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Rumor Kotaku: "sources" Say Microsoft is "in fact" making a second disc-less console (Lockhart) along with Scarlett despite Phil saying otherwise.

Aug 24, 2016
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If those names sound familiar, that’s because they’ve been floating around for a while. The earliest rumours about Microsoft’s next-gen roadmap, circa 2018, suggested that Project Scarlett would consist of two Xbox models: the high-performance Anaconda and the lower-end Lockhart. In June, however, Microsoft announced that Scarlett was a single, high-end console, which led to speculation and then press reports that Lockhart had been cancelled. But Kotaku has learned that Lockhart is in fact still in the works as a cheaper, digital-only alternative to Scarlett, as the original rumours suggested.

What we don’t know—and what likely isn’t finalised yet—is how the pricing will shake out. But it’s easiest to think of Anaconda as a successor to the Xbox One X and Lockhart as a successor to the Xbox One S, with a similar performance disparity. Game developers will be expected to support both Anaconda and Lockhart, which some are worried might hamper their ambitions for next-gen games in the coming years.

When speaking to Kotaku, one game developer briefed on Lockhart analogized it to the PlayStation 4 Pro in terms of raw graphical power, although there are other key differences that might make up for that. Lockhart is said to have a solid-state drive, like both Anaconda and Sony’s upcoming PlayStation 5, which is expected to have a significant impact on loading times. Developers briefed on Lockhart also say it has a faster CPU than any current video game console, which could allow for higher frame-rates, although there are other factors that might not become clear until the console is completely finalised, such as clock speed and cooling.

How come they re the only ones that have the sources to find out that it's a "fact" that Lockhart is a thing? Why would Phil lie about Scarlett being the online console? Why would he want to have two consoles of varying levels launch at once when devs would have to make games for both?

The only way this could work is if Lockhart comes out 2-3 years after Scarlett's launch otherwise that would be confusing to the average consumer and may screw up Scarletts power advantage. But again I ask, why is kotaku the only one with this story? If it's true that would mean Phil lied but there is no reason for him to do so.

Somethings off.
 
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Mista

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Microsoft is working on a lower-cost, no-discs version of Project Scarlett, its next-generation Xbox announced at E3 2019, which is code-named “Lockhart,” according to a Kotaku report citing four people briefed on the company’s plans.

Early rumors of the next-generation Xbox posted in February suggested that Microsoft would announced two models of its next-generation Xbox at E3 2019—the low-end “Lockhart” and the high-end “Anaconda.” However, when Project Scarlett was announced, it was only a single, high-end console (Anaconda). But according to Kotaku, Lockhart is still in the works as a cheaper, digital-only alternative.

Pricing details are currently unknown, but Kotaku likens Anaconda to the Xbox One X and Lockhart to the Xbox One S in terms of performance disparity. Game developers will be expected to support both devices, which has led some to worry about hampering their ambitions.

One developer likened Lockhart to PlayStation 4 Pro in terms of raw graphical power, but noted key differences such as a solid-state drive and faster CPU.

Microsoft is reportedly targeting 4K resolution at 60 frames per second on Anaconda devices and 1440p resolution at 60 frames per second on Lockhart devices, though this does not mean that every single game will meet those standards.

Some developers who spoke to Kotaku have expressed disappointment in Microsoft’s lack of communication regarding Project Scarlett. Where many developers say they have already received development kits for PlayStation 5, the recently leaked development kit image of which Kotaku mentions is legitimate, Project Scarlett development kits are harder to come by. However, most developers working on next-generation games have an idea of what specifications to target.

Whether PlayStation 5 or Project Scarlett will be the more powerful platform is currently unknown. The common consensus among developers that spoke to Kotaku is that they have roughly similar specifications and that the key differences may lie in other factors, such as operating system features or hidden technologies.

When reached for comment by Kotaku, a Microsoft representative said, “We do not comment on rumors or speculation.”
Gematsu
 

CyberPanda

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Tom Warren was right. And those so called insiders on Reee were wrong about Lockhart lmaoooo.
 

Fake

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Pricing details are currently unknown, but Kotaku likens Anaconda to the Xbox One X and Lockhart to the Xbox One S in terms of performance disparity. Game developers will be expected to support both devices, which has led some to worry about hampering their ambitions.
Dunno why people here still deny this.
 
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Apr 18, 2014
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This is kind of frustrating. What is the point of removing the drive to make it cheaper if you also lower its power? How expensive is the high end version going to end up being?

Thankfully I have already decided I am going to wait a year or two before getting the new consoles. I've got a huge backlog on my current consoles that I will likely never even clear at this point.
 

