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[Shiroi-San]

I've been using the lean gains method for about 6 months now, and I lost about 30 pounds of fat while increasing my strength in all my lifts. Even though my progress slowed during the holidays due to a shittier diet, I didn't gain any weight. It's epic!

 

[Troblin]

I just started leangains myself. The fasting isn't an issue at all especially since as a Muslim I fast for a whole month.

Its just getting the right schedule to get good proper workouts.

Have a question though about calorie intake. I weigh 160 and am 5'7. I have seen some minor increases in my strength over the two weeks I have been doing this. How much should my calorie intake be on workout and and off days? As of now I haven't been calculating but rather just watching my carb intake, which was already pretty low, and am being less careful about fat v carbs.

Any suggestions? Thanks!

Calorie intake is directly relative to your LBM and activity levels. You can find a TDEE calculator online which should give you a baseline for caloric intake.

My stats for reference (used the TDEE calculator for a guide, then adjusted it based upon my metabolism):

5'10
158lbs
12% bf
LBM =138lbs
activity level: low - moderate (desk job)

Caloric intake to maintain weight (rest days) ~2400
Caloric intake to maintain weight (workout days) ~ 2800-2900

 

[effzee]

Thanks for the input!

I have never really calculated my calorie intake before so more than the actual fasting I find this difficult. I was already on a high protein low carb diet while lifting 3-4 times a week. Used to eat 4-5 small meals spaced out about 3-4 hours.

Recently due to my work schedule my workout schedule has been a complete mess. Some weeks 4 days some weeks 0. Up and down and no consistency. Still started leangains but I won't be able to truly measure how well it works for me until I get back to a normal work and workout schedule.

 

[Arksy]

My weight loss has somewhat stalled. I was 280lbs down to 240lbs at 25, 6'4 tall. I was going to try ketosis but I think this might be a better fit. I'm sure I can do, but it might be difficult to get used to for the first few weeks.

My first question is to ask what program would people recommend? I'm thinking about either alternative day fasting or condensed eating window fasting. What are people's experiences with either?

 

[jmdajr]

I get massive headaches from not eating.

 

[A Human Becoming]

I've been doing a 16 hour fast for the past week. I've lost a few pound from it. Waiting until 11AM to eat isn't hard, it's going to be hungry that sucks.

 

[entremet]

My weight loss has somewhat stalled. I was 280lbs down to 240lbs at 25, 6'4 tall. I was going to try ketosis but I think this might be a better fit. I'm sure I can do, but it might be difficult to get used to for the first few weeks.

My first question is to ask what program would people recommend? I'm thinking about either alternative day fasting or condensed eating window fasting. What are people's experiences with either?

I've only done Martin's method. 24 day fasts sound crazy to me.

 

[cryptic]

I get massive headaches from not eating.

It passed, at least for me, but I also eat no grains due to a slight intolerance and no PUFAs, just saturated fats from coconut oil/ butter/ beef fat.
Supposedly your body will become better at prolonged fasting when your tissues become more saturated, although purportedly PUFAs take about 4 years to full digest.

EDIT: Also, when I started going past the 16/18 hr. fasting period I began to encounter mental health issues and of course, less energy.

 

[jmdajr]

I prefer to just eat smaller meals more often.

And keep hydrated of course.

 

[Arksy]

I've only done Martin's method. 24 day fasts sound crazy to me.

I might try going 24 hours with zero food tomorrow. See how I feel. Coffee and tea don't break the fast do they?

 

[Skellig Gra]

I might try going 24 hours with zero food tomorrow. See how I feel. Coffee and tea don't break the fast do they?

Seems like they would. I could be wrong though.

 

[fredrancour]

I might try going 24 hours with zero food tomorrow. See how I feel. Coffee and tea don't break the fast do they?

Not if you drink the tea unsweetened/without milk. Coffee is pretty much black by definition so that's fine. If you're insane enough to take it with milk and sugar then breaking the fast is the least of your worries.

 

[entremet]

I might try going 24 hours with zero food tomorrow. See how I feel. Coffee and tea don't break the fast do they?

Just don't add milk/cream or sugar/honey. Non caloric sweeteners are fine.

 

[Arksy]

Not if you drink the tea unsweetened/without milk. Coffee is pretty much black by definition so that's fine. If you're insane enough to take it with milk and sugar then breaking the fast is the least of your worries.

Espresso shot or bust. Yeah I like my tea and coffee unsweetened and black. I've sworn off most forms of sugar. I've never actually fasted before. This should be an interesting experience. I'll report in when it's done.

