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Jaffe:"Is this biased journalism? Or is it just me?"

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DanteFox said:
You guys are missing something fundamental and rather rudimentary: Like Mewthree said, Just because something is true, does not make it unbiased.Which is exactly what Jaffe was irked by.

He was irked by the fact that it was "biased" towards sony. I don't see him getting indignant over an interviewer sending him questions lauding how great God of War was, or how great another Twisted Metal would be.

At the end of the day it's not about perceived journalistic bias, it's all about journalistic bias towards an opinion in which we disagree with.
 
DanteFox said:
You guys are missing something fundamental and rather rudimentary: Like Mewthree said, Just because something is true, does not make it unbiased.Which is exactly what Jaffe was irked by. You may agree with every single assumed statement in the interview questions, but they do not present each side of the argument.
Here's an easy example of true, but still biased:

Let's say someone is accused of a crime (murder, rape, etc.), and the news runs a story on it. in the story, they interview the family/friends of the alleged victim, and proceed to fill the story with quotes from the victim's family/friends, but fail see what the accused person has to say about it, or print his side of the story. Even if everything in their article is grounded in truth as far as the quotes, etc. are concerned, it's still biased because it only presents one side of the story.

The same is true here. People are saying "ZOMG JAFFE IS TEH BIAS CUZ HE WANTS THE ARTICLE TO TALK ABOUT THE POSITIVES OF THE PS3 AND NEGATIVES OF XBAWKS" but Jaffe just wants to see a bit of journalistic neutrality/ fairness in the questions.

That is all.
Ummm,

YOU'VE NEVER SEEN THE FUCKING ARTICLE HE WAS GOING TO WRITE

HE WAS ASKING FOR THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STORY TO PRESENT

CAPITAL LETTERS!!!
 
Orlics said:
Peter Moore didn't complain when EGM did it to him, and we got a fucking kickass interview as a result.

That said those questions could have been phrased better, I agree. Who knows though. I'm interested as to what the article will turn out to be like.
Yeah, but Peter Moore agreed to that interview, right? Just as Peter Moore (or whoever agreed for him to do the interview) agreed to that interview, Jaffe had the right to choose not to answer the questions, especially considering it's not his job to do so/ it wasn't his place to do so.
 
Trailblazer said:
DUDE just stop it all ready!!

Your trying too hard to inject logic and reason in this cluster fuck of " Durr PS3 and Sony sucks" Thread.
You're right, this thread was gone before page 10. *Bows out of console war cafeteria food fight thread #294847*
 
Orlics said:
That said those questions could have been phrased better, I agree. Who knows though. I'm interested as to what the article will turn out to be like.
judging by the questions, i'd assume the article is going to be like every other article talking about the shortcomings of PS3. it's not like any of the questions broke new ground.
 
TheFallen said:
Was he expecting the journalist to ask, "How awesome is Sony's PS3?"

Probably not. Let me break down my complaints.

In hindsight, noting the PS3's lukewarm reception and relatively high cost, a lot of people wonder what Sony was thinking when developing the PS3. So... what were they thinking?
Here, he's basically states people don't like it and wants to know what Sony expected before launch. Fine. Summary: "Why release a PS3 at $600?"

It's been said that Ken Kutaragi and Howard Stinger dictated what technology the PS3 should include instead of doing proper research to what the consumer wanted while paying little mind to price. As a development partner, did you feel that was the case? Why/why not?
This question SOUNDS innocent, but pay attention to certain words. The basic question is "Did Sony choose to listen to developers over consumers?" But he goes an extra step by using words like "dictated" and "proper research" which just stresses how the interviewer already feels. 2nd question in and the bias is showing.

It seems that releasing a feature-rich console for $600, now $400, was a crippling move for Sony, especially given the recent economic downturn. Would you agree? Why/why not?
He's repeating the same question as the first, just rephrasing it and adding a LOLconomy punch to it.

Did you ever perceive low morale within the company once the $600 price was announced in 2006? Can you elaborate?
Low morale? Repeating the launch price again? How the hell do you ask that? And 'Can you elaborate?' Come on, that's on par with the 'How long did you know you were gay?' joke kids do. There's no need to restate it, especially when it's the SAME QUESTION as 1 and 3, which is "Why release a console at that price?"

Consumers appear indifferent to Blu-ray technology. Do you feel Sony overvalued Blu-ray, after DVD helped the PS2 become such a huge success?
Blu-Ray sales have actually exceeded expectations, but I can see how people can assume otherwise. Overall this question is fine.

