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How can Nintendo win back marketshare with their next home console?

The absolute last thing they want to do is rely on third parties. That was the plan with the Wii U at launch - and that kneecapped the system for a solid year.

Go cheap, and go modifiable. Handheld system with optional console for higher-res on-TV play.
 
in the past two generations, they've tried to differentiate with hardware. while this can lead to great results (Wii), it can also lead to really really terrible results (Wii U).

one general trend that we've seen is that hardware differentiation in the form of special controllers gives 3rd party developers an excuse to not put software on the system or put their B teams to work on the system. we commonly see a developer saying "we don't want to simply port the game over without really thinking about how to use the controller", which eventually means that the port doesn't happen.

another issue with their past two consoles is a lack of power. if they're not on equal footing with other competitors, they won't get multiplatform games, period. this is primarily an issue with their philosophy when designing consoles. they could easily have AMD build them an SoC on par with PS4 or Xbox One, but they wanted to focus on backwards compatibility (this doesn't add as much value as they think) and power consumption (most people don't care about this).

while it's true that they don't need to have a very powerful machine to make great games, it's also true that they need a competitive machine to get multiplat games. what it really comes down to here is a mismatch when it comes to what the market wants (powerful, cutting edge consoles) and what Nintendo has designed their console to be (small, power efficient, backwards compatible).

given all this, I'd prefer if Nintendo differentiated via software instead of hardware with their next console. what I'm referring to is that Nintendo "magic", their exceptional polish, their gameplay innovation. They need to apply that to the software (games, OS, online features). Build a solid competitive console, making it easy to get multiplatform titles, AND build an experience and games on that console that you can't get elsewhere.
 
The hardware and system features need to finally catch up to modern expectations and they need to get third parties. That is the recipe for success, yet they won't do it. The only reason I can think of that the Wii/Wii U is looked on negatively by people I know is that it's seen as a gimped toy. It doesn't have the functionality that people want. It would also help if they added good online multiplayer to their first party games. This is 2015 and while it's fun to play split screen, people expect to be able to play online with their friends in a party.
 
they have to launch with a big mass appeal game, something that is fresh, could be a new or existing IP. Not sure if 3rd party support is relevent, or even possible for them anymore though.

As well as something they already seem to be doing, making a single/cross platform environment for their products.
 
Make the console with similar hardware to it's competitors so third parties can make games for it with ease.

Make common sense online decisions.

Make one or two AAA new IPs and announce them early on or before the console is released

Maybe bundle a portable system with the console (bridge the mobile gaming experience with the home experience)

Include with the system a classic game bundle to get people with nostalgia. 5-6 SNES, N64, and Gamecube games for free.

No fee to play competitive online

Console comes with a normal controller (but is still compatible with all Wii and Wii U controllers too)
 
Mushroomer25 said:
The absolute last thing they want to do is rely on third parties. That was the plan with the Wii U at launch - and that kneecapped the system for a solid year.
Click to expand...

The plan was to appeal to the core gamers who felt ignored with the Wii. They failed, plain and simple.

It's not about relying on third parties, it's about having them to compliment your first party offerings and broaden your library.
 
Console and pro controller only,no gimmicks and I would buy, I really miss Nintendo nowadays. (I left when the Wii and its motion control crap came into play).
 
They very much devalued 3rd parties, and it's biting them in the ass. They thought with the Wii that they could sustain themselves, but it's painfully clear that that is not the case. They need to cater directly to 3rd parties, but I'm afraid that is also a path to death because the other companies are throwing millions around like crazy and Nintendo can't do that.

tengiants said:
They need to stop dealing with western games media since they seem to be obsessed with painting them in a bad light.
Click to expand...

The Western gaming media has been very positive with Nintendo for the past year. Once it was clear that the Wii U was a failure, they didn't have to keep saying that and could focus on the positives.
 
Ignoring the fact that I personally think the console industry is doomed, unless there's some radical change coming that makes it unique again, I don't think there's anything they can do. Third parties are not coming back, they seemingly have no desire to appeal to the 14 - 25 "mature" gamers (I don't think anything they tried would work anyway) and they're terribly slow at producing games for the fans that want to buy them.