 

[Interfectum]

I might try going 24 hours with zero food tomorrow. See how I feel. Coffee and tea don't break the fast do they?

Not really but one of the presumed benefits of fasting is the fact that your digestive system gets to rest during that time. So when you drink something with taste that could keep system slightly activated due to the anticipation of food. This could all be snake oil talk but it's just something I read.

Most of the time I drink tea during my fast (nothing added).

 

[snoopen]

Just don't add milk/cream or sugar/honey. Non caloric sweeteners are fine.

You can add a dash of milk, small amount of sugars or a normal amount of sweeteners.. it doesn't do much at all.

 

[TurbulentTurtle]

I never used to drink coffee but ever since I started IF/LG I've been getting a cup every week or two.
I could get used to it. No milk or sugar, of course.

 

[snoopen]

i have an espresso every morning and black tea normally twice before i break my fast at 2pm.. have lunch, a banana, gym around 6 and have a huge dinner with milk afterwards.

gum is really good, when i get busy at work i sometimes get close to forgetting to eat anyway.

 

[kurtrussell]

Wow, this really true?

The bit about toxins is by and large, bollocks, there's no scientific evidence of it, and it's more the kind of thing spouted by aging hippies.

HOWEVER, there is a lot of research backing up many other positive aspects of calorie restriction. Studies have found that it plays a role in the delay of onset dementia and alzheimers and it also reduces production of a growth chemical, IGF-1, which has been identified as a cause of some cancers.

This is perhaps the best book for beginners on all of the health benefits of fasting (not just weight loss) -> http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1780721676/ - the majority of the book is talking about the science behind it, but the last quarter gives an example 5:2 fasting pattern and recipes.

 

[Naked Snake]

Espresso shot or bust. Yeah I like my tea and coffee unsweetened and black. I've sworn off most forms of sugar. I've never actually fasted before. This should be an interesting experience. I'll report in when it's done.

Do NOT fast for 24 hours if you've never fasted before. Do it gradually and ease yourself into it. I can't remember where but I read a detailed article on a respectable blog on how extreme fasting can be dangerous if your body is not ready for it.

I've done it when I was new to eating paleo and just learned about the benefits of IF... I felt fine, but in retrospect I think it could have been a trigger/cause for some health issues I developed around that time, which I still suffer from to this day.

 

[Jak140]

I've unintentionally done sporadic intermittent fasting for years because I almost never eat breakfast and sometimes skip meals because I'm not hungry and forget to eat. I've gone whole days without eating and without realizing it until the next day. On the other hand I can go to a buffet and eat tons. Maybe this is why I've never been able to gain any weight?

 

[snoopen]

I've unintentionally done sporadic intermittent fasting for years because I almost never eat breakfast and sometimes skip meals because I'm not hungry and forget to eat. I've gone whole days without eating and without realizing it until the next day. On the other hand I can go to a buffet and eat tons. Maybe this is why I've never been able to gain any weight?

no, that reason is likely because you are skinny, don't have a lot of muscle to feed / grow and don't eat much in the first place, ie large amounts of food isn't required..
intermittent fasting is more than just skipping breakfast.

 

[Caramello]

So my routine is basically

12PM - Workout
1PM - Break fast with largest meal of the day
4PM - Small meal
8PM - Small meal (final meal)

Tomorrow though I have to work out at 8AM because I'm going out at 10AM.

Should I eat straight after the workout or wait until 1? I'm doing a body recomp so eating is kind of an important deal here.

Any advice would be much appreciated

 

[kurtrussell]

no, that reason is likely because you are skinny, don't have a lot of muscle to feed / grow and don't eat much in the first place, ie large amounts of food isn't required..
intermittent fasting is more than just skipping breakfast.

In theory, there is a chance that his behaviour may have contributed slightly to it.

One of the lab tests they did around fasting was to give mice a very high fat diet, but only allow one group access to it for 8 out of every 24 hours. The group with restricted access ate exactly the same amount of food, but gained 29% less fat and were healthier than the unrestricted access mice.

Therefore, it is possible that if by skipping breakfast, he ate both his meals within an 8 hour spell that this did indeed have some contribution to his weight, but this would involve him not consuming any carbs or protein (including milk etc) outside of the 8 hour window.

 

[Arksy]

Yeah that didn't end well. Here's a report.

I had a fairly large meal, three small roast potatoes, 1/4 chicken and two sausages at around 4pm on the 9th. I didn't really eat except for a small bit of salad at around midnight. Decided to fast.

