• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

IGN: "A Link to the Past is the only Zelda game ever made"

I agree with the fact that LttP is (along with Awakening) the best in the series. However most other Zeldas are really competent and overall awesome games.
 
IGn's recent podcast came across as extremely anti-nintendo, anti-zelda and anti-matt. its as if matt became some kind of parody joke character over there as the resident nintendo fanboy?

all games journalists should be able to enjoy nintendo and have some kind of roots or memories there - they represent such a great part of the industry. anyone who hates on nintendo has no soul!!

hating nintendo fanboys is ok though.
 
Sweedishrodeo said:
i love how the gaming sites have tried to become (more) opinionated recently and have ended up sounding like idiots. yeah because majoras mask and TP are just knock-offs of LTTP. idiots.
Click to expand...

they are starting to sound alot like me
 
Too bad aLTTP has enough awesomeness that it's predecessor is easily one of the best games this year, this gen and probably ever. Too bad he has to downplay subsequent Zeldas to get his point across. We get it, LTTP was great. It was the first, except he shoots himself in the foot.

Which is why Zelda 1 is less Zelda than its follow-up Zelda would be. The first NES game was free-flowing – there was little stopping you from playing through the game's dungeons out of order, and it had no development of story to speak of. The Legend of Zelda was an excellent game, one of the greatest 8-bit releases ever to come from Nintendo – but ultimately, it was a skeleton frame. A Link to the Past fleshed it out.

This SNES sequel refined what Zelda 1 had defined, harmonizing the freedom of exploring Hyrule with a more focused and linear flow. You still had some leeway. You still had plenty of opportunities to get off the beaten path, completing sidequests, goofing around. But the entire game is orchestrated – you feel free in your actions and choices, but all the while you're advancing the story.
Click to expand...

Welp, you heard the man, argument over. He ignores the main reason LTTP isn't the defining Zelda anymore than OoT over the first. Zelda's mainstay has been it's gameplay. Not it's story, not it's linearity. It's been exploration, dungeons, using items to tackle previously unsolved problems, tight controls, etc. Those were all there in Zelda 1.

So, his argument jumps to LTTP refining the experience. Hell, what is OoT? TP? Late to the party in the refinement group? You know, I like LTTP over any other. Probably nostalgia, who cares. Why do they have to review old games and give us their dumb, unintelligent opinions? Can I write for them? My opinions are just as half-assed.
 
kaizoku said:
IGn's recent podcast came across as extremely anti-nintendo, anti-zelda and anti-matt. its as if matt became some kind of parody joke character over there as the resident nintendo fanboy?

all games journalists should be able to enjoy nintendo and have some kind of roots or memories there - they represent such a great part of the industry. anyone who hates on nintendo has no soul!!

hating nintendo fanboys is ok though.
Click to expand...


i never thought that matt cassamassina was biased towards nintendo really.. his reviews are often very accurate and well written.. and i dont think he is overrating nintendo games particularly.. actually he and greg K were the only reviewers that i listened to for a long time.. he often made claims that are untrue and produced rumors that did not come true but.. still...

and the IGN podcasts really suck (including IGN wiikly with MattC)
 
Many people choose many different Zelda games as their favourite of the series. Every installment has people willing to say it is the best. This is the nature of a quality series.
 
Ugh. Biased review ftl.

LTTP may have been the foundation but it is not the only "zelda" game ever made. The latter games add tons of great new things to the series just as LTTP added great things.

Actually I would compare LTTP to TP in how they improved on an old formula. LTTP improved the LOZ formula while TP improved the OOT formula.
 
DeaconKnowledge said:
You know, while I disagree with this article, I will say that I am dying to see where Nintendo takes the series next, especially with the new control method open to them.
Click to expand...

Well I'm not, frankly. You'll see what I'm talking about in a couple of years.
 
norinrad21 said:
Probably just looking for attention
Click to expand...

I find it hard to believe that IGN (or any specific editor) decided to use a VC game review as an attention getter.

How many people do you think read that entire review? I sure as hell didn't.

