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I'm impressed by the game balance of THE EVIL WITHIN

Neiteio

Member
First, let me start by saying TEW may eclipse Bayo 2 and Tropical Freeze as my Game of the Year. It's rare in any year (let alone 2014) to see a horror-themed game of such length and variety, one with no hand-holding, and with such punishing encounters. So many memorable moments, each fueled by the adrenaline rush of feeling in control (thanks to tight mechanics), yet vulnerable (due to scarcity of resources)...

But more on that in a moment.

I was expecting an uneven experience from TEW, given the mixed reception here on GAF. But playing it post-patch on PS4, I love everything about it. The alleged "jank?" I don't see any, outside of the "gamey"-looking way Seb opens doors and breaks crates -- a holdover from RE4. The forced black bars and camera zoom? Only heightened the tension for me, making certain bosses especially suspenseful (Ch. 10 spoiler:
trying to shoot the ceiling lever and being unable to see Laura due to the black bars/camera zoom is INTENSE
). Also worth noting, the game plays with different types of fear, from nervous avoidance and panicky flight, to barely scraping by with crudely improvised combat. The first couple chapters establish the groundwork for stealth, how oftentimes the best approach is to avoid the enemy, silently picking them off if you can. The game opens up from Ch. 3 onwards, and only continues to evolve, layering in new suspenseful set-pieces. In hindsight, it's admirable how the game organically teaches the player how to handle themselves in each situation.

At any rate, I highly recommend this game.

Now then, about the topic in the title: GAME BALANCE. This might be the single most impressive quality of the game. I don't know how Shinji Mikami did it, but on the default difficulty of Survival, I never had much ammo. No matter how carefully I picked my shots... No matter how well I conserved my ammo... I was constantly at risk of having nothing to defend myself (because TEW players know melee won't save you). I think the most ammo I ever had was 20 bullets in my upgraded pistol. Beyond that, in a best-case scenario, I might have had five shotgun shells, four sniper bullets, three magnum rounds, and only enough trap parts to make a few bolts for the agony crossbow. Maybe I'd have a few grenades, if I were lucky. The health-restoring syringes seemed a bit more common, but they won't defeat the enemies trying to kill you!

In many encounters, I found myself straight-up out of ammo, and for at least one encounter, I think I would've had to restart the chapter if I were less equipped than I was (Ch. 6 mid-boss spoiler:
The 1v1 Sadist fight, if you've already exhausted the level's stockpile of ammo
). This really drove home the need to conserve ammo, making each fight against the trash mobs (who themselves are no pushover, and can quickly overwhelm) that much more harrowing. I had to make on-the-fly judgment calls, like whether now was the right time to use my last explosive bolt, etc.

I think on average I died to most bosses in this game 20+ times... Perhaps I'm not the most skillful player, but I've beat Demon's Souls, etc., and I found the bosses here much harder. They're just so fast, erratic and ruthless. Some of them are downright unnerving (again,
Laura
in Ch. 10). Many of the battles take place in environments that are hard to read under pressure (Ch. 7 spoiler:
The Keeper's lair
). Many boss arenas are filled with traps and blind corners, and some of them require you to shoot switches, pull levers and turn cranks, leaving yourself open to attack. And when your sole means of fighting back is so quickly exhausted, due to scarcity of ammo (if you even -had- ammo when you arrived at that checkpoint in the first place), you end up running for dear life, trying to exploit the environment to slow the boss down, until some means of fighting back reveals itself, whether it's the occasional trap you can trigger, or a single harpoon bolt sticking out of the wall. On so many occasions, my last bullet was what clinched the fight. Had my aim slightly strayed and missed its mark, I would've been one-hit killed and had to repeat a 10-minute battle (and 10 minutes can feel excruciatingly long at this game's level of intensity).

All of this... makes the game incredible.

It's amazing to me how the game maintains this delicate balance of "capable but just barely" over the duration of the entire game. It seems like many people finish the game in 15-20 hours. For me, it took around 30 hours, since I'm a chickenshit who had to study enemy patrol routines at length before making my move. However you play it, though, it's a lengthy game, and the game's difficulty scales so well to your character upgrades. A lot of thought clearly went into balancing this game, whether it's the way enemy movements seem to just barely lag behind if you manage your sprinting stamina just so, or how ammo reveals itself in subtle ways when you most need it, but only if you survive long enough to notice.

