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Let's talk about the friend zone

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Fudgepuppy

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Two weeks ago, I told a friend of mine that I wasn't sure if I wanted to date a specific girl. I wanted to get to know her a bit more because at that point I didn't feel like we clicked in the way I wanted to.

She said "Well hurry up and do something quick, because soon she'll put you in the friend zone".

This was so odd to hear, because I thought that among experienced people, the concept had been killed.

I remember lamenting and hating being just a friend with every girl I met in high school, but nowadays I groan at it all, thinking about how much of an idiot I was. Sure I was a nice guy, still am, but I wasn't a "nice-guy". I was just nice to people because I wanted to be, because it was the instinctual thing to be.

So let's talk about it, what are your opinions about it, do you believe in it?

Edit. To clarify I'm not looking for advice. I did take the girl out for a date, we had fun and became friends with benefits. I'm not interested in anything more.
 
I don't believe in it, but it happens to me anyways :)

On a serious level though, that shits stupid. The concept almost makes you feel like you're being but on "hold" almost. And if you like that person you kind of almost allow it to happen. It's pretty shitty.

Edit: Though sometimes the person doing the "friendzoning" doesn't realize they are and/or don't have the same feelings.
 
The "friend zone" is basically what happens when your window of opportunity for a romantic and/or sexual relationship closes.
 
The window to make something happen never closes as long as the other person is into you. And it never opens if they aren't. Time is sometimes a factor, but rarely the only one.

That being said, the best way to find out where you stand is to state your intentions clearly and respectfully. That way, if you're not on the same page, you can move on before someone gets their feelings hurt.
 
John Kowalski said:
What the difference between having someone in your friend zone and, well, being friends with someone?
Click to expand...

Friend zone = one person in the dynamic wants to be more than friends with the other person, but the other person doesn't share their feelings. They are both still content to spend time with each other in spite of (because of?) this fact.

Just friends = no desire from either person in the dynamic to be more than friends.
 
Viewt said:
The window to make something happen never closes as long as the other person is into you. And it never opens if they aren't. Time is sometimes a factor, but rarely the only one.

That being said, the best way to find out where you stand is to state your intentions clearly and respectfully. That way, if you're not on the same page, you can move on before someone gets their feelings hurt.
Click to expand...

If you're specifically talking about me and the girl, no worries, it got sorted out.
 
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
 
Fudgepuppy said:
If you're specifically talking about me and the girl, no worries, it got sorted out.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, I'm just speaking generally. If you've already told this girl what you're about, then I don't think an extra couple weeks to get to know her is going to make much of a difference.

pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

Bingo.
 
The friend zone is somewhere you put yourself and not something someone else does to you.

The "friend" in the friend zone is only in a friend zone because they want more and the object of their lust isn't attracted to them.

They then put on a pity party until they reveal their true colors as a disingenuous asshole trying a failed strategy to get laid.

It's a cage designed by the person that is usually in the friend zone.

If you want to be friends and their attraction to you doesn't matter, then you're friends. There is no friend zone.

If you want to be friends and you're attracted to them and they are not attracted to you and you say nothing about your attraction or ever explicitly act on it because you fear rejection and instead draw out the rejection process through a complicated set passive aggressive behaviors, then you are in the friend zone and it will end badly.

To avoid the friend zone you have to make a move and accept rejection or just move on emotionally.
 
Viewt said:
Oh yeah, I'm just speaking generally. If you've already told this girl what you're about, then I don't think an extra couple weeks to get to know her is going to make much of a difference.
Click to expand...

I invited her out the day after to see how I felt. We became friends with benefits.
 
pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

Hmmm. I've never heard this perspective before, very interesting. I always felt the term was weird/off putting but never considered the sexist implications of the term.
 
No one can put you in the friendzone. If you have feelings, make them clear, and be willing to walk away if you don't get the desired outcome.
 
It exists but it's different for every person. It's always best to make a romantic move as soon as you can when it's obvious and back out later if it's not working out. I used to try to be picky about my women in the sense that I was like "I dunno if it would work out between us in the long run" and let too many opportunities slip by. I fixed that a long time ago now I don't have those issues. The answer is always to go for it and then if things hit the rough patch back out in a respectful fashion. Just be super honest about the break up.
 
In my experience of peers, the friend zone is a fictional thing made up by people to justify why they never found the guts to make a move.

family_guy said:
No one can put you in the friendzone. If you have feelings, make them clear, and be willing to walk away if you don't get the desired outcome.
Click to expand...

