the first time ever, i changed my vision to fit the likes and concerns of others for the greater good.

now, that was no problem and i was very happy and honored to be able to tell the story of the "survivor" (which by the way, wasn't a way of saying all women die from rape, but rather she was able to overcome her internal battle with being a victim of rape) but it's what i decided to do the morning of the experiment that has now derailed the whole end product and i will explain.

the message on the wall was, "YOU JUST SAVED A LIFE." i have the footage of the walk through of that being the message. but in my head i had all the messages from people telling me that that wasn't the goal of the video and it wasn't to prove whether or not the bystander effect occurs in society. i needed a way to get the message of the people across. i then changed it to, "#STOP RAPE CULTURE ... PLEASE, Do Not Rape." but then i felt as if another group of people would have something to say. so finally at the last minute i changed it to,

"THIS IS WHAT A RAPIST COULD LOOK LIKE" with an arrow pointing to a mirror.

before releasing the video i was 100% content and confident in my work. i felt as if i had done the best i could with the time i allotted myself (my fault for giving myself a dead line) but overall, i was more than content.

after releasing the video i sat anxiously to see what the people would have to say. within minutes, every person who had something negative to say to me about conducting the experiment reached out to let me know that it surpassed their expectations and while not perfect they were pleasantly surprised and happy with the final product. i became ecstatic because all of my stresses and worries and doubts and fears were washed away and i felt that it was the beginning of great change and progress. but soon enough, it took a slight turn.

many people after watching the video took offense to the writing on the wall and thought it was saying, "LOOK IN THIS MIRROR. YOU ARE A RAPIST." no, no, no. in today's society, to be a "rapist" is to be some sort of "other" person who has issues within themselves and isn't an everyday normal civilian. but that isn't the case. the mirror was saying, "look at how you look in this mirror. a rapist could look EXACTLY like you." meaning, it could be anyone. no matter what they look like or what they struggle with they are capable of rape. and yes, same goes with "terrorist, murderer, thief" so on and so forth. these labels don't have faces. they don't have characteristics. they don't have color, language, beliefs etc. it could be an everyday civilian, JUST LIKE YOU.

the misunderstanding of that message went so far left field that everyone walked away thinking, "OMG how could you call a hero a rapist." i'd like to address that each person who burst through that stall was spoken to and had the victims story, the vision behind the mirror, the wall and experiment explained to them thoroughly. they were 100% on board and supportive of the message. they didn't go home with no one speaking to them thinking, "awe man, i just got called a rapist." as a lot of people who didn't understand the vision thought.

no matter what message i chose to put on the wall, there would be a side that wasn't happy with the execution of the video. if i could go back, i would hold off. i feel like this video is 3 years ahead of its and my time considering the state of not only youtube but society with the topic of "rape" and the realities of "rape culture." as i always say, i can easily continue to do pranks and make everyone laugh and smile. but i truly believed that i had a greater purpose and responsibility with my platform and felt i would be doing an injustice for us all if i didn't use it in a proper way. i mean, who else on youtube or anywhere for that matter has an audience with people of all ages and is shedding light this way?

it's just crazy how doing something that felt so right could end up making me feel so wrong.

bless, and until next time.

- Yousef Erakat
 
I'm mad at myself for being mad about this dumb bullshit. The only thing that has me agitated is I don't know for sure if anyone is going to pull this dude to the side, look him square in the eye and tell him that his 'experiment' is a dumb failure and that he is dumb for doing it. Like he should feel really fucking bad for having the idea, constructing the project, and then showing it to other people. At some moment in that process common sense should have stopped him, but it didn't and I need to have this explained to him in a condescending manner that will bring both enlightenment and shame.

I just really hope that happens.


it's just crazy how doing something that felt so right could end up making me feel so wrong.

*yessssssssss*
 
I bet more people would agree that 1 in 6 women get sexually assaulted if it was phrased "5/6th of women aren't sexually assaulted". People don't want to focus on the negative and if it makes them feel uncomfortable they'll try and mentally dispute the statistics.
 

It's only invasion of privacy to put cameras in women's bathrooms I guess? What an odd reason to put for not conducting the experiment with both genders? On its face, it doesn't stand up to even basic reasoning, unless you're sexist. It would have been interesting to see how many of each gender rushed in to help, but it probably wouldn't have provided him with the kind of answer he wanted, so he omitted it. I guess we'll never know.

And it's kind of juvenile to put "you just saved a life" as well. It could be one or more attackers, and they could be armed. You could rush in, and just get killed and not save anyone. Or you could save someone. It's not as simplistic as he portrays it.

was it just me or did this guy set up cameras in a public restroom?
isnt that like, super illegal?

Only invasion of privacy if he did it in the women's bathroom according to him.
 
I thought this was gonna involve Gaston or another similarly rapey Disney character.

It's rarely the ones you expect, why do you think Katarina Kodorofsky has only appeared twice in Mickey Mouse's Comic? She let him give Minnie the Jade Cat for her collection so he can see it every time he visits her and remembers what Katarina did to him...
 
I would've slowly walked towards the mirror to touch it and fall to the ground like a puppet.

Then cash in.


(I don't want to click but it sounds just like a fucked up thing to do, call rapist anyone who tries to help just to teach them a lesson they probably didn't need in the first place)
 

. i then changed it to, "#STOP RAPE CULTURE ... PLEASE, Do Not Rape." but then i felt as if another group of people would have something to say. so finally at the last minute i changed it

if i could go back, i would hold off. i feel like this video is 3 years ahead of its and my time

Maybe if this guy didn't have his head up his ass he could make a proper "experiment" or whatever he want's to call it. This idea really could have used some more time in the writer's room to make sure the right message is revealed.
 
I bet more people would agree that 1 in 6 women get sexually assaulted if it was phrased "5/6th of women aren't sexually assaulted". People don't want to focus on the negative and if it makes them feel uncomfortable they'll try and mentally dispute the statistics.

Is that so
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom