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[thequickandthedead]

Over here in the UK we had a history module in high school to do with the American West. It pretty much painted the Americans as the bad guys who robbed native americans of their land, killed all their buffalo and tried to destroy their culture by forcing their children to be re-educated in white schools.

Is it taught any differently in the US?

 

[Bo Knows GAF]

It really isn't taught at all. Not a joke post.

Edit: Until you begin taking college level education courses, or University, you won't see much that would elaborate on the terribke treatment of Native Americans. You'll learn basics about the West and it'll mostly stay around the California gold rush, or Mexican American War, but won't go any further.

 

[linkandzelda]

I did the same module so I would like to know also.

 

[potam]

It's more or less, "hey, our forefathers did some pretty fucked up shit. Let's now discuss everything else about Manifest Destiny."

 

[Caribou]

Yeah, not really taught at all, and the description in the op is pretty accurate

 

[Amir0x]

Depends on the type of class you were in. In Advanced Placement type classes, you definitely got a deeper overview of all this. One thing that I don't think was ever properly conveyed was the scale of the devastation, though.

Like only a few decades after the flood gates had opened from Europe, estimates of up to 60-90% of Native Americans were dead from disease. Like, Europeans were exploring the continent and kept coming upon haunting abandoned villages and empty homes or places strewn with dead bodies or the dying with no one to care for them.

They thought that was divine providence - god was cleaning the territory for them to inhabit it. Fucked up stuff.

 

[teruterubozu]

Is it taught any differently in the US?

We lay the blame on Europeans.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Yeah, not really taught at all, and the description in the op is pretty accurate

It really isn't taught at all. Not a joke post.

Where in the world did you guys go to school? That was almost some middle school level stuff here
and im talking Alabama schools of all places.(though it wasn't that deep until highschool.)

 

[SliceSabre]

It isn't.

American history education pretends the genocide of Native Americans never really happened or or covers it in a way that poses it as American settlers always being harassed by roving bands of merciless Natives and the Army as heroes to stop them except in the case of Custer.

 

[Amir0x]

It isn't.

American history education pretends the genocide of Native Americans never happened or poses it as American settlers always being harassed by roving bands of Natives and the Army as heroes to stop them.

This really isn't true. I was taught this in class from a very early age. It's one of the few subjects they didn't seem to shy away from too much. They tend to put it in the context of offensive policies like Manifest Destiny and whatnot.

I don't think it's taught well enough or expansively enough, but they definitely go over it. I feel the same way about when they teach slavery and abolition and whatnot. They touch on it and definitely go over how bad it is, but tend not to allow the full weight of the horror and responsibility fall on the American system itself.

 

[Stereogatari]

So Americans that lecture Turks online about their colonisation of Anatolia (or any other comparable lecturing of other groups) are hypocrites? Or is America so big that the school curriculums vastly vary?

 

[Bo Knows GAF]

Where in the world did you guys go to school? That was almost some middle school level stuff
and im talking Alabama schools of all places.(though it wasn't that deep until highschool.)

Philadelphia area. Manifest Destiny was always the focus and the Native Americans were not. It isn't that we didn't ever speak of it but to the level the OP is talking about, no that didn't get covered. The summation was that we killed the Indians, oh well next topic.

 

[potam]

I will say, though, that I don't think there are many Americans my age who don't know about the Trail of Tears and the atrocities.

I think there is something inherently American about not wanting to acknowledge our past. How we treated the native people, African slaves, and pretty much every group of immigrants...I think there is a general feeling of "yeah, our country went through some growing pains, but that's not the US of today." I'm not saying it's right, but I think that has a lot to do with it. It's difficult for a lot of people to reconcile our past with the idea of America and all it stands for.

Plus, our education system blows.

 

[teruterubozu]

Philadelphia area. Manifest Destiny was always the focus and the Native Americans were not. It isn't that we didn't ever speak of it but to the level the OP is talking about, no that didn't get covered. The summation was that we killed the Indians, oh well next topic.

This is very true. Hardly any details about the tribes and their diplomatic situations are taught - it's essentially one big sweep of "Indians".

 

[A Fish Aficionado]

So Americans that lecture Turks online about their colonisation of Anatolia (or any other comparable lecturing of other groups) are hypocrites? Or is America so big that the school curriculums vastly vary?

The latter. Depends on state and district.
And what Amir0x said. In California we go through it and even some of the tribes in California and the Mission system.


In high school, the Howard Zinn book is popular here, but I'm in a very liberal pro-union part of California.

 

[Marjorine]

This must be very school district dependent. It got covered heavily in all US history classes I took.

