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Intel Details Haswell Microarchitecture, Desktop/Mobile Lineup Fully revealed
- Thread starter 1st Course
- Start date
Disappointed.
Apparently mobile version of haswell only will feature HD4600 which is just tiny bit improvement over HD4000. The real improvement which is HD5200 is desktop only.
What is the point of this move? Desktop users can add graphic card anytime they want. It is the mobile market that can really benefited from good IGP.
You might actually just want to buy Ivybridge laptop when it becomes cheap
Apparently mobile version of haswell only will feature HD4600 which is just tiny bit improvement over HD4000. The real improvement which is HD5200 is desktop only.
What is the point of this move? Desktop users can add graphic card anytime they want. It is the mobile market that can really benefited from good IGP.
You might actually just want to buy Ivybridge laptop when it becomes cheap
The big deal with the mobile ones is that battery life might be hugely impacted. There's all sorts of crazy tech they've implemented to ensure the chips sip power. The VRM moving on-die is a big part of that, because they'll be able to fine tune voltages, which means a wider range of speeds as well as volts supplied that sufficiently power the chip while not providing too much.
Anandtech did a big writeup on them a number of months back that is worth a gander.
Anandtech did a big writeup on them a number of months back that is worth a gander.
Heard it was 128MB or something like that. I think it was mentioned in one of the first episodes of the AnandTech podcast, but I'm not sure. We'll soon find out.
EDIT: Here's the quote from Anand
AnandTech said:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6355/intels-haswell-architecture/12
But nevermind Haswell. Skylake's where it's at.
SneakyStephan
Banned
So still no prices then?
I'm eagerly waiting for haswell to release so I can pick up a cheap second hand p68 mobo with a 2500k
The fact that they upped the numbers in the naming scheme (x6xxk instead of x5xxk) suggests they're going to sell these alongside ivy bridge and that there is going to be another price hike for the overclockable quad core :\
I'm eagerly waiting for haswell to release so I can pick up a cheap second hand p68 mobo with a 2500k
The fact that they upped the numbers in the naming scheme (x6xxk instead of x5xxk) suggests they're going to sell these alongside ivy bridge and that there is going to be another price hike for the overclockable quad core :\
Great write up on how Haswell OC's. Looks like the BCLK will be able to be OC'd in strap increments, which introduces the possibility of OC'ing non 'K' processors like we've seen with the 3820.
cartman414
Member
Ivy-E won't be seeing very large upgrades if any at all. (Except the quad core being unlocked with 4820K.)
Also, none of the Ultrabook models (U/Y) will have any on-die iGPU mem.
Wow, this is pretty shocking really. I didn't realise this was happening so soon for Intel and motherboard manufacturers.
So, what really happens is that Intel save costs with the expense being passed onto the mobo manufacturers, who themselves then pass onto the consumer who end up taking the hit to the wallet.
Intel can then be more strict on the amount of products/prices they want on the market also.
Seems crazy to wait for this if you're wanting a high-end CPU, because those costs in this part of the market are going to be crazy compared to what is available now.
I could be all wrong on the above, but this is what I have gathered from some quick researching.
Edit - Seems like LGA will still be around for Broadwell in some form, and it is more likely the lower end CPU's going onto BGA.
cobragt4001
Banned
If the overclocking is that much better then I might consider that upgrade but hate the fact I'd need a new mobo. I caught hell trying to overclock my 3570k to 4.7ghz
Yeah, the enthusiast platform will continue to be LGA.
Like today we have Socket 1155 (Sandy/Ivy) and Socket 2011 (Sandy-E/Ivy-E), Broadwell-E will be LGA.
Delid it. Most should hit 4.8-5.0 once you get that terrible TIM out of there. It takes 30 mins and isn't nearly as scary as it sounds.
cobragt4001
Banned
I might try that. For gaming is there any advantage of the 2011 vs 1155?
