Guerrillas in the Mist
Member
Eh? I meant that discounting soundtracks for largely being on PC or Amiga or whatever and being part of a rather niche scene, isn't a great reason to do so. Not sure what you mean by that.
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Japan vs. The West - who creates the best videogame soundtracks?
- Thread starter Kagoshima_Luke
- Start date
Eh? I meant that discounting soundtracks for largely being on PC or Amiga or whatever and being part of a rather niche scene, isn't a great reason to do so. Not sure what you mean by that.
petran79
Banned
There is no video game music without Epic Megagames.
I think for 1994 this has to be the top contender for best music.
Thanks to Robert Allen.
http://epicgames.com/community/2012/05/epic-composer-interview-robert-allen/
From a technical perspective, working on Jazz Jackrabbit and Epic Pinball was a bit more challenging since we were moving to using sequenced digital music instead of the AdLib (FM synthesis) music that was common for the day. Im not sure anyone had published a PC game with digital music at that point, but Epic was all about pushing the limits. Even though the sound engine was cutting edge, I was only allowed 4 different sounds at a time and some really stringent limits on the size of the song files. At the time, the goal was to have the complete shareware game, including the music files, fit one a single 1.44 MB floppy disc. Certainly there were musicians who were far better at creating this kind of music, but because of my limits, I focused on some kind of catchy melody or theme that matched the graphics, and a beat that would set the pace of the level.
favorite track
https://youtu.be/olO-Vg18BeM?list=PL7D70C4037DA3ADA4
and best boss music in a video game ever!
https://youtu.be/rgcIDALP2Cg?list=PL7D70C4037DA3ADA4
best bonus stage music as well
https://youtu.be/UKXztzialAo?list=PL7D70C4037DA3ADA4
I think for 1994 this has to be the top contender for best music.
Thanks to Robert Allen.
http://epicgames.com/community/2012/05/epic-composer-interview-robert-allen/
From a technical perspective, working on Jazz Jackrabbit and Epic Pinball was a bit more challenging since we were moving to using sequenced digital music instead of the AdLib (FM synthesis) music that was common for the day. Im not sure anyone had published a PC game with digital music at that point, but Epic was all about pushing the limits. Even though the sound engine was cutting edge, I was only allowed 4 different sounds at a time and some really stringent limits on the size of the song files. At the time, the goal was to have the complete shareware game, including the music files, fit one a single 1.44 MB floppy disc. Certainly there were musicians who were far better at creating this kind of music, but because of my limits, I focused on some kind of catchy melody or theme that matched the graphics, and a beat that would set the pace of the level.
favorite track
https://youtu.be/olO-Vg18BeM?list=PL7D70C4037DA3ADA4
and best boss music in a video game ever!
https://youtu.be/rgcIDALP2Cg?list=PL7D70C4037DA3ADA4
best bonus stage music as well
https://youtu.be/UKXztzialAo?list=PL7D70C4037DA3ADA4
The Yo Tornado
Member
This would actually be a hell of a thread idea or article. I prefer Japan personally but there's a lot of awesome Western OSTs that slipped through the cracks. It'd be fun to compare and contrast them.
I can definitely think of way more Japanese soundtracks that I find catchy and memorable than western ones.
Though it's kinda funny. Back in the day, I really doubted the ability of Japanese composers to have any real sort of range because I watched the original Dragonball Z, and its soundtrack felt like something that came from the 1950s, and I assumed all (or most) Japanese music was like that.
Though it's kinda funny. Back in the day, I really doubted the ability of Japanese composers to have any real sort of range because I watched the original Dragonball Z, and its soundtrack felt like something that came from the 1950s, and I assumed all (or most) Japanese music was like that.
petran79
Banned
Japanese games in the west were mainly on consoles, so till the arrival of cds, music composers had to follow a certain standard.
But computers had so many different standards and sound cards, that it was a much more difficult task to make the music compatible with all the hardware. From FM to Wavetable, you had to test both or even recompose the track, especially for arcade ports.
Regarding programming skills and music, European and American composers had the advantage.
But computers had so many different standards and sound cards, that it was a much more difficult task to make the music compatible with all the hardware. From FM to Wavetable, you had to test both or even recompose the track, especially for arcade ports.
Regarding programming skills and music, European and American composers had the advantage.
XANDER CAGE
Member
There are trends I like and dislike in both scenes (although I think Japan is a much tighter scene than "the West" which covers a way broader spectrum).
I've grown tired of rock-drums-and-orchestra JRPG soundtracks, and I'm really sick of most AAA western games chasing the Dark Knight soundtrack still. I think my favorite soundtracks from Japan are the truly bizarre ones (Drakengard is a highlight for me) and my favorites from "the West" are actually soundtracks that pull in bands and other established artists. HEALTH's soundtrack for Max Payne 3 is an all-time favorite, for example.
