shadyspace
Banned
I was trying to get her to just do the z target recenter but then she kept doing it against walls and then it would fuck up and I couldn't get her to understand why not to recenter against walls
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How the hell do you teach someone how to play a dual analogue game?
- Thread starter shadyspace
- Start date
JinjoUnchained
Member
Can she play a keyboard instrument? The method for learning dual analogue and a keyboard instrument should be similar. Have her practice a repetitive action with both sticks separately AND slowly. Then, when she's mastered that, slowly try to perform the two actions at the same time. This step will take patience and repetition until she can engage the part of her brain that will let her perform both actions at the same time. Finally, when that is mastered, speed up the simultaneous activity until she is at game speed or "at tempo", if you will. Let me know how that works.
I agree. Having to use both sticks at all times without worrying about camera angles or anything like that should help her get used to them.
I am pretty sure we are talking about moving character with left stick and the camera with right.
I dot think it is harder in WW, just that OPs girlfriend has never used it before.
My girlfriend learned on CoD4. I stood and watched her hands as she played and every time her thumb moved from the right stick for no reason, i told her off, if she was moving it to push a face button then that was fine. I was contemplating sticking her thumbs to the sticks, but she got it eventually and completed CoD4.
darkness_s
Member
You could always try inverting the axis, it's easier to grasp for some people that way. Otherwise I think she just needs practice. Also, in the case of Wind Waker, you could maybe get around it by using the left trigger to center the camera on the back of Link.
Refreshment.01
Member
I can't believe this...
How is this possible? How many people know about other people who can't coordinate their hands? How old is she?
darkness_s
Member
I actually think Mario 64 could help in explaining the concept since you're moving the guy holding the camera with the right stick.
It's very possible if she hasn't ever played a game like this before. It's like when you start to play the drums and you have to learn to move your legs/arms independently from each other, but also in rhythm.
Great analogy but not sure where Dr. Banner fits in.
My oldest sister blasted through Donkey Kong Country Returns like a pro. Plays all the old school platformers. She insists that she can't play 3D games because they're too complicated for her. It's probably pretty common with people who stopped gaming after the SNES era.
terrisus
Member
R
Retro_
Unconfirmed Member
PC gaming for one.
I know a few.
It's just one of those things you expect everyone to know to do without realizing how difficult it is because you've done it for so long. Like dragon punch motions in fighting games
bengraven
Member
Play a slower game that doesn't require too quick reactions.
I played Morrowind for 50 hours on Xbox before finally figuring out how to use dual sticks. I could walk around and get used to moving my view while walking.
Now I can't play single stick games like on PSP or older systems.
Best thing that happened for my gaming at that point and a great way to learn.
I played Morrowind for 50 hours on Xbox before finally figuring out how to use dual sticks. I could walk around and get used to moving my view while walking.
Now I can't play single stick games like on PSP or older systems.
Best thing that happened for my gaming at that point and a great way to learn.
This ^^^ has happened to me more than once with my wife.
First you get them used to playing with the second analogue stick on a game where it isn't moving the camera in a three dimensional space, you need to stick to 2D. Games like Pixel Junk Shooter, Super Stardust HD. Its important they are used to using a second analogue physically but also seeing how the two sticks control two different directions, or actions at once.
Then once they have mastered that, you get them to play a very slow paced and easy three dimensional game, like WW.
Then once they have mastered that, you get them to play a very slow paced and easy three dimensional game, like WW.
Freezie KO
Banned
Why isn't she using the Wiimote? It's much easier to aim. Then you just move around and recenter the camera.
This^^^ also for me. I can play single player OK enough. Online forget it, just miserable spawn die spawn die over and over. Would help if I could have alot of time to play but job, wife, kids, and house makes it impossible to ever be on the same playing field as a teenager.
I taught my girlfriend to use dual analogs with Nintendoland. She learned from the Animal Crossing attraction. Lol
Now she can use them pretty good now. She's been playing Black Ops II online lately. I'd say she got the dual analog controls down now. We occasionally play Left 4 Dead 2 as well.
Now she can use them pretty good now. She's been playing Black Ops II online lately. I'd say she got the dual analog controls down now. We occasionally play Left 4 Dead 2 as well.