Ultimately, TEW is like RE4, but without the power creep of endless ammo and overpowered melee moves. It's an adventure of similar scope and scale, with the same variety and pacing, but without the supreme sense of player empowerment. Rather, TEW robs the player of power on a regular basis (and the moments where it grants power are a blessed release). It's the antithesis of most games these days, and for that I commend it, since it's certainly not the most marketable move.

Anyone else impressed with this aspect of TEW, or TEW in general?
 
I generally agree with all of your points. It's an exceptionally well crafted and balanced game...until it decides to introduce SMG/Assault rifle wielding enemies or bow wielding enemies that can lock you into a loop of get hit, explode, fall over and get hit the millisecond you stand up and rinse/repeat until you're dead.

Terrible gameplay decision.
 
My only issue with this game was the performance and stupid cinematic black bars that actually impede the quality of gameplay. Otherwise the game was exceptional.
 
The technical issues and camera issues detract from the core experience.

Have those slight annoyances been fixed via patch or update, TEW would be my runner up to GOTY.

Reportedly, Shinji Mikami managed to salvage this project from a failed scifi game. He also did so with a small team and with dealing with Bethesda incompetence.

I'm really impressed with the end result. Safe man and Laura are easily my favorite enemy designs.

Also, the Agony Crossbow is GOAT.
 
I have to wonder if there's an AI director of sorts at work. While there are scenarios that are clearly designed to drain the player's resources (the
chapter 11 gondola fight
), many mundane encounters have similar effects.

Generally I think the game is amazing, though the black bars are a bit too thick (ratio is 2.5:1 when it should be 2.35:1) and the FOV could be wider. I've noticed some mechanics inconsistencies such as matches randomly not working, prompts randomly not appearing, and it being a crapshoot if flailing enemies on the ground will actually connect or not - utterly infuriating on Akumu mode where you die in one hit. Having to crouch to knife a stunned enemy is a bit silly. It's that any these issues are a huge deal in isolation, though experiencing all of them together brings the experience down a peg.

edit - There was also THIS

Still, the other aspects of the game place it in my top 5 of the year. Mikami still paces his games better than anyone else.
 
I generally agree with all of your points. It's an exceptionally well crafted and balanced game...until it decides to introduce SMG/Assault rifle wielding enemies or bow wielding enemies that can lock you into a loop of get hit, explode, fall over and get hit the millisecond you stand up and rinse/repeat until you're dead.

Terrible gameplay decision.
On the few occasions those enemies appeared, near the end of the game, I found them thrilling rather than frustrating (but I suppose I had the good fortune to not find myself locked in the loop you described). They immediately become top priority for the player, so there's a rush from trying to shake them off your trail (Ch. 11 spoiler:
The construction yard
), or trying to stay out of their line of sight until you can find ammo or some way to get the drop on them. I liked their inclusion, insofar as they made the groups they appeared in even more threatening.
 
My only issue with this game was the performance and stupid cinematic black bars that actually impede the quality of gameplay. Otherwise the game was exceptional.

The black bars actually work to the game's benefit in helping to create a much more tense and unsettling atmosphere by restricting your view in such a way.

Works wonderfully, especially when you're creeping around the sewers or apartment building or hospital.
 
It's a shame had such a negative opinion of this game, I loved it. Well worth the $30 I spent on it. Not Resident Evil 4 levels of love, but I'd say it was about as fun as Resident Evil 5 which I really enjoyed.
 
On the few occasions those enemies appeared, near the end of the game, I found them thrilling rather than frustrating (but I suppose I had the good fortune to not find myself locked in the loop you described). They immediately become top priority for the player, so there's a rush from trying to shake them off your trail (Ch. 11 spoiler:
The construction yard
), or trying to stay out of their line of sight until you can find ammo or some way to get the drop on them. I liked their inclusion, insofar as they made the groups they appeared in even more threatening.

They are thankfully very few in numbers, but the getting caught in a loop really ended up annoying the hell out of me and really soured my encounter with them.