I lasted until around 4pm on the 10th when a few friends and I went for basically afternoon drinks and then dinner. I had a noodle soup at an asian bistro. Hot and sour, dumpling soup. Later that night I had a donor kebab, two servings of sushi and about a litre of coke zero and a serving of chocolate. I managed to stay away from alcohol at least.

It's still under my normal daily intake of 2k cal but I felt really hungry for most of the day. I think it's because I didn't properly prepare well. I'm going to try again. It's now about 10pm on the 10th and I finished eating at 9pm. I'm going to try to last until at least 3pm tomorrow evening, giving me an 18 hour fast. If I still feel OK I might try to extend it to 6pm.

The social situation really killed it for me.

 

[Jak140]

In theory, there is a chance that his behaviour may have contributed slightly to it.

One of the lab tests they did around fasting was to give mice a very high fat diet, but only allow one group access to it for 8 out of every 24 hours. The group with restricted access ate exactly the same amount of food, but gained 29% less fat and were healthier than the unrestricted access mice.

Therefore, it is possible that if by skipping breakfast, he ate both his meals within an 8 hour spell that this did indeed have some contribution to his weight, but this would involve him not consuming any carbs or protein (including milk etc) outside of the 8 hour window.

You've pretty much described my eating schedule for the last twelve years. No food until afternoon, not even snacks or drinks other than water and maybe high pulp orange juice occasionally (I hardly ever drink milk, only like once or twice every few months at most) and dinner between six and seven.

 

[snoopen]

I always drink milk right before my eating period ends.. tends to keep me feeling full for a long time.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

girlfriend is looking at doing a juice fast. I'm keen to try just for the 'I tried it' experience after I finish insanity workout, however, I've heard it's basically a 'give yourself the runs and shit your way to weightloss'

doesn't sound too appealing.

 

[despire]

girlfriend is looking at doing a juice fast. I'm keen to try just for the 'I tried it' experience after I finish insanity workout, however, I've heard it's basically a 'give yourself the runs and shit your way to weightloss'

doesn't sound too appealing.

Juice fast? Doesn't sound like a great idea..

 

[snoopen]

girlfriend is looking at doing a juice fast. I'm keen to try just for the 'I tried it' experience after I finish insanity workout, however, I've heard it's basically a 'give yourself the runs and shit your way to weightloss'

doesn't sound too appealing.

where does the protein come from?

 

[Sullen]

Forgive my ignorance: wouldn't fasting like this cause your body to believe it is being starved and therefore begin storing fat?

 

[Az987]

How come every damn time I see this thread I read it as Intermittent Fisting and think to myself "That doesn't sound very fun."

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

Hmm, so how would I do this if I wanted to? I work out every day around 5:15 pm. I do P90X and Insanity, would it be detrimental to do a fasting schedule on that kind of high intensity workout?

What do you eat after the fast? Right now I'm doing low carb + Insanity.

 

[A Human Becoming]

I started having diarrhea after more than a week of not eating between 7PM to 11AM. My diet hasn't changed besides actually limiting my calories. Is this a common result? It could be medication I'm taking however as it has caused it in the past.

 

[Kraftwerk]

Forgive my ignorance: wouldn't fasting like this cause your body to believe it is being starved and therefore begin storing fat?

The body doesn't even begin to go into starvation mode until 60 hours or so. We are not as weak as some believe.

Of Course everyone is different, and you should give this a try before you consider doing it for a X amount of time.

That number is based on a study of a few people.

Study

 

[entremet]

Hmm, so how would I do this if I wanted to? I work out every day around 5:15 pm. I do P90X and Insanity, would it be detrimental to do a fasting schedule on that kind of high intensity workout?

What do you eat after the fast? Right now I'm doing low carb + Insanity.

I would not do low carb on something like Insanity and fast. You will crash and crash hard. At least eat some healthy carbs post workout for glycogen restoration.

Fast in the morning till lunch. Eat a moderate lunch.

Eat another meal at around 3 or 4 PM. Both of the meals should not be big but hit around 50 percent of calories total

Do Insanity at 5:15PM, eat a huge post workout meal at around 50 percent of total calories. Eat carbs at this time. Good ones--potatoes, rice, sweet potatoes. No crap like sandwich bread or fries.

You can go low carb on non workout days.

Look at the Leangains guide for more info:

http://www.leangains.com/2010/04/leangains-guide.html

 

[Arksy]

Ok so I've hit about 18 hours and I'm feeling pretty good. I think it was far more important to eat at 9pm the previous night. It's about 3pm now on the 11th. I've had half a bottle of water and a espresso shot. Not feeling to bad. I think I could extend it until 21 hours or later.

