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In Appreciation of Riviera
- Thread starter ethelred
- Start date
Wow, I remember looking at a gaming website and seeing the the name Riviera and thinking "What is this, some Disney game?"... Boy was I wrong!
It's a bit restrictive, and it wasn't what I expected, but it's extremely fun. The only part that REALLY didn't like about it was...
SPOILERS?
When you're trying to complete a side mission (? it's been a while) and you have to complete a DDR like thing without a miss for what seems like 15 minutes... I can't tell you how many times I was screaming during that part.
/SPOILERS?
Might as well take the game back from my friend and replay it. It's been some time!
It's a bit restrictive, and it wasn't what I expected, but it's extremely fun. The only part that REALLY didn't like about it was...
SPOILERS?
When you're trying to complete a side mission (? it's been a while) and you have to complete a DDR like thing without a miss for what seems like 15 minutes... I can't tell you how many times I was screaming during that part.
/SPOILERS?
Might as well take the game back from my friend and replay it. It's been some time!
What a great thread, and what a coincidence, I recently got the PSP version since the GBA one was ATLUS-impossible to find.
The game looks beautiful, though you can tell they stretched and filtered the sprites in a weird way. I'm actually finding myself looking for battles just to listen to that beautiful score and to see what grade I can get, something I wasn't experiencing since Baten Kaitos Origins.
Fio said:
But that was the whole point, that you have limited options in battle and you need to strategize as to how best to make use of your inventory and which three characters to use. As I said, the battle system is all about preplanning before the battle even begins. As I said, the best comparison I could make is Ogre Battle, where planning and prebattle decisions are the most important element.
In most fights, you shouldn't need more than four items, especially since there's a lot of skill overlap -- Ein can use pretty much every weapon in the game, so you can easily have him set up to use similar attacks as one of your other two attackers. And Cierra and Fia can both get different effects out of magical items, so if you bring a staff into battle, it's just like you're taking two items.
A Black Falcon said:
Basically, yes. I can play dozens of RPGs that have free roaming dungeons, but Riviera is very uncommon in how well it melds graphic adventure game exploration with RPG mechanics. The heavy amount of text plays into that, too, and I didn't mind it because hey, it was all very well written and most of it furthered the characters' personalities or added little descriptive flairs to the areas/world anyway. I found most of Riviera's departures from the norms of RPGs refreshing.
A Black Falcon
Member
ethelred said:
With every character being able to use different weapon types, and getting different kinds of moves and special moves out of those weapons, selecting which weapons to take with you has great strategic depth and is a huge part of the game... the key, really, is how the different characters use the items differently, so one person heals from the same kind of item that another one attacks with. You really have to think about your choices. Take a powerful weapon that maybe only one character can use, for instance, or a weaker one that several can?
And it was also good that your inventory was limited as well. Oh, sure, it's annoying and cruel to have to decide on which items to keep and which to drop, but infinite inventories just aren't great design... you should have to make those kinds of choices in RPGs.
Absolutely.
It might help if you like graphic adventures, admittedly, but I do, so I really saw that as a good thing... it's one part RPG, one part graphic adventure, and one part dating sim, with quick-time events thrown in too.
Llyranor said:
If you were skillful and lucky, you MIGHT be able to get by, but I'd say that training is necessary for anyone short of god.
Yeah, really. The final boss is a bitch, even with my training of -everything-
Hmm... I'm thinking about starting it again... I forget, does it have New Game +?
A Black Falcon
Member
Althane said:
You need to train weapons.
Remember, when you go in training mode, you don't deplete weapons! This is incredibly important, particularly for weapons that only have a few uses... for some weapons, the only way to use their special attacks is to use them in practice battles. And for the others, it wastes a lot of uses getting their special attacks if you do it in normal battles... particularly with how the normal battles sometimes are kind of spread out.
The only annoying part is when you want to get some weapons up in a long and challenging stage with some quick-time event stuff in it (at the end of the area, perhaps) that you don't want to fail, so you need to waste lots of time doing all that stuff over and over, only to mess up at the end... again.
But aside from that, it's not that bad. I mean, there aren't all that many normal battles. Don't do the training and the game would be quite short... but definitely harder, thanks to not being able to use as many special attacks. Yeah, you will need them for the hard parts, and training is really the only way to do it.
A Black Falcon
Member
Llyranor said:
The game's like 30 hours long...it's really not that big of a deal. As I said, without those battles, the game would be way too short! And they go quickly (easy enemies) and you have more freedom because you don't need to take Ein with you in them, too. And, of course, weapons don't degrade.
One way to deal with it is wait until you have several weapons you need to train up, so that you can deal with them all at once instead of wasting time training just one weapon for one character or something. That can get a bit irritating sometimes, but if you've got several characters with weapons to master, it's more productive.
