Tricky I Shadow
Banned
Amir0x said:
Sounds exactly like L.A Noire to me.
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L.A. Noire vs Heavy Rain: let's discuss!
- Thread starter chubigans
- Start date
Sounds exactly like L.A Noire to me.
Rahxephon91
Banned
What are they then?Tricky I Shadow said:
Amir0x said:
2 minutes huh? Good to see you're still riding the fact train.
I turn shit movies off at the 10 minute mark. Either you're a genuine masochist or HR must have been doing something right for you to sit there through all 10+ hours of it.
Ulairi said:
Hyperbolic crap like this isn't helping anyone's argument.
HK-47 said:
Heavy Rain should be tried and convicted for doing actual harm to the game industry. I blame it, the critics who turned their minds off while reviewing it, and the gamers who were in awe of it. The first victim of Heavy Rain is Tomb Raider and we should all be angry about what is being done to that game.
Ulairi said:
Again, but he did articulate why. He did it in terms of what it made him feel. He felt fear, he felt tenderness, whatever. That's him articulating why. He's doing this in spite of all the negative qualities he admits the game has. I rolled my eyes at a lot of the stuff in Heavy Rain, but I'm not going to tell this dude that his experience was invalid because it doesn't match up to my own.
TruePrime said:
Well, that's the thing. 'Badness' in videogames isn't an intrinsic quality. It's a matter of opinion. I mean, the whole Dudebro thing started because cuyahoga was defending a Babiez game.
Oh, sure. But what if someone told you that you were wrong for liking those characters? That's what we're seeing here.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for someone saying 'man, you have shitty taste' (okay, maybe less aggressively than that). At least then we're clear that we're pitting different senses of taste.
Tutomos
Member
Amir0x said:
Yes, Amir0x. David Cage knows you are going to pull the trigger on that helpless Hobo that your partner was interrogating. He wants you to suspect Ethan as the killer of his own son. He wants you to completely trust Shelby as an benign detective genuinely trying to help. His methods were preemptive, but nonetheless he succeeded in what he set out to do: made you care even for only one moment.
Fusebox said:
10 hours?
LMFAO. Heavy Rain is 10 hours if you fell asleep for five hours.
The two minute comment, as anyone familiar with the English language knows, is hyperbole-for-effect. My final play through of Heavy Rain was 4 hours and 30 some odd minutes, I forgot the exact minute count. On my first try I got the very best ending possible in the game.
The reason I sat through Heavy Rain for that long is because of one simple thing. Because it was so bad, I wanted to see if it would keep getting worse.
It did.
Tutomos said:
Except I didn't care for even a single moment. About anything. Except I sat there laughing at literally scene after scene because it was blowing my mind with how bad it was.
Tricky I Shadow
Banned
Amir0x said:
Again, you're confusing the ability to spot objective evidence for a position with being able to create an objective interpretation of the art as a whole. You're being entirely ridiculous, yet I'm now convinced you actually are of the belief that you are in the right here. That somehow, because you will it hard enough, the definition of the term 'fact' and centuries of understanding of the critique of art are rendered moot by your words.Amir0x said:
You're not intellectually debating, you're simply someone who happens to hold the more dependable position steamrolling that position forward. You can, of course, find a ton of evidence to support this position, but you're under the mistaken impression that this makes your position correct on any level other than the subjective.
I am at least 70% of the way through LA Noire and Beat Heavy Rain twice.
As an aside I found it funny that Heavy Rain was shat on so much to prop up LA Noire, or when crusaders of either side accuse the other game of 'not being a game', since they're both far more similar than they are different.
Each title does things better and worse than the other that should be considered key to making a good adventure game, and that really what both of these titles are, and because so much of what makes these title appealing or not is pretty subjective to the person experiencing them, I doubt that there's going to be many concessions between each group.
I think I'm just going to talk about what each title sucks at first.
Heavy Rain has major plot, writing, and acting issues that are further hurt by the technology used to represent those performances on screen. To be fair to the writing and plot holes, they were intending that the game have endings where any one of your main characters could in fact be the killer, but were running out of time/money, necessitating a patch work job that shows its problems.