Do NOT fast for 24 hours if you've never fasted before. Do it gradually and ease yourself into it. I can't remember where but I read a detailed article on a respectable blog on how extreme fasting can be dangerous if your body is not ready for it.

I've done it when I was new to eating paleo and just learned about the benefits of IF... I felt fine, but in retrospect I think it could have been a trigger/cause for some health issues I developed around that time, which I still suffer from to this day.

What kind of health problems? Humans should be able to fast on food for 24 hours without too much risk. It sounds odd.

 

[Chittagong]

My first 24h ever is really pretty easy, done soon, I even went lifting and had tons of energy. Only was a cranky little bitch once mid day but a black coffee took off the edge. I think it was just a first timer thing. The weirdest thing is how conditioned I am to contextual food, feels a bit emotionally empty not eating then I usually have.

I could easily continue until tomorrow but I think it's better to stick to 24h and enjoy life a little, that's the only way to make this a lifestyle not a diet. The idea is to do something like 8pm to 8pm right, not to skip an entire day?

 

[Mayyhem]

I get massive headaches from not eating.

The first week was tough, I experienced this as well. Since then though, body has adapted. I'm the leanest and most energetic I've ever been. I've also been making great muscle gains at the gym.

Stick to it man, gets better I promise.

 

[Cubsfan23]

I've read that short-term fasting makes Natural HGH levels spike, which slows down aging. Explains the higher life expectancy.

 

[Chittagong]

Third week of 5/7 IF, easiest yet by far.

- no headache
- no crankiness
- no loss of power
- almost no stomach rumble

I'm already at 25h, should have a small soup based dinner today and maybe a fruit but for the first time I don't feel the urge to dash to the fridge the moment I hit 24h. Made it through the day with a single Americano and San Pellegrino water

 

[FinKL]

I'm hitting the gym again and have a basic understanding of Martin's Leangains method but I'm confused about the preworkout meal.

As I recall, he mentions that it would be "harmful" to work out on an empty stomach and recommends a preworkout meal.

Technically, training is not completely fasted - that would be detrimental.

On his website he mentions taking BCAA preworkout. Is the BCAA's the same as a preworkout meal? Or are we talking carb/protein meal. The reason why I think he recommends these are because they are proteins your body will need during working out. You aren't really breaking the fast because they are pretty much 0 calorie so that's why these are recommended?

 

[TurbulentTurtle]

I'm hitting the gym again and have a basic understanding of Martin's Leangains method but I'm confused about the preworkout meal.

As I recall, he mentions that it would be "harmful" to work out on an empty stomach and recommends a preworkout meal.


On his website he mentions taking BCAA preworkout. Is the BCAA's the same as a preworkout meal? Or are we talking carb/protein meal. The reason why I think he recommends these are because they are proteins your body will need during working out. You aren't really breaking the fast because they are pretty much 0 calorie so that's why these are recommended?

My understanding of it is that it helps give you some boosted energy during a fasted training session, because otherwise you would feel weak as hell.
I take BCAAs before my fasted workouts and I always seem to be more focused, though that just might be a placebo effect.

 

[Caramello]

I actually find that I perform better working out completely fasted. It's going to be an individual thing but for me breaking my fast generally makes me a little sleepy and sluggish for a while so it's not ideal for me to break my fast before a workout.

 

[TurbulentTurtle]

I actually find that I perform better working out completely fasted. It's going to be an individual thing but for me breaking my fast generally makes me a little sleepy and sluggish for a while so it's not ideal for me to break my fast before a workout.

I've read experiences of people from both sides of the camp, where some can just concentrate way better on lifting without having eaten anything in the past 15+ hours, and others who need to eat something to get a little boost.
Either way is fine, as long as you're eating within your eating window and getting most of your calories/carbs in post workout.

 

[FinKL]

Awesome, thanks for the info guys.

I also agree that breaking the fast kinda slows me down a bit.

 

[Bulbo Urethral Baggins]

I've been doing this for over 20 years and had no idea that what I was doing was fasting

 

[Foxy Fox 39]

I feel malnourished but if you guys say it will extend my life....

 

[Rookje]

Anyone have the original Leangains diet? I have the workout, FAQ etc. but not the exact diet suggestion.

 

[Dereck]

I've been doing this for over 20 years and had no idea that what I was doing was fasting

What kind of affect has that had on you?