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[TintoConCasera]

 

[Gaiff]

Isn't that often the case after major trailers or gameplay showcases? I don't think we can read much into this.

 

[Kings Field]

 

[GudOlRub]

Forgot about GTAV and Miles.

My other points still stand though, and thats like 4 games in like 20 years lol

Alan Wake 2, Death Loop, Forspoken, Half-Life Alyx, AC Black Flag Freedom Cry, The Walking Dead S1, Mafia 3... want me to go on?
Yes, white people are the most represented group in gaming without a doubt, but if you want to start doing this dumb exercise, then let's do it for every ethnicity out there, I will bet you any money you want that black people are not the least represented group.

 

[T4keD0wN]

Whatever... I wouldnt have picked Yasuke myself, but perhaps the character fits for the story that they want to tell, perhaps theyll handle it really well and the game will offer some great social commentary, if not then Ubisoft will look a bit silly for not picking a more fitting or popular character, this is Ubisoft and their games rarely offer a great narrative so its right to be sceptical

Its a bit too early to judge the game solely on this when we dont even know the reason for why they went this road.

 

[TintoConCasera]

Isn't that often the case after major trailers or gameplay showcases? I don't think we can read much into this.

Could be. But if so, man that's sad for Ubisoft, maybe they should just stop releasing videogames if every trailer makes their stock plummet.

 

[Moneal]

Alan Wake 2, Death Loop, Forspoken, Half-Life Alyx, AC Black Flag Freedom Cry, The Walking Dead S1, Mafia 3... want me to go on?
Yes, white people are the most represented group in gaming without a doubt, but if you want to start doing this dumb exercise, then let's do it for every ethnicity out there, I will bet you any money you want that black people are not the least represented group.

pretty sure they were only saying black man, so Alan Wake and forspoken are out.

 

[balls of snow]

Ehh they did well for Baghdad in Mirage that it brought some historian to tears. I will defer to ubisoft on this thanks.

 

[Von Hugh]

 

[kruis]

It’s still debated. There just isn’t that much info about him, but based on what is known, he enjoyed a privileged position besides Nobunaga.

He may have acted as a bodyguard and is very likely to have received military training as well. Considering that he was also huge and incredibly strong (allegedly), it’s believed he acted as trusted security.

The samurai bit is contested because what the title means wasn’t always consistent throughout history and changed depending on the time period. I’ve been looking it up and I’ve seen a lot of no he wasn’t a samurai but also a surprising amount of yes, he was a samurai. I thought the consensus among experts was no but turns out it might not be the case.

According to historical record Yasuke came to Japan with a group of Jesuit missionaries, stayed in Japan for less than three years and was part of Nobunaga's clan for less than 18 months. It would have been absolutely impossible to become a Samurai in such a short period for an outsider who spoke little Japanese.

 

[Represent.]

Alan Wake 2, Death Loop, Forspoken, Half-Life Alyx, AC Black Flag Freedom Cry, The Walking Dead S1, Mafia 3... want me to go on?
Yes, white people are the most represented group in gaming without a doubt, but if you want to start doing this dumb exercise, then let's do it for every ethnicity out there, I will bet you any money you want that black people are not the least represented group.

I was talking specifically about Black males. Not females. AW2, Forspoken, Alyx are black females. And Walking Dead is not an AAA game.

But again, people are only quoting that part of my argument. Not mentioning everything else I said. Where was the outrage for the Ass Creed game that took place in the Caribbean, where we played as a Welsh guy? There wasn't a single peep.

I only have an issue with race swapping. this is not a little mermaid situation, which I understood. Yasuke, samurai or not, existed, and was black. He remains black in the game.

 

[Mr Moose]

pretty sure they were only saying black man, so Alan Wake and forspoken are out.

Did you just assume their gender?

Add Blade and Crackdown 3 to the list.

 

[Black_Stride]

Once again, it's the choice of Japanese people to pick who they put as a main character.
Yes, white people are from Europe, in case you didn't notice. Even if they have been for a few generations in the American continent.
Exactly the same for Asians in American. And even African-Americans.
The only American-American are the natives. What we used to call "Indians".

Okay was just checking.
European as in the blanket term for white people.

Asians for a very long time, have been one of the least represented groups in western media.
And once again, they get to not being represented in a game set in an Asian country.
Yes, Yosuke was a real person. But Ubisoft is already changing what he really was, to pretend he had a much bigger role in Javanese society.

