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[mckmas8808]

I still think controller-less gaming is more appealing to the causal party crowd than explaining controllers. Even if only 2 people can play at once.

What makes you think this is true? It's never been done before like EVER! Even arcades never done this before.

Are we sure gamers want to play their video games with no controller at all?

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

I will buy it when it is below 100 dollars.

 

[DevilWillcry]

Seriously not trolling (I feel like it needs to be noted in Kinect threads), But this thing is going to bomb (yes even with the casuals) if it launches at that price point. Especially when the Wii is only $50 more for an entire system with an established library. When did this thing get so expensive? I was expecting Kinect to launch around $80-$90. What is keeping the costs so high?

 

[ralexand]

What in the specifications warrants this price?

It seems way overpriced at first glance.

Most of these things are considered overpriced when first released. Remember $599 and the Wii was also bashed for its initial price.

 

[erlim]

Are they brothers?

 

[ralexand]

What makes you think this is true? It's never been done before like EVER! Even arcades never done this before.

Are we sure gamers want to play their video games with no controller at all?

No arcade ever had the tech that Kinect has.

 

[surly]

Regardless of the price (which is high), how can they sell this thing with no bundled in games or demos?

What is keeping the costs so high?

It costs $150 per unit to make according to Develop-Online.

 

[NeoUltima]

They are feeling out prospects at $150 before they make it official.

 

[theultimo]

Are they brothers?

Have you seen the Konami Conference?

 

[-PXG-]

The Wii was sold out everywhere for what was essentially an enhanced gamecube with a revolutionary control scheme for a price tag of $250. Don't see $299 as being a major stumbling block for Kinect's success especially considering you don't need the expensive add ons like an additional controller or wii board to do all the things that the Wii does.

$299 is a major stumbling block. Kinect has to compete with the Wii, which is $199. Who knows, Nintendo might lower the price too.

Sure, the Wii in the long run is more expensive (three nunchukus, remotes, motion plus and a Wii Fit board). But most people focus on the cost of admission/ initial price. Some argued that the 360 was more expensive than the 60GB PS3. In way, it was true, but only if you added the network adapter, play and charge kit, HD DVD drive, USB/ card reader hubs and 1 year sub. of XBL. Kinect alone is $150. With an Arcade it's $300. A Wii is $200. Exlcuding extra shit, what do you think is gonna sell more?

It's not just price either, but image too. MS has no reputation of being casual or family friendly. Nintendo does. People associate Microsoft and Xbox with hardcore gamers.

 

[Branduil]

So what would the price have been if they had kept the dedicated processing chip?

 

[mujun]

Seriously not trolling (I feel like it needs to be noted in Kinect threads), But this thing is going to bomb (yes even with the casuals) if it launches at that price point. Especially when the Wii is only $50 more for an entire system with an established library. When did this thing get so expensive? I was expecting Kinect to launch around $80-$90. What is keeping the costs so high?

I think 150 is too high and it will probably bomb at that price but comparing it to the Wii isn't really fair as it's not a HD console.

 

[woodypop]

Yay! I get a chance to use this!

Looks like the Leaning Tower of SEGA is reaching for dude's crotch.

 

[antiquegamer]

Misprint? What is that.

Probably because Kinect need to be plug into USB, so it's for those that used USB port for wi-fi.

Anyway, $150.00 with no game included is really bad. Though at this point I am incline to think that the pricepoint is $150.00 with Arcade at $150.00 that's 299 for Kinect bundle.

 

[ralexand]

$299 is a major stumbling block. Kinect has to compete with the Wii, which is $199. Who knows, Nintendo might lower the price too.

Sure, the Wii in the long run is more expensive (three nunchukus, remotes, motion plus and a Wii Fit board). But most people focus on the cost of admission/ initial price. Some argued that the 360 was more expensive than the 60GB PS3. In way, it was true, but only if you added the network adapter, play and charge kit, HD DVD drive, USB/ card reader hubs and 1 year sub. of XBL. Kinect alone is $150. With an Arcade it's $300. A Wii is $200. Exlcuding extra shit, what do you think is gonna sell more?

It's not just price either, but image too. MS has no reputation of being casual or family friendly. Nintendo does. People associate Microsoft and Xbox with hardcore gamers.

And the Wii was selling at an even greater rate at the higher price point. If consumers want something they are willing to spend $300 to get it. Don't see MS having any problem convincing people this is the next great thing. Hell, it hit the talk show circuit right after it was announced last year. Can't imagine how much more exposure its going to have by the time fall rolls around.

 

[mckmas8808]

MS expects to sell 5 million this year.

WHOA!!!! Why? You mean this calender year? I wonder how much Sony expects the MOVE to sell then geez.