LA Noire is obsessed with showing how great its actors are resembled on screen, but comes across as extremely impersonal in the story telling. Why should we care about Phelps? Unless the game has some amazing twists near the end that I haven't gotten to, I'm ready to say that the game and the structure of the cases really hurt the overall potential of the product. It's few and far between that you actually end up caring for the victims and empathizing with their family simply because cases move by far far too quickly. How many times have I heard that Phelps has a wife, yet I never get to see her? Somewhat oddly, though, the overall pacing of LA feels very decompressed, even though you're zipping from case to case, the overall plot moves at a snails pace, and shares with Heavy Rain some serious logic issues here and there, especially
and how slowly characters come to realizations during that arc. To build on that LA Noire has some serious problems with investing you in the cases, not only because of the rapid fire case pacing but also because of how darn easy they are when it comes down to interrogations.
The B plot that you see in flashbacks and newspapers unfolds far too slowly over too long a period of time for you to really get into the events themselves, and because the main story telling of LA Noire is so impersonal, the token line here or there that is meant to tie these two stories together falls flat and just isn't enough. It makes a connection, but that's about all it does.
The end result, is that as an experience, LA Noire feels slow, empty, and superficial, but it is occasionally punctuated by some very nice performances, or a case here and there that lives up to the promise of the opening narration, or least feels as though it it touching upon those ideas.
As far as gameplay goes, LA Noire is fairly simplistic, almost to a fault, but it's aim isn't complex gameplay, but to immerse you in what's happening on screen. it has an almost insultingly paper thin world to explore, if only to allow it to sort of be called open world. I do appreciate the greater focus of the experience over a GTA, and the cases are what matters, but there's very little reason to replay this game at all, except maybe if you bungled a specific case badly and are a perfectionist, but the likelihood of that happening is very small.
---------------
Heavy Rain has a lot of areas where it's downright laughable, as oppose to outright boring/disappointing. For starters the voice acting is extremely uneven, and nowhere does this come across more potently than a certain scene with some children, or heck any children in the game period. Obviously everyone knows about the plot holes and that the game has some seriously ham fisted dialogue and heavy handed elements to it. The script is also a mess, with certain elements dropped outright or shoehorned in despite being in an unfinished state (like the scene where the bird dies somehow right at the beginning not even having a proper lead in). The end performances that we see on screen are also hit or miss, mostly due to the motion capture technique being used. If it sounds like I spent more time going over the issues of LA NOIRE, well that's because I'm playing through it at the moment and the experience is very fresh in my mind.
--------------------------------------
Overall how do these two games stack up? I find myself having enjoyed the experience of Heavy Rain more than the experience of LA NOIRE. That largely comes down to three things: The method of interaction, focus of the story, directing.
Method of interaction
My own personal slant on the story of LA NOIRE is only further made glaring by the very simplistic gameplay that complements the overall package. It's basically simplistic GTA mechanics to traverse the world, with 'press X O []' to choose your responses to NPC statements. This works well in keeping the experience moving, and I think is a necessity due to the sheer amount of stuff that happens in LA NOIRE, but the mechanics don't immerse you in what you're doing. They only function to facilitate what you're doing in the most passive way possible for the player, so they can get done.
Compare this fight in LA Noire to the following fight in Heavy Rain.
LA NOIRE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_ZS778WkAY&feature=youtu.be&hd=1&t=8m10s
Heavy Rain
http://youtu.be/c4bsKpk1YjY?hd=1&t=5m28s
Now you tell me which one seems more memorable and involved?
What good is all the stuff you do in LA NOIRE (or rather the collection of thing that are repeatedly done) when the mechanics behind it makes everything feel somewhat forgettable. This is why I like what Heavy Rain did, it tried to make every action you took, from getting a plate out to running from a man with a shotgun, feel involved.
And just for people who haven't played Heavy Rain: that you can fail those QTE's in the apartment fight, and it branches accordingly.