I, like many others, probably just went:

1. Clicks LTTP VC Review
2. Sees 9.5 score
3. Nods
3. Moves on
 
Manmademan said:
A LTTP in 3-D with NO OTHER CHANGES AT ALL would completely obliterate wind waker, twilight princess, and ocarina of time.
Click to expand...
So you say the original author is right in that those games are all just ALTTP redux, and then go on to say that they're not the same because if they were the same they'd be soooooo much better than they currently are.

Gotcha. That makes perfect sense.



(That said, ALTTP is the best Zelda game, by a massive margin. But that doesn't make IGN's assertion any less stupid.)
 
OoT's dungeon design absolutely slaughters ALTTP. No question.

ALTTP may be amazing for a 1992 game, but it's design hasn't really aged all that gracefully... it's significant for laying out the modern Zelda formula, but (like Zweizy said) basically every sequel to follow it has outdone it (minus TWW/TMC).
 
What snobbery. So yeah, not much is new in Zelda since LttP, however the same could be said that Halo is just Doom, which was just Castle Wolfenstine 3d. In the end it's just pretenious. The thing about Zelda is that it isn't about all these "ZOMG TEH NEW!" stuff, in fact fans don't play it for new stuff, they play it because Zelda does such a fine job at getting the already established stuff right. So was LttP the most influential? You'd probably be right. But is it the end all be all? Nah.
 
Yeah it felt exactly like LTTP in TP when I was
Swinging my ball and chain
and
dangling from a grate using my double hookshot
and
transforming into a fricking wolf!
. In 3D.

I :lol at IGN.
 
jarrod said:
OoT's dungeon design absolutely slaughters ALTTP. No question.

ALTTP may be amazing for a 1992 game, but it's design hasn't really aged all that gracefully... it's significant for laying out the modern Zelda formula, but (like Zweizy said) basically every sequel to follow it has outdone it (minus TWW/TMC).
Click to expand...

The combat engine for the 3d games also slaughters ALTTP's boring directional swish and slash combat.
 
I wouldn't go as far as to say it's the only Zelda game, but all the Zelda games after do feed quite a bit from LttP. All of the 3D Zeldas use OoT as its base, which used LttP as its base. It's biggest contribution is probably in music though. I still say that LttP has the best music in a Zelda game if only because it established nearly all the major musical themes for the later games (The Hyrule Castle theme, Zelda's Theme, Kakariko Village, Ganondorf's Theme, Fairy Theme, etc). OoT tossed in a few songs (Temple of Time, Lost Woods, and the Serenade of Water) but otherwise it's all LttP.
 
LttP is very good, but OoT and TP (WW and others are debatable) have refined and furthered the Zelda formula much more than Mr. M. Thomas is giving them credit, and MM discarded it for its crazy awesome weirdness.
 
An old friend of mine once said, "You can't spell 'ignorant' without IGN."

Here's how I feel. The zelda games, generally speaking, are some of the finest and most enjoyable I've ever played. So instead of getting into a mental masturbation wankfest, I'll just appreciate each game for what it is, so long as I'm having fun. I loved LttP, MM, OoT, MC, LA, etc. If I had to pick a favorite, I'd say Twilight Princess, but I've a blast with any of 'em. Great games, and while they borrow many elements and mechanics from each other (like the Metroid and Castlevania series does from its predacessors), they are also each quite different and always manage to bring something new and fresh to the table, while also being very fun. What more could I ask for?
 
I agree with the idea of A Link to the Past being the definition of the Zelda series. It's nothing but true, and Miyamoto itself explained the importance of A Link to the Past in the series because the game defined the Zelda series.

So he is no wrong about this, but of course... saying that the other games are the same is just saying shit or trolling, as the series has done the 3D adoption earning hundreds of new things and elements. The formula of the series did not changed, of course, that's why they're Zelda after all, but they got improved and moreover, got a perfect transition from 2D to 3D, which isn't a easy job never.
 
The free-flowing gameplay of LoZ is superior to the more ridgid ALTTP. The 'fleshing-out' in ALTTP detracted from the original play mechanic. LoZ had many novel ways of obstructing areas of the overworld, including having some areas be too difficult to play through unless you had a good sword, a ring, or sufficient skill at playing.