As I said though, it's incredibly well balanced outside of that minor issue.
 
The black bars actually work to the game's benefit in helping to create a much more tense and unsettling atmosphere by restricting your view in such a way.

Works wonderfully, especially when you're creeping around the sewers or apartment building or hospital.
Yeah, the game seems very carefully designed around the black bars. They focus your attention in a particular way and create blind spots that make you feel vulnerable, making it so I felt guarded the entire time. I found this especially interesting in Ch. 13, when you have to get past
two fake Ruviks in the hotel
, since I'd be crouching at the corner, but the camera would allow only a sliver of a glimpse of the enemies down the hall. It ratcheted up the suspense nicely, since I sure as hell didn't want to blow my cover and deal with
the Laura arms popping out of the ground
.
 
TEW is like RE4 without the whole actually being good part. The game is not scary, it's poorly designed, it runs like shit, the bosses are cheap and the only way I ended up without much ammo is when I loaded all of my bolts into a boss that was apparently invincible at that point.

There is only one thing that any developer should look at TEW for inspiration, and that's the shooting mechanics.
 
Thats a good write-up op. I agree that game has really good balance but it is hella jank on consoles.
Ran great on PS4 post-patch. Not a constant 30 fps, but the only real dips happened during a couple in-engine cutscenes (Ch. 6 spoiler:
Guillotine cutscene
), and only briefly at that. It seems you have to manually install the patch from the Notifications menu, once downloaded, so hopefully people are actually playing with the patch installed (rather than simply downloaded).
 
completely agree with you OP. I recently finished TLOU on survivor and never felt so hard pressed as on the normal difficulty of TEW. It's too bad that the second half of the game is not made of the same quality as the first.
 
TEW is like RE4 without the whole actually being good part. The game is not scary, it's poorly designed, it runs like shit, the bosses are cheap and the only way I ended up without much ammo is when I loaded all of my bolts into a boss that was apparently invincible at that point.

There is only one thing that any developer should look at TEW for inspiration, and that's the shooting mechanics.
Not sure I see where you're coming from with that assessment. I found TEW to be much scarier, and orders of magnitude more challenging than RE4. Game runs fine on PS4, post-patch, and aside from a couple rough spots (the finicky nature of matches, etc), much of what people call "jank" are the few gamey animations that were also present in RE4, and that I didn't even notice after a few chapters. The bosses aren't cheap, either, although I suspect I know what you mean by those invincibility frames (I.E. when The Keeper respawns).
 
I greatly prefer TEW over RE4..

I know. At this point I think everyone on GAF probably knows.

Also, while I'm here, I might as well point out that a shit camera and vision restricting black bars doesn't count a tension building, it counts as fucking me off every time one of the bosses gets their one-hit kill move in. Why not stick black bars and 0 field of view in Dark Souls, it'll just make the fights more intense.
 
I will say that speedrunning the game on casual using (unlockable weapon spoilers)
brass knuckles
was one of the most satisfying experiences I've ever had with a game.
 
The best part about TEW is Mikami =P

But yeah, talking about game design TEW is outstanding, my biggest problems are the story (which, despite liking, is pretty bad) and the fact that RE4 exists.
 
edit - There was also THIS

Just so nobody else does this lol, just sprint over these little guys they'll just pop.

I know. At this point I think everyone on GAF probably knows.

Good :)

I will say that speedrunning the game on casual using (unlockable weapon spoilers)
brass knuckles
was one of the most satisfying experiences I've ever had with a game.

My casual run was the only one that kinda put me to sleep, I can't even believe people had to drop the game completely because they found it too hard even on that mode.
 
The black bars actually work to the game's benefit in helping to create a much more tense and unsettling atmosphere by restricting your view in such a way.

Works wonderfully, especially when you're creeping around the sewers or apartment building or hospital.
Nah, shit sucks. So much better without it(or at least minimized).

I think this game is going to get more respect as time goes on. Its definitely one of the best games I've played this year and manages to stay fresh throughout.

I also highly advise everybody to play this on PC if you have the ability. You can get reasonable performance(solid 30fps) without any really great PC and you can control the level of black bars, all the way to getting rid of them completely.
 