 

[Chance Hale]

It was talked about in Jr. High and High School history courses in Alaska/Texas. Didn't shy away from the various massacres and people being forced into reservations. The US doesn't have a nation wide set of teaching standards for better or worse, what you were taught heavily depends on your district, let alone your state.

 

[Enthus]

I was taught about it fairly early on, and had to do some deeper projects and research into it in high school U.S. history courses. One thing that sticks out to me early on was seeing this picture in a book in 5th or 6th grade and thinking about how shitty it all was:

 

[SliceSabre]

This really isn't true. I was taught this in class from a very early age. It's one of the few subjects they didn't seem to shy away from too much. They tend to put it in the context of offensive policies like Manifest Destiny and whatnot.

I don't think it's taught well enough or expansively enough, but they definitely go over it. I feel the same way about when they teach slavery and abolition and whatnot. They touch on it and definitely go over how bad it is, but tend not to allow the full weight of the horror and responsibility fall on the American system itself.

This is simply my experience in my high school history courses which I admit is limited because I was only required to take 3 years of history back in high school and don't remember much of what we learned in middle school. In my classes we simply did not cover the stuff with Native Americans much and the times we did they were never painted in a positive light it felt it was approached from a "The Army and Feds did what they had to do." sort of way.


Also this was like 12 years ago so I may not remember everything.

 

[theusedversion]

I can say that while I learned a lot about that time while I was in middle school, I don't remember ever hearing about the widespread disease that Indians were battling at the time. I only became aware of it because of this Cracked article. It kind of blew my mind when I read it.

6 Ridiculous Lies You Believe About the Founding of America

http://www.cracked.com/article_19864_6-ridiculous-lies-you-believe-about-founding-america.html

 

[potam]

We might as well start posting where we went to school.

GA - taught that it happened, but didn't cast the government in an especially harsh light from what I remember

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

This is very true. Hardly any details about the tribes and their diplomatic situations are taught - it's essentially one big sweep of "Indians".

This I definitely agree with.

 

[Amir0x]

This is simply my experience in my high school history courses which I admit is limited because I was only required to take 3 years of history back in high school and don't remember much of what we learned in middle school. In my classes we simply did not cover the stuff with Native Americans much and the times we did they were never painted in a positive light.


Also this was like 12 years ago so I may not remember everything.

Well like some people have said, what students are taught varies a lot depending on what district you were in, what state, what text books you used, etc... so it's possible you didn't learn a lot.

I think in my experience most students in America do learn about it and know it was "wrong", so-to-speak, but they never get too deep into the minutiae of the events or into a more critical overview of what it says about America itself. So it's not expansive enough the teaching. That said, if you were in Advanced Placement classes for History, they do go deeper.

 

[Ettie]

We spend a fairly significant amount of time on it at my school, but I'm from Oklahoma so the perspective is different.

 

[RDreamer]

This really isn't true. I was taught this in class from a very early age. It's one of the few subjects they didn't seem to shy away from too much. They tend to put it in the context of offensive policies like Manifest Destiny and whatnot.

I don't think it's taught well enough or expansively enough, but they definitely go over it. I feel the same way about when they teach slavery and abolition and whatnot. They touch on it and definitely go over how bad it is, but tend not to allow the full weight of the horror and responsibility fall on the American system itself.

Yeah, it was taught to me, but that amounted to a couple paragraphs or so in the book, and maybe a few minutes of lecture. Then again everything was about that length. WWII had like a page or something. There was never time to dwell on anything at all.

 

[Nostremitus]

I was taught it was an atrocity early on.

 

[Amir0x]

Yeah, it was taught to me, but that amounted to a couple paragraphs or so in the book, and maybe a few minutes of lecture. Then again everything was about that length. WWII had like a page or something. There was never time to dwell on anything at all.

I also keep repeating this, but I think it heavily depends on the type of History classes you were in. History and English were my two best subjects and I was in Advanced Placement for them, and in my AP History class they went way deeper into the subjects than my friends who weren't learned.

 

[andycapps]

I remember it being covered in highschool pretty thoroughly, though it wasn't until college when they really beat into my head what a horrible thing we did to the Native Americans. In highschool it was more about the facts about what happened, and in college they elaborated on some of the stories of the Native Americans and what they went through.

 

[……forgetit]

I remember it being a big deal even at a young age and we watched multiple movies and documentaries on it.

 

[Chance Hale]

Yeah, suppose I should note I was pre-ap in Jr. High and AP in High school.

