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[lightskintwin]

Yeah, it basically boils down to some form of this. You either didn't make a move, waited too long to make a move, or botched your attempt at making a move, and thus the other person has lost interest in you. It ultimately is the whole "window of opportunity is closed" deal.

The idea that it's some thing purely made by sexually frustrated manbabies is really off point, in my opinion.

Pretty much.

 

[BlueTsunami]

You realize you can go on dates and still get friend zoned, right?

Thats true, but I've always thought of the term as never being able to get out of it. A failure to launch into something possibly romantic. Going on a date and having it fizzle out, ultimately deciding lets be friends, at least you had a go at it. To the person that never got that date, they seem perpetually stuck in a what if scenario. At least the date can kill that fantasy if it doesnt work out.

 

[kirblar]

The friend zone is somewhere you put yourself and not something someone else does to you.

The "friend" in the friend zone is only in a friend zone because they want more and the object of their lust isn't attracted to them.

They then put on a pity party until they reveal their true colors as a disingenuous asshole trying a failed strategy to get laid.

It's a cage designed by the person that is usually in the friend zone.

If you want to be friends and their attraction to you doesn't matter, then you're friends. There is no friend zone.

If you want to be friends and you're attracted to them and they are not attracted to you and you say nothing about your attraction or ever explicitly act on it because you fear rejection and instead draw out the rejection process through a complicated set passive aggressive behaviors, then you are in the friend zone and it will end badly.

To avoid the friend zone you have to make a move and accept rejection or just move on emotionally.

Yup. The situation (unequited affection) is real, but it's not on the other person to change, it's on you.

 

[TickleMeElbow]

I think it's when you want to date/bang someone, but they just see you as a friend. So you remain friends because you're cool with that as well, but you still want to bang them haha.

 

[blame space]

let's talk seduction science

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

I'm all about the "casual acquaintance zone" where people are my friend and vent to me constantly when they have nobody else then ditch me when better friendship opportunities come along.

 

[Captain Smoker]

But you can call that normal human coupling behavior. Unrequited love can lead to some bitter feelings and it's better to call it like it is instead of assigning some label to it that casually villifies the uninterested party (usually a woman).

I wouldn't overthink everything, it's a linguistic thing in my opinion.

Humans abbreviate a lot of stuff in language, "friend zone" is just another term like "Schadenfreude" in my opinion.

As I already stated, women get into this "friend zone" - situtation just like men.



But, this term was used so often, particular in the Pick Up - scene and as an internet joke that it became a synonym for a certain, possible "friend zone" - situation:

The "nice guy" dude that tries to get her in the bed, acts too nice to persuade her, which usually isn't attractive to her and she puts him in the "friend zone".


But again, it's a bit unfair to assume that all dudes just want to put their dick in the girl without any romantic feelings / true love, this dumb as well.
And this is usually one given premise of the people who call the term "friend zone" sexist and if you look at it, this premise is sexist as well.

 

[Moff]

the friend zone is where people with romantic feelings end up when they do not make their intentions known and never make a move, out of fear of rejection. They usually blame themselves and not the other person for that. Lots of way over the top aggressive posts in this thread. I ended up in friendzones plenty of times when I was young, it happens to people with low self esteem, and I learned from it.

 

[Megalosaro]

It's a thing I guess, but we need to stop looking at it negatively.

Being nice to a chick shouldn't be a pass for them to like you

 

[LucidMomentum]

I'm all about the "casual acquaintance zone" where people are my friend and vent to me constantly when they have nobody else then ditch me when better friendship opportunities come along.

Are you me?

 

[John Kowalski]

let's talk seduction science

I hear kids are all about the multivariables these days.

 

[ZackieChan]

Hmmm. I've never heard this perspective before, very interesting. I always felt the term was weird/off putting but never considered the sexist implications of the term.

When one's posting abilities are like a hammer, all one sees is nails

Are you me?

You always seem like a dude that's got it together in the dating thread 😉

 

[PSqueak]

If you use the word friendzone unironically, i will question your ability to let go, respect other's right to say no and possibly think you feel dangerously entitled.

 

[blakep267]

Yeah, it basically boils down to some form of this. You either didn't make a move, waited too long to make a move, or botched your attempt at making a move, and thus the other person has lost interest in you. It ultimately is the whole "window of opportunity is closed" deal.

The idea that it's some thing purely made by sexually frustrated manbabies is really off point, in my opinion.

That window of opportunity can be like a day or two which is crazy. I remember once I asked a girl out and she agreed then that night she went to a party and met a dude who lived in her dorm and that was a wrap for me

 

[I_D]

The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/

Perhaps, but that's never been my understanding of it.