I prefer this in a narrative focused experience to the 'my first GTA' mechanics in LA NOIRE. The mechanics in LA NOIRE are there by necessity because of the story having so many cases, but the mechanics of Heavy Rain complement its story, something that at best can't be said for LA NOIRE.
Focus of the story
I find the more personal and focused story of Heavy Rain to be a more engaging experience than the NOIRE pulp crime generator that LA NOIRE quickly moves us through, with barely enough time to appreciate a character, or partner.
Heavy Rain, is like a worse written Rocky Balboa film, is it hokey and emotionally manipulative? Absolutely, but the end result is that it still pulls at those emotions in ways that LA NOIRE seldom manages to achieve, if ever. There's no reason for us to care about Phelps as a person, we never see anything in his personal life and any real insights into who he is that allow us to relate to him as much more than the detective archetype that he was designed to be.
Where as Heavy Rain tries to give us every reason and way to relate to the main characters in it's story, from scenes with Ethan and his children, to Shelby being forced to care for a baby. Heavy Rain succeeds in humanizing it's central players, where as the central players of LA NOIRE are props to move the player from case to case; never given enough time or quality exposition (with the exception of Finbarr) to really grow on you.
They're immaculately acted, and their writing is good, but they're given little to actually work with, since 90% of everything they say is only relevant to the plot at hand and does little to endear them to you as people.
Directing
The presentation of Heavy Rain is done is such a way to attempt to be very personal, where as LA NOIRE is extremely detached. Every scene in Heavy Rain is specifically directed to play out as though it were a scene from a film, but played as a game with that does everything it can from a directors perspective to give the player a sense of immersion in acting out the scene.
LA NOIRE is a simplistic game that is occasionally broken up by cutscenes, Heavy Rain is one continuous cutscene, that strives to keep you are in control almost the entire time.
In LA NOIRE your mistakes are meaningless. You can completely bomb every case in the game and you will continue to get promoted regardless. In Heavy Rain, your mistakes and choices are yours, and directly impact on the outcome of the story.
Go back to that Heavy Rain Youtube video and watch it in its entirety. Look at how much it tries to make you sympathize with the woman in the video who lost her son, or how the set and music and lighting, punctuated with the various camera angles give it a very cinematic experience. The way they choose to tell their story is far more effective than a shot reverse shot interrogation between a character we are given no reason to care about and a victim that we are never given enough time to care for.
As an aside I found it funny that Heavy Rain was shat on so much to prop up LA Noire, or when crusaders of either side accuse the other game of 'not being a game', since they're both far more similar than they are different.
Each title does things better and worse than the other that should be considered key to making a good adventure game, and that really what both of these titles are, and because so much of what makes these title appealing or not is pretty subjective to the person experiencing them, I doubt that there's going to be many concessions between each group.
I think I'm just going to talk about what each title sucks at first.
Heavy Rain has major plot, writing, and acting issues that are further hurt by the technology used to represent those performances on screen. To be fair to the writing and plot holes, they were intending that the game have endings where any one of your main characters could in fact be the killer, but were running out of time/money, necessitating a patch work job that shows its problems.
LA Noire is obsessed with showing how great its actors are resembled on screen, but comes across as extremely impersonal in the story telling. Why should we care about Phelps? Unless the game has some amazing twists near the end that I haven't gotten to, I'm ready to say that the game and the structure of the cases really hurt the overall potential of the product. It's few and far between that you actually end up caring for the victims and empathizing with their family simply because cases move by far far too quickly. How many times have I heard that Phelps has a wife, yet I never get to see her? Somewhat oddly, though, the overall pacing of LA feels very decompressed, even though you're zipping from case to case, the overall plot moves at a snails pace, and shares with Heavy Rain some serious logic issues here and there, especially
(concerning the Dhialli murders)
The B plot that you see in flashbacks and newspapers unfolds far too slowly over too long a period of time for you to really get into the events themselves, and because the main story telling of LA Noire is so impersonal, the token line here or there that is meant to tie these two stories together falls flat and just isn't enough. It makes a connection, but that's about all it does.
The end result, is that as an experience, LA Noire feels slow, empty, and superficial, but it is occasionally punctuated by some very nice performances, or a case here and there that lives up to the promise of the opening narration, or least feels as though it it touching upon those ideas.