 

[NR1]

I will agree to a point that the subject is often glossed over, but it is taught several times. For me, it was never really mentioned in elementary school, but in middle and high school it is talked about. Often times it is only discussed in the early European exploring years (Spanish destruction of the Aztec and Incan Empries). They talk about how the settlers would give the Natives small pox infested blankets. It's actually taught more about how the Native Americans were whiped out more by disease since they had no immunity or resistance, rather than a mass killing by explorers and settlers.

American destruction of the Natives is talked about, but it's more about how they keep giving them reservations to live on, but then a few years later the government says, "Yea, sorry, we want this land too. Move along to a new home." Basically, by the time the United States is established, most of the destruction has taken place and what little is left is now consider acceptable behavior.

So badically, a lot of blame gets placed on the early European explorers.

I would say America accepts more blame for slavery and the Jim Crow era, than the Native American eradication.

Thanksgiving often times will exemplify the United States position on Native American relations. This is really the only narrative that is taught up until Middle School.

 

[Zaraki_Kenpachi]

This is very true. Hardly any details about the tribes and their diplomatic situations are taught - it's essentially one big sweep of "Indians".

I think it depends on how many tribes you had near you. Where I grew up there was a couple of namable tribes in the area so local tribes were very much taught.

 

[……forgetit]

I'll add that I took ap history and my teacher was a direct descendent of Andrew Jackson. She really emphasized all the fucked up things he did and made sure we knew he was an all around terrible president and human being.

 

[Kite]

Those posters saying their schools didn't go over it at all.. LOL umm yeah my Texas public education didn't get as in depth as some posters would like but it certainly wasn't ignored. We learned about the trail of tears and how unfair and messed up the reservations are.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Over here in the UK we had a history module in high school to do with the American West. It pretty much painted the Americans as the bad guys who robbed native americans of their land, killed all their buffalo and tried to destroy their culture by forcing their children to be re-educated in white schools.

Is it taught any differently in the US?

That's how it was taught K-12 when I went through. Learned about several tribes, Trail of Tears, Euro diseases, etc. plenty that wasn't covered, but there was no general impression made other than the land was all taken by force from Natives, some parts taken from Mexico and some northern parts from the French who were fucking around with Canada.

Was standard Anerican history. No AP courses required.

 

[potam]

I'll add that I took ap history and my teacher was a direct descendent of Andrew Jackson. She really emphasized all the fucked up things he did and made sure we knew he was an all around terrible president and human being.

I was gonna make a joke about Jackson being good at kicking the shit out of the British...but then I started reading his wiki.

Jackson defeated the Red Sticks at the Battle of Horseshoe Bend in 1814. US forces and their allies killed 800 Red Stick warriors in this battle, but spared the chief Red Eagle, a mixed-race man also known as William Weatherford. After the victory, Madison's Secretary of War Armstrong ordered Major General Thomas Pinckney in April 1814 to make the surrender treaty. [19] Pinckney made moderate terms of surrender including handing over an unspecified amount of land, the construction of U.S. forts, turning over warriors who instigated hostilities, and agreeing to stop trade with foreign countries. Jackson opposed the unpopular Pinckney treaty desiring to completely destroy the Creek nation. Jackson was promoted Major General and given charge of the Seventh Military District, replacing Major General Thomas Flournoy. Jackson, now commanding general, immediately threw out Pinckney's treaty and forced severe terms upon both the Upper Creek enemies and the Lower Creek allies, wresting twenty-two million acres in present-day Georgia and Alabama from all the Creek for European-American settlement. [19] Jackson also confiscated land from Indians who had sided with the Americans. Jackson stated that the terms must be accepted or the tribe would be forcefully removed to Florida. On August 9, 1814 35 Indian elder leaders signed Jackson's Treaty of Fort Jackson. The warrior faction of the Creek nation and the British, however, did not formally recognize the treaty. [19]

According to author Gloria Jahoda, the Creeks coined their own name for him, Jacksa Chula Harjo "Jackson, old and fierce".[20]

The Seminole attacked Jackson's Tennessee volunteers. The Seminole attack left their villages vulnerable, and Jackson burned their houses and the crops. He found letters that indicated that the Spanish and British were secretly assisting the Indians. Jackson believed that the United States could not be secure as long as Spain and the United Kingdom encouraged Indians to fight, and argued that his actions were undertaken in self-defense. Jackson captured Pensacola, Florida, with little more than some warning shots, and deposed the Spanish governor. He captured and then tried and executed two British subjects, Robert Ambrister and Alexander Arbuthnot, who had been supplying and advising the Indians. Jackson's actions struck fear into the Seminole tribes as word spread of his ruthlessness in battle (he became known as "Sharp Knife").

