-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Lets See What GAF Was Saying About PS2 A Little Before Launch...
- Thread starter Cheebs
- Start date
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
xaosslug said:Seriously, why don't paaps want Playstation to rule supreme for another gen? Is it all out of spite? 600$? They've been nothing but good to me, personally.
cause they're ARROGANT!!!
and they took out RUMBLE!!! THEY MUST BURN FOR THAT!!
xaosslug said:Seriously, why don't paaps want Playstation to rule supreme for another gen? Is it all out of spite? 600$? They've been nothing but good to me, personally.
I think people are fairly comfortable with Sony's sales numbers. But any one of these companies that isn't attacked from all angles (by the press, not us) isn't learning how to lead.
Stoney Mason
Banned
xaosslug said:
I don't see why any consumers would want any company "ruling" the industry. Competition breeds better products. Monopolies suck. I think the worst country to be a gamer in is Japan. Basically all you have for home console in Japan is Playstation, hopefully Wii will give gamers an alternative there. In America PC, Xbox, Gamecube, and PS2 were all viable. This is the best place to be a gamer cause we have the most choice. I think the sole focus on PS2 game development in Japan has seriously hurt the abilities of the Japanese game developers compared to the rest of the world.
DarknessTear
Banned
History repeats itself.
---- said:
The best PS2 games are arguably from Japan devs and Japanese publishers...
Theres certainly lots of doom and gloom for PS3 but the PS2 got its backslash too. Most consoles that don't receive some backslash are the ones that seem to flounder. Gamecube and PSP didn't recieve the amount of bad press at launch that the X360, PS2 and the upcoming PS3 got/are getting.
For this reason I kinda think the Wii will have a hard time post launch...
In the end I think Sony will once again have a success with the PS3. It may start slow (like the PS2) but in the end I think everything will shape up for it (like the PS2).
radioheadrule83 said:I'll take this one if I may Speevy
Seriously, good points of discussion...
1) It took Gamecube and Xbox a full year to reach the 10 million userbase that DC had acquired upto that point. And yes, it had great first party SEGA support, but as we now know, a lack of EA support can render a console fatally redundant. Even if it didn't make the console gimped in terms of support, SEGA just couldn't support the machine. Prior console failures had sucked them dry. For their money, they quite wisely cut and run.
2) I don't believe there's a trend here. I believe that 360 will compete favourably at Christmas. Its got big titles on the way, and Sony won't be able to produce enough PS3s to meet demand (as is normal for such a launch)
3) I believe he was saying that Dreamcast was pure gaming Vs Sony's convergent model for PS2. This time both Microsoft and Sony have highly competitive online / media models.
4) I remember people giving PS2 graphics a hard time too at first. But I remember it as something of a backlash. Are you going to deny that it was one of the most hyped launches of all time? Remember the pushing and the riots on launch days across the world? The shortage? Possibly manufactured? It was insane. Despite any retarded 'jaggy' talk back then, people at GAF and IGN and in the real world were more excited about PS2 than any other platform. I'm not sure thats the case for PS3 at all.
5) I think this remains to be seen. They're still going to have phenomenal support, but I don't see any publisher turning their nose up at the Xbox 360 userbase any time soon.
6) Its more complicated now though isn't it? Both consoles have multiple SKUs. Different featuresets. And we're in a whole new ballpark now in terms of price, its unprecedented. Nintendo may have taken themselves out of this race, but you have to concede that this Christmas there may be a new console on offer that is $300+ cheaper than PS3.
Tom
1) I don't get your argument about Sega's money problems. This is not a thread about the future of 360. And EA mattered in USA a lot Europe much less and Japan zero.
2) Well I see very good sales in USA and bad in the other two regions for 360. But it's not like USA can make up for the failure in the other two regions. Also we won't be able to make this comparison for long since the cancelation DC rumors started after a year+ of DC's launch.
3) Well PS3 is more media oriented than 360 don't you agree? Not to mention that if the Linux rumors are true it'll be a lot more.
4) You sound like the PS3 launch already happened and didn't have enormous amounts of hype. Wait till Sony's colossal marketing and PR hype machine once again starts to make judgement. As for graphics I think we pretty much agree that before launch and some months after it DC was considered equal if not better by many.
5) It still has the best lineup. That's what matters.
6) I don't think Sony is to be concerned for Wii in any other region but Japan. Not to mention Wii's old technology will become more apparent by the years. It's like looking at N64 when PS2 launched and after 2 years. Situation is way more complicated as far as prices are concerned though, I give you that.
PepsimanVsJoe
Member
In a perfect world all three consoles would each have 33.3% marketshare and system wars would be fought over that remaining .1%.
Unfortunately that is not the case. I expect PS3 to dominate again. Not to say I'm happy about it, but I figure as long as the sky is blue and the grass Sony will continue to control the console market. I don't like their methods but y'know they are backed by some of the best game developers in the world.
I probably said something like this last gen when the PS2 was poised to smash my poor DC into dogfood.
