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[Jamix012]

i think Nintendo is inconsistent but it's nonetheless trivial.
i just don't understand Nintendo's decision to censor something so harmless in the first place.

Probably to avoid ESRB backlash.

 

[Crayons]

"...yeah, that's definitely a dick."

- Patricia Hernandez, Kotaku Editor and Full-time Reporter

Probably the deepest thing to come out of Kotaku in a while.

 

[braves01]

Kotaku: "We've run out of legitimate controversies to write about"

 

[DrWong]

26 episode budget, actually. (they made a point of this in an interview once)

Also all the best FLCL animation is Kanada-style, too. Notably, most of the best cuts in FLCL are Hiroyuki Imaishi or Yoh Yoshinari, and that's sort of their thing.

Yeah, they'were both heavely influenced by Kanada, like many others animators.

Also, do we know if the dick takes advantage of the 3D effect? Would it sexualize it if it was the case?

 

[KojiKnight]

This is important. They're both "art" in the strictest sense, but only one of those two things is pandering fanservice.

Ding ding!

Lindsay: I'm not worried about it, but there is a good chance Nintendo felt it was a possibility... there is very little reason aside from that to change a SINGLE picture in a SET of "risque" bathing suit clad guys and girls. Tharja's pose was quite a bit more "sexual" (again, it's a girl bent over with her butt aimed more or less at the camera).

That said, if you have a link to an image from a T based game of a girl in a bikini bent over with her butt intentionally facing the camera (as compared to an image where a girl is in a bikini bent over with her butt NOT facing the camera, but can be MADE to via camera movments) feel free to post it so we can further the discussion and talk more of hypocrisy.

 

[MrHicks]

WAT...................please don't tell me the writer DIDNT recognize david and just called it "statue"

no no no

 

[Tempy]

Is this the longest jschreier has taken to show up and defend kotaku's honor? I hope he's alright.

Maybe he got tired from boasting several times that kotaku was the first to reveal the "Durango" code name. Such investigative journalism can be tiring!

 

[2+2=5]

I can understand having stupid opinions, but how can a woman that call "that statue" the donatello's david be a journalist?

 

[JordanN]

Probably to avoid ESRB backlash.

For a Teen rated game? I dunno.

TEEN

Content is generally suitable for ages 13 and up. May contain violence, suggestive themes, crude humor, minimal blood, simulated gambling and/or infrequent use of strong language.

Vs

MATURE

Content is generally suitable for ages 17 and up. May contain intense violence, blood and gore, sexual content and/or strong language.

I recall Skullgirls has a scene where Filia's ass is clearly on spotlight but it's Teen. You also have Cammy in all the Street Fighter games (although it's not as direct).

 

[Chance Hale]

I don't think that's pregnancy.

What Roto said Exaggeration ahoy!

She's having duodecuplets

 

[KojiKnight]

26 episode budget, actually. (they made a point of this in an interview once)

Also all the best FLCL animation is Kanada-style, too. Notably, most of the best cuts in FLCL are Hiroyuki Imaishi or Yoh Yoshinari, and that's sort of their thing.

Thank you, didn't know off the top of my head if the budget was single cour or 2 cour... just knew it was very high even for most OVA stuff.

As for those cuts being the best, well that's a matter of opinion. Either way we can agree FLCL was awesome (aside from episode 2... bleeeeh. But 5 our of 6 isn't bad.... also the Pillows were awesome)

 

[rpmurphy]

She's having duodecuplets

What Roto said Exaggeration ahoy!

I wish that were the case.

Spoiler

Look at the field.

 

[Vamphuntr]

I can understand having stupid opinions, but how can a woman that call "that statue" the donatello's david be a journalist?

Well, she probably isn't a true journalist. Unless you consider writing about games journalism.

 

[Zaventem]

A big non issue. I'm sure if the stature wasn't popular and hundreds of years old you'll have people on here crying about a flaccid penis in a nintendo game.

 

[Harpuia]

Well this is just kinda shameful! I feel like she wrote the article without so much as an afterthought on her own reasoning. Is it that hard to understand that one is a classic piece of art and the other is pretty much just gratuitous fan service? You would think that after some thought one would think "huh, ok THIS is why one is ok and the other might not be."

That being said, it's a little weird that covering up Tharja is where Nintendo draws the line in a game that features this character:

 

[KojiKnight]

A big non issue. I'm sure if the stature wasn't popular and hundreds of years old you'll have people on here crying about a flaccid penis in a nintendo game.

NSFW NAKED MICHAEL JACKSON STATUE

I agree fully.

