EDIT: HyperCubed4, in response to your no.gif, I said there should be an option to SKIP the tutorial, right from the start. And then if you need it, you can come back to it later. The game would be designed such that anyone who's played Zelda before wouldn't need the tutorial.
Oh come off it. Giving the player some or all of the items right away would be a very natural extension of how Skyward Sword narrowed the item selection and tried to keep most of them useful for more of the game.
That's a valid point, but surely not impossible to solve. Maybe the game could have scalable difficulty, adjusting the enemy layouts, attack patterns, etc, in each dungeon as you go through them. But really, I think it would be fine for some dungeons to simply be harder. It would be like Demon's Souls or Dark Souls: You explore a new area, you find yourself in over your head, you back out and decide to explore elsewhere. Then, when you're a more seasoned player, you come back and try the problem area again -- and this time the challenge is "just right."How are you gonna keep the game consistently challenging while letting the player tackle the dungeons in any order?
I just want a Zelda game featuring this guy:
That's a valid point, but surely not impossible to solve. Maybe the game could have scalable difficulty, adjusting the enemy layouts, attack patterns, etc, in each dungeon as you go through them. But really, I think it would be fine for some dungeons to simply be harder. It would be like Demon's Souls or Dark Souls: You explore a new area, you find yourself in over your head, you back out and decide to explore elsewhere. Then, when you're a more seasoned player, you come back and try the problem area again -- and this time the challenge is "just right."
By "tutorial" I mean endless explanations by Navi/Midna/Fi/etc, I mean the game pausing to explain any item every time you've picked it up (YES, I KNOW HOW MUCH A BLUE RUPEE IS WORTH), I mean fetch quests at the start of Skyward Sword to "demonstrate" and "teach" mechanics, etc. All of that is what I consider a tutorial. You know, the slow-ass parts that drag for an hour or two at the start of the last several 3D Zeldas.Zelda games have never needed a tutorial before, that's one of the reasons that made them great. The act of even putting in a tutorial would saturate the game. If you need to tell people how to play your game, you're not doing your job properly. Blindly dumping the player into a game with no direction obviously isn't the right choice either, but a tutorial right off the bat isn't the right way to go.
Oh man, voice acting. That's another thing they need to do, but they need to do it WELL. Everyone talks but Link; no annoying voices. Maybe an option for mouthing the words silently to text boxes if people want the old-school "storybook" approach.I would honestly just be happy if the next one was open world, had voice acting and the writing wasn't so goddamn awful and painful to read/listen to like in many japanese games. We can start there for the next Zelda and keep the improvements coming on future games, baby steps for now.
Zelda games have never needed a tutorial before, that's one of the reasons that made them great. The act of even putting in a tutorial would saturate the game. If you need to tell people how to play your game, you're not doing your job properly. Blindly dumping the player into a game with no direction obviously isn't the right choice either, but a tutorial right off the bat isn't the right way to go.
I would honestly just be happy if the next one was open world, had voice acting and the writing wasn't so goddamn awful and painful to read/listen to like in many japanese games. We can start there for the next Zelda and keep the improvements coming on future games, baby steps for now.
Oh man, voice acting. That's another thing they need to do, but they need to do it WELL. Everyone talks but Link; no annoying voices. Maybe an option for mouthing the words silently to text boxes if people want the old-school "storybook" approach.
I want a Zelda that takes place in a distant future, y'know maybe some plasma swords and moblin robots and shit?
Kid Icarus Uprising has one of the best scripts and voice acting in gaming in years, right up there with the Portal 2s of the world. When Nintendo puts their mind to it, they can write and voice with the best of 'em.I'm not sure I trust Nintendo with voice acting frankly. Have you played a 3D Mario in the past decade? Ain't good.
By "tutorial" I mean endless explanations by Navi/Midna/Fi/etc, I mean the game pausing to explain any item every time you've picked it up (YES, I KNOW HOW MUCH A BLUE RUPEE IS WORTH), I mean fetch quests at the start of Skyward Sword to "demonstrate" and "teach" mechanics, etc. All of that is what I consider a tutorial. You know, the slow-ass parts that drag for an hour or two at the start of the last several 3D Zeldas.
Let's get back to MM. Chase the Skull Kid to Clock Town and BOOM, clock's ticking, you're on your own motherfucker, think fast.
Open world Zelda to the modern gamer:
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d173/Gentlegamer/zeldatutorial.jpg[IMG][/QUOTE]
Dropping players into a world with no explanations or instructions is abysmal game design. There is a happy medium between LoZ on NES and Skyward Sword Handholding, where the best games live.
Yeah, sorry about that -- I should've been clearer. Basically, I'm saying they should design the whole game so that you learn through the simple act of playing, -without- the game assigning you banal tasks to complete or stopping the game to blatantly explain something. For stuff like "what's a blue rupee," just tuck it away on the pause screen and let people pull it up on their own if they forget what it or any other item/mechanic does.Ohhhh... I get what you mean. So, no tutorials in general? I thought you meant one big one at the start of the game. That sounds a little better. No comments by Navi, Midna or Fi would have been great; Fi is, beyond a shadow of a doubt, the most useless sidekick to any Nintendo character ever.
I can see the merit in not hearing quotes like "you are running low on hearts, go get hearts or you will die." Some form of direction may be needed, but if the game design is done properly, no direction may be needed at all.
Well you know what given that only 25% of people are finishing games nowadays. Who gives a fuck anyway? Clint Hocking had a massive rant about this in the latest Edge.Open world Zelda to the modern gamer:
Cue the 4chan Miyamoto image.
Dropping players into a world with no explanations or instructions is abysmal game design. There is a happy medium between LoZ on NES and Skyward Sword Handholding, where the best games live.
How can you even lump the graphic of games like WW, TP and SS together?! They are so different as if they are not from the same franchise; I am pretty sure for some one who doesn't know what games they are priory, it will be difficult to say if Link from WW is the same character as that of TP or SSAgree 100% with the OP. Zelda's core's been rotting for awhile; aside from the brief aside in WW, I'm just plain annoyed with the direction it's taken since OoT. I know MM's the darling of GAF, and I love all its ideas on paper, but the game's aesthetics (and the franchise's aesthetics at large since OoT) are enough to drive me the fuck away.
When Zelda goes HD, it needs to be an open world title like the NES original.
It has the three elements I want back in the series: 1) EXPLORATION/ADVENTURE, 2) A LIVING WORLD, and 3) BEING TREATED LIKE AN EXPERIENCED GAMER.
http://zs.ffshrine.org/album/legend-of-zelda/english-instruction-manual-scans/z1manual-05-06.jpg[IMG][/QUOTE]
Are you trying to say that this stuff shouldn't be included in the game because it can be put in the manual? That shit doesn't fly anymore, and rightly so. It's only excusable in such old games because of the extreme technical limitations they faced.
Too bad it was horrible though.
ok i just want a new sprite based top down Zelda.
neither of us will ever get what we want.
YOU'LL GET: Ocarina of Time with controller gimmicks, low difficulty and more handholding than ever before.