Also I support the X360 because green is my favorite color. If the PS3 came out with an all-green console with green controllers I would buy it at launch and probably pay twice as much for it.
Unfortunately that is not the case. I expect PS3 to dominate again. Not to say I'm happy about it, but I figure as long as the sky is blue and the grass Sony will continue to control the console market. I don't like their methods but y'know they are backed by some of the best game developers in the world.
I probably said something like this last gen when the PS2 was poised to smash my poor DC into dogfood.
Also I support the X360 because green is my favorite color. If the PS3 came out with an all-green console with green controllers I would buy it at launch and probably pay twice as much for it.
soul creator
Member
Speevy said:
Dreamcast had the better online service! :lol
I hope that no one in this topic is taking these quotes seriously. Just because some people were wrong and others right then, does not make them anymore likely to be wrong or right now. It's best to just have a good laugh and move along, trying to infer anything out of this is just foolishness.
People did this exact same thing with the PSP. They took inaccurate predictions about the PS2 and compared those quotes to what people were saying about the PSP (even when most people thought the PSP was going to do fairly well at the time). If we made a thread, "Lets See What GAF Was Saying About PSP A Little Before Launch... " then we'd have to assume that the PS3 is doomed!!! The situation between the PS2 and PSP was different, just as the situation between the PS2 and PS3 is different. This thread is pointless.
People did this exact same thing with the PSP. They took inaccurate predictions about the PS2 and compared those quotes to what people were saying about the PSP (even when most people thought the PSP was going to do fairly well at the time). If we made a thread, "Lets See What GAF Was Saying About PSP A Little Before Launch... " then we'd have to assume that the PS3 is doomed!!! The situation between the PS2 and PSP was different, just as the situation between the PS2 and PS3 is different. This thread is pointless.
radioheadrule83
Banned
JJConrad said:
Well put. I agree.
Speevy said:
Yeah but when all these quotes were written xbox and GC didn't really matter and the info was limited about these consoles. I think you're expanding the thread discussion more to a DC-360 comparison rather than PS2-PS3 comparison it's really intended for.
In other words the purpose of the thread is to rub these quotes in the face of Sony haters who imply that PS3 has "big problems to overcome" and other bullshit, and not to piss off xbox fans with 360-DC comparisons.
sonycowboy
Member
Speevy said:
:lol :lol
How can you be "High-End Middle" with 3 competitors
Sales: ??? (but mediocre at best so far)
Graphics: 2nd
Features: 2nd or 3rd (GCN has virtual console & controller, 360 has Live & Media Center Integration)
Support: 2nd or 3rd (Sony still #1, Wii still #3 but is picking up support)
Zombie James
Banned
JJConrad said:
It's pointless to compare consoles with handhelds, totally different markets.
sonycowboy said::lol :lol
How can you be "High-End Middle" with 3 competitors
Sales: ??? (but mediocre at best so far)
Graphics: 2nd
Features: 2nd or 3rd (GCN has virtual console & controller, 360 has Live & Media Center Integration)
Support: 2nd or 3rd (Sony still #1, Wii still #3 but is picking up support)
I said "of the three competitors" Each is a competitor to another.
The 360 has more features than the Wii.
And if you don't think the 360 has more support than Nintendo, well, I guess you haven't been paying attention for 5 years. Also, since when do you turn hypotheticals into facts? There are more games announced for the 360, far more, and there were even more games announced 3 months before launch.
blindrocket
Member
Wow, some of that is exactly what's being said now! :lol
sonycowboy
Member
Speevy said:
I was just playing on the support, but the Wii controller is MUCH more than a single feature. And while Live Arcade is good, as a featureset, the virtual console with thousands of classic games is worth quite a bit more.
If you're trying to match features, the Wii does pretty well by comparison.
Link648099 said:Except things were very different then. Nintendo didn't have a viable alternative to Sony's sloppyness and now they do. And Microsoft didn't appear to have much of a prayer, which they do in America. Just because reactions might be similar does not represent a quantitative comparison.
The Xbox wasn't even out yet...
JJConrad said:
You mean just like it happens now with optimistic Wii predictions because of DS's success?
The only thing I learnt from this post is that handhelds and consoles should never be mixed to make predictions. Handhelds is a totally different market. If that's your point then I agree.
sonycowboy
Member
BorkBork said:
That's true, but the FUD stays the same
He Wants Chalupas
Banned
There was bad PS2 press? I remeber nothing but raves... then again I was an OPM subscriber._leech_ said:
sonycowboy said:
The Virtual Console is about games the most of us have already played before, and may still own... sure it's great to download the games you may have missed out on back then, but other than that, they're the same games... not to mention that we don't know how much these downloads will cost - as old as they may be, Nintendo still probably regards them as full games, not little downloadables that can be downloaded for cheap...
I've heard that there will be indie games there as well, but I haven't heard too much about that since back then...
With XBL Arcade, you get brand new titles, and the games we already know actually get graphical facelifts and the great bonus of online play - we won't be playing virtual console games online either...