 

[Platy]

Kotaku learns that diferent localization teams do diferent things

Also, learns about art

That being said, it's a little weird that covering up Tharja is where Nintendo draws the line in a game that features this character:

Weird ?
The logic is pretty obvious

Small penis = small boobs = ok

bouncy bits = not ok

A big non issue. I'm sure if the stature wasn't popular and hundreds of years old you'll have people on here crying about a flaccid penis in a nintendo game.

Or if it was The Origin of the World (L'Origine du monde in the original)

 

[Thagomizer]

Don't get me wrong, I respect you looking at it that way. I'm just saying, for me personally, such shortcuts come off lazy, especially since I know their animators are capable of doing better, as is plainly evident from their opening montages where the animation is greatly improved.

Uh, did you miss the part where they had limited time and budgets and thus developed that art style specifically to try to look as good as possible within that constraints? That's not an opinion and is the exact opposite of lazy. Are you deliberately ignoring the people explaining to you why OVA's and opening sequences look better, including that post you quoted?

 

[Labrys]

That being said, it's a little weird that covering up Tharja is where Nintendo draws the line in a game that features this character:

It's obvious she's a dragon in a loli suit! No need to freak out over that, right?

 

[nailbombxx]

I was so close to calling this one.

 

[KojiKnight]

While revealing, it's still quite different than if you kept the pose, but focused the camera 180 degrees from where it currently is.

I'm a little baffled that people don't understand that it's not the OUTFIT or the CHARACTER that caused the censorship, but the pose and the angle the picture was "taken".

I was so close to calling this one.

You were indeed, you could be the next Pachter! Only right more often.

 

[Übermatik]

it's almost as if kotaku dont know a fucking thing about art

Or games.

 

[partyphone]

What if the thing in question could cause them problems with ESRB and thusly cost them money?

Well that's why they submit games to the ESRB in the first place. Major retailers won't carry games that aren't rated. And the ESRB makes me queasy too since what they do is tantamount to censorship.

 

[TemplaerDude]

You guys love bitching about Kotaku but giving them the hits anyways. I stopped clicking through to that joke of a website a long time ago and if you all stopped talking about the garbage they write the world would be a better place.

 

[bon]

Michelangelo's David compared to anime butt.
I'm glad Kotaku is around to post such thought provoking articles.

 

[KojiKnight]

Well that's why they submit games to the ESRB in the first place. Major retailers won't carry games that aren't rated. And the ESRB makes me queasy too since what they do is tantamount to censorship.

ESRB is tantamount to censorship like IGN is tantamount to making games bad.

 

[Rickenslacker]

Or games.

But games are art.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I think the problem is that a distinction isn't being made between the two cases. With Tharja, it makes sense to censor in order to avoid a higher ESRB rating as noted by KojiKnight. With regards to the statue, the need for this form of censorship is (hopefully) not there. I understand both decision, even if I don't agree with censorship but a full time reporter apparently cannot.

Hernandez's rhetoric is weird and muddled at best and like Kotaku's previous political articles, comes across as willfully myopic. It seems like the site is getting lost in their own loaded language.

Not to accuse you, but is the appropriate reaction to this article the responses it's gotten so far? See, this post is nice because it's one of few in the thread that seriously discusses it, while most replies simply mock it and make pretty sweeping assumptions. The statue of David is so common an image that anyone would know what it is, making me think that the assumption that she doesn't know what it is is made only to hurt her credibility.

 

[partyphone]

ESRB is tantamount to censorship like IGN is tantamount to making games bad.

What you said is complete nonsense.

Developers are forced to make everything M rated or less because no one will sell AO rated games.

 

[Harpuia]

While revealing, it's still quite different than if you kept the pose, but focused the camera 180 degrees from where it currently is.

I'm a little baffled that people don't understand that it's not the OUTFIT or the CHARACTER that caused the censorship, but the pose and the angle the picture was "taken".

Oh no, I understand that it's the pose and what the picture is focusing on, but what I'm saying is if Nintendo was going this direction with this game, you'd think they'd go all the way!

 

[A Link to the Past]

I would say that the ESRB has some influence on censorship. IIRC, Sakurai didn't want Snake having guns because he feared that it would raise the ESRB rating.

It's certainly not as bad as the MPAA is, though.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

I really only posted the article because all the dancing around of identifying the sculpture was weird.

It'd be like posting about Starry Night and referring to it as "The painting with the glowing balls."

 

[KojiKnight]

What you said is complete nonsense.

Developers are forced to make everything M rated or less because no one will sell AO rated games.

And you think Walmart and other retailers would sell an AO rated game just because it didn't have an AO rating? If that was the case, you could always publish a game without a rating. You know you don't HAVE to get ESRB ratings for games right? Though Walmart won't stock a non-rated game either...