If TEW does anything right, it's definitely got the fundamental combat mechanics down. There is definitely some sort of fine tuned formula going on there when it comes to ammo/resource drops and item placement. While ammo and resources are scarce and such, there's plenty of alternatives strewn throughout the combative areas. Whether that's making use of the traps & hazards to minimize loss of ammo or by simply managing your inventory and using your bow for crowd control, there are quite a few options at your disposal when it comes to handling the baddies...

Too bad it was the most disappointing game of the year for me! I've said my peace about this game and I don't feel like repeating myself, so I'll leave it at that. But talk about a game where a combat engine is more or less wasted, farting around in an awful, inconsistent campaign-game mess of a scenario.
 
Also, while I'm here, I might as well point out that a shit camera and vision restricting black bars doesn't count a tension building, it counts as fucking me off every time one of the bosses gets their one-hit kill move in. Why not stick black bars and 0 field of view in Dark Souls, it'll just make the fights more intense.
The game seems clearly designed around the black bars/camera zoom, and balanced accordingly. I honestly forget they were there most of the time, and was reminded of them in hindsight when I thought about how intense some parts were, and how the view affected things.
 
TEW is like RE4 without the whole actually being good part. The game is not scary, it's poorly designed, it runs like shit, the bosses are cheap and the only way I ended up without much ammo is when I loaded all of my bolts into a boss that was apparently invincible at that point.

There is only one thing that any developer should look at TEW for inspiration, and that's the shooting mechanics.

This is kinda where I'm at.

What happened Mikami?
 
Ran great on PS4 post-patch. Not a constant 30 fps, but the only real dips happened during a couple in-engine cutscenes (Ch. 6 spoiler:
Guillotine cutscene
), and only briefly at that. It seems you have to manually install the patch from the Notifications menu, once downloaded, so hopefully people are actually playing with the patch installed (rather than simply downloaded).

I played it post patch 2 days ago. I think im just too sensitive to frame rate because even 30 fps gives me migraines so sub-30 TEW was unpleasant at times. I did like the game a whole lot though.
 
My casual run was the only one that kinda put me to sleep, I can't even believe people had to drop the game completely because they found it too hard even on that mode.

I also played on casual for my no upgrade run and found it really easy. Can't imagine how effortless it would be with even a few pistol critical upgrades.
 
The game seems clearly designed around the black bars/camera zoom, and balanced accordingly. I honestly forget they were there most of the time, and was reminded of them in hindsight when I thought about how intense some parts were, and how the view affected things.

They seemed intentional to hide some traps on the ground which were stupidly easy to spot with them disabled, after half a dozen playthroughs with them on and off I don't really have a preference at this point, items are slightly harder to pick up when they're enabled and the lantern is bright as fuck when they're disabled.
 
Good write-up. This is a serious contender for my GOTY, and I've only just beaten chapter 6. You hit on the exact reason I'm finding myself enjoying this more than RE4, a game I loved to death and have played through 7 times: pacing and balance. There hasn't been a moment in the game where I felt powerful. I have to take on every enemy encounter carefully, and I always feel like I'm just barely surviving.
 
The game seems clearly designed around the black bars/camera zoom, and balanced accordingly. I honestly forget they were there most of the time, and was reminded of them in hindsight when I thought about how intense some parts were, and how the view affected things.

You sure it wasnt because the game ran like absolute ass pre-patch? and still even AFTER all of the patches? Opening up that much real-estate would surely make it run even worse, no?
 
I agree with most of what you say apart from the black bars. I went into the game liking the idea, however once I started playing I found them a pain in the ass so I removed them, which made the game about ten times more enjoyable (and didn't take away from the intensity).
 
They seemed intentional to hide some traps on the ground which were stupidly easy to spot with them disabled, after half a dozen playthroughs with them on and off I don't really have a preference at this point, items are slightly harder to pick up when they're enabled and the lantern is bright as fuck when they're disabled.

That feel when you get a good rhythm going, only to run into a random bear trap on Akumu :(
 
My only issue with this game was the performance and stupid cinematic black bars that actually impede the quality of gameplay. Otherwise the game was exceptional.