As far as gameplay goes, LA Noire is fairly simplistic, almost to a fault, but it's aim isn't complex gameplay, but to immerse you in what's happening on screen. it has an almost insultingly paper thin world to explore, if only to allow it to sort of be called open world. I do appreciate the greater focus of the experience over a GTA, and the cases are what matters, but there's very little reason to replay this game at all, except maybe if you bungled a specific case badly and are a perfectionist, but the likelihood of that happening is very small.
---------------
Heavy Rain has a lot of areas where it's downright laughable, as oppose to outright boring/disappointing. For starters the voice acting is extremely uneven, and nowhere does this come across more potently than a certain scene with some children, or heck any children in the game period. Obviously everyone knows about the plot holes and that the game has some seriously ham fisted dialogue and heavy handed elements to it. The script is also a mess, with certain elements dropped outright or shoehorned in despite being in an unfinished state (like the scene where the bird dies somehow right at the beginning not even having a proper lead in). The end performances that we see on screen are also hit or miss, mostly due to the motion capture technique being used. If it sounds like I spent more time going over the issues of LA NOIRE, well that's because I'm playing through it at the moment and the experience is very fresh in my mind.
--------------------------------------
Overall how do these two games stack up? I find myself having enjoyed the experience of Heavy Rain more than the experience of LA NOIRE. That largely comes down to three things: The method of interaction, focus of the story, directing.
Method of interaction
My own personal slant on the story of LA NOIRE is only further made glaring by the very simplistic gameplay that complements the overall package. It's basically simplistic GTA mechanics to traverse the world, with 'press X O []' to choose your responses to NPC statements. This works well in keeping the experience moving, and I think is a necessity due to the sheer amount of stuff that happens in LA NOIRE, but the mechanics don't immerse you in what you're doing. They only function to facilitate what you're doing in the most passive way possible for the player, so they can get done.
Compare this fight in LA Noire to the following fight in Heavy Rain.
LA NOIRE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_ZS778WkAY&feature=youtu.be&hd=1&t=8m10s
Heavy Rain
http://youtu.be/c4bsKpk1YjY?hd=1&t=5m28s
Now you tell me which one seems more memorable and involved?
What good is all the stuff you do in LA NOIRE (or rather the collection of thing that are repeatedly done) when the mechanics behind it makes everything feel somewhat forgettable. This is why I like what Heavy Rain did, it tried to make every action you took, from getting a plate out to running from a man with a shotgun, feel involved.
And just for people who haven't played Heavy Rain: that you can fail those QTE's in the apartment fight, and it branches accordingly.
I prefer this in a narrative focused experience to the 'my first GTA' mechanics in LA NOIRE. The mechanics in LA NOIRE are there by necessity because of the story having so many cases, but the mechanics of Heavy Rain complement its story, something that at best can't be said for LA NOIRE.
Focus of the story
I find the more personal and focused story of Heavy Rain to be a more engaging experience than the NOIRE pulp crime generator that LA NOIRE quickly moves us through, with barely enough time to appreciate a character, or partner.
Heavy Rain, is like a worse written Rocky Balboa film, is it hokey and emotionally manipulative? Absolutely, but the end result is that it still pulls at those emotions in ways that LA NOIRE seldom manages to achieve, if ever. There's no reason for us to care about Phelps as a person, we never see anything in his personal life and any real insights into who he is that allow us to relate to him as much more than the detective archetype that he was designed to be.
Where as Heavy Rain tries to give us every reason and way to relate to the main characters in it's story, from scenes with Ethan and his children, to Shelby being forced to care for a baby. Heavy Rain succeeds in humanizing it's central players, where as the central players of LA NOIRE are props to move the player from case to case; never given enough time or quality exposition (with the exception of Finbarr) to really grow on you.
They're immaculately acted, and their writing is good, but they're given little to actually work with, since 90% of everything they say is only relevant to the plot at hand and does little to endear them to you as people.