Fresh Face
Banned
This is good advice and should help. Try LEGO star wars 3. Start with one stick (the left, and more basic one) with the camera being controlled by the game. Once she's got that down, you can show her how to move the right stick to tweak the camera view.
I actually didn't know this was a big of a problem as it was until reading this thread.
Granted, someone did mention Ape Escape and I do remember getting a Dual Shock when that came out as the new fan-dangled thing.
Still, I guess the easiest thing to do is to find a game that lets you have auto-camera and then slowly tweak around with it. Personally, I'd imagine that Mega Man Legends is a good teaching tool (particularly the second one, but good luck finding that one at a cheap price!)
Granted, someone did mention Ape Escape and I do remember getting a Dual Shock when that came out as the new fan-dangled thing.
Still, I guess the easiest thing to do is to find a game that lets you have auto-camera and then slowly tweak around with it. Personally, I'd imagine that Mega Man Legends is a good teaching tool (particularly the second one, but good luck finding that one at a cheap price!)
Neuromancer
Member
Teach her the general idea, then have her walk around the house, controller in hand, pretending that manipulating the controller is what's causing her to walk around, look, jump, duck etc. Also record this and upload the video to YouTube for us.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Darn you Nintendo! Your plan to ruin relationships is succeeding exceptionally well.
Goodacre0081
Member
I think old FPS's like UT and quake on PC helped me get my head around dual analog. as fucked us as that sounds
then again I bet it was aggravating for her having you watch and try to help. i would just let her play and figure it out for herself.
then again I bet it was aggravating for her having you watch and try to help. i would just let her play and figure it out for herself.
Like a couple people here I was gonna say Portal or Portal 2 since it let's you pretty much move at your own pace, with no real enemies showing up for at least a few hours into the game.
Generally, I think the reason most people here can even use dual analog is because we gradually learned it as game designers gradually refined it throughout the N64/PS1 and PS2 eras. I remember starting out on games like GoldenEye and Turok which were essentially single analog (or simply had the assistance of the C buttons). This is exactly why a lot of Japanese games from that era have fixed camera angles and awkward controls -- because a lot of Japanese gamers still don't like dual analog. It's why a lot of Japanese games today have buttons to center the camera behind the player.
Anyone picking up games today has to basically learn like 15 years of game design all at once. I really do think dual analog is one of the biggest dividers between what makes a hardcore game and what makes a casual game.
On the subject, how many shooters today still have a control option that's essentially single analog? I'm talking about where the Y axis on the left analog stick controls movement, but the X axis on the same stick turns your character. This is basically how GoldenEye and Metroid Prime operate, but I think some other shooters do this as a sub option. Usually you aim up and down by holding a shoulder button.
Generally, I think the reason most people here can even use dual analog is because we gradually learned it as game designers gradually refined it throughout the N64/PS1 and PS2 eras. I remember starting out on games like GoldenEye and Turok which were essentially single analog (or simply had the assistance of the C buttons). This is exactly why a lot of Japanese games from that era have fixed camera angles and awkward controls -- because a lot of Japanese gamers still don't like dual analog. It's why a lot of Japanese games today have buttons to center the camera behind the player.
Anyone picking up games today has to basically learn like 15 years of game design all at once. I really do think dual analog is one of the biggest dividers between what makes a hardcore game and what makes a casual game.
On the subject, how many shooters today still have a control option that's essentially single analog? I'm talking about where the Y axis on the left analog stick controls movement, but the X axis on the same stick turns your character. This is basically how GoldenEye and Metroid Prime operate, but I think some other shooters do this as a sub option. Usually you aim up and down by holding a shoulder button.
There are some good options posted. I'd also suggest that you could have the participant focus primarily on the right (camera) stick to get the concept. Practice by calling out objects in the environment to look at. Experiment by asking the person to point "up" or "down" to determine if they need an inverted camera to start as well.