Yes, we know Yasuke was not a member of the Hidden Ones, a league of Assassins going up against the the Templars Order who want to gather the pieces of Eden, to rule the world
His importance in Japanese society as a Samurai well I havent played the game, I have no idea how important the cat actually is in Japanese society.
Him being a Samurai is in question......well if there is a blank space in history, which there is as far as I can tell there is....they can fill it with Yasuke being a Samurai. I dont think him having a title of "Page" or whatever would have been less outrageous to people.
One black guy who is a deuteragonist to an Asian woman in a game full of Asians isnt Asians being NOT represented......am I missing something....are there like a ton of non-Asian characters in this game ive missed.

Africa, is still a very small percentage of gaming spending worldwide.
By the reasoning you made, if a group of people doesn't buy games in enough quantity, then they don't get to be represented.
Why do you use that argument against Asians, but not against Africans?
Why must Asians, again, be under-represented in western media?

What argument?

If the next game is Assassins Creed Conquest, and it takes place in Southern Africa during the colonization, one of the protagonists is Portuguese or Dutch the other is a local......that would be fine.
The usual crowd would be upset because people need to be upset about shit, but the majority of people would be like sure.....if the white cat is an ally, so be it....let see where this story goes.
How am i for Asians being underrepresent, you gave me an analogous scenario and ive explained why I would be totally fine with it.
Asians arent being under represented in this game, half the playable characters are Asian likely 99% of NPCs are Asian.
Where is the underrepresentation?

I guess I'm a Samurai too since there's no record to prove otherwise.

Hey in this modern era we are told to acknowledge whatever people want to be identified as.
So if you want to be identified as a Samurai.......so be it.
Samurai Tinto

 

[coolmast3r]

Looking at like/dislike ratio on the reveal trailer suggests A LOT of people are not happy about this, and rightfully so.

 

[Gaiff]

According to historical record Yasuke came to Japan with a group of Jesuit missionaries, stayed in Japan for less than three years and was part of Nobunaga's clan for less than 18 months. It would have been absolutely impossible to become a Samurai in such a short period for an outsider who spoke little Japanese.

Well, can you tell us what it would have taken at the time to become a samurai? What were the specifics? Nobunaga was a major figure of power so he would have done whatever he wanted, especially when he was known to eschew traditions and angered many conservatives at the time. He even went as far as allowing the building of a church near his residence and allegedly tore down houses to allow the Jesuits to expand their church. The man was known to favor westerners compared to other daimyos at the time.

I've been looking at different history channels, the wikipedia talk page, web articles, and reddit posters with credentials, and there is disagreement over his status, so I don't think just going, "it's impossible because there wasn't enough time," is much of an argument.

 

[Superbean]

Alan Wake 2, Death Loop, Forspoken, Half-Life Alyx, AC Black Flag Freedom Cry, The Walking Dead S1, Mafia 3... want me to go on?
Yes, white people are the most represented group in gaming without a doubt, but if you want to start doing this dumb exercise, then let's do it for every ethnicity out there, I will bet you any money you want that black people are not the least represented group.

Goal posts will be moved soon. Best not to engage with trolls. Either they are troll or so utterly devoid of intellectual weight that there is no point in engaging

 

[winjer]

What argument?

If the next game is Assassins Creed Conquest, and it takes place in Southern Africa during the colonization, one of the protagonists is Portuguese or Dutch the other is a local......that would be fine.
The usual crowd would be upset because people need to be upset about shit, but the majority of people would be like sure.....if the white cat is an ally, so be it....let see where this story goes.
How am i for Asians being underrepresent, you gave me an analogous scenario and ive explained why I would be totally fine with it.
Asians arent being under represented in this game, half the playable characters are Asian likely 99% of NPCs are Asian.
Where is the underrepresentation?

Your argument was that Japan buys few AC games, so they can't expect to be represented.
I question, then should that also apply to Africans. The obvious answer to both situations is that it should not matter, as they all should be represented.
But for some reason, you made the argument that Japanese can't have the expectation of being represented, because they don't buy many AC games.

 

[Schmendrick]

I´m not even gonna comment on the trash Ubisoft presented, but...
could you stop acting like some random guys on a social media platform are representative for....anything?

This clickbait bullshit is retarded enough when people do it that get paid for it.

 

[GudOlRub]

I was talking specifically about Black males. Not females. AW2, Forspoken, Alyx are black females. And Walking Dead is not an AAA game.