It seems the PS3 has been cobbled together since its release: feature-cutting to help cut costs, patched with controller rumble, patched with Home, patched with trophy achievements -- like the console never had a specific plan. During your tenure, did you feel the powers that be at Sony had a grip on what exactly would make the PS3 a success? Why/why not?
Give me a fucking break. 'Cobbled together?' This is basically spin, trying to turn any positive developments made into a negative. Like how the 360 added HDMI, made wireless controllers standard, the NXE, Xbox Originals, and you know, any feature added in the last 3 years. Ignore the question. It's just repeating the same shit as 1,3,4, asking what Sony thought before launch. (Except this time, trolling right before it instead of mentioning price)

What has been your biggest concern as a PS3 developer?
Legit question, but there's an EASY opposite to this. Unfortunately our little interviewer never cares to ask.

Was the Wall Street Journal right: has hope faded for PS3 as the "comeback player"?
Fine question on its own, but to end the interview on this is tactless. Not surprising, given the tone, but it's a question no one wants to answer. You just end up making David confused. What is he supposed to respond with? There's still hope? The most likely response will be to sidestep it and say he'll keep making the best games he possibly can.

On that note, I don't believe MSNBC is completely biased towards Microsoft. This one guy? Sure, but the company as whole? Not really.
 
Branduil said:
bf2v4o.jpg

"Everything is going as planned. Do not listen to the lies of the MSNBC devil dogs, for they serve the great satan."

cut his mic!!! cut his mic now!! :D

that gif is win. glad it's not ken. (or could we get a second version?)
 
DanteFox said:
Yeah, but Peter Moore agreed to that interview, right? Just as Peter Moore (or whoever agreed for him to do the interview) agreed to that interview, Jaffe had the right to choose not to answer the questions, especially considering it's not his job to do so/ it wasn't his place to do so.
Yes, alright. So Jaffe should say "I'd rather not participate in your piece," instead of running to the internet and blowing things out of proportion, as he is wont to do.

If Jaffe really wanted to cut the interviewer "down to size" or something, he would have replied and defended his beloved console. Are the questions loaded? Yes, some of them. Does that mean there is no way to present the PS3 in a positive light in your potential answers? Hell no.
 
DanteFox said:
You guys are missing something fundamental and rather rudimentary: Like Mewthree said, Just because something is true, does not make it unbiased.Which is exactly what Jaffe was irked by. You may agree with every single assumed statement in the interview questions, but they do not present each side of the argument.

I believe you are missing something fundamental about the journalist's email. That wasn't his article. Sure, he spent little time getting to the questions about the negative history, but the end result is not presented to Jaffe here. He may already have collected his research about the positives, may not be interested in a puff piece or focusing on what Sony has been doing right. These are things neither Jaffe or GAF know. The article could contain dozens of paragraphs talking about Sony's turnaround since the launch, you never know.
 
:lol :lol

Wow.

Well, at least I understand why some of GAF's well known...umm, eccentric personalities worship this dude.
 
TheFallen said:
I believe you are missing something fundamental about the journalist's email. That wasn't his article. Sure, he spent little time getting to the questions about the negative history, but the end result is not presented to Jaffe here. He may already have collected his research about the positives, may not be interested in a puff piece or focusing on what Sony has been doing right. These are things neither Jaffe or GAF know. The article could contain dozens of paragraphs talking about Sony's turnaround since the launch, you never know.
:lol Yeah right. You honestly think that?
 
This "is it biased" stuff is basically fox news' "fair and balanced" remixed. Several have admitted that in referring to the questions, whether there inference is true or not, they're still biased.

.. so basically, questions should not be biased to the TRUTH. Lovely.
 
TheFallen said:
I believe you are missing something fundamental about the journalist's email. That wasn't his article. Sure, he spent little time getting to the questions about the negative history, but the end result is not presented to Jaffe here. He may already have collected his research about the positives, may not be interested in a puff piece or focusing on what Sony has been doing right. These are things neither Jaffe or GAF know. The article could contain dozens of paragraphs talking about Sony's turnaround since the launch, you never know.
Which is why, considering the journalist's employer, Jaffe decided to play it safe and not answer the obviously slanted questions in the first place. Sure, the journalist could have been gathering one side of the story while interviewing someone else on what sony did right, MS did wrong, etc. but do you really think that's what was going to happen? Really?

Better to play it safe IMO.
 
DanteFox said:
You're right, this thread was gone before page 10. *Bows out of console war cafeteria food fight thread #294847*

I'm not in here from a console-war perspective at all, I'm here in a 'Jaffe handled this entirely the wrong way' perspective.
So you got some questions that offended your inner fanboy. Who gives a shit? Don't answer them, or actually give him back an intellegent answer.

