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How would you make Demon's/Dark Souls better?
- Thread starter Misguided
- Start date
Bl4ckSunsh1n3
Member
I liked how it kept getting more and more populated ( not to mention the abundance of fellow players flickering in and out ). Wish that Firelink had been the same, rather than its opposite.
Spirit of Jazz
Banned
Better designed (in regards to combat) and tougher boss fights would be the priority for me after the technical issues. More Ornstein & Smough less Demon Firesage & Gaping Dragon please.
Maybe add a hardcore option once it's been beat but the game really isn't designed for this on the first play-through. Things like the drake bridge are unfair enough as they are, let along if you had to restart your game from there.
Maybe add a hardcore option once it's been beat but the game really isn't designed for this on the first play-through. Things like the drake bridge are unfair enough as they are, let along if you had to restart your game from there.
Bosses with multiple phases.
On by default, and if you turn it off, you get no online features/can't coop.
On by default, and if you turn it off, you get no online features/can't coop.
If we're changing core ideas, why not just turn it into a character action game too? That's also more accessible.
I think fights like the Gaping Dragon (giant, visually impressive adversaries) have their place still. Firesage was just pure placeholder, more like a representation of the rushed development. So long as gimmick fights like BoC are totally gone...
Hopefully they follow the trend set by DLC content and go all out in that fashion.
Backfoggen
Banned
Your character also gets a cute pink hat, like in I Wanna Be The Guy.
Um, this is all fucking fantastic? How have I not seen this stuff before?
Love seeing that things I merely suspected weren't insane or out of left field.
Spirit of Jazz
Banned
The fight was utterly brain dead and left me disappointed given how amazing the thing looked. I'm not saying they shouldn't have giant terrifying monstrosities but they should attempt to make the gameplay live up to the aesthetics of the creature. Style over substance seems to be the antithesis of what they're going for.
AndrewDean84xX
Banned
I do. Those are just the changes I want made for me to love it. Like I said in the other thread, these are just my selfish "wants", not what I expect to happen. If the changes aren't made, not a big loss, just one less sale. Not a big deal.
One thing is true though, if the dev/pub want more money, they would be smart to make the game more accessible. I fully admit to having a "bro-like" taste in games. At the same time, I like the occasional "hardcore" title as well.
AndrewDean84xX
Banned
One more thing I want.
Drop-in/Drop-out co-op.
Drop-in/Drop-out co-op.
Mr. B Natural
Member
Improve framerate
Make the combat more complex with more complex and varied enemy AI, rather than have smoke and mirrors where
a giant clam is fighting just like a knight which is fighting just like a boss twice the knight's size. Mesh swaps and stat changes do not a full game make to anyone with any awareness.
Rely less on exploiting moronic AI and more about out smarting intelligent AI. In other words, make the game as smart as the fans actually think it is.
And, best and hardest to accomplish of all, make the levels procedural and regenerate every time you die, akin to spelunky. That way, the game is less about memorizing shit and traps and anything the game can throw at you and more about being a good, careful, intelligent and throat-in-your-mouth frightened player. It would make the game actually fun rather than annoying and overly time consuming.
Make the combat more complex with more complex and varied enemy AI, rather than have smoke and mirrors where
a giant clam is fighting just like a knight which is fighting just like a boss twice the knight's size. Mesh swaps and stat changes do not a full game make to anyone with any awareness.
Rely less on exploiting moronic AI and more about out smarting intelligent AI. In other words, make the game as smart as the fans actually think it is.
And, best and hardest to accomplish of all, make the levels procedural and regenerate every time you die, akin to spelunky. That way, the game is less about memorizing shit and traps and anything the game can throw at you and more about being a good, careful, intelligent and throat-in-your-mouth frightened player. It would make the game actually fun rather than annoying and overly time consuming.
Since demon's souls, the one thing I always thought it could add that would give it a whole new dimension is light platforming ala castlevania and metroid. I always thought ds was basically the 3d castlevania that never was .. except for the platforming/verticality aspect. I think it was the shortcut that you could take down to the flamelurker where you had to fall on descending platforms that first made me think of it. The controls in general would have to be revamped to accommodate it but if they could get it right and add a vertical aspect to exploration, it would be amazing.