But yeah, in general, I get frustrated by the "Japan does this and the West does this" breakdowns. I don't know where the whole melodic-vs-atmospheric thing started, or why atmospheric is inherently bad, but it's a pretty poor description.
I've grown tired of rock-drums-and-orchestra JRPG soundtracks, and I'm really sick of most AAA western games chasing the Dark Knight soundtrack still. I think my favorite soundtracks from Japan are the truly bizarre ones (Drakengard is a highlight for me) and my favorites from "the West" are actually soundtracks that pull in bands and other established artists. HEALTH's soundtrack for Max Payne 3 is an all-time favorite, for example.
But yeah, in general, I get frustrated by the "Japan does this and the West does this" breakdowns. I don't know where the whole melodic-vs-atmospheric thing started, or why atmospheric is inherently bad, but it's a pretty poor description.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Japanese. Absolutely no comparison. I still remember tunes from many years ago that stuck with me in many Japanese games and I still encounter great tunes from Japanese games even today. Western games tend to try to emulate movies and imo are forgettable and not as memorable for me. To me all of that supposed orchestral, "epic" music sounds very similar to me and it doesn't particularly stand out in games. When I hear something like Sworn to Swords in DMC4 or the boss music in Streets of Rage, it immediately stands out to me and even hypes me up at times. Find me a better soundtrack than Streets of Rage, Silent Hill or Metal Gear Rising for example to name a few.
mcz117chief
Member
hmm, I guess this is the reason why I remember much more Eastern OSTs than Western. The only exceptions are Halo, Crysis 2 and God of War
MrRudiMentary
Member
Both. Japan is great but the West has people like Jack Wall, Jeremy Soule, Marty O'Donnell, the guy who did The Last of Us, Harry Gregson-Williams and a whole bunch I'm forgetting. GAF's Eastern bias is strong.
The West for me. I enjoy the works of Koji Kondo, Takeharu Ishimoto, and other Japanese composers, but ultimately prefer soundtracks by such people as Mike Morasky, Martin O'Donnell, Harry Gregson-Williams (and his recent protégé Ludvig Forssell), Alexander Brandon, Michiel van den Bos, Nathan Grigg, Solar Fields, Zak Belica.
TheSlySoul
Member
I say Japan because most OSTs I have are eastern games.
The OST to Stick of Truth is pretty great though.
Edit: Actually it depends on how much EU counts for western because I love David Wise and Grant Kirkhope. I love both of them.
The OST to Stick of Truth is pretty great though.
Edit: Actually it depends on how much EU counts for western because I love David Wise and Grant Kirkhope. I love both of them.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Yep. Him and Yuzo Koshiroa imo are the greatest of all time.
It's written by the western composer Jamie Christopherson.
wow this is the best out of both worlds.
both of them sound so random i wonder if a 5 year old just tried out some midi stuff....
unbelievable to see this shit as OST.
btw. what is the west?
USA+EU?
we are comparing a couple of countries against one country?
wow....
If you had to break it down to a single, overarching sentence, I'd have to agree with the statement.
On the other hand I'd also heartily and more readily agree that game soundtrack culture and history can't exactly be described in a handful of paragraphs, let alone a single sentence.
k I'm gonna make a list of awesome non-Japanese VGM composers because apparently some people need their memories jogged. This is off the top of my head, with about 5 minutes of thinking.
Jeremy Soule
Frank Klepacki
Marty O'Donnell
Jake Kaufman
Tommy Tallarico
Alexander Brandon
Bobby Prince
Spencer Nilssen
Austin Wintory
Matt Uelmen
Jesper Kyd
Jeroen Tel
Chris Huelsbeck
Alberto Gonzalez
Richard Jacques
Tim Follin
David Wise
Grant Kirkhope
Rob Hubbard
Martin Galway
Jonathan Dunn
David Whittaker
Matt Gray
Ben Daglish
Neil Baldwin
Matt Furniss
Barry Leitch
Dean Evans
I do not see how anyone could look at that list and still say "why can't westerners compose music????????" except by willful ignorance.
Jeremy Soule
Frank Klepacki
Marty O'Donnell
Jake Kaufman
Tommy Tallarico
Alexander Brandon
Bobby Prince
Spencer Nilssen
Austin Wintory
Matt Uelmen
Jesper Kyd
Jeroen Tel
Chris Huelsbeck
Alberto Gonzalez
Richard Jacques
Tim Follin
David Wise
Grant Kirkhope
Rob Hubbard
Martin Galway
Jonathan Dunn
David Whittaker
Matt Gray
Ben Daglish
Neil Baldwin
Matt Furniss
Barry Leitch
Dean Evans
I do not see how anyone could look at that list and still say "why can't westerners compose music????????" except by willful ignorance.