The training's really not a big deal. You only do it every once in a while when you're like 1 step away from a save point. It's actually kinda fun, since you can try out various strategies to see what kinds of tactics and/or weapon combinations will earn you higher ranks (which in turn net you better loot in the main/story battles). And as a bonus, practice fights have an entirely different combat theme than regular (story) or boss battles. Hell, probably the best battle music in the game.
Speaking of the quick time events, I never found them all that difficult, usually just messing up due to random errors (damn you human hands! If only I had perfect hands...)... except skipping the stone across the lake.
I eventually did that part in an emulator just to bloody well do it (hey, in my defense, i only SS'd at the beginning). Still, that one was just insane.
Oh, and the grinding isn't too bad. Key is: Bring Ein, and the two that can use the new weapon (make sure you do it as soon as you get it). Takes one battle (unless it's a weapon. Items, not so much) to do it, three at max (well... if it nukes everybody, maybe a bit more), but there's never an -enormous- grind for a single item, and if you keep it down to each time you get a new item, it's not bad at all.
And just use the Diviner for Ein. Best weapon EVER.
Edit: Hmm... clearly I did a lot of overkill in that game.
;;
I eventually did that part in an emulator just to bloody well do it (hey, in my defense, i only SS'd at the beginning). Still, that one was just insane.
Oh, and the grinding isn't too bad. Key is: Bring Ein, and the two that can use the new weapon (make sure you do it as soon as you get it). Takes one battle (unless it's a weapon. Items, not so much) to do it, three at max (well... if it nukes everybody, maybe a bit more), but there's never an -enormous- grind for a single item, and if you keep it down to each time you get a new item, it's not bad at all.
And just use the Diviner for Ein. Best weapon EVER.
Edit: Hmm... clearly I did a lot of overkill in that game.
;;
A Black Falcon
Member
Althane said:Speaking of the quick time events, I never found them all that difficult, usually just messing up due to random errors (damn you human hands! If only I had perfect hands...)... except skipping the stone across the lake.
I eventually did that part in an emulator just to bloody well do it (hey, in my defense, i only SS'd at the beginning). Still, that one was just insane.
Oh, and the grinding isn't too bad. Key is: Bring Ein, and the two that can use the new weapon (make sure you do it as soon as you get it). Takes one battle (unless it's a weapon. Items, not so much) to do it, three at max (well... if it nukes everybody, maybe a bit more), but there's never an -enormous- grind for a single item, and if you keep it down to each time you get a new item, it's not bad at all.
And just use the Diviner for Ein. Best weapon EVER.
Edit: Hmm... clearly I did a lot of overkill in that game.
Gah... the skipping stone... wasn't that the one at the very end of an hour long chapter section that was incredibly easy to fail and was incredibly hard and you only got one chance at (of course, like most of the stuff in the game)? So hard!
... seriously, while I really, really loved it, the difficulty level was a bit odd. On the one hand, it was very forgiving -- battles are only rarely actually hard if you've trained the weapons and use strategy, and even if you do lose it doesn't punish you at all and you can pretty much just start the battle over (but with the enemy weakened, usually). But on the other hand, you always have limited TP which means that you won't be able to do everything (interact with everything) unless you do well in battles, which can be hard, so you often have to just leave things behind you want (or re-do battles until you do better at them), the QTEs are sometimes hard and you are usually only given one chance at them, so if you fail the only way to retry is to reload your last save (you can only make permanent saves between chapter sections), and the branching paths mean that you can't get everything, and the item system constantly requires you to throw out items, and it can be hard to figure out what to say in conversations in order to build the relationships you want (or annoy the people you want)... oh, and the puzzles are hard sometimes. It's one part modern easy stuff and one part oldschool somewhat hardcore RPG/adventure mix.
Llyranor said:
And remember, there are no random battles. The only normal battles are set-piece battles in specific screens, and those are somewhat spread out sometimes. In between (once a chapter or once every few chapter sections should be fine) you do practice battles to train weapons. If you get bored, just move on and try to play with what you have... but it's not that bad.
Not too long. Seven chapters, each broken up into several sections, adding up to 25-30 hours total...
(Oh, and did I mention the multiple paths? Sometimes you have to make decisions about which way to go, or are faced with a QTE, and what you choose or do there determines where you go next... and you can't go back to previous sections or, sometimes, previous screens. So there truly are multiple routes though many of the chapters. Awesome!)
I finally started playing this game after four months of sitting in my DS' GBA slot, and I'm loving it so far. Middle of the fourth chapter, and I really like how things are going.
+I love the concept of a stage/point based RPG.
+I love countless non-linearities and either/or choices.