LoZ had something important keeping it together without requiring a full blown story-line: the need to collect the eight pieces of the Triforce of WISDOM in order to overcome the Triforce of POWER. The moral there is that Wisdom beats Power, but that it takes longer to develop. Explore the game, become wise; and then you'll restore peace to Hyrule. t

It didn't rely on scripted events, it all happens in the mind of the player. "Hmm I need a key for this dungeon... maybe I should buy one from that shop I saw...? but I'll have to earn some money first... I wonder where a good place would be to make rupees...? ok, where was that shop again?" etc etc.
 
Ridiculous. ALttP is a great game, but the 2D Zeldas were always straining against the confines of 2D. Ocarina is the first full realization of what Zelda could be, as the series has always wanted to be 3D but technology took ten years to catch up to it.

Just the freedom 3D has lent to the dungeon design makes the IGN statement absurd. I love the whole Zelda series (yes, even Minish Cap and 2), and I own three versions of ALttP (SNES, GBA, VC), but anyone who thinks ALttP has anything that stacks up to the Arbiter's Grounds dungeon and boss fight in Twilight Princess is smoking some serious rose-colored crack.
 
highspeeddub said:
The free-flowing gameplay of LoZ is superior to the more ridgid ALTTP. The 'fleshing-out' in ALTTP detracted from the original play mechanic. LoZ had many novel ways of obstructing areas of the overworld, including having some areas be too difficult to play through unless you had a good sword, a ring, or sufficient skill at playing.

LoZ had something important keeping it together without requiring a full blown story-line: the need to collect the eight pieces of the Triforce of WISDOM in order to overcome the Triforce of POWER. The moral there is that Wisdom beats Power, but that it takes longer to develop. Explore the game, become wise; and then you'll restore peace to Hyrule. t

It didn't rely on scripted events, it all happens in the mind of the player. "Hmm I need a key for this dungeon... maybe I should buy one from that shop I saw...? but I'll have to earn some money first... I wonder where a good place would be to make rupees...? ok, where was that shop again?" etc etc.
Click to expand...

I absolutely agree with you. Zelda series should have a come back to the origins, and get into exploring another kind of elements that there are in gaming. That's why I was a bit disappointed with Wind Waker and Twilight Princess, 'cause apart of the whole theme thing (sea navigation, Wolf Link, etc) there's nothing new to the series, or diferent.

Ocarina of Time was ****ing great 'cause was Zelda in 3D, Majora's Mask was ****ing great 'cause the gameplay based on the Clock town's people relationship, which made the game diferent and outstanding on its own merits. Wind Waker and Twilight Princess fails on this, despite the new themes included in the game the gameplay formula wasn't that different from Ocarina of Time.

It's like the Castlevania series. They can't keep going and going with the same formula again and again just changing the storyline and the theme. This isn't good for the series health.

So I absolutely agree with your post highspeeddub. Nintendo should explore new gameplay concepts with the Zelda series. Just like what they did with Majora's Mask or For Swords multiplayer, and looking back to the origin of the series... there's the overwhelming free world of the original Zelda (absolutely stunning, I'm playing trought the game right now and feels fresh and amazing after a few minutes of play). The level up system and power/magic elements that used Zelda 2: Link's Adventure are also great elements that should be back explored in the series.

And let's not forget about how Zelda 1 & 2 made great used of the players imagination. As you said, in the firts Zelda players create their own story and so, something closer in Zelda 2. When you get a tip, it's not like how to do something. I can't forget the moment in Zelda 2 where a NPC says to you he heard about a mysterious house in the forest, and how you get to get in is just outstanding, pure mind-blowing. Like Super Metroid, when you had to learn how to do things after seeing some creatures in the world doing it. That was absolutely mind-blowing!

Being the same will end with the series, at least the popularity of the series.
 
jetjevons said:
Yeah it felt exactly like LTTP in TP when I was
Swinging my ball and chain
and
dangling from a grate using my double hookshot
and
transforming into a fricking wolf!
. In 3D.

I :lol at IGN.
Click to expand...

hmmm...but which game invented the hookshot, and had the main character transforming into an animal as a major plot point back in 1992? hint: not twilight princess.
 