I think they should step away from the console industry altogether, skirting all the unfavorable comparisons, and tapping into a non-traditional market like they did with the Wii, gameboy and NES.

Though I really liked the idea someone put up earlier about them purchasing take-two. Totally unrealistic, but man it would be Hoo-larious.
 
I don't know what people's idea about "bringing 3rd parties back" could possibly do for Nintendo. Do you think anyone is going to play the latest Assassin's Creed game on a Nintendo console? Do you think the audience for those sorts of games is savvy enough to go "look, this console is objectively the best choice because it has all my favorite third-party titles as well as the best exclusive line up" or do you think they're going to immediately identify the brand with Sony and Microsoft?

(It's the latter, by the way)
 
The third party ship has sailed and it's not coming back. They need to diversify their own software output and make games that appeal to the people that are buying games.
 
Make the SNES 2. Literally call it that and you will have my money. Standard controller packed in but have the GamePad as an optional extra because I would buy one thanks to it actually being useful despite what others think.

Make it have standardised hardware like x86 architecture, make it compatible with what third party wants and continue pumping out gorgeous first party titles. Let your studios experiment like Splatoon, moneyhat if you need to. Unified account system would work, as would creating a handheld system that can work alongside the home console.
 
Offer a machine that has the same feaures and power as the other ones or more, at the same or accordingly increased price with the same third party support but with Nintendo games on it. Not that hard to figure out. Keep the Nintendo difference on the software, don't fuck up with the hardware, kiss a lot of third party ass.
 
Wewtness said:
I don't know what people's idea about "bringing 3rd parties back" could possibly do for Nintendo. Do you think anyone is going to play the latest Assassin's Creed game on a Nintendo console? Do you think the audience for those sorts of games is savvy enough to go "look, this console is objectively the best choice because it has all my favorite third-party titles as well as the best exclusive line up" or do you think they're going to immediately identify the brand with Sony and Microsoft?

(It's the latter, by the way)
Click to expand...

People would play the games on Nintendo consoles if they looked better than the Sony/Microsoft counterparts. Pretty simple.

Add cross-platform online with PC versions of the same games to make up for userbase differences.
 
Honestly, they probably can't. The market for dedicated devices that exist primarily to play Mario et al. is only going to continue to decline, and their core competencies are too far removed from what it would take to even start winning back the major third parties.
 
HowZatOZ said:
Make the SNES 2. Literally call it that and you will have my money. Standard controller packed in but have the GamePad as an optional extra because I would buy one thanks to it actually being useful despite what others think.

Make it have standardised hardware like x86 architecture, make it compatible with what third party wants and continue pumping out gorgeous first party titles. Let your studios experiment like Splatoon, moneyhat if you need to. Unified account system would work, as would creating a handheld system that can work alongside the home console.
Click to expand...

They don't need you. They likely already have you, in some form or fashion. They need the people that don/t know what SNES is. They need the people that don't normally give two shits about Mario or Zelda or Metroid. The one time they did this in the last 20 years (with the Wii) is when they had their greatest success. That's not a coincidence.
 
The Wii U can't even play DVDs, Blu Rays, or music....

The hardware is there. There's no reason for those features to not be in there. That's the problem with them. They refuse to include features that are standard by now and think they are in some other league. If they aren't holding the same standards for their console, they shouldn't hold the same standards for their sales.
 
I don't think Nintendo will change from its path of hardware differentiation based on what Nintendo has said of its next-gen plans and the lack of any indication of going back to being a direct competitor. Wii U and even 3DS had problems that Nintendo had to deal with, but I don't think it will scare them away from that strategy. However, whether that involves finding a new blue ocean is anyone's guess. Although, as we all know, Nintendo has given up on that with both of its current handheld and home console platforms.