If you are then taken out of context or feel you weren't fairly quoted, you then have every right to complain. And when you do I'm sure you'll find people's opinions on the subject would be very different.
 
JordoftheDead said:
I'm not in here from a console-war perspective at all, I'm here in a 'Jaffe handled this entirely the wrong way' perspective.
So you got some questions that offended your inner fanboy. Who gives a shit? Don't answer them, or actually give him back an intellegent answer.

If you are then taken out of context or feel you weren't fairly quoted, you then have every right to complain. And when you do I'm sure you'll find people's opinions on the subject would be very different.

I can understand that. The list-wars things is a little old and doesn't help his case. But I'm just trying to explain the questions themselves are both biased and unprofessional. I'm not commenting on whether the PS3 is a success or whether the things the guy asked are true or not.

TheFallen said:
When did the questions sent to Jaffe for this man's research become the article itself? It's not an interview. It's an article.
And if someone emailed you, said they were writing an article on Batman and did nothing but ask you questions about how Bob Kane sucks and the like, you wouldn't question his motives?
 
JordoftheDead said:
If you are then taken out of context or feel you weren't fairly quoted, you then have every right to complain. And when you do I'm sure you'll find people's opinions on the subject would be very different.
He didn't want to give him that chance. Why wait until he is taken out of context? why not just refuse to give them their little quotes that they can easily use in whatever context they wish? The second option makes more sense. Give the interviews to the people who earn/deserve them.
 
JordoftheDead said:
I'm not in here from a console-war perspective at all, I'm here in a 'Jaffe handled this entirely the wrong way' perspective.
So you got some questions that offended your inner fanboy. Who gives a shit? Don't answer them, or actually give him back an intellegent answer.

If you are then taken out of context or feel you weren't fairly quoted, you then have every right to complain. And when you do I'm sure you'll find people's opinions on the subject would be very different.

Dude- my shit gets taken out of context so fucking often that I felt- for once- I would cut this shit off at the pass.
 
davidjaffe said:
Dude- my shit gets taken out of context so fucking often that I felt- for once- I would cut this shit off at the pass.


Well atleast there's devs like you pointing it out. We were getting tired of the gaming "journalism" lately, and people just brushing our indications aside, as some sort of failed conspiracy theory.
 
dfyb said:
dude, this is NeoGAF.

a- fucking love your gif.
b- I don't mean here. I mean from journalist that take things I say, remove words, turn them into headlines on their sites and shit. Fuck that. Sick of it.
 
davidjaffe said:
Dude- my shit gets taken out of context so fucking often that I felt- for once- I would cut this shit off at the pass.

i felt the same way about "talking" to my girlfriend about stuff that bothered me. she had no idea how to "talk" out problems. i was dumped a few weeks ago.

bitterness aside, i totally see where you're coming from, but everyone seems to be taking this whole thing as you knowing exactly what's up and trying to make a point, and everyone trying to counter that point, when all you were doing was just posting the email and saying that you were a little disturbed by it.

i would have been too. there's my vote. "mark it" or whatever. sorry i don't have a fancy gif for you.
 
pakkit said:
Yes, alright. So Jaffe should say "I'd rather not participate in your piece," instead of running to the internet and blowing things out of proportion, as he is wont to do.

If Jaffe really wanted to cut the interviewer "down to size" or something, he would have replied and defended his beloved console. Are the questions loaded? Yes, some of them. Does that mean there is no way to present the PS3 in a positive light in your potential answers? Hell no.

Judging by the tone of those questions, the interviewer would have then framed those replies to play up the defensive element, casting Jaffe as a developer in denial blustering in defense of a doomed console. As our good friend Admiral Ackbar likes to say, 'It's a trap'. And sometimes the only way to win is not to play. Jaffe did the right thing.

pakkit said:
I don't think you know how journalism works.

He understands it better than you do, that's for damn sure.
 
Hey David, I have a real question for you.

WHY UTAH? I mean, I have relatives in Salt Lake City and I've visited there a handful of times, but why leave LA?
 
M3wThr33 said:
Hey David, I have a real question for you.

WHY UTAH? I mean, I have relatives in Salt Lake City and I've visited there a handful of times, but why leave LA?

I left LA to move to San Diego cause it was better for my kids (grandparents are here, better schools, bigger houses for the cash,etc). I still live in SD and work from my home office. The other dev of EAT SLEEP PLAY are in Utah and I head out every 2-10 weeks (depending on production) and do the rest via IM, video chat, and ftp.