Link to the Past is the only Zelda I was able to beat and felt like playing again.

All the other Zelda games I have played don't even come close, although Link's Awakening was a fine experience.
 
Manmademan said:
hmmm...but which game invented the hookshot, and had the main character transforming into an animal as a major plot point back in 1992? hint: not twilight princess.
Click to expand...

And your point is?
 
omg rite said:
I think it's the best 2D Zelda ever.

But hey, nostalgia. Woo.
Click to expand...
Ah, the good old nostalgia card. But whatever. Minish Cap wasn't really bringing anything special to the table. It also wa pretty short and didn't offer much extra stuff to do. The best aspects of the game were the things it borrowed from the 3D games and expanded on (sword techniques, for example). Individually I put Ages and Seasons above all the other GB games. The fact that I think of Oracle of Ages/Seasons as a single game, puts them even further up.
 
He's not talking about the game quality being better than any other, or even harping on the others as being knockoffs, or arguing that there are absolutely no new elements in any Zelda game following. He's only saying that the core essence almost spiritually underlying LttP is the formula that's been remade and reworked with every non-sidestory entry in the series since. And I don't see any reason to argue that much; do we not agree that Zelda main entries can be viewed as "retellings" of the same story? It may be seven sages, it may be seven maidens, it may be seven wise men; Ganondorf may have found the Golden Land or he may just want to reach the Golden Land without having gotten there already; the Master Sword may be in a forest or in a temple--but all of these elements are roughly the same core idea.

We say we have certain expectations about what a "Zelda game" should do, or even "a Zelda main game," in other words expectations about a certain series "signature," and those expectations are rooted in what A Link to the Past started and Ocarina of Time continued. And, perhaps, if Miyamoto was speaking in sincerity, what Twilight Princess finished off. (Incidentally, this is probably the same reasoning as why a lot of people were angered when Mario Sunshine introduced FLUDD; it was somehow fundamentally spiritually different from what "a Mario game" proper entailed.)

And the argument should especially make sense to those of you who argue (as I don't) that, say, every 2D Castlevania since Symphony of the Night has been more of the same, or every Mega Man game since [whatever] has been the same, or every Pokemon game since the original has been the same. Mechanically, they're absolutely not--they all introduce new ideas, to varying degrees, in their sequels--but on a spiritual level of intent and creative idea, the essences of the games are the same (defeat the resurrected Dracula, become the champion, etc.), and that's what people are pinpointing when they peg those franchises as growing stale.
It's probably why those who play games predominantly for story and immersion don't "get" how something like Mega Man can still be going on successfully with what's fairly close to "the same formula," while those who play games regardless of story (I'm generalizing on either side to make a point) will make a note of every last difference in gameplay, however slight, and appreciate it. And I'm even in that latter camp--I hated IGN's reviews of Fire Emblem 8/9, Advance Wars 2/DS, and Pokemon Emerald for critiquing the games as nothing new--but that doesn't preclude me from trying to see where the Zelda: LttP reviewer is coming from, and that "where" so happens to be a pretty common "where" within gaming circles.
 
I agree with what he said to a certain extent, it's somethign I've always thought. Nintendo just keeps on "re-imagining" LTTP with every Zelda title.
 
jett said:
I agree with what he said to a certain extent, it's somethign I've always thought. Nintendo just keeps on "re-imagining" LTTP with every Zelda title.
Click to expand...

Here's another person that didn't play Majora's Mask! See, when Nintendo goes astray from the formula (Zelda II, MM) people complain, but when they stick close to the formula, people still complain. So how exactly can they please everybody?
 
Majora's mask is undeniably different than any other Zelda. I hate how often people like to rag on the Zelda series for being too similar, while when majora's Mask was realeased, everybody underrated it, said it was too wierd, passed it over (myself included).