+Battle system is fun and original.
+Possibly the best sprite work I've ever seen.
+Fantastic soundtrack.
The long-ish attack animations and 'no-exp for dead members' are kind of irritating, especially when I lose charges on very limited items. I might have to do a practice battle at some point to control the latter problem.
Nice pick-up in the OP on the similarities to US.
So far, it's seeming like an RPG that I might I might place through twice, which has rarely happened in recent years.
EDIT:
Beat it. Very enjoyable game, though I wish the battle animations were shorter. I'll probably do another playthrough eventually, but the slow battles might bring that to a halt.
I might even go back to finish Yggdra Union, but... it would have to be with a FAQ. I hate the poorly defined mission objectives and changes.
+I love the concept of a stage/point based RPG.
+I love countless non-linearities and either/or choices.
+Battle system is fun and original.
+Possibly the best sprite work I've ever seen.
+Fantastic soundtrack.
The long-ish attack animations and 'no-exp for dead members' are kind of irritating, especially when I lose charges on very limited items. I might have to do a practice battle at some point to control the latter problem.
Nice pick-up in the OP on the similarities to US.
So far, it's seeming like an RPG that I might I might place through twice, which has rarely happened in recent years.
EDIT:
Beat it. Very enjoyable game, though I wish the battle animations were shorter. I'll probably do another playthrough eventually, but the slow battles might bring that to a halt.
I might even go back to finish Yggdra Union, but... it would have to be with a FAQ. I hate the poorly defined mission objectives and changes.
Small bump since I actually started the game, finally (360 dead, can't play Vesperia or IU ;_
. In 2nd dungeon, and really enjoying it. The battle system is pretty fresh.
Quick question, though, can you have your character 'wait' out a turn? I don't necessarily want to have them attack every turn (bumping up the enemy rage meter), and I don't always want to bypass that by making them use finite items. If no, then I'll have to adapt accordingly.
EDIT: Hmm, given the limited inventory, I guess you're supposed to use up all your items.
. In 2nd dungeon, and really enjoying it. The battle system is pretty fresh. Quick question, though, can you have your character 'wait' out a turn? I don't necessarily want to have them attack every turn (bumping up the enemy rage meter), and I don't always want to bypass that by making them use finite items. If no, then I'll have to adapt accordingly.
EDIT: Hmm, given the limited inventory, I guess you're supposed to use up all your items.
eXistor
Member
I liked the game, but it wasn't great either. I got to the point that I felt the game overstayed its welcome. If I played the game for 20 more minutes I could finish it, but I have lost all interest in ever playing the game again so I won't ever finish it. Same happened with Super Paper Mario (last dungeon) and Mario & Luigi 2 (also last dungeon).
A Black Falcon
Member
Tsubaki said:
Yeah, just bring an item that does some effect on your party -- heal, boost, something like that. That's how you skip turns. You get plenty of such items, it works out fine (and indeed, strategically deciding when to not boost your enemy's meter is sometimes important).
If you lose you can re-do the fight, but it's made easier...
Of course, the game really isn't hard enough that you should be losing much. If you're losing a lot, it's because you're not training up your weapons after you get them and because you aren't using good enough strategy. The 'redo easier' feature is nice to have I guess, but certainly is not an important gameplay feature anything like it is described there. You just need to play the game properly.
Sad story about me and Riviera. I bought it for the PSP last year and was only an hour or so from beating it when my PSP developed a malfunction. Luckily I had the extended warranty with Circuit City where I bought it. Stupidly though, I left my game in the drive when I went to get my new one. I keep thinking I am going to get another copy but paying that $30 for just another hour or so of gameplay has kept me from taking the plunge.
Still though, I loved my time with the game and have always thought it was under appreciated.
Still though, I loved my time with the game and have always thought it was under appreciated.
Small bump as I've been progressing further in the game. I'm currently in what I believe to be the final dungeon in the game.
I've really been enjoying it so far. First off, good dungeon pacing. No tedious crap for the most part, and a lot of stuff is simply optional. I quite enjoy the item management. Limited number of items, and limited uses per item makes each of them more important. It's a nice balance between making sure you have enough items to last through the dungeons, and using the better items when you need to.
The combat system itself is a blast. It seems 'limited' at first, but everything is very detailed/specific. A lot of importance is put in which items you bring into combat. Very fresh system, and since every battle is a set piece, I haven't felt like I've been fighting the same fights over and over again. I'm about 20-25 hrs in right now, and it definitely hasn't outlived its welcome.
I haven't cared too much about the story. It's mostly a glorified dating sim. Writing itself is decent. Music is niiiice.
I'll tackle Yggdra Union after this little gem.