Iwata's said a couple times now that Nintendo isn't a good competitor as well as not being a resource-rich company as part of the reasons why it won't try to compete with Sony and Microsoft. Other known factors have to do with its concern over increased development costs, not caring what Sony and Microsoft do, the kind of software it likes to make that isn't about photo-realism and storytelling among some other things.
 
They should keep doing what they are doing: Don't copy competition and be innovative.

Not every innovation will be accepted from the mainstream gamer. But I don't want to miss Wiimote and Gamepad.

But they must have better marketing and should spend some money for third party games.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
They don't need you. They likely already have you, in some form or fashion. They need the people that don/t know what SNES is. They need the people that don't normally give two shits about Mario or Zelda or Metroid. The one time they did this in the last 20 years (with the Wii) is when they had their greatest success. That's not a coincidence.
Click to expand...

That is true. I'll be there no matter what because I'm a heavily invested Nintendo fan who just wants SNES 2.

Third parties is going to be the key for this next console, and if they can't secure that then it just won't float well enough. Do what Sony did, build a console for developers.
 
Ship first? Ohhh wait....

Not sure really. They'll have to transform their way of doing business almost completely. SCE is the handbook at the moment.
 
Wewtness said:
I don't know what people's idea about "bringing 3rd parties back" could possibly do for Nintendo. Do you think anyone is going to play the latest Assassin's Creed game on a Nintendo console? Do you think the audience for those sorts of games is savvy enough to go "look, this console is objectively the best choice because it has all my favorite third-party titles as well as the best exclusive line up" or do you think they're going to immediately identify the brand with Sony and Microsoft?

(It's the latter, by the way)
Click to expand...

Historically every best selling system has been the one that offered consumers the hottest releases. You can go back to the Atari 2600, NES, Playstation, PS2, etc. The Wii is the only system that ever bucked that trend, but that's because it was a fad.

So yes, consumers would most certainly be more inclined to side with Nintendo if they were offering the latest GTA, Elder Scrolls, Assassins Creed, Battlefield, etc. But they need to be equal to Sony and Microsoft in terms of support. Not just a game here and there from a few companies.
 
Wewtness said:
I don't know what people's idea about "bringing 3rd parties back" could possibly do for Nintendo. Do you think anyone is going to play the latest Assassin's Creed game on a Nintendo console? Do you think the audience for those sorts of games is savvy enough to go "look, this console is objectively the best choice because it has all my favorite third-party titles as well as the best exclusive line up" or do you think they're going to immediately identify the brand with Sony and Microsoft?

(It's the latter, by the way)
Click to expand...

People are going to go to the console that has the features and games they want. This generation proves that. Plenty of people didn't hesitate going from the 360 to PS4 or from PS2 to 360. I don't think people are as attached to Sony/Microsoft as you think they are. There's a very large group of people that moves in between.
 
CurseoftheGods said:
I don't think of the Wii U as a failure. In fact, it's my favourite of the current gen systems. However, there's no denying that it's not nearly as successful as Nintendo's previous consoles.
Click to expand...

It's a successful system in terms of its game library

But it's a failure system in terms of its market impact.

I think that's the basic line to draw.

CurseoftheGods said:
I think doing these things might help their next system:

-ditch gimmicks, focus on traditional controls
-make similar hardware to the competition for more 3rd party support akin to the GameCube
-more online features, the stuff on Wii U was a great start

I think Nintendo trapped themselves in a niche where only the hardcore gamers will buy their home consoles. It might be profitable, but I don't see why Nintendo shouldn't be a little more aggressive in the console market.
Click to expand...

I think for Nintendo it'd be a very dumb move to 'ditch gimmicks.' I may not always approve of them, but when Nintendo hits on a smart idea, they usually make it work to their advantage. I think the problem with Wii U actually was they tried straddling the line and made a lot of dumb decisions in the process.

For example, for a system that had a GamePad option they actually could have used extra power for various gameplay related reasons. But really, I just think they didn't think the GamePad idea all the way through - unlike other Nintendo platforms they really never figured out an app that truly justified its existence in the way Wiimote did for Wii, and it just wasn't anything that surprised people. Most instinctively understood the dual screen concept based on DS and 3DS, and it's just not something that's going to get people rushing to stores anymore. Much like Kinect 2.0 didn't for XBO. People been there, done that.

