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[ShinNL]

Ah, this must the reason why I like Golden Sun 1 a lot more than Golden Sun 2.

Or that I think FFX was weirder than FFVII (just felt strange when playing it).

Or how I can never get into Baten Kaitos (I & II)

And love the same games (that I have) as the opening post.

I see... I see.

Maybe the same reason why fighting games are the most fun to play. Maximum control, very very functional character, and absolutely no story or personality that I have to worry about.

 

[Pureauthor]

Ah, this must the reason why I like Golden Sun 1 a lot more than Golden Sun 2.

Unh? Both games had characters with largely the same amount of motivation (next to none), largely the same amount of dialogue (way too much), and roughly the same amount of issues. (No parents, no home, etc).

I liked GS1's 'we don't have a snowball's chance in Hell' vibe that was missing in GS2, but I really don't see how characterization plays a big part.

 

[Rlan]

The severe lack of character is what really killed SSX: On Tour. In SSX 3's Big Radio you'd hear about some rivalries between characters, and have your own character yell out phrases when doing tricks. On Tour had you create your own up-and-coming racer, which just made it pretty boring.

 

[ElectricBlue187]

I really hate this thread for some reason

 

[DarknessTear]

Can anyone picture Earthbound without characters?

 

[djtiesto]

Fun and interesting characters can definitely elevate a game above mediocrity, and at the same time, painfully bad characters can dock a game a point or two for me. Tidus is the perfect example of the latter...

 

[elostyle]

The whole goal has always been to provide a more realistic environment and flesh out the characters so that a real story can be told. Gaming is still an entertainment medium. I don't want to read a book where the main character is just a blank nobody.

This is not really true, the kind of game most of what we play on next gen machines came from has always been about letting you do and experience things you can't in real life. To an extend, characters work against that as it detaches yourself as the player from what is going on. The whole role playing aspect. Of course, not many designers are capable of creating compelling 'experience frameworks' with blank lead characters. So now we have this whole story bound kind of gaming that focus on strongly defined protagonists (Kratos says hi).

I can personally go either way.

 

[madara]

What was that chick's name in Grandia 3? Alphina? Those extremely whiny over cliched rpg ones I want to punch in the face, otherwise no I like my characters.

 

[AAK]

Can anyone picture Earthbound without characters?

Try MGS.

 

[thetrin]

I can't recall ever being duped concerning gender.

Well, except for Leo. Leo is a complete mystery. >_<

Wtf?! How could you possibly think Leo is a chick?!

 

[AAK]

Her voice and pose.

 

[Dina]

I can't recall ever being duped concerning gender.

Bridget says hi.

 

[disappeared]

How can you dislike a game that features characters? Boy, you're going to hate films and novels.

How else can stories be told if there aren't other beings present to propel them forward?

 

[Blackace]

Bizarre. That`s never happened to me (outside of Magna Carta, of course :lol)

but it sounds like it has happened to you in real life...

 

[Defuser]

I find Final Fantasy games turn me off alot. Its like "Holy crap. Shes hot! Best female character design ever!!" Then she talks and she is a he.

I think you better see a eye docter,if you can't tell the difference..of course Magna carta is a exception to it.

 

[Bad_Boy]

while we are at it, lets take characters out of movies too. :/

 

[Pureauthor]

Bridget says hi.

Uh, no, not really.

Then again, I sorta cheated, since I stumbled upon Bridget's profile on the net prior to ever having played a Guilty Gear game.

Wtf?! How could you possibly think Leo is a chick?!

In favour of male:

The name.

Is a Fighting-Game character without a large chest.

In favour of female:

Her appearance, stance, looks, the works.

 

[Defuser]

while we are at it, lets take characters out of movies too. :/

 

[agent069]

You, guy, should play MGS!

What's worst is that we're dead serious here, while MGS are heavily criticized for their high amount of cinematics (like 15 minutes of cutscene/codec then 5 minutes of gameplay), but the fact is there's no script, no shitty cinematics in the middle of the gameplay, you can mess with the AI, and thanks to some clever/open level design, you can play them dozens of time everytime doing different things.

I wish developers would stop putting scripts and in game cinematics everywhere, they're great on the first playtrough but damn, this leads to shallow game where you never die (since dying is even more painful when the game linear scripted and unchallenging), we want games not movies

 

[dog$]

I'm mostly indifferent to characters in videogames. I appreciate good character design and I don't ask for much for me to find a character likeable. However, I can't say it particuarly bothers me if so&so isn't in a game, characters are never a game's selling point for me, and it doesn't take much for me to dislike a character as well. Speaking of which:

On a related topic, I hate games that have "mascot" characters.

This I can mostly agree with.

I tried to play Devil May Cry 3 and after about 10 minutes I couldn't take it anymore because I got so disgusted by Capcom trying to cram Dante's "coolness" down my throat. I think part of the reason why I never care about playing a Metal Gear Solid game is because I really don't give a shit about Solid Snake or the rest of the people. They don't offend me but I don't see why I should spend my time playing the game just for the sake of interaction with these people. I'm baffled as to why Sonic still enjoys popularity today; it's been, what, 10 years since there's been a Sonic game that most people consider to be good? 15? Yet there's still more Sonic games today. I don't get it.

I think you better see a eye docter

i think you should see a brian doctro

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

I can never relate to female characters in games. Thus I rarely play as them..................unless they are funny as heck, like in Disgaea.

 

[Tarazet]

We're talking about games here.. not movies. Sure, he could go and buy an Atari 2600 and knock himself out, but he shouldn't have to.

XBLA is one idea.