 

[soldat7]

 

[Mrbob]

I think 150 is too high and it will probably bomb at that price but comparing it to the Wii isn't really fair as it's not a HD console.

But the argument can be made the Wii has a more functional motion controller setup than Kinect ever will be, and the entry price is still lower.

$199 for Wii system plus Wii Sports plus Wii Sports Resort plus motion plus

vs

$299 for 360 and Kinect (rumored core bundle)

I guess my question is to those looking at a Wii, what is the appeal of getting 360 and Kinect instead? All the Wii knock off titles MS has slated for the launch of Kinect? It has already been established this generation that HD graphics are a nice extra, but not a requirement for purchase.

 

[-PXG-]

And the Wii was selling at an even greater rate at the higher price point. If consumers want something they are willing to spend $300 to get it. Don't see MS having any problem convincing people this is the next great thing. Hell, it hit the talk show circuit right after it was announced last year. Can't imagine how much more exposure its going to have by the time fall rolls around.

Yeah, but the Wii had no direct competition. Wii is a different market than 360 and PS3. Kinect is attempting to put the 360 in the same market as the Wii. The Kinect Arcade bundle is $100 more than the Wii and coming out 4 years later. MS has a fuck load of catching up to do, even if they only want a small piece of that market.

 

[Firewire]

I think this thing will fail to kinect.

 

[Afrikan]

What in the specifications warrants this price?

It seems way overpriced at first glance.

I don't know but Sony's $39.99 PSEye

Resolution

* 640×480 pixels @ 60 Hz
* 320×240 pixels @ 120 Hz

Kinect

# Color VGA Motion Camera 640 x 480 pixel resolution at 30FPS
# Depth Camera 640 x 480 pixel resolution at 30FPS

and both seem to have the same "4 microphones supporting single speaker voice recognition"

so the main $110 difference is the IR part of Kinect's camera.....unless I'm forgetting other stuff, hardware wise.

 

[mckmas8808]

No arcade ever had the tech that Kinect has.

Ummm....that's my point. So I'm shocked to hear someone on this site state that casual gamers will be more interested in non controller gaming, because since it hasn't been done before how does he know?

 

[JesseZao]

On second thought, Kinect is not worth my time. Make it official already.

 

[flyinpiranha]

What makes you think this is true? It's never been done before like EVER! Even arcades never done this before.

Are we sure gamers want to play their video games with no controller at all?

And nobody ever did motion control on a console. Or 2 screens on a handheld. Or 3D gaming. Or 4 controller ports. It's just an evolution, and obviously not one many people want to embrace. I can't blame them, the games look like shit and the tech has yet to prove itself. But I'm being optimistic as it would be cool because I enjoyed the shitty Eye Toy games back in the day and wanted to see more done with it. This is just the next step. And it doesn't mean ALL of gaming is going this way.

It's not a sink of swim mentality with gaming anymore. You can have your casual games AND the ones that appeal to the majority of what makes up GAF.

Does anybody think Nintendo abandoned their core audience this generation by going for a different crowd than their competitors?

 

[-PXG-]

I will be damned if MS turns a profit on this thing. If that happens, you really can sell anything.

 

[ralexand]

But the argument can be made the Wii has a more functional motion controller setup than Kinect ever will be, and the entry price is still lower.

$199 for Wii system plus Wii Sports plus Wii Sports Resort plus motion plus

vs

$299 for 360 and Kinect (rumored core bundle)

I guess my question is to those looking at a Wii, what is the appeal of getting 360 and Kinect instead? All the Wii knock off titles MS has slated for the launch of Kinect? It has already been established this generation that HD graphics are a nice extra, but not a requirement for purchase.

HD graphics plus a sensor that can map your whole body without a need for a controller. This is the stuff of sci-fi fantasy. In Star Trek people were not shaking controllers with shiny balls on the tip to get things done. Kinect tech in some form will be how people will interact with their "computers" in the future.

 

[lastplayed]

No sale!

 

[DMeisterJ]

I refuse to believe it will cost $150 cuz Microsoft didn't say what the cost of this thing was, surely this is wr-...

Oh, tons of online retailers including Microsoft's own online store have confirmed this price? Oh... Well...

Doesn't really matter cuz GAF is hating on it, so it must be an immense success!

 

[Rabid Wolverine]

No Fucking Thanks.

Ill put this saved money towards my PC Upgrade.

 

[surly]

It has already been established this generation that HD graphics are a nice extra, but not a requirement for purchase.

Don't something like 70% of US homes have a HD TV now? I'm sure I read that stat somewhere last week. That's way up on the figures from 2-3 years ago. The Wii has been the only option (up to now) if you want motion controls and more "family friendly fun", so maybe it's not that people don't care about HD - it could just be that the more hardcore HD consoles don't appeal to them. It still doesn't make HD graphics a "requirement", but I think it's also wrong to generalise and say that casual gamers don't care.