David
 
M3wThr33 said:
And if someone emailed you, said they were writing an article on Batman and did nothing but ask you questions about how Bob Kane sucks and the like, you wouldn't question his motives?

Why question his motives though? He could write the article without a source blatantly bashing the PS3, but instead he went to David Jaffe to acquire research on the topic. Jaffe should be pleased he has the chance to educate the journalist by answering the questions.
 
davidjaffe said:
I left LA to move to San Diego cause it was better for my kids (grandparents are here, better schools, bigger houses for the cash,etc). I still live in SD and work from my home office. The other dev of EAT SLEEP PLAY are in Utah and I head out every 2-10 weeks (depending on production) and do the rest via IM, video chat, and ftp.

David

One Question.

Name the game that made you a gamer.:D
 
TheFallen said:
Why question his motives though? He could write the article without a source blatantly bashing the PS3, but instead he went to David Jaffe to acquire research on the topic. Jaffe should educate the journalist by answering the questions.
He doesn't need to answer the questions in order to educate him. Before the journalist starts to learn about the gaming industry, he should learn how to come up with neutral, unbiased questions, or at least try to get the other perspective on the PS3 before expecting full participation from a dev, especially one with higher priorities than feeding in quotes for "PS3 is a failure" article #347
 
Tellaerin said:
He understands it better than you do, that's for damn sure.
:lol

I'm saying the writer almost undoubtedly got the article assigned to him, so blaming him is pretty stupid. Trying to take an angle to make an article or news piece interesting is common practice. This whole idea of interviews reading like PR's makes as much sense as that person that wanted objectivity in reviews.
 
braimuge said:
One Question.

Name the game that made you a gamer.:D


So many- all on the Atari 2600.

Combat, Adventure, Dodge Em, Raiders of the Lost Ark...

then on APPLE 2e:

Mask of the Sun, Serpent's Star, Hard Hat Mack


Old school shit dude :)
 
Doesn't sound particularly biased, but it sounds more like the guy is trying to make his own story by provoking Jaffe.
 
davidjaffe said:
So many- all on the Atari 2600.

Combat, Adventure, Dodge Em, Raiders of the Lost Ark...

then on APPLE 2e:

Mask of the Sun, Serpent's Star, Hard Hat Mack


Old school shit dude :)

Like I expected, Atari classic stuff.

Am I retard for not understanding what the APPLE 2e is?

Is it derived from MAC? :P
 
BUT even so, he seems to ignore ANY of the success it has had up till this point or any of the missteps the 360 has made...but again, I could be wrong...

While I understand that it's troubling that he's not acknowledging the successes the PS3 has had until now, I don't see why he would mention the 360's missteps if it's an article about the PS3's history.

But if he's going to make a direct comparison to MS's console in the article then yes it would be completely uberbiased not to take into account both console's pasts.

Then again, since were looking at the questions he's asking David Jaffe (ie PS3 developper), I don't know why he would mention the 360's missteps in those questions, regardless of their presence in the final article or not.

And yes, I do enjoy posting invisible posts right into chaos :)
 
davidjaffe said:
So many- all on the Atari 2600.

Combat, Adventure, Dodge Em, Raiders of the Lost Ark...

then on APPLE 2e:

Mask of the Sun, Serpent's Star, Hard Hat Mack


Old school shit dude :)


:D My very first video game, as kids we were shocked when our dad brought home an Atari 2600 with a copy of Combat. So many great games in one and so many memories, the Tank games were my favourite, especially when we worked out you could exploit it by jamming yourself into a corner and repeatedly shooting to teleport to the other side :lol
 
Man, old games were great. The weird thing is that even with all the advances in today's technology, for some reason gaming was just more fun back in the day. Atari was the shit. The SNES, oh God, that made me stay at home for days.
 
pakkit said:
:lol

I'm saying the writer almost undoubtedly got the article assigned to him, so blaming him is pretty stupid. Trying to take an angle to make an article or news piece interesting is common practice. This whole idea of interviews reading like PR's makes as much sense as that person that wanted objectivity in reviews.


Firstly, him being assigned to write so pessimistically about the PS3 is certainly doubtable. Second, just because having a certain jaded and controversial (un-professional) angle is common practise doesn't make it commendable nor should it make it free from criticism. Lastly, who said anything about reading like a PR statement? Why can't gaming news just be neutral, fair and tactful? Why does it have to be slanted either way, read like something Fox would cook up, or something you'd find in a gossip mag? That certainly is not good journalism, however you try and spin it.
 
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