Yep. It's not always advisable to do this, so it requires tact, but it's good advice.
 
Doesn't exist, if you manage to be friends with someone but intended to hook up then you've failed to make your intentions clear. But even from then, speaking from anecdotal experience here, you can still manage to form a romantic relationship with someone even if you started out as friends.
 
pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

Yoritomo said:
The friend zone is somewhere you put yourself and not something someone else does to you.

The "friend" in the friend zone is only in a friend zone because they want more and the object of their lust isn't attracted to them.

They then put on a pity party until they reveal their true colors as a disingenuous asshole trying a failed strategy to get laid.
Click to expand...

That's a bingo.
 
AnathemicOne said:
Doesn't exist, if you manage to be friends with someone but intended to hook up then you've failed to make your intentions clear. But even from then, speaking from anecdotal experience here, you can still manage to form a romantic relationship with someone even if you started out as friends.
Click to expand...

Dude, that is a textbook definition of the friend zone.
 
pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

This is ridiculous and gets parroted way too much.

Yes, there are certainly some dipshits out there that use "friend zone" as simple code for an "obligation" that he thinks a girl will not fulfill. It's ugly and it's bullshit.

But the vast majority of usage of friend zone is exactly as described up thread before you:

I've been in the friend zone plenty of times. I didn't expect anyone to sleep with me just becasue I was nice to them. They liked me well enough as a person but didn't see me as a romantic interest. It sometimes hurt, but that didn't suggest any sort of expectation or obligation to sleep with me.
 
What's there to say ? Sometimes people like you, just not in a romantic way. Sometimes people think they might like you, but if they get to know you better, they realise your not romance material ( but can still be a welcome factor in their life ).

The friend-zone only exists as a concept, because people in general fucking suck at being turned down.
 
DeaconKnowledge said:
Dude, that is a textbook definition of the friend zone.
Click to expand...

I suppose? People like to throw the term friend zone as a negative aspect as if just wanting to be friends with an attractive person is a bad thing. For me friends and friend zone are the same thing, the latter is just another unneeded term.
 
snacknuts said:
Friend zone = one person in the dynamic wants to be more than friends with the other person, but the other person doesn't share their feelings. They are both still content to spend time with each other in spite of (because of?) this fact.

Just friends = no desire from either person in the dynamic to be more than friends.
Click to expand...

pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

These two don't go together. I'm missing something.
 
Faiz said:
This is ridiculous and gets parroted way too much.

Yes, there are certainly some dipshits out there that use "friend zone" as simple code for an "obligation" that he thinks a girl will not fulfill. It's ugly and it's bullshit.

But the vast majority of usage of friend zone is exactly as described up thread before you:

I've been in the friend zone plenty of times. I didn't expect anyone to sleep with me just becasue I was nice to them. They liked me well enough as a person but didn't see me as a romantic interest. It sometimes hurt, but that didn't suggest any sort of expectation or obligation to sleep with me.
Click to expand...

Yeah, this is a big reason why I'm not on board with that idea. It assumes all guys simply want to fuck said woman and that's all. It's also oblivious to the notion that women can get friend zoned too.
 
Fudgepuppy said:
Two weeks ago, I told a friend of mine that I wasn't sure if I wanted to date a specific girl. I wanted to get to know her a bit more because at that point I didn't feel like we clicked in the way I want to.
Click to expand...

To answer this, I would say dating her is the only way to know if you click.

What you're doing is:
Become friends to decide if you should date or not.

What you should be doing:
Date her to decide if you want to start a romantic relationship or not.
 
Faiz said:
This is ridiculous and gets parroted way too much.

Yes, there are certainly some dipshits out there that use "friend zone" as simple code for an "obligation" that he thinks a girl will not fulfill. It's ugly and it's bullshit.

But the vast majority of usage of friend zone is exactly as described up thread before you:

I've been in the friend zone plenty of times. I didn't expect anyone to sleep with me just becasue I was nice to them. They liked me well enough as a person but didn't see me as a romantic interest. It sometimes hurt, but that didn't suggest any sort of expectation or obligation to sleep with me.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it's weird to see that definition blow up over the last few years.
 
the friend zone was invented because shy guys who take too long to ask a girl out think that it's the timing that made her reject him, not a lack of interest
 
pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

You can't possibly believe that. It's one person being in love and the other not returning it. You do believe romantic love is a thing, right? That people have feelings that are distinct from friendship, and that it hurts to not have that returned?