I don't wanna be that guy, but I think I agree with this statement. It may not even be straight bias, but the games that feature some of the great Japanese composers are certainly more popular on GAF than their western counterparts.
Mark Morgan
Jeremy Soule
Michael Hoening
Inon Zur
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Well, he is great then. Konami games never disappoint in the music department. Got to admit, Tommy Tallarico and Spencer Nielsen are really good also.
i'd add Tim Wright, Martin Iveson, and Nathan Mccree,
Are there any examples you have of standout pieces from these guys? I'm familiar with a few names (Jeremy Soule, Jake Kaufmann, Tim Follin, Richard Jacques, and David Wise in particular) but not the others. And also, how many of those people are still composing? That's imo the biggest shame of western game musicians, most of the best from the early 90's days are no longer in the game, while at least us Japanese game music fans still have new Koshiro, Uematsu, Mitsuda, etc. to look forward to.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Add Steve Henifin, Francisco Cerda, and Christophe Héral to this list. I posted samples earlier in this thread.
Edit: oh, and why not Zack Parrish (Valdis Story) and the Freedom Planet composers, they're quite solid.
Still prefer Japan tho. 
johnnydrama
Banned
I kinda like both, but I prefer the west. Just more in line with the kind of music I enjoy.
Alright, I'll bite and give you a sampler for each. Keep in mind that many of these guys are pretty eclectic and one track is not necessarily representative of their whole oeuvre.
Jeremy Soule - Skyrim - Secunda: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvsMn05WtaI
Frank Klepacki - Command & Conquer - Act on Instinct: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4AUY-v1nsE
Marty O'Donnell - Halo 2 - Unforgotten: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmKOKRjxAAo
Jake Kaufman - Shovel Knight - Strike the Earth! Plains of Passage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqAYMZSOQao
Tommy Tallarico - The Terminator- Taking to the Air: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGobJ153r78
Alexander Brandon - Deus Ex - The Synapse: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHQZNNajxOk
Bobby Prince - Doom 2 - Into Sandy's City: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkhCNx-8Qos
Spencer Nilssen - Ecco the Dolphin (Sega CD) - Motion E: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hro03nOyUuI
Austin Wintory - Journey - Apotheosis: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypNgvc6c6Cc
Matt Uelmen - Diablo - Tristram: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ET7OEgRgwPU
Jesper Kyd - Adventures of Batman & Robin (Genesis) - Space Boss: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AQ6vNh6s9c
Jeroen Tel - Cybernoid - main theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYQ9zUWVG4o
Chris Huelsbeck - Turrican 2 - The Final Fight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLdBw_hg6dw
Alberto Gonzalez - Tintin: Prisoners of the Sun - Stage 4-2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzZab0uEd1w
Richard Jacques - Sonic 3D Blast (Saturn) - Rusty Ruin Act 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJ5dXMLhQPc
Tim Follin - Silver Surfer - Stage 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J0H5ah1G7A
David Wise - Donkey Kong Country 2 - Stickerbrush Symphony: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J67nkzoJ_2M
Grant Kirkhope - Banjo-Kazooie - Spiral Mountain: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPUn5biib1c
Rob Hubbard - International Karate - main theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzlK_JNuOGE
Martin Galway - Comic Bakery - loader: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nf29ShkoAiA
Jonathan Dunn - Ocean Loader 4: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2qT7vGqg7c
David Whittaker - Shadow of the Beast - Welcome: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VX2_G2RwRy8
Matt Gray - Last Ninja 2 - The Mansion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMJjqVB9JCM
Ben Daglish - Last Ninja - The Palace: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwD0PlKI3JU
Neil Baldwin - Magician - Abadon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OM25EnTM6Ng
Matt Furniss - Puggsy - Redwoods: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDF3RvP7W2I
Barry Leitch - Top Gear - Las Vegas: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwC7qpzpTUU
Dean Evans - Waterworld - Diving: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0H5YoFv09uQ
Seems like a lot of people need to go back and listen to the stuff that was being pumped out on the spectrum/C64 and Amiga. Also Tim Follin/Geoff Follins stuff is just staggeringly good. The music he did for Ghouls and Ghosts on the C64 is just gobsmacking. His Sinclair beeper music is just....well....it's a technical marvel.
Tim Follin. Ghouls and Ghosts C64: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEjKPvk4rnw
Listen. Enjoy. Hear him produce a better soundtrack to the game than capcom did.
Tim Follin. Ghouls and Ghosts C64: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEjKPvk4rnw
Listen. Enjoy. Hear him produce a better soundtrack to the game than capcom did.
Robot Pants
Member
Most of my favorite soundtracks come from the East.
NieR
Symphony of the night
MGS1
But then Hotline Miami 2 kinda destroys them.
Still have to go with East though
NieR
Symphony of the night
MGS1
But then Hotline Miami 2 kinda destroys them.
Still have to go with East though