Jeremy092387
Member
I actually miss the Nexus. Bonfires were okay. I really am 50/50 on having an open world or a central hub.
This would ruin the game and make it terrible. The whole point is that the person you summon is random. It's what makes it exciting. I think they should bring back the rating system from Demon's Souls so you can see the rating for someone you are about to summon.
I liked the "gameness" of the hub. You go into a level and then you "beat" it. Then you go back to the hub and try a different one. I liked it this way because it cut out the travel time. The open world in Dark Souls was cool but there was a lot of time wasted just trying to get to certain areas and backtracking.
I think most beneficial changes would revolve around tweaking covenant systems. They really seemed incomplete and were subsequently confusing as hell. Darkmoon Blades were hunting people who dispelled the illusion of Anor Londo and sinners, despite the game overtly mentioning that punishing sinners was the province of another god (Clearly missing a covenant there), and Gravelord covenant was just a hot mess every which way you slice it.
I hope to see some new covenants that keep the same basic roles:
- The vanilla invasion covenant
- The black phantom invasion covenant
- The retribution/punishment covenant
- The help-a-sun-bro-out covenant
- The defend-an-area-from infidels covenant
Dark Souls was on to a good idea, just needs some smoothing out the rough edges. Also wouldn't mind better matchmaking options.
For single player aspects, really the only thing I'd change are the item descriptions that aren't accurate.
I hope to see some new covenants that keep the same basic roles:
- The vanilla invasion covenant
- The black phantom invasion covenant
- The retribution/punishment covenant
- The help-a-sun-bro-out covenant
- The defend-an-area-from infidels covenant
Dark Souls was on to a good idea, just needs some smoothing out the rough edges. Also wouldn't mind better matchmaking options.
For single player aspects, really the only thing I'd change are the item descriptions that aren't accurate.
Really? There are plenty of games that have a pause button. This is not one that should or can because of how the multiplayer works. If you need to pause you can quit the game at any time and then go back into the same area. Do people really not understand what makes this game great?
Yeah, and take a good several minutes getting back to it versus... Unpausing it. Surely you can see why people might bemoan its lack in at least offline mode.
H_Prestige
Banned
Either quit game or stand in a safe spot. And pause would only work in PvE anyway.
The fact that the enemies are bound by the same rules as the player, regardless of their size or shape, has appealed to me from the moment I noticed it.
I don't know if I've ever encountered truly intelligent AI in a melee game (or any other), but I'm all for more complex and less predictable attack patterns. But in the end, it will always come down to recognizing these patterns and exploiting them.
Tell us how you really feel.
Has a visually complex 3D game with combat ever pulled this off? Because until that happens, I'll stick to static and thoughtfully designed levels. I would be cool with alternate enemy placements though.
Version 3.0
Member
How to improve Demon's Souls: drop the hub and linear levels, make it one seamless open world.
Dark Souls did this. I was happy.
It makes me sad to see people wishing for regression.
Dark Souls did this. I was happy.
It makes me sad to see people wishing for regression.
Amibguous Cad
Member
But in DS you can play in offline mode or stay as a hollow
Amibguous Cad
Member
Seeing the way the game world interconneted and finding shortcuts in Dark Souls was really fun, though - they pulled off the Metroidvania thing pretty well.
I'd sure as hell spend Christmas Eve with Solaire.
HOLY SHIT! LOL!
I agree it was cool, like dropping the ladder at the first bonfire, however I just think they can go a lot crazier with the designs of the levels if they don't have to all be connected. It may just be nostalgia from Demon's Souls clouding my judgment.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
This thread is kinda depressing. Sure, the guys saying they want kawaii art, regenerating health, QTEs and checkpoints are just trolling and it's funny, but it appears some of the comments are still serious... Tsk tsk.
What I would change:
- Frame rate issues, obviously.
- Targeting could use some improvement still.
- More random enemies, or less static ones at least (DeS had the patrolling mindflayers, but I can't think of any DkS enemy that isn't just staying still in one place except the Blighttown mosquitoes... well, until some of the forest giants in the DLC at least).