It's fucking weird that we get mad at people - particularly men - for developing romantic feelings toward a friend and daring to be frustrated by that. "Friendship and lifelong intimacy are exactly the same thing! You should be happy with either one! Otherwise, you're just a sex-crazed animal!"
 
Faiz said:
How does recognizing that someone sees you as a friend but not as a romantic possibility "acting like sex is owed".
Click to expand...

They have "zoned" you off from romance with them. Don't pretend the difference between friendship and romance is not sex.
 
pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

I mean it's entirely possibly it can also mean that someone wanted to be in a romantic, not necessarily sexual, relationship with someone, but it stuck in a friendship state.

But yeah, I'm sure it gets used for the sexist notion as well.
 
AnathemicOne said:
I suppose? People like to throw the term friend zone as a negative aspect as if just wanting to be friends with an attractive person is a bad thing. For me friends and friend zone are the same thing, the latter is just another unneeded term.
Click to expand...

The Friend zone isn't just being friends with a woman though. It's wanting to be romantic, failing, and becoming "friends" even though that wasn't your intention.

Hell, in your post you admitted that you were friend zoned but managed to put enough work into it to turn it around.
 
pashmilla said:
The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/
Click to expand...

LOL what? Dude the friend zone is born from people not being compatible. You know girls get friend zoned all the time too right? I have a friend who weeps to me constantly about being friend zoned by this one guy. Come on man have some perspective.

The idea that the friend zone is imaginary is stupid too. The concept is simple, one person likes the other, the other likes them but not enough to be intimate. That's some some factious non-sense, it happens every day. You've seriously never had a girl friend who wants to get with you but she's not your type so you have to dial things back?

It leads to a lot of drama which is obvious which is why it becomes such a hot button word. Once people learn to let go though they can move past the friend zone and just be friends. Love and Desire is tough thing to overcome though.
 
David H Wong said:
You can't possibly believe that. It's one person being in love and the other not returning it. You do believe romantic love is a thing, right? That people have feelings that are distinct from friendship, and that it hurts to not have that returned?

It's fucking weird that we get mad at people - particularly men - for developing romantic feelings toward a friend and daring to be frustrated by that. "Friendship and lifelong intimacy are exactly the same thing! You should be happy with either one! Otherwise, you're just a sex-crazed animal!"
Click to expand...

It's not the feelings, It's the passive aggressiveness around it.
 
David H Wong said:
You can't possibly believe that. It's one person being in love and the other not returning it. You do believe love is a thing, right? That people have feelings that are distinct from friendship, and that it hurts to not have that returned?

It's fucking weird that we get mad at people - particularly men - for developing romantic feelings toward a friend and daring to be frustrated by that. "Friendship and lifelong intimacy are exactly the same thing! You should be happy with either one! Otherwise, you're just a sex-crazed animal!"
Click to expand...

I feel like I'm living in some weird alter universe where we've forgotten the existence of r/theredpill and "nice guys".

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/nell-grecian/friend-zone_b_10317948.html
http://www.thecrimson.com/column/femme-fatale/article/2016/2/18/friend-zone-sexist/
https://feministsatlarge.wordpress.com/2013/01/30/the-friendzone-is-a-sexist-myth/
http://everydayfeminism.com/2015/08/time-to-ditch-friendzone-idea/
http://www.salon.com/2013/10/12/6_reasons_the_friend_zone_needs_to_die/
 
Do I believe in it? You mean do I believe that if someone's intentions are not made known at some point the other person in an undefined relationship may "move on" assuming they were ever romantically interested? Yes, and it can happen regardless of either party's sex.
 
The friend zone is the concept that a woman who is attracted to a guy will become less attracted to him as they get to know each other.

So a man who claims to have been relegated to the "friend zone" is simultaneously narcissistic enough to believe he is instantly attractive, yet has low enough self-esteem that he feels he only ever drives others away.
 
The 'friend zone' is where guys and girls who never had a chance in the first place are put

Cool as friends but nothing romantic. You can also be friends with someone and you both find each other attractive sexually but never get together with them for whatever reason.
 
I think it's a silly term. Just because someone cares about you as a friend, but doesn't want to fuck you doesn't mean you were friend zoned. It implies that friendship is a bad thing.
 
The friend zone does not exist. If someone wants to be friends with the other person they're just not into them romantically or sexually. I've been friends with girls before for years and then ended up getting together...I got out of the zone.
 
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