Directing
The presentation of Heavy Rain is done is such a way to attempt to be very personal, where as LA NOIRE is extremely detached. Every scene in Heavy Rain is specifically directed to play out as though it were a scene from a film, but played as a game with that does everything it can from a directors perspective to give the player a sense of immersion in acting out the scene.
LA NOIRE is a simplistic game that is occasionally broken up by cutscenes, Heavy Rain is one continuous cutscene, that strives to keep you are in control almost the entire time.
In LA NOIRE your mistakes are meaningless. You can completely bomb every case in the game and you will continue to get promoted regardless. In Heavy Rain, your mistakes and choices are yours, and directly impact on the outcome of the story.
Go back to that Heavy Rain Youtube video and watch it in its entirety. Look at how much it tries to make you sympathize with the woman in the video who lost her son, or how the set and music and lighting, punctuated with the various camera angles give it a very cinematic experience. The way they choose to tell their story is far more effective than a shot reverse shot interrogation between a character we are given no reason to care about and a victim that we are never given enough time to care for.
bender
What time is it?
After spending time with LA Noire (I finished the homicide desk before quitting on the game), I understand how those that dislike Heavy Rain feel. Neither have great stories and most issues people leverage against Heavy Rain could e pinned on LA Noire as well. I appreciate that Heavy Rain tried to get the player invested in its characters. How successful that attempt was is debatable. It's something I wish Team Bondi would have tried with LA Noire. Maybe I could have forgiven Cole's violent mode swings during investigations or how oblivious he was while being funneled down a predictable murder mystery. I know I didn't come close to finishing the game and maybe that's something else in favor of Heavy Rain as that ride was over rather quickly.
obonicus said:
Being told I have shitty taste happens all the time, I don't give a damn because it is exactly that. My taste, no one elses, if I couldn't take one on to the chops then my opinion certainly isn't very strong.
Also, no one is saying that those who like Heavy Rain are bad people, or that they shouldn't have their opinion, or it is some how invalid. If it was then I could understand this mindset.
Plotholes and out of place Material is going to get called out for being badly written at the very least, trying to act like our favorite thing (FF VIII/XIII for me or Heavy Rain for others) is crazy, bad writting is bad writting.
If it can touch you, or if you can connect with something despite it having issues then more power to you. I'm like this with alot of things I enjoy but sometimes you need to be critical of things you like just as much as things you don't.
Edit:
Don't get me wrong, I don't even know if the writting is "bad " or no in Heavy Rain. I can say that I made it up to right after the first black out and the Decetive/Hooker scene and I couldn't take any more of the characters I didn't care about or the fact it really felt like torture to play it because it handled like Garbage and was a QTE fest.
Amir0x, you were ten minutes shy from doing a speed run.Amir0x said:
http://www.archive.org/details/HeavyRainSpeedrunCodyMiller
But I'm sure you were exaggerating the four and a half hours, right? It's ok, we all make mistakes.
Excellent writeup Zen! I think I might add the best arguments in the OP.
Amir0x said:
I say this having read your review:
Considering that you aren't looking, it will be a long time indeed. You can't say that your opinion is fact, and then refuse to acknowledge anyone that brings up valid points or counter points and then be surprised when no one wants to waste their time with you. No one is saying that you're wrong when it comes to how poorly the story was delivered in its final form.
chubigans said:Amir0x, you were ten minutes shy from doing a speed run.
http://www.archive.org/details/HeavyRainSpeedrunCodyMiller
But I'm sure you were exaggerating the four and a half hours, right? It's ok, we all make mistakes.
Excellent writeup Zen! I think I might add the best arguments in the OP.
Well then I'm a speed runner. I didn't think it was possible to go any slower? The game literally pulls you from scene to scene? You only stop for a few seconds to investigate with Norman and all you do is scan the ground briefly and all clues are found in short order.
Not sure what is supposed to be holding up time here. All dialogue is quick spit. There's nothing to think about. I didn't hesitate on any scene since it was obvious what to do?
I realize a large contingent of GAF hated Heavy Rain, but I quite liked it.
I was hoping that LA Noire would help me understand what GAFfers thought Heavy Rain was missing, but it really let me down.