That said, OOT was a huge reinvention of the series. Yes it still has a light and dark world of sorts, and it uses the same weapons, however in the move to 3D all of those weapons had to be rethought along with a new combat system. Puzzles were extrapolated into the third dimension and weapons were modified as such. Enemies could no longer behave in the same way, combat became more about timing than locamotion. It's OOT that each successive Zelda (save Majora's Mask) has been aping with marginal improvements

The problem here is: how much can you change a game in a series without making it so different that it no longer belongs in the series? You get people bitching like this all the time, but the same stuff happens in every series. Deviate too much and one group complains, deviate too little and another complains, the trolls get to attack either way.
 
omg rite said:
I think it's the best 2D Zelda ever.

But hey, nostalgia. Woo.
Click to expand...
Nostalgia has nothing to do with it... TMC felt like half a Zelda game, objectives were unsatisfying, exploration was needlessly truncated, it has arguably the weakest dual world setup yet and the whole thing was extremely short. Really a gigantic letdown after the full bodied, imaginiative Oracle games and pretty easily the weakest overhead Zelda imo.

TMC just feels like a lot of rough design concepts quickly strung together.... it's a lot like TWW in that regard.
 
Magicpaint said:
Here's another person that didn't play Majora's Mask! See, when Nintendo goes astray from the formula (Zelda II, MM) people complain, but when they stick close to the formula, people still complain. So how exactly can they please everybody?
Click to expand...

Play to the region, my friend.

For America Link will be roided up, cuss like a sailor, and Zelda will have big tits.
For Europe Link will smarmy, intelligent, and Zelda will have big tits.
For Japan, Link will look like an anime reject, have amnesia, and Zelda will have big tits.

There, everyone is happy! :D
 
Jiggy37 said:
I hated IGN's reviews of Fire Emblem 8/9, Advance Wars 2/DS, and Pokemon Emerald for critiquing the games as nothing new
Click to expand...

Curiously, Fire Emblem is one of the few series that had significant changes in the rules that keep the gameplay different from each other chapter in the series. I can't but disagree with all the people who says that the series are the same in every chapter. That's like trolling.
 
jarrod said:
Nostalgia has nothing to do with it... TMC felt like half a Zelda game, objectives were unsatisfying, exploration was needlessly truncated, it has arguably the weakest dual world setup yet and the whole thing was extremely short. Really a gigantic letdown after the full bodied, imaginiative Oracle games and pretty easily the weakest overhead Zelda imo.

TMC just feels like a lot of rough design concepts quickly strung together.... it's a lot like TWW in that regard.
Click to expand...

Completely disagree. It was short, for a Zelda game, but that's okay. I didn't think objectives were unsatisfying and I thought it had some of the best dungeons in a Zelda ever.

Plus, I thought the dual world setup worked wonderfully. The world wasn't as small as it looked, as you could find all these little nooks and crannies all over the place.

Wish Capcom were doing PH.
 
Magicpaint said:
Here's another person that didn't play Majora's Mask! See, when Nintendo goes astray from the formula (Zelda II, MM) people complain, but when they stick close to the formula, people still complain. So how exactly can they please everybody?
Click to expand...

Majora's Mask is the exception, but it's still rooted in OoT gameplay which takes a ****load of cues from LTTP. :P

I never said if it was a good or a bad thing, I love both AoL and MM, just so you know.
 
tanasten said:
I absolutely agree with you. Zelda series should have a come back to the origins, and get into exploring another kind of elements that there are in gaming. That's why I was a bit disappointed with Wind Waker and Twilight Princess, 'cause apart of the whole theme thing (sea navigation, Wolf Link, etc) there's nothing new to the series, or diferent.
Click to expand...

I hate it when people try to evaluate a game's worth by whatever main gimmick appears in the game. Yup TP is just OOT with a wolf.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

IGN: The 10 Best Metroid Games Ever Made
Analysis Trailer  2
57
1K
Mr Hyde replied
  • Featured
Hyrule Warriors: Age of Imprisonment |OT| The Legend of Zelda: No Link in the Past
|OT|  2 3
121
3K
darth.shrimp replied
What is the most beautiful game ever?
2 3 4
180
1K
Generic replied
I wish they made a sequel to Ghostbusters The Video Game
26
325
Stafford replied
Army of Two: The 40th Day director says the co-op game is the “gayest game ever made”
2
75
1K
DonkeyPunchJr replied
Top Bottom