I think Nintendo needs to march to the beat of their own drum, but I will say they're coming up toward some very uncertain times. VR is being pioneered by Sony, Facebook/Oculus and Microsoft with Augmented Reality VR, so the 'gimmick' next-gen may very well be dominated by these companies, because Nintendo is otherwise clearly behind unless they've been frankly miraculous at keeping it a secret. It'd be momentous even by Nintendo standards with all the VR buzz going around in the industry. And how would they make theirs stand out? That's a case where they will actually need decent specs to be VR competitive, so it'd be curious to say the least. On top of that, it's no secret that gaming dedicated hardware is increasingly being marginalized in this industry, and that's always been Nintendo's bread and butter since Gameboy. It's going to be a fascinating decade for Nintendo to say the least.


In the end, Nintendo needs to not follow the pack. They're not like Sony and Microsoft, and they should continue to embrace that. They just need to figure out a new way to embrace it that also happens to sync with the market at large, like DS and Wii did.
 
KratosEnergyDrink said:
They should keep doing what they are doing: Don't copy competition and be innovative.

Not every innovation will be accepted from the mainstream gamer. But I don't want to miss Wiimote and Gamepad.

But they must have better marketing and should spend some money for third party games.
Click to expand...

Yeah, they could very well stick with this strategy. However, in the case of the 3DS and Wii U, those respective new hardware features did not make for compelling system-selling points. The GamePad was something that tried to solve a problem in households that didn't really need to be solved. If I remember correctly, Iwata once said that off-TV play was an idea Nintendo came up with in attempt to primarily solve Japanese consumers not showing as much interest in home consoles compared to handhelds. Changing how we play games cannot be an easy thing to come up with, and as you said, mainstream gamers won't necessarily care about them either, and the same can be said of third party companies too.
 
Rogue_Ledr said:
Here is an idea:

How about NOT releasing a new console?

They could go multiplatform and make a fortune.
Click to expand...

Thank you!
Its the most-obvious answer.

They have the best IP, some of the best developers, and they're not pushing out dozens of AAA titles annually anyway. Use those same resources to put games on the PS4 / XB1 and go gold-swimming like Scrooge McDuck. ...Hell, let Microsoft and Sony fall all over themselves to bid for the exclusive rights to a franchise that isn't Mario or Zelda. How much would Sony pay to finally have a must-own exclusive FPS like Metroid Prime?


Sephiroth_GR_ said:
Just like Sega...
Click to expand...

Totally disagree with you here. At the time, Sega was still making some good games. But the quality dip in their portfolio on the whole had begun. I had a Dreamcast. I had Sonic Adventure and a dozen others. Not even close to the great games that Nintendo is making today. And those Nintendo developers wouldn't be going anywhere; they would stay with Nintendo and I'm confident they could make the transition in tech from WiiU to PS4 / XB1.
 
HowZatOZ said:
That is true. I'll be there no matter what because I'm a heavily invested Nintendo fan who just wants SNES 2.

Third parties is going to be the key for this next console, and if they can't secure that then it just won't float well enough. Do what Sony did, build a console for developers.
Click to expand...

It won't work for Nintendo. Pubs/devs won't make games for it regardless as they think their games won't sell....core gamers won't buy it as they won't believe 3rd parties will support it long term.

I'd actually go in completely the opposite direction if I was Nintendo..do what suits themselves almost 100% (and indies as they will actually be willing to support them)...and assume you'll be getting almost zero big 3rd party support. EA aren't going to support it no matter what, same for Take Two, same for Bethesda,same for Konami.

Either make a powerful,cheap, barebones gaming machine aimed squarely at the Nintendo core with a pinpoint focus (won't sell much but might make a profit)...or try and do something so different and out there that the mass market notices ala the original Wii (which is a roll of the dice as it's as likely to crash and burn as it is succeed).