Achillias

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This is a great idea. More choices, I'm going to buy the most powerful console (which I always do) but their are a lot of people who don't need that. More options for people, so they can decide which they're going for, is always good.
 
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Mista

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The thread is duplicate sorry about that. Please continue the discussion here

 
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There was another thread about this somewhere else but the article seemed to claim the disc-less version was also less powerful which would be idiotic. I hope that isn't true because I would love a disc-less top shelf console having been digital only for this entire last gen.


My post from the other thread:

This is kind of frustrating. What is the point of removing the drive to make it cheaper if you also lower its power? How expensive is the high end version going to end up being?

Thankfully I have already decided I am going to wait a year or two before getting the new consoles. I've got a huge backlog on my current consoles that I will likely never even clear at this point.
 
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Bladed Thesis

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There was another thread about this somewhere else but the article seemed to claim the disc-less version was also less powerful which would be idiotic. I hope that isn't true because I would love a disc-less top shelf console having been digital only for this entire last gen.


My post from the other thread:
The rumor is it is less powerful.
 
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Dabaus

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I said this in another thread:

IF, if lockheart is back im convinced Microsoft have no idea, long term plan, or vision for their next gen console. If Lockheart is back this is another example, like they've done all generation, of throwing crap against the wall to see/hope something sticks. Theyve abandoned the advice and wishes of third party developers on this, are writing off potential future technology like VR, with nothing to replace it, and betting their entire future on cloud streaming when there isnt any clear demand from a large portion of consumers. I beleive we are looking at a Sega Saturn to Sega Dreamcast transition and fall right here.
 

Bryank75

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It's supposed to be a new generation, a new standard and already MS are undermining the progress that is supposed to be made.
Consoles always worked best when there was one SKU at launch, everyone goes in at the ground floor together. Simplifying what was to be delivered and focusing on the new high specs.

Now MS wants to drag the whole new generation down to sell a few consoles to cheap ass mothers.....

This new console should NOT be considered 'next gen'.... because it isn't!
 

mckmas8808

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How come they re the only ones that have the sources to find out that it's a "fact" that Lockhart is a thing? Why would Phil lie about Scarlett being the online console? Why would he want to have two consoles of varying levels launch at once when devs would have to make games for both?

The only way this could work is if Lockhart comes out 2-3 years after Scarlett's launch otherwise that would be confusing to the average consumer and may screw up Scarletts power advantage. But again I ask, why is kotaku the only one with this story? If it's true that would mean Phil lied but there is no reason for him to do so.

Somethings off.

I agree. No way this thing can work for MS. It's ONLY bad news.
 

Grinchy

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The disc-less Xbox One is just a regular Xbox One with the drive removed and a giant gaping hole inside where it used to be. Same mold, same everything. Just one less feature and no upside.

If they do that again for this one, I will officially have no idea what they are thinking anymore.
 

mckmas8808

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The disc-less Xbox One is just a regular Xbox One with the drive removed and a giant gaping hole inside where it used to be. Same mold, same everything. Just one less feature and no upside.

If they do that again for this one, I will officially have no idea what they are thinking anymore.

This one is also suppose to have a GPU and CPU that's 40% slower or smaller too.
 

GermanZepp

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I'd glady buy the disc-less version if it's a little cheaper.

I like the idea of a discless console if:

*Is cheaper
*Has better storage
*Uptaded pro consumer software licening agreement.
*some free online service, like multiplayer or streaming, free games.
 
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I don't recall him giving a straight "no", but rather giving a vague answer suggesting two different specs would be difficult or something.

I'll eat my balls if they announce two new sets of specs we haven't had before. I think there are two realistic scenarios:

1. Scarlett is scarlett, and lockhart is just a revised X with or without disc.
2. They release two Scarlett-specced consoles; one without disc tray.

I don't get the major hysteria in here, both of these options would be fine to me. Let's not jump straight to worst case scenario.
 
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I said this in another thread:

IF, if lockheart is back im convinced Microsoft have no idea, long term plan, or vision for their next gen console. If Lockheart is back this is another example, like they've done all generation, of throwing crap against the wall to see/hope something sticks.

This statement doesn't make sense, you do realize that the Xbox One All Digital is the test to see if it works right? The third worse selling SKU?
 

NickFire

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The most recent comment I saw from the MS guy looked like dancing to me, which I'm pretty sure I noted at the time. This rumor resurfacing is no surprise, and fits well with the suggestion that they don't expect to get beat by power / price. CPU's will be the same, letting MS run marketing campaign of same power for less money. Any gpu differences will be explained by this machine is for most people, and this one targets 4k 60fps is my bet.
 