Edit:
I have my 3570k at 4.7ghz, the process of getting their was tough. 4.7ghz on my cpu is quite stable but if I could do 4.8ghz that'd be awesome.
40 vs. 16 PCI-E lanes, if that is important to your setup. Otherwise, not really.
That's one thing I will never do... delid. People say that like it's nothing. I have shaky hands and I sweat too much to do that crap.
Yeah I'll be waiting for Broadwell and Maxwell to hit before building my monstrosity.
Thinking about getting a GTX 780m and Haswell based laptop though.
http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-780M.88993.0.html
http://videocardz.com/39987/nvidia-geforce-gtx-770m-and-780m-spotted-monster-gaming-notebooks
Yeah I'll be waiting for Broadwell and Maxwell to hit before building my monstrosity.
Thinking about getting a GTX 780m and Haswell based laptop though.
http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-780M.88993.0.html
http://videocardz.com/39987/nvidia-geforce-gtx-770m-and-780m-spotted-monster-gaming-notebooks
Witchfinder General
punched Wheelchair Mike
In other words my OC'd 3570k at 4.4 should last me a while.
cobragt4001
Banned
Why do a laptop when you can just hook up a desktop and keep upgrading?
Mr. Wonderful
Member
The 128MB of VRAM on the GTe is interesting, but the real serious business would start with Broadwell if they went ~256MB of eRAM + DDR4.
Because I'm in the military and get deployed all over the place. This ASUS saved my ass last deployment whenever I had downtime. It's starting to show its age though.
Isn't it Skylake the first to adopt DDR4?
Pffft. A marine who can't pack a 900D needs to go to the weightroom.
Heh heh heh. 3 Maxwell GPUs are going into that 900D... Maybe CM will have a Cosmos III out by then.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
EDRAM on one of those chips. Very interesting.
cobragt4001
Banned
I'm seeing a lot of folks say the i7-920 (I have a 930) is good enough to stick around for this gen. I agree. But I'm still getting the mega itch and my motherboard's been acting up. Rather than trying to find an affordable mobo for this processor, I'm thinking I'm going to be a gigantic whore and do an entire rebuild.
Since I have 2GBx6 right now, I'll probably be investing in 8GBx2 or 8GBx4 depending on how big of a whore I want to be, and selling off or giving away the 2GB sticks.
I have a GTX 460, TRYING to hold onto that until the GeForce 700 series comes out. Planning on getting a 770 if it's around that $400 price point, or maybe a 670 when it gets cheaper after the 700s bump it down. We shall see...
Since I have 2GBx6 right now, I'll probably be investing in 8GBx2 or 8GBx4 depending on how big of a whore I want to be, and selling off or giving away the 2GB sticks.
I have a GTX 460, TRYING to hold onto that until the GeForce 700 series comes out. Planning on getting a 770 if it's around that $400 price point, or maybe a 670 when it gets cheaper after the 700s bump it down. We shall see...
GHG
Member
This is what I'm waiting for. Until then Intel do not have my attention with these incremental increases of ~15% every 18 months.
cartman414
Member
Might try writing Intel. * shrugs *
Even IB-E only tops off at 6 cores.
Even IB-E only tops off at 6 cores.
cartman414
Member
Wrote Intel and got a stock "we do not comment on unannounced products" response. Guess I couldn't expect anything more.
A for effort though! How many people would actually take the time to do that as opposed to complain on a forum? Respect.
I wonder if the CPU can use that eDRAM when the GPU is going unused or disabled, that would be very interesting. IBMs highest end CPUs (and with a much smaller local one, the Wii U CPU) have eDRAM caches, that would have interesting performance implications
Looks like only quads will get GT3e. Bummer, I was hoping for MBP sized 13 inch laptops with that GPU for decent integrated gaming.