But again, people are only quoting that part of my argument. Not mentioning everything else I said. Where was the outrage for the Ass Creed game that took place in the Caribbean, where we played as a Welsh guy? There wasn't a single peep.

I only have an issue with race swapping. this is not a little mermaid situation, which I understood. Yasuke, samurai or not, existed, and was black. He remains black in the game.

Why males only? That's a bit weird ngl but you do you.
And please do point out where the historical figure is among all these characters

I'd love to know why Ubi decided to go for a real person as a protagonist in this specific context, it was surely completely natural and not motivated by some agenda by any means, surely it's not because having another random black character in 16th century Japan would be ridiculed because how fucking dumb it'd look, so they had to go for the one documented black dude that existed back then so that they have plausible deniability when people call them out on their bullshit.

 

[STARSBarry]

Isn't that often the case after major trailers or gameplay showcases? I don't think we can read much into this.

Yes... but normally in the other direction.

 

[Kilau]

Where was the outrage for the Ass Creed game that took place in the Caribbean, where we played as a Welsh guy? There wasn't a single peep.

Maybe because he was a pirate operating in the Caribbean? Come on now lol.

 

[mansoor1980]

thanks to whoever gifted me GOLD
generally its John Marston

 

[SCB3]

Another very common SJW argument. Witcher has monsters in it so why not put in black people? Same with LOTR.

Doesn't LotR have them? The Witcher does, In all fairness to those books, they were wrote in JRR Toikiens time (I actually live near where he did and it wasn't even part of the Slave trades at all) where Black people simply didn't exist in his world and The Witcher was written about middle age Poland

Now you can make an argument for more Racial diversity, but you have to do it fitting to that world and not simply shoehorn things in for the sake of it, something I think Game of Thrones does quite well in fact

 

[scydrex]

This game is going to flop

 

[Loomy]

This has nothing to do with woke, political correctness, DEI, or any other dog whistle buzzwords you may want to throw around.

This is Ubisoft being lazy fucks.

I bet the modern day portion of the game has a black protagonist (probably with the Killmonger hairstyle) jump into the animus because he's a descendent of Yasuke.

Where he is a bold fighter, she’s the hidden blade in the shadows. It's through her that Ubisoft are seemingly rediscovering the series’ stealth roots in a manner that surpasses even last year’s Assassin’s Creed Mirage.
-IGN

Why is she not the primary/sole assassin player character in this game called - checks notes - Assassins Fucking Creed?

 

[Audiophile]

Pissing off the majority of Japanese players in a game about their own culture? Only Ubi can pull this off.

Then again, considering who the lead writer is, I'm not surprised:

https://twitter.com/mossinmind

And even with all this bullshit, the purple forum is still complaining:

A daily reminder that these people will never be happy, no matter what. Stop catering to the mentally ill.

It's the "...still haunts me" that really seals the crazy.

 

[KXVXII9X]

Yikes, that is embarrassing. Ubisoft should take note and change some things.

Also, this is a thing both West and East both have screwer up when making a piece of work based off of a culture they aren't familiar with.

I just hope Ubisoft changes some things because I feel like it is kind of insulting. Especially with screwing up certain architecture and having the sword positioned wrong. Doesn't look like they did their homework.

 

[Guilty_AI]

West makes historically accurate game set in japan, highliting less known locations and historical events:
-Racist and cultural appropriation!

West makes historically butchered game in a series that once prided itself on authenticity:
-Too many straight people!

 

[Loomy]

It's not clear why Ubisoft decided to make an AssCreed game set in Japan in the first place, considering that we are currently drowning in open world games set in Japan and nobody asked for an AssCreed game there after both Ghost of Tsushima and Rise of the Ronin have already been released and both are good games which star an actual Japanese protagonist in feudal Japan

People have been asking for this since before Sucker Punch started working on Ghost of Tsushima.

 

[Represent.]

Maybe because he was a pirate operating in the Caribbean? Come on now lol.

So whats the difference really.

We played as a White pirate in a setting where mostly blacks live. Could have chosen a black protag. Didn't. No outrage.

vs

We play as a black historical figure in a setting where mostly Japanese people live. Could have chosen a Japanese protag (Still have a one in the game). Outrage

i just dont see the major difference here

 

[Black_Stride]

Did you just assume their gender?

Add Blade and Crackdown 3 to the list.

The playable Agents in Crackdown, 2 and 3 are the United Nations of playable characters.