 

[Mrbob]

I'm trying to figure out where I said casuals didn't care. I said it isn't a requirement. There are other aspects too to these systems besides visuals, and Wii has pioneered this generation already in terms of motion control. Anything MS and Sony do will be secondary to what Nintendo owns in the motion space until they have new systems out.

My main point was to state for a casual observer, taking graphics aside, the Wii package looks a lot more compelling. You save 100 dollars in price, plus you get two of Nintendo's biggest sellers this generation packed in with the system. Nintendo was also smart enough to get motion plus into the new systems as well for future use.

 

[EvilDick34]

Don't something like 70% of US homes have a HD TV now? I'm sure I read that stat somewhere last week. That's way up on the figures from 2-3 years ago. The Wii has been the only option (up to now) if you want motion controls and more "family friendly fun", so maybe it's not that people don't care about HD - it could just be that the more hardcore HD consoles don't appeal to them. It still doesn't make HD graphics a "requirement", but I think it's also wrong to generalise and say that casual gamers don't care.

There is no freakin way 70 percent of US households have HDTV. I work at Target and we consistently are out of stock on digital converters even after all this time since the digital switch over. If i were to just pull a number out of my ass i would put it at somewhere around 50 percent and that is being generous.

 

[Mrbob]

It is 46%.

http://www.tvlampsnbulbs.com/2010/01/us-hdtv-penetration-increases-to-46/

This is also an interesting comment from the article:

There is still room for tremendous growth is the percentage of people who actually watch HD content. Many people in the US may have HDTVs but don’t use them to actually view better quality content. Blu-ray player sales are picking up but only a small fraction of people own them. Also, many aren’t willing to pay the additional fee in order to have HD service from their cable or satellite company.

 

[surly]

It is 46%.

http://www.tvlampsnbulbs.com/2010/01/us-hdtv-penetration-increases-to-46/

I guess it depends which report you read. Here's a more recent one: -

Two-thirds of U.S. households now own a high-definition television, and more Americans plan to buy one in the coming months, according to a report from the Consumer Electronics Association.

The Arlington-based group says video products continue to be the top consumer electronics device U.S. consumers own, with 65 percent of U.S. homes now owning at least one HDTV set, up 13 percent from a year ago. Consumers are also buying HDTVs as secondary sets. The average household now has 1.8 high-definition televisions, up from 1.5 percent a year ago.

http://washington.bizjournals.com/washington/stories/2010/05/03/daily61.html

And another older one: -

High-definition TV ownership now has reached 53 percent of total U.S. households, an 18 percentage point increase in ownership over 2008, when 35 percent of households reported owning an HDTV, says the Cable & Telecommunications Association for Marketing. That was up from 23 percent penetration in 2007.

Among HDTV set owners, 69 percent now subscribe to high definition service, compared to 56 percent a year ago.

http://satellite.tmcnet.com/topics/satellite/articles/61391-hdtv-now-53-percent-us-homes.htm

 

[EvilDick34]

It is 46%.

http://www.tvlampsnbulbs.com/2010/01/us-hdtv-penetration-increases-to-46/

This is also an interesting comment from the article:

Yeah, i just looked up an an article from the NYTIMES and as of the end of may, they are saying 50 percent.

http://mediadecoder.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/05/25/a-closer-look-at-hdtv/

 

[EvilDick34]

I guess it depends which report you read. Here's a more recent one: -


http://washington.bizjournals.com/washington/stories/2010/05/03/daily61.html

Again, there is no way that penetration of HDTV is above 50 percent, absolutely no way. Two sources just linked say otherwise.

 

[Mad_Ban]

That is a disgusting price. D:

 

[Mrbob]

I hope the actual number is closer to 65 percent. The sooner the country fully adopts HDTVs the better.

Now the next step is to get people to buy 3D tvs. :lol

 

[surly]

Again, there is no way that penetration of HDTV is above 50 percent, absolutely no way. Two sources just linked say otherwise.

And 2 sources that I just linked say the figure is above 50%. Why are you discounting my links over the other ones posted? Because you work in a store selling TVs? lol. My link mentions the Consumer Electronics Association. The link the other guy posted says the stats come from "a research group" that they don't even name. If you click the link at the bottom of that article, it takes you to the source, that says: -

According to the firm's HDTV 2009: Consumer Awareness, Interest and Ownership study, 46 percent of U.S. households have at least one HDTV

A lot can change in a year.

 

[DiscoJer]

There is no freakin way 70 percent of US households have HDTV. I work at Target and we consistently are out of stock on digital converters even after all this time since the digital switch over. If i were to just pull a number out of my ass i would put it at somewhere around 50 percent and that is being generous.