Nintendo will never get major 3rd party support until either Xbox/Playstation leave the market (unlikely)..or they spend themselves into oblivion by paying for every port.
 
Blu-ray and MP3 player. Do the "it only does everything" approach that made me fall in love with the PS3. Both Sony and Microsoft seem to have abandoned this approach this gen. I would love to only need to have one box under my TV.
 
Nintendo can beg third parties all they want and even make some decisions to its hardware that will please third party companies. However, if the games don't sell, then it won't matter how powerful Nintendo's next console is. Third parties are out to make money and if they realize a certain platform is not viable because of considerably weak sales and notice the target demographics not present on the console's user base as well as consumer buying trends, then they may not even consider porting the game to Nintendo's home console . At best, it could see some late ports (as a low priority platform) and at worst, it could see virtually none released at all.
 
There's more than likely going to be some kind of gimmick attached to their next box, it's damn near unavoidable.
It'll be underpowered in comparison to the other 2, that's pretty much a given also.
If they want to attract new gamers, get some core support back, or even just get people talking positively I'd simply reinvent or redefine their franchises. Don't solely rely on the gimmick itself as a prime reason to buy Nintendo or their games, but get people talking about the new Animal Crossing or Zelda as though it's something they've never seen before. Reinvent the wheel as it were. I'd like to hear people say, "that's not the Mario/Star Fox/Metroid I know or remember", followed b a joyfull "holy shit!". The gimmick shouldn't be at the core of Nintendo gaming next gen is how I feel, give us a breather and blow us away with some head turning software.
 
Nintendo is screwed pretty much. Why?

- Third party support.
* Ultimately to get third parties back on board they need a console that is an AMD APU with 8GB of memory. Something similar enough that ports are not overly difficult.
* By doing that they immediately lose backwards compatibility because the cost of entry would be too much to support.
* They have to adjust their entire philosophy on the West and Third parties in general. For their next console to have that support they would have to already done this. They haven't and won't.

- Online ecosystem.
* They would have to invest hundreds of millions of dollars to ensure they have a presence similar to even the early days of PSN. Billions to get it to Live/PSN as they are now.

- Gimmicks
* In order to see Wii level market penetration they would need a gimmick that has not been done with universal appeal. That simply does not exist with the market the way it is today. A portable system that can hook up in the living room would fail. No third parties again, low power, and no serious online presence.

- The Nintendo base
* I've touched on this before some, but Nintendo has done nothing but lose market share every generation except the Wii (which most would agree was an outlier or flash in the pan). Note that from the NES to the GameCube Nintendo lost on average 15 million customers every time. The Wii was released at the perfect time in history and saw incredible success.

However take a look at GameCube lifetime sales and look where the Wii U will be given realistic estimates. Yep, again it's about 15 million loss.

The problem here is that with drop offs like that and the Wii U maybe managing 12-14 million sales something has to give. It's no secret Nintendo is looking at other potential revenue streams with QoL, Amiibos and the virtual console. (The last two being easily capable of being done on other platforms.)

Ultimately Nintendo's problems are far too many and they have shown absolutely no signs of fixing anything. From a business perspective they are diversifying without admitting defeat atm.

They make exceptional games, but nothing about anything else they do is exceptional and I think they are seeing what a Nintendo might look like after another commercial flop.

I love Nintendo's games, but from what I'm looking at I don't see it. There is entirely too much investment to do upfront to compete with Sony or Microsoft, they have done fuck all to fix third party relations and their anti West mentality, and they are diversifying their company in other markets which is a clear sign they are looking at their whole company's future can be secure.

From what I see and believe, I think Nintendo knows home consoles are not an option here sooner rather than later.
 
x86
graphixsss!!!!!!
Metroid
3rd Party Support
Online and Modern Server Infrastructure
Stop Pandering to a tech-inadequate generation.
 