TheGreatYosh

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It's smart for them to release a cheaper disk-less console, because a lot of people will only get one as a secondary console, and buying all their disks for PS5 anyway.
 
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Bladed Thesis

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I love the idea of a disc less console IF it is SMALLER!!! The new Discless XB1 is literally the same size which is crazy.
If it was like 1/2 the size and easier to travel with I’d be all about it!
Honestly, the current discless One is such a lazy design. Should've been much smaller and thinner with a sleeker build. Removing the disctray mount and just putting plastic over the disc slot was just pure laziness and was one of the things that ruined the product for me.
 
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The most recent comment I saw from the MS guy looked like dancing to me, which I'm pretty sure I noted at the time. This rumor resurfacing is no surprise, and fits well with the suggestion that they don't expect to get beat by power / price. CPU's will be the same, letting MS run marketing campaign of same power for less money. Any gpu differences will be explained by this machine is for most people, and this one targets 4k 60fps is my bet.

Did you even read what you write? None of this is happening.
 
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Lort

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What a great summary of everything we have known for 12 months., without anything new!

oh apart from everyone now agrees Google Stadia is DOA.
 
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Did you drink too much coffee again? Or do you really believe they will sell two next gen sku's with a disc drive being the only difference beyond storage size?

Or the reality that there will only be one console at launch, and IF there is a discless version it will be years later.
,
You are basically saying MS will do thing that already has evidence not to work, it's not happening. They aren't going to dual market to consoles at launch based on the CPU and make the flagship the premium version and make the weaker one the mainstream version, that's drug hallucination levels of nonsense.
 
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Mochilador

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This is a goddamn shame if true. If the PC market has shown us anything, its that having an inferior version of a product available on the market causes all games developed for that market to be severely downscaled to the lower performing version.
Not in this case. The only difference is that one version would be disc-less, just like the Xbox One S All Digital.
 

Bladed Thesis

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Not in this case. The only difference is that one version would be disc-less, just like the Xbox One S All Digital.
My post was sarcasm, commenting on the thought process that developing games for systems with wide ranges in performance is some game-breaking "mistake." It truly has been the status quo in PC gaming for at least the last fifteen years. In regards to one just being discless, the Verge article clearly states a performance difference and a resolution target difference between the rumored two Xbox next gen systems.
 

Bladed Thesis

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It's also way less powerful, same power as a PS4 Pro. It's not a next gen console....
Even if it has the increase from NAVI Tflops, a better GPU and standardized SSD? Inferior "next gen" surely if true but not next gen at all?
 
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NickFire

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Or the reality that there will only be one console at launch, and IF there is a discless version it will be years later.
,
You are basically saying MS will do thing that already has evidence not to work, it's not happening. They aren't going to dual market to consoles at launch based on the CPU and make the flagship the premium version and make the weaker one the mainstream version, that's drug hallucination levels of nonsense.

Of course the disc won't be the only difference. The cheaper one will have a cheaper gpu as well.

And there is plenty of reason to question whether the cheap version is treated as the mainstream one. For instance, it they want to announce a much cheaper starting price on an E3 cage, and then market how cheap it is. And it would fit nicely with gamepass and streaming too.

Will my hunch prove true? No way to tell right now. But to say I'm off base because I wonder whether a streaming company who wants to win on price will make a cheaper version their main version, seems unwarranted.

Don't forget how crazy Wii probably sounded at first. A machine with last gen specs that you wave wands at?
 
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Bladed Thesis

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Of course the disc won't be the only difference. The cheaper one will have a cheaper gpu as well.

And there is plenty of reason to question whether the cheap version is treated as the mainstream one. For instance, it they want to announce a much cheaper starting price on an E3 cage, and then market how cheap it is. And it would fit nicely with gamepass and streaming too.

Will my hunch prove true? No way to tell right now. But to say I'm off base because I wonder whether a streaming company who wants to win on price will make a cheaper version their main version, seems unwarranted.

Don't forget how crazy Wii probably sounded at first. A machine with last gen specs that you wave wands at?
The Witcher running on Switch is proof that people can work wonders. "Running"
 
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ThaMonkeyClaw

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I would be totally fine if Sony also released two SKUs with the PS5, one with a optical drive and one without. I am full digital on my games and the only reason I want the optical drive is for my 4K blu-ray collection, which I know some people could care less about, so why not save a few bucks going with a discless version for them, as long as they don't compromise on any of the other system specs.
 
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