Looks like only quads will get GT3e. Bummer, I was hoping for MBP sized 13 inch laptops with that GPU for decent integrated gaming.
synce
Member
Wait WTF, am I misunderstanding here or are we really getting 3.3GHz quads in ultrabooks??? My current 16-incher tops out at 3.2GHz with quad TB
Edit: Looking a bit closer I see they haven't detailed the CPU's ending with U, which I guess stands for Ultrabook :/
Edit: Looking a bit closer I see they haven't detailed the CPU's ending with U, which I guess stands for Ultrabook :/
Haswell-E might have one at $300 or so.
They don't really need 6 cores though. AMD and Intel have both basically achieved 8 thread CPUs, despite both using 4 cores (4 core pairs in the case of AMD). People who want or need the extra overhead a beefy hex core brings to the table generally need it for enterprise or multimedia creation. A $550 processor isn't really that much more than a $330 processor when you are talking business tools.
They don't really need 6 cores though. AMD and Intel have both basically achieved 8 thread CPUs, despite both using 4 cores (4 core pairs in the case of AMD). People who want or need the extra overhead a beefy hex core brings to the table generally need it for enterprise or multimedia creation. A $550 processor isn't really that much more than a $330 processor when you are talking business tools.
Because it's a useless step. FPS is useful in rendering, how many frames can my rig render in a second. With a game you want a smooth experience and that's why that graph shows what frame time 99% of all frames was rendered in. It's really FPS that's the strange metric.
PCperspective "converted" some graphs over to FPS, but I personally find the graph showing all frame times over the test period much more helpful than a number or a simple graph. Frame time graphs also show big stutters (one frame on screen for 100ms, 0.1second) as the big important thing they are. IMO they just flat out make more sense and give a better view over how the game is displayed.
Notice SLI shows a much better average FPS, but have gigantic stutters the first graph masked.
Ultra low wattage, means the TDP (heat) is 17W. 25-45 is normal for laptops.
What he is saying, and what others have said, is show the exact same data, but instead of ms, show each frame as a FPS number to make it easily recognizable.
When you show the speed of a race car going through a speed trap, you are essentially measuring how quickly the car traveled through a given distance. This is then converted to MPH, despite MPH not being the actual measurement being taken.
evil solrac v3.0
Member
do you have the 900D with you? can you please tell me if there is enough space to do a pull/push configuration with a 280mm Radiator on the top part?
No he doesn't, but the answer to that question will depend on which 280mm rad you are talking about. The final answer will be yes most likely. There is 110mm of clearance, which means a radiator 60mm thick will fit, although probably snugly (25mm per fan).
I bought one two days ago (for my parents's PC). $100.
Bearing in mind just gameplay was shown and the 650 was TDP locked at 35W, no framerates were shown. One could be 50 and one could be 90 for all we know and they would look comparable on 60HZ monitors, but one would have significantly more room to grow.
I wonder how much performance that eDRAM will add, and how much the GT3 alone will gain without it. I was hoping for 13" laptops with GT3e, but that doesn't seem like the plan now.
cartman414
Member
Thanks man.
Considering quad-core (albeit non-hyperthreaded) Atom CPUs aren't too far off, I imagine the same for Ultrabook geared Core ix processors.
Mr. Pointy
Member
I have an old Phenom 2 1090T from 2010. Still trying to decide between waiting for this, Steamroller, or getting an i7-3770K.
What's the expected release date for Haswell?
What's the expected release date for Haswell?
1st Course
Member
Even if the GT3e did outperform the 650 in raw performance I imagine that it would still probably fall behind it when it come to in games performance, Intel drivers are still just very young when compared to AMD/Nvidia drivers.
~Month from now.
Maybe that's just the initial launch?
I was toying with the idea of updating from my MacBook Air 2010 to MacBook Air Q3 2013 but if it's *<HD5xxx then I will wait until 2014 before I upgrade.
PS! Read on Twitter today that Haswell will be the first Intel CPU to include x86 extensions for Hardware Transactional Memory (exciting stuff if you're into multicore programming).
Probably not. The big generational changes in interface systems (SATA 3.0, PCI-E 3.0, USB 3.0) already happened with Ivy.