The way he captured Florida though is kinda badass, despite his assholeness.

 

[Ray Wonder]

It was taught, but it was all light subjects. They don't really tell how brutal it was. I remember learning about cooperation, and Native Americans teaching Europeans about agriculture. I only learned about a few battles. I didn't learn about a Native American genocide, which is pretty much what it was.. I'm half Chippewa, so I took interest in it.

 

[biggersmaller]

My wife is a teacher now and I was on a school board for a while. Sadly, history in general is no longer an emphasis, with closing the achievement gap in the way of math, science, reading, and technology taking 95% of a teacher's time.

In my day? Every year there was a Native unit, starting in 3rd grade in Minneapolis (80s) we had our introduction on this topic. It focused heavily on the Dakota War and included a reading on the simultaneous hanging of 38 Dakota in Mankato. Thing is, horses and wooden forts may-as-well be ancient Greece to a kid. You're not old enough to make the connection that there's a reason not a single Native kid is in your class until middle school, and by then you're a jaded teen just thinking about girls.

I never had a college course broach the subject, though I worked a summer gig that worked with Native kids that had behavioral problems. You talk with the old timers there and you will hear a whole new perspective.

 

[sangreal]

The fuck is with the schools where people are saying it wasn't taught. We were taught heavily about this stuff it feels like every year back when I was a kid. I'd say it was the focus of our social studies/history courses

 

[Seanspeed]

I was definitely taught this stuff in fair detail. I mean, we didn't have a class devoted to it or anything, but it was hardly anything that was ignored.

 

[Bigboss242]

Trail of tears thats about as far has it goes even through high school.

 

[Broank]

We did quite a bit around 4th and 5th grade. I remember our class having to do presentations on the different tribes, indian removal acts, trail of tears etc. There were definitely many many months of history class spent on it around that time and I even remember there were a couple speakers that came in to talk about how bad it was in a lot of detail. This was in Michigan.

 

[biggersmaller]

It was taught, but it was all light subjects. They don't really tell how brutal it was. I remember learning about cooperation, and Native Americans teaching Europeans about agriculture. I only learned about a few battles. I didn't learn about a Native American genocide, which is pretty much what it was.. I'm half Chippewa, so I took interest in it.

It was taught to me as a war. This battle happened here, this battle happened there, this treaty was signed, this treaty was broken. The conclusion my friends and I made at the time was that they were more conquered than eradicated.

 

[CrankyJay]

It really isn't taught at all. Not a joke post.

Edit: Until you begin taking college level education courses, or University, you won't see much that would elaborate on the terribke treatment of Native Americans. You'll learn basics about the West and it'll mostly stay around the California gold rush, or Mexican American War, but won't go any further.

I learned about it in my 7th grade American History class. It probably differs from district to district.

 

[Wafflecakes]

I don't actually recall what I was taught.

The school I work at does teach it fairly prominently in high school though.



(Helps that I am the History teacher)

 

[astroturfing]

would it be called "displacement" if it was the other way around? if native americans had conquered Europe and "displaced" all the European peoples... i don't think we'd use any euphemisms.

honestly though America should get some respect for not really trying to hide the past (compared to some countries that straight up deny their atrocities). even i as a finnish person got to know quite a lot about how native americans were mistreated, watched a lot of american movies growing up that gave a good impression of native americans etc (though certainly not 100% accurate but still).

 

[Rockandrollclown]

It was covered pretty extensively when I was in school. We were taught about it at every level (elementary, middle school, and high school). This was just normal classes in Ohio. Spent a lot of time on slavery too, weird to me to hear that some schools just gloss over the bad parts of our founding.

 

[Mental Atrophy]

It is weird to me that some states/districts don't teach it. It was definitely in my curriculum when I was a wee student twenty years ago.

 

[Erheller]

Throughout middle and high school there were passing mentions of things like smallpox and the Trail of Tears. The only time we actually went more in-depth into those topics was in AP US History, which was taken by only a small minority of students in my school.

The latter. Depends on state and district.
And what Amir0x said. In California we go through it and even some of the tribes in California and the Mission system.


In high school, the Howard Zinn book is popular here, but I'm in a very liberal pro-union part of California.

We read the Zinn book here in Illinois.

 

[RockTurtle]

i was taught about the different tribes, the diseases brought over accidentally (and on purpose), trail of tears etc..

not as in depth as ww2, but i certainly recall it wasn't all sparkles and bells and whistles.

south florida