The fact that the game still doesn't run great with the bars makes it seem like they're there to help with performance, not for atmosphere. The game looks great on PC with the bars removed too.

I agree with parts of the OP. There were a few moments that felt amazing after I cleared a room with a round or two of ammo to spare. But every one of those moments where I felt smart for getting by with what I had was balanced out by a situation where I died because of the controls, or got hit by a one-hit-kill attack, or had to run around a level for ten minutes re-collecting items after a death.

In terms of keeping gameplay varied and changing the tone of the game in interesting ways, The Evil Within is expertly balanced, but my enjoyment was all over the place.
 
I liked the first few chapters...until it began to be a run 'n' gun zombie shooter.

Are you talking about chapter 6 by any chance? There are only a couple chapters like that in the game.

Its no more a run n gun zombie shooter than RE4 is.

It's really not even close, RE4 has like more than double the enemies that this game has and it drowns you in ammo.

It's amazing to me how the game maintains this delicate balance of "capable but just barely" over the duration of the entire game.

My initial playthrough was brilliant for this, there were multiple encounters where I came out with less than a handful of bullets and it felt awesome.
 
The technical issues and camera issues detract from the core experience.

Have those slight annoyances been fixed via patch or update, TEW would be my runner up to GOTY.

Reportedly, Shinji Mikami managed to salvage this project from a failed scifi game. He also did so with a small team and with dealing with Bethesda incompetence.

I'm really impressed with the end result. Safe man and Laura are easily my favorite enemy designs.

Also, the Agony Crossbow is GOAT.

Links?

TeW is a Tango Studio game, Bethesda only paid the bills.

I've been following the game for a long long time (when sculpts of the enemies began appearing on digital sculpting forums years ago).

The interference I remember reading about was Bethesda asking Shinji to direct the game when they bought the Studio, and that they wanted survivor horror.

I also believe Bethesda might be responsible for the game ditching UE3 for ID Tech (the sculpts that appeared online years ago were done on UE3 tools), and frankly fuck then for that. ID Tech 5 sucks.

The game performance issues can probably be traced to that horrible decision.
 
Different tastes, and all that. I felt that the game balance was all over the place. The Chapter 10 example the OP cited was the area that eventually made me stop playing for good. I was not having a great time with the game as it was, and realized I was forcing myself to play at that point.

It has its moments for sure, but overall I found it uneven and unfocused.
 
I never wrote about RE4. I wrote what I wrote as a general statement.
That's fine. So long as you dislike RE4 for the same and are being consistent, that's fair.

I don't see it, though. There's a few instances where you're faced with a horde of zombies, but it definitely rewards more careful play more often than not. Its also more fun if you don't just go in guns blazing in every situation.
 
That's fine. So long as you dislike RE4 for the same and are being consistent, that's fair.

I don't see it, though. There's a few instances where you're faced with a horde of zombies, but it definitely rewards more careful play more often than not. Its also more fun if you don't just go in guns blazing in every situation.

Resident Evil 4 never presented itself as a slow horror game. It takes about ten minutes for you to start getting swarmed in RE4. TEW pretends to be a stealthy horror game for an hour before it gets bored.
 
Different tastes, and all that. I felt that the game balance was all over the place. The Chapter 10 example the OP cited was the area that eventually made me stop playing for good. I was not having a great time with the game as it was, and realized I was forcing myself to play at that point.

It has its moments for sure, but overall I found it uneven and unfocused.
Sorry to hear that. Maybe someday you'll come back to it and beat that boss. It took me the most tries of every boss in the game, feeling borderline impossible at points, but the satisfaction when I finally beat it... Priceless. :-3
 
The game performance issues can probably be traced to that horrible decision.
The game performance issues can probably be traced to them taking an engine that was designed to run at 60 FPS no matter what and lock it to 30 and forcefully inject their own lighting technology into the engine. I wouldn't have it any other way, as the lighting in Evil Within is some of the best I've seen in a game, and I played on PC, so performance wasn't an issue, but it can probably be attributed to that one particular decision by Tango. I highly doubt that decision by Tango was mandated by Bethesda.

The lighting is so good that when a light source manages to go inside of Sebastian's head the shadow on the wall is the inside mesh of his head. It's amazing.
 
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