- Fix that crappy ragdoll physics on the dead enemies. The gargoyles in 3-2, and the... giant insectoid things (whatever the hell they are) in Blighttown were especially annoying to trudge through.
- No more family masks please xD
- No more non-scaling weapons and spell, makes griefing and low-level runs too easy.
- Have a more balanced PvP mode (the DLC arena was a nice try, but still not quite there).
- Better and more aggressive enemy AI.
- The "reloading" mechanism to refresh the content is kinda stupid, it shouldn't work like that. Snuggly/Sparkly is one thing, but to get the NPC's armors, spawn the golem, etc. it's just a bit stupid. The only reason I found the golem was because I died after killing the hydra by falling into the hole in the water. xD
- Covenants need a revamp for sure. Many were useless, and feeding the items to level up was tedious (one by one with that slow animation and you needed to feed 30? gah) for uncertain rewards. Maybe show you need X of the items to reach level 2, allow the player to feed the amount of items they want in one go, and give an indication of what the reward is (a spell, an armor?) without necessarily saying what it is in detail. And of course if you do stuff like the Gravelord covenant, make it work properly.
- Make the game harder when summoning phantoms. An OP phantom can ruin the experience.
- No more automatic death BS like Seath, please. And yeah Bed of Chaos is a stupidly designed boss. Demon's Souls had pretty much no cheap deaths, when you died 99% of the time it was your fault. Dark Souls had a few "cheap" moments and some "death by camera/framerate/bad design" moments, so I'd say... maybe 85%?
- Balance the weapons a bit more. Some weapons are fun, but bad, like the whips. Others were just too strong, like the claymores, great scythes, and zweihanders.
- Get rid of useless upgrade paths. Mercury, tearing, occult, raw, crystal, etc... no need for that, why is that even there? Magic/divine is so alike, there's little difference (at least moon vs crescent had more significant differences).
- Item menus are fine, but could be better. Personally, I thought Stockpile Thomas > the Bottomless Box, by far. And have a "repair all" on blacksmiths please.
Those are all fairly minor things though, and hell pretty much every game is bound to have useless gear and items, not everything is good loot. Still, small improvements like that would be quite welcome.
What's wrong with the Demon Ruins?
I agree with the targeting though, 100%. Oh boy this was aggravating, haha.
I don't see the problem with the HUD, it looks fine and elegant to me.
Anyway, at the worst, you could just flask away the poison damage, and return to the bonfire when you're low. Sometimes when I explore Blighttown I barely bother using moss.
...I think my post is tl;dr.
Sorry.
What I would change:
- Frame rate issues, obviously.
- Targeting could use some improvement still.
- More random enemies, or less static ones at least (DeS had the patrolling mindflayers, but I can't think of any DkS enemy that isn't just staying still in one place except the Blighttown mosquitoes... well, until some of the forest giants in the DLC at least).
- Fix that crappy ragdoll physics on the dead enemies. The gargoyles in 3-2, and the... giant insectoid things (whatever the hell they are) in Blighttown were especially annoying to trudge through.
- No more family masks please xD
- No more non-scaling weapons and spell, makes griefing and low-level runs too easy.
- Have a more balanced PvP mode (the DLC arena was a nice try, but still not quite there).
- Better and more aggressive enemy AI.
- The "reloading" mechanism to refresh the content is kinda stupid, it shouldn't work like that. Snuggly/Sparkly is one thing, but to get the NPC's armors, spawn the golem, etc. it's just a bit stupid. The only reason I found the golem was because I died after killing the hydra by falling into the hole in the water. xD
- Covenants need a revamp for sure. Many were useless, and feeding the items to level up was tedious (one by one with that slow animation and you needed to feed 30? gah) for uncertain rewards. Maybe show you need X of the items to reach level 2, allow the player to feed the amount of items they want in one go, and give an indication of what the reward is (a spell, an armor?) without necessarily saying what it is in detail. And of course if you do stuff like the Gravelord covenant, make it work properly.
- Make the game harder when summoning phantoms. An OP phantom can ruin the experience.
- No more automatic death BS like Seath, please. And yeah Bed of Chaos is a stupidly designed boss. Demon's Souls had pretty much no cheap deaths, when you died 99% of the time it was your fault. Dark Souls had a few "cheap" moments and some "death by camera/framerate/bad design" moments, so I'd say... maybe 85%?