Heavy Rain was varied and continually novel, while LA Noire was repetitive and dull. Sure, Heavy Rain had QTEs, but those were fountains of novelty compared to the boorish "tap x and rotate shit for clues," and "guess doubt or lie when interviewing this guy?"
Heavy Rain was absolutely on rails, but LA Noore gained nothing from being off them. The game was linear as hell, but didn't benefit from any of the cinematic elements that made Heavy Rain memorable and interesting.
And even if you didn't like Heavy Rain's story, at least it had a clear, unwavering arc, whereas La Noire really struggled to connect the relevance of the cases with anything broader.
I was hoping that LA Noire would help me understand what GAFfers thought Heavy Rain was missing, but it really let me down.
Heavy Rain was varied and continually novel, while LA Noire was repetitive and dull. Sure, Heavy Rain had QTEs, but those were fountains of novelty compared to the boorish "tap x and rotate shit for clues," and "guess doubt or lie when interviewing this guy?"
Heavy Rain was absolutely on rails, but LA Noore gained nothing from being off them. The game was linear as hell, but didn't benefit from any of the cinematic elements that made Heavy Rain memorable and interesting.
And even if you didn't like Heavy Rain's story, at least it had a clear, unwavering arc, whereas La Noire really struggled to connect the relevance of the cases with anything broader.
TruePrime said:
Undoubtedly: being able to be critical of something you enjoy is hugely important in actually being able to discuss it intelligently. Some of the people defending the game do admit its flaws, though, and it still had a powerful enough effect that the net result was positive.
Ulairi said:
Jeez, who'd thunk these bad games (or HR anyway, haven't played enough of LA to pass judgement) would elicit such passionate discourse? Any subject that can bring this out in people has to have some merit.
I loved HR, in the same way I loved the first 2/3 of Fahrenheit. They were ridiculous. The story is inept and hamfisted in (many) places. The characters (subjectively; one of my mates hated Ethan with a passion - mostly due to how bad the technology driving - the production - the character was, rather than the acting or writing - and killed him off ASAP on his first playthrough) were excellent, and believable, given the (as above, inept/ridiculous/hamfisted) contexts they were placed in.
So if it's 'in spite' of those things that I still managed to enjoy HR, then so be it!
Liquid Helium
Member
I think Heavy Rain embodies the idea of games as an artistic/storytelling medium more than L.A. Noire does, but I think L.A. Noire is better written. I think and hope that in ten years we will look back and say these two games were some of the most important games made this generation, it's obvious to me that videogames will eventually primarily become a storytelling medium instead of a form of escapism and "entertainment" and I feel like these games embody that philosophy, even if their execution is flawed, Heavy Rains flaw being it's poor writing and L.A. Noir's being that it did not make the full jump, opting for massive shootouts with flamethrowers in some parts and making parts of itself 'gamey', I would have significantly enjoyed the interrogation more if it did not come up with a tick or a cross at the end. I think within the next 5 to 10 years there will be a game in the vain of Heavy Rain and L.A. Noire that is well written, were your actions have consequences to the story (and not in a way were you get a 'good ending' or a 'bad ending' or make a good choice or a bad choice) and were you don't rack up a massive kill count for no reason. And I think that when that happens it will be a Beatles or moment for the medium.
Zen said:
I have responded in kind to literally hundreds upon hundreds of Heavy Rain defense attempts. Literally hundreds. This is revisionist history of such a tall order it's again personally offensive. I have spent hours of my life in Heavy Rain threads specifically deconstructing every Heavy Rain fans argument that even remotely attempted to say something positive about the story; none of them responded with anything that has ever made sense.
Trent Strong
Banned
LA Noire was boring, repetitive, poorly written, was not a game, ran like ass, had no consequences, had bad graphics with the exception of the facial animaiton, the mechanics and camera were terrible, 'doubt' = 'You're lying!!', etc. Everything about this game is terrible except for the facial animation.