Your argument was that Japan buys few AC games, so they can't expect to be represented.
I question, then should that also apply to Africans. The obvious answer to both situations is that it should not matter, as they all should be represented.
But for some reason, you made the argument that Japanese can't have the expectation of being represented, because they don't buy many AC games.

I saw the 3 tweets the OP used with the thread title being "Japan" as a whole.
And joked that those 3 sales are lost to Ubisoft.
Knowing Ubisoft is going to make a killing off this game, they must be in shambles.

You extrapolated that im insinuating Asians dont deserve representation in a game set in Asia.
So this is a completely different argument now.........to which I have responded.
This very game isnt an example of Asians NOT being represented, when half the protagonists are Asian and the vast vast majority of NPCs are going to be Asian.

A hypothetical game set in Africa with a White Protag......I explained why I wouldnt be against that either.


Re-Read our quote train.

 

[LazyParrot]

Hey, I can do that too. Japan is very happy with Assassin's Creed: Shadows, and these tweets prove it:

TBH from what I've seen so far, the reaction seems to be mostly positive.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

This has nothing to do with woke, political correctness, DEI, or any other dog whistle buzzwords you may want to throw around.

This is Ubisoft being lazy fucks.

I bet the modern day portion of the game has a black protagonist (probably with the Killmonger hairstyle) jump into the animus because he's a descendent of Yasuke.


Why is she not the primary/sole assassin player character in this game called - checks notes - Assassins Fucking Creed?

Assassin's Creed hasn't been about assassins or assassination since AC4

 

[Punished Miku]

Doesn't LotR have them? The Witcher does, In all fairness to those books, they were wrote in JRR Toikiens time (I actually live near where he did and it wasn't even part of the Slave trades at all) where Black people simply didn't exist in his world and The Witcher was written about middle age Poland

Now you can make an argument for more Racial diversity, but you have to do it fitting to that world and not simply shoehorn things in for the sake of it, something I think Game of Thrones does quite well in fact

My personal position on most things is as follows. 1) Try to allow creator intent / creator freedom to be the guiding principle. 2) Obviously token characters / race swapping / political propaganda that sticks out and harms the story is annoying. I don't think this qualifies as any of those things, yet. Just the fact that this person actually existed nullifies any suggestion that this is a token character for me.

For me, I'm fine with the Witcher and FFXVI also. Creator intent / freedom to make what you want. I'm fine with RE5. I'm fine with this AC protagonist so far. I'm fine with Nioh. I'm fine with The Last Samurai. What I see a lot of on here though is people fine with all of that except this one game with a black lead, which is pretty hypocritical.

 

[nial]

I don't want to defend AC Shadows, but random Twitter users are not 'Japan'. That said, it will be fun to compare its first week retail sales to those of Ghost of Tsushima.

 

[Mr Moose]

The playable Agents in Crackdown, 2 and 3 are the United Nations of playable characters.

And one of them is Terry Crews.

 

[CoreyFlawless]

Kinda reminds me the overactive re5 moment. But also, should we not wait until there more gameplay and more of story before the complain.

 

[Loomy]

Assassin's Creed hasn't been about assassins or assassination since AC4

You're right. Mirage brought them back to that and people responded very well to it. Granted, this game was probably already years into development when Mirage came out, but still...

 

[winjer]

I saw the 3 tweets the OP used with the thread title being "Japan" as a whole.
And joked that those 3 sales are lost to Ubisoft.
Knowing Ubisoft is going to make a killing off this game, they must be in shambles.

You extrapolated that im insinuating Asians dont deserve representation in a game set in Asia.
So this is a completely different argument now.........to which I have responded.
This very game isnt an example of Asians NOT being represented, when half the protagonists are Asian and the vast vast majority of NPCs are going to be Asian.

A hypothetical game set in Africa with a White Protag......I explained why I wouldnt be against that either.


Re-Read our quote train.

This is what you said.
As if the opinion of Japanese people about this game don't matter.
And it's not just 3 people. Several post in this thread have shown it's a lot more.
And why should the opinion of Japanese people not matter? They are right in wanting to be represented in a game set in Japan.

All 3 Japanese people who would have bought Assassins Creed in Japan are totally up in arms.

What the fuck is UBI going to do knowing instead of 10 million units they are gonna sell nine million nine hundred ninety-nine thousand nine hundred ninety-seven.

 

[Represent.]