Another fun exercise would be to have them play a game like geometry wars with only the right stick. Sticking in the center as long as possible and shooting only might allow them to feel accustomed to the right stick interaction. After that, have the two get integrated and slowly merge the two concepts. This would allow the person to get used to using the right stick, as the physical manipulation of the stick is probably the most alien concept. It's like learning to brush your teeth with your non-dominant hand. It feels odd to start. -Adam
Another fun exercise would be to have them play a game like geometry wars with only the right stick. Sticking in the center as long as possible and shooting only might allow them to feel accustomed to the right stick interaction. After that, have the two get integrated and slowly merge the two concepts. This would allow the person to get used to using the right stick, as the physical manipulation of the stick is probably the most alien concept. It's like learning to brush your teeth with your non-dominant hand. It feels odd to start. -Adam
sol_bad
Member
One stick at a time until it clicks.
*EDIT*
I honestly didn't realise how hard it is for someone to learn how to play games who is new to games. Not until my nieces were old enough to play them.
I forgot how simple controls were when I was a kid. A joystick and one button on the Commdore 64, then a d-pad and 2 buttons on the Master System. The controllers evolved over time implementing new features.
I grew up with these evolution's and learnt each new mechanic as they came along.
These days, someone who plays a game for the very first time has 4 face buttons, 2 analogue sticks, 2 analogue stick buttons, a d-pad, a start and select button, 2 shoulder buttons and 2 trigger type buttons.
This is on a standard style control pad.
It's quite insane how many buttons there are to contend with for a new comer.
ALTHOUGH, I also played PC games as a kid and there are a fucktonne of buttons on a keyboard which I had to learn what they all did for each individual game. PC games were much more complex back in the day as well.
*EDIT*
I honestly didn't realise how hard it is for someone to learn how to play games who is new to games. Not until my nieces were old enough to play them.
I forgot how simple controls were when I was a kid. A joystick and one button on the Commdore 64, then a d-pad and 2 buttons on the Master System. The controllers evolved over time implementing new features.
I grew up with these evolution's and learnt each new mechanic as they came along.
These days, someone who plays a game for the very first time has 4 face buttons, 2 analogue sticks, 2 analogue stick buttons, a d-pad, a start and select button, 2 shoulder buttons and 2 trigger type buttons.
This is on a standard style control pad.
It's quite insane how many buttons there are to contend with for a new comer.
ALTHOUGH, I also played PC games as a kid and there are a fucktonne of buttons on a keyboard which I had to learn what they all did for each individual game. PC games were much more complex back in the day as well.
MrCookiepants
Member
I'm trying to think of the first time I played Tomb Raider or Halo and I don't remember having problems. I probably did struggle at first, but I was having too much fun to notice.
My dad's mouse broke once and it was hilarious watching him try to play MW2 with a 360 controller. :lol
My dad's mouse broke once and it was hilarious watching him try to play MW2 with a 360 controller. :lol
I still remember ps1 fps game sessions with the original ps1 controller that didn't have analog sticks.
For example: in Quake 2 ps1 version you use shoulder buttons to move the camera. Those were the days...
Maybe she should try some twin stick shooters to learn how analog sticks work. Geometry wars or Super Stardust HD maybe?
For example: in Quake 2 ps1 version you use shoulder buttons to move the camera. Those were the days...
Maybe she should try some twin stick shooters to learn how analog sticks work. Geometry wars or Super Stardust HD maybe?
gutter_trash
Banned
Portal and Portal 2 are the best, I used this game to make my gf aware in a FPS game
the first test chambers are tutorially enough to help guide them through
the first test chambers are tutorially enough to help guide them through
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Because most women are used to only one analog stick or none at all.
(obv joke).
(obv joke).
OfWhiteSkinOnRedLeather
Member
Galaxy Monkey is the best thing ever.
Cymbal Head
Banned
I have to admit that I'm still terrible at playing dual analog shooters. Using the right stick for camera control I've got down, but precision aiming is another story. I didn't have my first two-stick pad until I got a Gamecube at 16, and I still stayed away from dual analog games. I grew up playing FPSes with a mouse and keyboard.
Funny thing is, I remember being comfortable with MDK2 on the Dreamcast almost immediately.
Funny thing is, I remember being comfortable with MDK2 on the Dreamcast almost immediately.