- Balance the weapons a bit more. Some weapons are fun, but bad, like the whips. Others were just too strong, like the claymores, great scythes, and zweihanders.
- Get rid of useless upgrade paths. Mercury, tearing, occult, raw, crystal, etc... no need for that, why is that even there? Magic/divine is so alike, there's little difference (at least moon vs crescent had more significant differences).
- Item menus are fine, but could be better. Personally, I thought Stockpile Thomas > the Bottomless Box, by far. And have a "repair all" on blacksmiths please.
Those are all fairly minor things though, and hell pretty much every game is bound to have useless gear and items, not everything is good loot. Still, small improvements like that would be quite welcome.
Haha, I think they were well designed actually, in terms of "architecture" and layout, but Lost Izalith was "wasted". It could have been one of the most awesome levels, but the lava was too bright, the noise walking on it was too annoying, and there wasn't enough hidden stuff to make it worth exploring. I like the second part of it with the poison pit though, that was a cool area (though the Siegmeyer subquest there was just graahhhh). The boss sucked, which is a shame. It looked badass, it shouldn't have been so gimmicky.
What's wrong with the Demon Ruins?
I liked the Nexus, but I also like the Dark Souls open-world too. I don't know which I like more, to be honest, they both have their strengths, I guess?
I agree with the targeting though, 100%. Oh boy this was aggravating, haha.
I don't see the problem with the HUD, it looks fine and elegant to me.
I'd like that, actually! I don't get what the rest of your post is all about though...
Except the NPC telling you to not go into Blighttown without moss or you'll die? Come on, the "prior knowledge" is in the game, you just have to pay attention to what the NPCs are saying. Besides, the dart snipers automatically drop moss when you kill them.
Anyway, at the worst, you could just flask away the poison damage, and return to the bonfire when you're low. Sometimes when I explore Blighttown I barely bother using moss.
Other than the horrid framerate drops in Blighttown, what is wrong with those levels? They were brilliantly designed.
Agreed! Boss souls were fantastic and useful (for the most part) in DeS. In DkS, I think only one or two are worth anything, and only for specific builds. I can think of Quelaag's soul for dex builds (Furysword and/or Chaos blade) and Priscilla's for the Lifehunt Scythe; anything else? I'm honestly at a loss. Boss souls were so useless, alas.
HATE
Except that what made DkS attractive and a big seller was the fact that it was a "hardcore old school" game...
I'm down with harder. What modern game (modern as in PS3/360 gen) do you consider to be hard, though?
I agree partially with some of those, though not all (I don't agree with the implication that DkS is poorly designed overall). I did break out the calculator, haha, you're right, this should have been clearer in the menu. Firebombs and kunais should have been more useful, they don't last very long indeed. As for respecing though... nah, live with your mistakes. I mean there's no level limit really, just keep leveling up the stats you need. If you want tightly optimized stats, then make a new toon.
Or just someone who used the Bottomless Box glitch.... no, seriously, this post is just all matters of wrong. Overpowered invaders in the Burg and Parish at low levels are not people who "worked hard" for their gear. I can guarantee you that. They are griefers who abused the BB glitch, without any doubt.
...I think my post is tl;dr.
Sorry.disappeared
Banned
Perhaps less of an improvement, but more an option would be four-player support. The ability to play with three other friends and venture through the game. Keep the rest of the game virtually as-is, but add the co-op. Demon's Souls and Dark are two of the best D&D games to lack the D&D name this generation. And D&D is always at its most interesting when multiple players are involved, inebriated or not.
13 dollars is like 13 tacos bro, are you saying 13 tacos are worth more than GOTG?
cat litter
Member
Dude, buy it. I doubt it'll get much cheaper than 13. Then by the time you finish it, the dlc may drop in price.
arglebargle
Member
i am sorry for the bump as well. i may be remembering incorrectly, but i thought that once you made it across the bridge, in the area where there are a few weak enemies, a blue eye knight and archers above you, they added 2 BP red eye knights. i also hadnt killed the dragon so that definitely made it harder.
dark_prinny
Banned
Make it more Demons and less Dark.