I think a powerful console with nintendo's exclusives, bluray playback, all the third party support, and a robust online service would be my dream. However, even if nintendo puts out a comparable machine, third parties may ignore it because nintendo fans buy nintendo games. It's risky to go all out on a limb hoping third parties or the xbox/playstation audience comes back.

they should just embrace their niche and make cheap hardware good enough for their games that's appealing as a secondary console. I don't think it makes sense for me to own both a ps4 and xb1 right now, especially since both offer many of the same games and require paid online services. The wiiu slots in nicely as a secondary console with vastly different exclusives and free online.
 
Ditch the PowerPC architecture. They aren't doing indies or third parties any favors by using it.

... Though thankfully they seem to be going completely 86x with the next console.
 
Pretty sure that Nintendo will not make another traditional console. They'll focus on some sort of hybrid instead, that will merge their handheld and home console separation into a single lineup.
 
They should stay conservative.

Release their next console and focus on hitting a low price point. Definitely put price before power. There should be as much connectivity as possible between their home and handheld systems, but they should continue to make different games for each. Expand modestly with a new first party studio or two that caters to the core audience and makes a nice headline (maybe try to get Platinum on board or build new European studio that includes some ex-Rare employees).

Attempting to get third parties back would be expensive and (likely) fruitless. Ditto for trying to get back marketshare from Microsoft or Sony. Going third-party would be a huge risk, and is almost certainly not what Nintendo's best option is at this point.

Nintendo should focus on making money and keeping their customers happy, rather than "winning" the console race.
 
Amir0x said:
I think for Nintendo it'd be a very dumb move to 'ditch gimmicks.' I may not always approve of them, but when Nintendo hits on a smart idea, they usually make it work to their advantage. I think the problem with Wii U actually was they tried straddling the line and made a lot of dumb decisions in the process.

For example, for a system that had a GamePad option they actually could have used extra power for various gameplay related reasons. But really, I just think they didn't think the GamePad idea all the way through - unlike other Nintendo platforms they really never figured out an app that truly justified its existence in the way Wiimote did for Wii, and it just wasn't anything that surprised people. Most instinctively understood the dual screen concept based on DS and 3DS, and it's just not something that's going to get people rushing to stores anymore. Much like Kinect 2.0 didn't for XBO. People been there, done that.

I think Nintendo needs to march to the beat of their own drum, but I will say they're coming up toward some very uncertain times. VR is being pioneered by Sony, Facebook/Oculus and Microsoft with Augmented Reality VR, so the 'gimmick' next-gen may very well be dominated by these companies, because Nintendo is otherwise clearly behind unless they've been frankly miraculous at keeping it a secret. It'd be momentous even by Nintendo standards with all the VR buzz going around in the industry. And how would they make theirs stand out? That's a case where they will actually need decent specs to be VR competitive, so it'd be curious to say the least. On top of that, it's no secret that gaming dedicated hardware is increasingly being marginalized in this industry, and that's always been Nintendo's bread and butter since Gameboy. It's going to be a fascinating decade for Nintendo to say the least.


In the end, Nintendo needs to not follow the pack. They're not like Sony and Microsoft, and they should continue to embrace that. They just need to figure out a new way to embrace it that also happens to sync with the market at large, like DS and Wii did.
Click to expand...

They should steal GabeN's original Haptic controller...
 
Nintendo doesn't need to compete power wise. What they need is functionality parity. The Wii U should offer Blu-Ray playback. The Wii U should offer a robust online ecosystem. There is currently zero reason to own the machine outside of first party Nintendo exclusives, and history has proven that they have limited mass market appeal. I don't think releasing a PS4 clone would do them any favors, but they need more than just different software in order to stand out in this competitive industry.
 
antibolo said:
Pretty sure that Nintendo will not make another traditional console. They'll focus on some sort of hybrid instead, that will merge their handheld and home console separation into a single lineup.
Click to expand...

I think that is what most people want, including me. It'd be nice just so that they have all their AAA on one console and don't deviout their hardcore titles to specific hardwares.
 
Honestly I don't mind the "gimmicks" when they're not overdone. I like having a map on the bottom screen / touch pad and some menus / etc are better navigated with a touch screen.

Kind of wish the thing was more powerful so that I wouldn't have to buy another console for 3rd party titles.
 
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