 

[FantasticMrFoxdie]

All according to Kotaku. Keep on giving them hits guys. I love this kind of groundbreaking journalism.

 

[Roto13]

What you said is complete nonsense.

Developers are forced to make everything M rated or less because no one will sell AO rated games.

That's not censorship.

 

[XANDER CAGE]

I really only posted the article because all the dancing around of identifying the sculpture was weird.

It'd be like posting about Starry Night and referring to it as "The painting with the glowing balls."

I think I bought one of those paintings on the street last time I was in Vegas!

 

[Tomat]

Small penis = small boobs = ok
boingy bits = not ok

Fixed.

 

[partyphone]

That's not censorship.

that's why I used the word tantamount.

 

[Metal-Geo]

For a second there I thought she had a metal dick.

 

[Principate]

Well that's why they submit games to the ESRB in the first place. Major retailers won't carry games that aren't rated. And the ESRB makes me queasy too since what they do is tantamount to censorship.

Come on it's old cinema issue, 12A films generally sell more than 18 or 15 films do, so in order to keep the 12A status, the makers cut some of the more questionable parts, this is exactly what Nintendo did. Though while ironically it doesn't matter too much with games in general is does probably matter to a large proportion of Nintendo's target market in handhelds, so in order to not take any chances they cut and censor shit, in regards to games that they wish to be appealing to younger ages.

 

[LightofRohan]

This is so embarrassing. It's even worse now that she's still defending her point, even though we all know she didn't know what the statue was initially.

 

[Village]

But, it's Michelangelo's David. It's like not recognizing the Mona Lisa.

There is an entire Simpsons episode mocking Springfield for being so cartoonishly uncultured that they don't recognize it. It was meant to be something so absolutely outlandish that no normal person could possibly be expected to act that way.

As a person who goes to an art school. Who gives a shit honestly. They don;t know about Michelangelo's david , my gosh.

* goes on with everyone's daily lives*

Knowing art is one of those things that are nice, but is eventually meaningless because someone caring or not means.... nothing. You think it doesn't sadden me a little they do not know what it is? At the end of the day, eh. It sucks if they go on a game show i guess.

 

[Hrothgar]

It's as if Kotaku is experiencing an identity crisis.

 

[Nibel]

It's feels so dumb that every tiny bit of reputation that Schreier and Totilo try to build with their mostly excellent articles get shattered by such unbelievable bullshit

Those two should start a gaming site on their own

 

[KojiKnight]

that's why I used the word tantamount.

Again... it's not censorship, if the game developers "creative process" didn't involve "having to make shit tons of money", they could easily make a game without getting it rated and sell it via other means. We do live in a digital age.

If you want to go down that route, then MONEY is what is censoring games. Focus tested-to-death games that give up creativity to be more marketable.

 

[partyphone]

And you think Walmart and other retailers would sell an AO rated game just because it didn't have an AO rating? If that was the case, you could always publish a game without a rating. You know you don't HAVE to get ESRB ratings for games right? Though Walmart won't stock a non-rated game either...

....

 

[ShockingAlberto]

As a person who goes to an art school. Who gives a shit honestly. They don;t know about Michelangelo's david , my gosh.

* goes on with everyone's daily lives*

Knowing art is one of those things that are nice, but is eventually meaningless because someone caring or not means.... nothing.

Well, I'm sorry it doesn't pass your personal test for being thread-worthy. Do you have an e-mail address or should I just PM you next time I want to post something so you can sign off on it?

 

[partyphone]

Again... it's not censorship, if the game developers "creative process" didn't involve "having to make shit tons of money", they could easily make a game without getting it rated and sell it via other means. We do live in a digital age.

If you want to go down that route, then MONEY is what is censoring games. Focus tested-to-death games that give up creativity to be more marketable.

I did not say it was censorship. That is why I used the word tantamount.

 

[ixix]

A significant part of the David's appeal is the tremendous understanding of human physiology and the mastery of the medium of marble that it represents. The technical skill required to realize it is tremendous, and recognition of that fact is part of the reason why it's so highly regarded.

By comparison, Animal Crossing's David's dong is made of, like, five polygons haphazardly glued together with the boundless power of math. Everything else you see in it is pretty much just the magic of pure imagination.

What I'm getting at is that there's like, a way more important philosophical question here, which is whether or not we can even really consider that statue in Animal Crossing to be Michelangelo's David.

Somebody should dig up Magritte and ask him. I ain't Belgian, so somebody else is gonna have to do it.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Wait, it just occurred to me. FE:A is rated T. Was Tharja's butt really something that was going to elevate it to M-rated, especially when, again, the same DLC shows just as suggestive a scene as Tharja's butt?