Apparently it's 65%

Saw this the other day

http://next-generation-communicatio...nd-more-consumer-electronics-products-cea.htm

Sixty-five percent of U.S. homes now own at least one HDTV, an increase of 13 percentage points from last year, making it the top industry growth driver of the past 12 months. Consumers also are buying HDTVs as secondary sets.

The study which was conducted between January 28 and February 1, 2010 said that ownership of computers also continues to increase.

Currently, 86 percent of U.S. households own at least one computer, making it the third most owned CE product category behind televisions and DVD players. The popularity of netbooks, owned by 12 percent of U.S. households, and laptops, now owned by most households (58 percent), is helping drive the computer category.

 

[Lebron]

I'm not, but my mom plans on getting one. That fitness title sold her.

 

[mckmas8808]

And nobody ever did motion control on a console. Or 2 screens on a handheld. Or 3D gaming. Or 4 controller ports. It's just an evolution, and obviously not one many people want to embrace. I can't blame them, the games look like shit and the tech has yet to prove itself. But I'm being optimistic as it would be cool because I enjoyed the shitty Eye Toy games back in the day and wanted to see more done with it. This is just the next step. And it doesn't mean ALL of gaming is going this way.
It's not a sink of swim mentality with gaming anymore. You can have your casual games AND the ones that appeal to the majority of what makes up GAF.
Does anybody think Nintendo abandoned their core audience this generation by going for a different crowd than their competitors?

But motion controls still used a controller. That's something that all people were use to. And 2 screens on a handheld was smart, but I think you are under estimating how great Nintendo's first party studios are.

They make the Wii better than any 3rd party can. Should we have faith that MS's 1st party studios can bring it that well when it comes to bringing the best out of Kinect in order for it to be as big as MS wants it to be?

 

[Linkup]

Microsoft certainly can sell 5 million of these this holiday season, just need to get the marketing right and they already have a road map for that.

 

[EvilDick34]

And 2 sources that I just linked say the figure is above 50%. Why are you discounting my links over the other ones posted? Because you work in a store selling TVs? lol. My link mentions the Consumer Electronics Association. The link the other guy posted says the stats come from "a research group" that they don't even name.

I never said because i sell TV's, dont troll me please. Secondly since you want to be a smartass, i sell probably 20 converters to every 2 or 3 hdtvs. Anecdotal as hell but that is like that at every Target in Chicago and suburbs.

 

[ZeroRay]

They make the Wii better than any 3rd party can. Should we have faith that MS's 1st party studios can bring it that well when it comes to bringing the best out of Kinect in order for it to be as big as MS wants it to be?

To be honest, the best games shown for Kinect were third party. Microsoft better put Dance Central on the front lines to show people the hardware.

 

[BananaBomb]

MS is setting themselves up for a goddamn rout. They better be willing to suck up the failure and launch their new console in a year or two when Nintendo comes down hard.

 

[theultimo]

I never said because i sell TV's, dont troll me please. Secondly since you want to be a smartass, i sell probably 20 converters to every 2 or 3 hdtvs. Anecdotal as hell but that is like that at every Target in Chicago and suburbs.

In the Twin cities, we sell 20 HDTV's to every 2-3 convertors from Best Buy reports. However, I think more penetration is happening in the West and East Coast then the midwest. The nation could have over 50%, but not every district come close to that.

 

[Maximus.]

Definitely not buying this thing at that price, maybe at 60 bucks i would consider it. Too bad this thing will probably sell like hot cakes :/

 

[mckmas8808]

I never said because i sell TV's, dont troll me please. Secondly since you want to be a smartass, i sell probably 20 converters to every 2 or 3 hdtvs. Anecdotal as hell but that is like that at every Target in Chicago and suburbs.

Dude you are arguing against CEA. That's a very well respected research group in the electronics world.

To be honest, the best games shown for Kinect were third party. Microsoft better put Dance Central on the front lines to show people the hardware.

This isn't good for the short term. MS needs 1st party games to lead this thing for the long term. At the very least 1 of the few.

 

[harriet the spy]

And 2 sources that I just linked say the figure is above 50%. Why are you discounting my links over the other ones posted? Because you work in a store selling TVs? lol. My link mentions the Consumer Electronics Association. The link the other guy posted says the stats come from "a research group" that they don't even name. If you click the link at the bottom of that article, it takes you to the source, that says: -


A lot can change in a year.

Your second source does not say anything of the sort - it says among those who have an HDTV, 69 percent subscribe to HD TV service.

This does not mean that 69% of people have an HDTV.

It's like saying that among people who own a blu-ray player, 69% prefer buying blu-ray over dvds (made up number). Which would not mean that 69% of the population prefers blu-ray.