 

[DDayton]

The whole goal has always been to provide a more realistic environment and flesh out the characters so that a real story can be told. Gaming is still an entertainment medium. I don't want to read a book where the main character is just a blank nobody.

Where would gaming be if we didn't take advantage of character development?

Arrrgh... the goal has not been to "flesh out characters" to "tell a story", at least not universally. These are video games we are talking about, and games are not restricted to being story telling devices. There are many forms of entertainment, and just a few deal with telling stories... gambling, games, toys, and sports do not require stories to be entertaining.

How can you dislike a game that features characters? Boy, you're going to hate films and novels.
How else can stories be told if there aren't other beings present to propel them forward?

Video games are fundamentally different from movies and books, and do not have to use the same elements. Stories are certainly not required for good games (see Tetris, possibly the greatest game of all time), although there is certainly room for games with stories and character development.

Story-driven games are one kind of game, but they are not the sum total of gaming. I'd argue they aren't even the best form of gaming, but that is probably straying a bit far into personal taste.

 

[Tellaerin]

Re the OP:

In a word, no. In fact, I feel completely the opposite.

If anything, I'd like to see more character-driven titles.

Fun and interesting characters can definitely elevate a game above mediocrity, and at the same time, painfully bad characters can dock a game a point or two for me. Tidus is the perfect example of the former...

Fixed to reflect my opinion.

(EDIT: That's not entirely accurate. I actually liked the mechanics of FF X quite a bit; I wouldn't call it mediocre. But the characters and their interactions with one another - particularly Tidus - helped push the game to the top of the list of my favorite FF's.)

 

[Feindflug]

Not enough: he had too much style in the way he moved and got on his horse. It's still a good game, but I'm sick of the avatars in the game being characters, with a style, with looks, with faces, with clothes. I just want blanks. Who gave a shit about Mario in Donkey Kong arcade? Now he has a voice and catch-phrases and shit. Oh, man -- too much.

 

[EphemeralDream]

Hmm I guess I should pick up this "How to Design Video Games" book that people are referencing here. Just like any other medium, there isn't one proper way to do something. If the game designer wants to focus on characters, let them, but if they want to have a story where the lead character is the player, that's fine also. Depending on the use, both can enhance the experience. It's a bad example but in Tony Hawk's Underground it feel pretty cool to design and then play as myself. I was disappointed to hear that the customization was toned down in Project 8. At the same time I like games where the characters are very developed and just because their personality is defined doesn't mean the player can't relate to them. I think with many people who are casual fighting game fans, they choose characters whose personality they like and work on getting better with them. Basically all the characters I like to play with in Soul Calibur are ones who I like the design of also.

Are there games where the personality is too forced? Definitely. Most people would say that the story work in 3D Sonics has gone way too far. For a personal example, I myself was very annoyed with the characterization of Zero in the latter half of the X games and preferred his MM Zero characterization much more. Proper characterization can really enhance the experience though IMO and I encourage any efforts to do so in video games.

 

[Jasoco]

You can blame Pac-Man for this. Get over it.

Don't want a game with characters, don't buy a game with characters.

 

[MoxManiac]

I thought it was three guys and one girl.

3 of them look like girls though.

 

[MoxManiac]

How can you dislike a game that features characters? Boy, you're going to hate films and novels.

How else can stories be told if there aren't other beings present to propel them forward?

I think the point he's making is that games should stop trying so hard to tell a story and concentrate on fun gameplay. I don't disagree.

 

[Adagio]

Not enough: he had too much style in the way he moved and got on his horse.

...



:lol

 

[Tellaerin]

I think the point he's making is that games should stop trying so hard to tell a story and concentrate on fun gameplay. I don't disagree.

I think he's going way too far in the opposite direction, though. It sounds like he wants all games to be like Tempest 2000 or Geometry Wars - reflex challenges with abstract visuals and nothing resembling characters or personalities. Sure, those types of experiences can be enjoyable in their own right, but I'd hate to see the industry ever collectively move in that direction - as far as I'm concerned, moving away from characterization and storytelling in games couldn't be considered anything but devolution.

 

[Open Source]

Video games are part interactive entertainment (game mechanics, overcoming challenges) and part passive entertainment (story, presentation). Sounds like the OP prefers his games to be heavy on the interactive side and light on the passive side.

For me, the worst games are the ones where you spend a lot of time in the passive stuff (JRPGs -- buttoning through poorly written/translated dialog) even though it's tedious and doesn't add much to the game. In other words, if you're going to make the player spend a lot of time doing something, make that part of the game good. I can enjoy games that are heavy on passive entertainment, although I certainly wouldn't give up my twitch games.

I don't mind all the characters having personalities and whatever as long as they fit in with the rest of the presentation; i.e., if the story's flat and poorly told, then interesting characters that are part of that story are worthless to me.

 

[Oblivion]

Nintendo is on the border of destroying Link (he is already 'iconic' in the 3d games. Thankfully, he doesn't talk...).

I disagree. Aside from some really *ahem* questionable design decisions in the past, I think Nintendo's done a good job of having him remain similar to what he was originally.

Mario on the other hand, I'll agree with you.

 

[Virgin Wii]

I can honestly say I have yet to meet someone in Japan I thought was a woman (even the new-halves) that was a man..

How would you know? Do you crotch-check everybody you walk by?

 

[Firestorm]

I can't recall ever being duped concerning gender.

Well, except for Leo. Leo is a complete mystery. >_<

You should play Tales of the Abyss. Ion... They tell me his gender and I still didn't believe them until some time later =/ Thought it was a running joke or something.