I'd venture to say PS2 had a worse E3 prior to its launch then PS3 did, there were like no decent games, and Dreamcast was rockin pretty hard at that point. This place used to be a lot worse with Sony hate before a lot of those guys got banished to that other forum. It's funny to see how deranged some people become when they go over their and show their true colors as people. ( not just referring to games now )
Mainstream media was much more enthusastic about PS2 than PS3. The media has been very negative about PS3 since E3. I think the price really soured a lot of people on PS3. As much as the E3 2006 demos didn't match up to the E3 2005 ones I still think the media would have been very forgiving had the PS3 been only $300 or something. I think the fact that Microsoft has spent a lot of time and money courting the media and bloggers has had a slight effect as well on how the media treats Sony now.He Wants Chalupas said:
He Wants Chalupas said:
The lack of games, jaggies, unbelievable Sony hate especially from deranged Sega fans , the console was "ugly" etc etc. Oh yes there was. The last two were mentioned mostly at forums but they still did some damage.
Actually "jaggies!!!!" is the old "600$$$ lol"
travisbickle
Member
wait for TGS, you can quote me on that, they'll be a lot of tears and tantrums and we'll see what all the companies have install for the next 12 months.
Zombie James
Banned
He Wants Chalupas said:
- Cost.
- Dreamcast.
- Aliasing.
- Unimpressive titles.
- Shortages.
- Analyst doom & gloom.
And i'm probably missing some.
I think its pretty obvious that the 360 is a much more viable competitor than the DC ever was. Sega had a pretty specific following that been severely injured by serious hardware idiocy. The saturn was a pretty big flop, and the Dreamcast's fanbase was never even a real threat to the PS2.
I'm not declaring a winner of this new generation, of course. But I think the 360 has a much better chance than the Dreamcast could have even hoped for.
I'm not declaring a winner of this new generation, of course. But I think the 360 has a much better chance than the Dreamcast could have even hoped for.
Moneyhats2k5
Member
Ajax said:
Costs twice as much (300 vs 150), 2 controller ports, no online out of the box, DOA2 DC > DOA2 PS2.
Everyone is going to buy it for DVD movies, DC is gamer's machine, etc etc.
Fun times on IGN defending Sony and preeching the future of FFX, GT3, and MGS2.
Sega fanboys thought Head Hunter was a MGS killer at that time (early 2000). :lol :lol :lol
sonycowboy
Member
---- said:
Agreed.
By and large the media was very friendly and certainly bought into the PS2 hype. There were certainly stories about how expensive the PS2 would be for Sony ($450-$500+), how the shortages were likely to hit (and they did), and how weak the launch software was.
IMO, Sony would be enjoying tremendous press right now, if not for the price. The $600 (press ignores the $500 version) was like a punch to the kidneys. It actually angered folks and made them believe Sony was basking in unbelievable arrogance. The E3 2005 thing is a bit overblown, because the playable titles at E3 2006 were visually impressive and looked beyond what the 360 was showing for the most part, even if it didn't equal the videos from 2005. And, apparently every game has had substantial improvement since then, so when they launch, I think they'll get sterling reviews from a graphical standpoint (we'll have to see about gameplay).
Also, Microsoft has really done a good job marketing themselves to the press and being incredibly available to them. When the 360 was launching, Allard, Bach, and especially Moore were EVERYWHERE, giving interviews to dozens of media outlets. Access that is just about unprecedented in this industry.
This was all hardcore gamer forum based discussion. Newspapers, magazines, and media outlets were not talking about jaggies or lack of games with regard to PS2. Mainstream outlets like Newsweek were quoting developers as saying PS2 was the most important invention since the printing press and promising an experience like "jacking into the Matrix." They also always made note that PS2 would have the largest library of games. Discussion on these forums is not indicative of mainstream perception.Ajax said:
krypt0nian
Banned
TheDuce22 said:
Bearillusion
Banned
---- said:
The 360 is already dead in Japan and nothing will change that. Nothing. Sales in Europe are also very low. With the PS3 launching in Europe for about the same price the PS2 did I don't see a change.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
History always repeats itself, that's why gaf can look at the previous trends and know with absolute certainty that the same thing will happen.
I should know, i was burnt by the sony fans being able to see this historical pattern thing when we were debating launch prices. Of course, i made a fool out of myself for going for a higher price, but was made to look stupid when Kaz Hirai walked on stage and said "$299" to the backdrop of a PS3 logo at this years E3. It was EXACTLY the same as what happened last time, so i for one won't be doubting that this gen will play out exactly the same as last time. It always happens this way. Be warned!
425 GBP >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 299 GBP
I should know, i was burnt by the sony fans being able to see this historical pattern thing when we were debating launch prices. Of course, i made a fool out of myself for going for a higher price, but was made to look stupid when Kaz Hirai walked on stage and said "$299" to the backdrop of a PS3 logo at this years E3.
It was EXACTLY the same as what happened last time, so i for one won't be doubting that this gen will play out exactly the same as last time. It always happens this way. Be warned!425 GBP >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 299 GBP