Tricky I Shadow
Banned
Rahxephon91 said:
The fact that completely innocent people constantly run from you? The fact that somehow evidence was planted everywhere without anyone knowing it? The fact that the most basic of stories can be unnecessarily complicated with far too many characters and zero character development? The fact that the interrogation system is broken? The fact that pretty much everything feels disjointed? The fact that the 'conclusions' are so ridiculously underwhelming? The fact that the boss at one point yells at you and then he literally in the next scene praises you? The fact that no one gave a shit about when Cole died?
EDIT: Oh yeah, your choices in L.A Noire mean absolutely nothing.
Amir0x said:
I'm not saying it's a speed run, people that have done speed-runs are saying that it is a speed run:
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=h...s=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a
"On my 3rd playthrough I did a 'speedrun' of this game in about 4:20h."
"Speedrun of Heavy Rain in 3:50:04 discounting load times. The total run time including load time from beginning to the end of the credits is 4:18:xx"
But sure dude, call ME the liar lol...
bender said:
I could have swore I even went into the Heavy Rain thread to say I finished it in that time way back when. I'm counting my trophy time and it seems to end up around 6 hours and some minutes, but I remember I had the game paused for a long time when I waited for my fiancee to get back from the store since she wanted to see the story play out so even still the actual time would only be like 5 hours or so in game.
I'm completely cool with. My only arguement against the story is people trying to say that Plotholes and other such nonsense isn't bad writing. It is, now if the story surronding these issues are enough to make rise above the stuff on the negative end then awesome.obonicus said:
Same with the controls, if those things actually enhanced the experince for people then sweet, I just can't bring myself to understand it or agree.
Overall I'm more miffed about Silent Hill Shattere Memories not even being brought up in the OP despite how much effort went into it's story and the fact it came out before either Heavy Rain or LA Noir.
Slurmer said:
you can at the end can't you? Get shot by the police
kodt said:
Fascinating. It's not that you have to justify it; it's that if you around claiming that people criticizing the game are saying something that is false or call us out by saying we're haters then you have to stand by your word and defend it.
If you don't get involved in those debates and just say "I like it", more power to you. It's not a defense of the game.
I played and beat both.
As an experience, fresh, original, unique and amazing Heavy Rain is better for me. I liked LA Noir but i felt like it was too long, i loved it at the begining but towards the end i just want it to end and move on.
For me Heavy Rain was amazing from begining to end, plot holes and all it was amazing.
As an experience, fresh, original, unique and amazing Heavy Rain is better for me. I liked LA Noir but i felt like it was too long, i loved it at the begining but towards the end i just want it to end and move on.
For me Heavy Rain was amazing from begining to end, plot holes and all it was amazing.
I liked Heavy Rain more. It never overstayed its welcome and it knew what it wanted to do, while remaining interesting as it progressed. I got bored to death with LA Noire after the first 4-6 hours where I felt I had seen everything this game had to offer.
Different strokes for different folks, because the games are vastly different and each have their own flaws.
Different strokes for different folks, because the games are vastly different and each have their own flaws.
Despera said:
and we've already gone down the road in this topic
"how is it engaging?"
"it made me FEEL STUFF"
"but how if the characters, plot and writing were so awful? How can you connect to these aspects in a game that is only story if it's all so poorly written?"
"Because I do! It's about MOMENTS, man! Moments! It was tense in these MOMENTS!"
That's not a defense of the position. It's just like saying "becuz I do." In which case, is this the topic for you?
Amir0x said:
I never called anyone who dislikes the game a hater. I am not asking you to defend your position.
I admit there are some really dumb plot holes. I still enjoyed the game. You can say I am factually wrong, but the truth is I liked it. I'm sorry this offends you so much.
NotTheGuyYouKill
Member
Amir0x said:
You can get him to hang himself if arrested by the police a little earlier in the game.
The Xtortionist
Member
Ulairi said:
Because most of the one-off stuff on God of War would be incredibly unintuitive and frustrating to control manually?
Amir0x said:
yep, but just saying, if his friend killed him off ASAP, then his friend had him killed him off in the ending, and i don't really consider that "killing him off". you can fail all of the trials, and play as carelessly with ethan as you please, but he will always make it to the ending.