I've really been enjoying it so far. First off, good dungeon pacing. No tedious crap for the most part, and a lot of stuff is simply optional. I quite enjoy the item management. Limited number of items, and limited uses per item makes each of them more important. It's a nice balance between making sure you have enough items to last through the dungeons, and using the better items when you need to.
The combat system itself is a blast. It seems 'limited' at first, but everything is very detailed/specific. A lot of importance is put in which items you bring into combat. Very fresh system, and since every battle is a set piece, I haven't felt like I've been fighting the same fights over and over again. I'm about 20-25 hrs in right now, and it definitely hasn't outlived its welcome.
I haven't cared too much about the story. It's mostly a glorified dating sim. Writing itself is decent. Music is niiiice.
I'll tackle Yggdra Union after this little gem.
mrkapawutzis
Member
Another bump. This game is now on sale at Amazon and Play-Asia for $20 (the PSP version). I just picked one up, I'll start it next week though.
whiterabbit
Member
Well, since this thread got bumped, I'll mention I finally played through it, and beat it in a few days this winter, playing mostly at night when I couldn't sleep on vacation and had trouble adjusting to Eastern time.
Anyway, I enjoyed it. I'm glad I got to play through it. If you'll recall, this is the thread that got me interested in it. i saw it at a store and was like, hmm, that's it.
It still gets me that it says "RPG Cult Classic" on the back of the box.
Anyway the battle system was a breath of fresh air, however I think it's entirely missable in a way. Nothing about it screams must-play or best RPG ever, however the battle system again is good: I liked the special attacks; and it was somewhat challenging, although automatic restarts are nice. Good animations, however sometimes lengthy. Each fight feels significant since there are no random battles. The characters are at least likeable (I guess I have a thing for angels), however the VA gets annoying very quickly. I listened to my ipod a lot.
The "dating sim" (or whatever) system is very subtle; it might as well not even exist. It's just like, if a character trips, you can either choose, "Watch where you're going stupid!" or "Are you okay?" and they'll have a smiley face if you give them positive feedback, however there is no place in the interface to check your progress on this. Aaand I got interrupted anyway while trying to watch my ending (don't ask), so I didn't even see which character I had the most relationship with, and what happened.
I think Ein started up a school with whoever it was.
Also, puzzles! There are a few neat puzzles in the game, and I don't even particularly like puzzles in RPGs very much.
Anyway, I enjoyed it. I'm glad I got to play through it. If you'll recall, this is the thread that got me interested in it. i saw it at a store and was like, hmm, that's it.
It still gets me that it says "RPG Cult Classic" on the back of the box.
Anyway the battle system was a breath of fresh air, however I think it's entirely missable in a way. Nothing about it screams must-play or best RPG ever, however the battle system again is good: I liked the special attacks; and it was somewhat challenging, although automatic restarts are nice. Good animations, however sometimes lengthy. Each fight feels significant since there are no random battles. The characters are at least likeable (I guess I have a thing for angels), however the VA gets annoying very quickly. I listened to my ipod a lot.
The "dating sim" (or whatever) system is very subtle; it might as well not even exist. It's just like, if a character trips, you can either choose, "Watch where you're going stupid!" or "Are you okay?" and they'll have a smiley face if you give them positive feedback, however there is no place in the interface to check your progress on this. Aaand I got interrupted anyway while trying to watch my ending (don't ask), so I didn't even see which character I had the most relationship with, and what happened.
I think Ein started up a school with whoever it was.
Also, puzzles! There are a few neat puzzles in the game, and I don't even particularly like puzzles in RPGs very much.
tiltnkirby
Member
whiterabbit said:
The game got turned to easy mode right when you were given practice mode.
A few of the boss battles were a little tough but that was mostly because I didn't take the right weapons/people into the fight. And damn those slimes, even in practice mode they'd damage your weapons, asses.
As for the story and dating sim part, I had more fun on the 2nd time being an ass to everyone trying to get to true Rose ending. Even if I lose out on some items, it's way funnier to send Lina into quicksand and blame her for the lost item instead of sending Serene to get it no prob.
As for the bold part, yea it toke some time like Ledah's level 3 EX or Ein's level 3 EX.
But I'm still a sucker for this game and Yggdra Union, and I'm sure Knight in the Nightmare when it comes out here, hopefully by the end of the year.
Yeah, I just finished the game recently as well. Really enjoyed it, mainly for the battle system. If I ever replay it again, I'll completely bypass using practice mode for a good challenge. I really liked how item management was implemented.
I'm tackling Yggdra Union now and really enjoying it as well. Seeing the same elemental icons and Rage/Max was nice.
I'm tackling Yggdra Union now and really enjoying it as well. Seeing the same elemental icons and Rage/Max was nice.