Hey, I can do that too. Japan is very happy with Assassin's Creed: Shadows, and these tweets prove it:

TBH from what I've seen so far, the reaction seems to be mostly positive.

finally some hope for humanity

 

[SCB3]

My personal position on most things is as follows. 1) Try to allow creator intent / creator freedom to be the guiding principle. 2) Obviously token characters / race swapping / political propaganda that sticks out and harms the story is annoying. I don't think this qualifies as any of those things, yet. Just the fact that this person actually existed nullifies any suggestion that this is a token character for me.

For me, I'm fine with the Witcher and FFXVI also. Creator intent / freedom to make what you want. I'm fine with RE5. I'm fine with this AC protagonist so far. I'm fine with Nioh. I'm fine with The Last Samurai. What I see a lot of on here though is people fine with all of that except this one game with a black lead, which is pretty hypocritical.

Where did I say I was against it? I even said I liked the real story of Yasuke as its genuinely interesting and having that be retold in a series I enjoy for its historical merits with some leeway given of course could be fun

My only issue would be if they turn him into a super assassin and make him out to be far more important than he actually was in history, at that point its not AC to me

 

[Tiamat2san]

The assassin’s creed in japan that i always wanted already exists.
It’s called Ghost of tsushima.

Can’t wait for the second game.

Seriously Ubisoft is doing Ubisoft stuffs.
I am not surprised at all.
It gets worse every time.

 

[Punished Miku]

Where did I say I was against it? I even said I liked the real story of Yasuke as its genuinely interesting and having that be retold in a series I enjoy for its historical merits with some leeway given of course could be fun

My only issue would be if they turn him into a super assassin and make him out to be far more important than he actually was in history, at that point its not AC to me

My 2nd post wasn't really aimed at you specifically. I probably didn't need to quote it the 2nd time.

And I'm sure they will make him a super fighter that's stronger than he was in reality, because it's a video game.

 

[poppabk]

Are Québécois considered Europeans.........or is that an umbrella term for white people?
What does country of origin of the developer have to do with anything?

Id understand if Yasuke was completely made up the writers wanted an outsider who err stood out, Niohs William was already take.........Naoe is a completely made up character by the way.
Make no mistake im not for or against Yasuke being the deuteragonist, I havent played the game yet to see what he adds to the strory, but im going to be avoiding his playstyle anyway, cuz I prefer stealth.
If the game featured a Japanese or White Samurai.......again id have to gauge the story once I went through it, but id still be avoiding the play style either way.


Mate alot of games dont even have African servers......the whole continent....not one server.
We are just happy when a game has the decency to actually remember we exist.

If a game was set in Africa and one of the protagonists was white.......I wouldnt be losing my shit, no one would.
Hell bring on an African Assassins Creed with a Portuguese Protag........im in, as long as we get to kill a bunch of colonizers.
The game has a ton of Japanese people.....it has one black guy.....your analogy is alittle extreme no?
In terms of protagonists its a 50/50 split between Japanese and non-Japanese.

Not sure what you are talking about. Sony have lots of PSN coverage in a small part of Africa.

 

[The Cockatrice]

Hey, I can do that too. Japan is very happy with Assassin's Creed: Shadows, and these tweets prove it:

TBH from what I've seen so far, the reaction seems to be mostly positive.

Nice bots accounts.

 

[Topher]

I really don't see the problem with the black Yasuke myself since it is historically accurate. I'm just hoping for a great game.

 

[Kilau]

So whats the difference really.

We played as a White pirate in a setting where mostly blacks live. Could have chosen a black protag. Didn't. No outrage.

vs

We play as a black historical figure in a setting where mostly Japanese people live. Could have chosen a Japanese protag (Still have a one in the game). Outrage

i just dont see the major difference here

The difference is that being a pirate had no deep historical or ethnic ties to the Caribbean, anyone could be a pirate and the game showed how diverse that group was, including black and women pirates.

 

[BaneIsPain]

literally sitting on goldmine and blew this up. classic ubisoft. lmao

 

[LazyParrot]

Nice bots accounts.

For all we know you could be a bot account. What if it's bots all the way down?

 

[FunkMiller]

I really don't see the problem with the black Yasuke myself since it is historically accurate. I'm just hoping for a great game.

The colour of the protagonist's skin is largely irrelevant, when the game itself is always online, stuffed with MTXs, sold in multiple over-priced editions, and comes from a games publisher that potentially lets people get away with quite literal rape.

The dead cat strategies Ubisoft employ with these kinds of public stunts is extremely obvious.