My experiences have always been more of a 'A girl is nice to a guy, and he develops a crush on her' kind of thing. She's just being a normal friend, like she'd treat anybody else, and he doesn't get much attention from girls so he latches on to any fragment of a chance he might have.

There are a lot of guys out there who are socially awkward, and they have a really tough time talking to people they find attractive (straight, gay, whatever). So when an attractive person is nice back, they immediately think it could go further. It's not really a 'I like you and am nice to you, so you're obligated to return the favor' kind of situation.

The same thing happens to a lot of girls who struggle to talk to people, but it definitely seems to be more common among boys.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

The reason it's called friend zone is because only friends are allowed in the zone.

 

[E92 M3]

I only know one person that escaped the friend zone.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

so if a male asks a female, clearly and plainly "do you want to go on a date with me" and the female responds "no/i have a bf/not interested but we can still be friends"

Its A) the males fault he got friend zoned
B) he's sexist
C) he's an asshole for "being nice and expecting sex for being nice"
I dont even understand you people.

Yes of course there are assholes out there that whine or complain about being friend zoned when they put themselves there, but there are others that clearly state intentions and get put into the friend zone.

Being rejected isn't a person "put into the friend zone." It's being rejected.

A point you were missing from a quoted post: "be willing to walk away if you don't get the desired outcome."

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Two weeks ago, I told a friend of mine that I wasn't sure if I wanted to date a specific girl. I wanted to get to know her a bit more because at that point I didn't feel like we clicked in the way I wanted to.

She said "Well hurry up and do something quick, because soon she'll put you in the friend zone".

This was so odd to hear, because I thought that among experienced people, the concept had been killed.

I remember lamenting and hating being just a friend with every girl I met in high school, but nowadays I groan at it all, thinking about how much of an idiot I was. Sure I was a nice guy, still am, but I wasn't a "nice-guy". I was just nice to people because I wanted to be, because it was the instinctual thing to be.

So let's talk about it, what are your opinions about it, do you believe in it?

Edit. To clarify I'm not looking for advice. I did take the girl out for a date, we had fun and became friends with benefits. I'm not interested in anything more.

I suggest reading the ladder theory. The original website is gone but someone archived the content.

Long story short, haha, if a girl is interested in you, then you can take your time, but beware that the cliche of striking the iron while it is hot applies here, because a girl can easily go from being attracted to you to not being attracted to you if you hang around her enough without acting on how you feel.

 

[Angry Grimace]

While certainly a person in the friend zone has to agree to the friend part, the conclusion that the person who thinks they've been boxed that way believes they are "owed" sex is asinine. The problem with that argument is that its essentially a slippery-slope argument.

I do not think that thought process occurs or is the logical conclusion of someone's failure to deal with heartbreak constructively.

 

[Leafhopper]

I'm all about the "casual acquaintance zone" where people are my friend and vent to me constantly when they have nobody else then ditch me when better friendship opportunities come along.

This is too real.

 

[jstripes]

If a straight guy is friends with another straight guy and they're not having sex are they in the friend zone?

 

[_Nemo]

The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/

No. Fuck off with that shit.

 

[AnathemicOne]

so if a male asks a female, clearly and plainly "do you want to go on a date with me" and the female responds "no/i have a bf/not interested but we can still be friends"

Its A) the males fault he got friend zoned
B) he's sexist
C) he's an asshole for "being nice and expecting sex for being nice"
I dont even understand you people.

Yes of course there are assholes out there that whine or complain about being friend zoned when they put themselves there, but there are others that clearly state intentions and get put into the friend zone.



its cause they don't. These things aren't black and white, they are shades of grey and should be taken by case by case basis.

The issue here is the assumption that woman/person your attracted to has the sole power/responsibility of declaring a friendship, just like a normal romantic relationship a friendship works both ways; two people have to agree to it.

If we take your example and say the woman rejects the dude but offers friendship instead then it's back in the dude's court to decide whether he wants to make the friendship or cut contact. Now there's a third option in where the dude makes the friendship but intends to eventually sway the woman to a romantic relationship and that's were we get into sexist bullshit.

 

[ZackieChan]

Being rejected isn't a person "put into the friend zone." It's being rejected.

A point you were missing from a quoted post: "be willing to walk away if you don't get the desired outcome."

I really don't see how this is all so difficult to grasp. It's been explained multiple times, including your post, but some people seem dead set on putting some ulterior sexist spin on it when it's really much simpler, imo.

Edit: maybe I misunderstood you

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

No. Fuck off with that shit.

Then why would the term imply a binary? As in, "we're fucking/dating" or "we're not fucking/dating." Does she exist for any other reason to a person who uses the term? Why is the person complaining about being in the friend side of it?

 

[hypernima]

I'm all about the "casual acquaintance zone" where people are my friend and vent to me constantly when they have nobody else then ditch me when better friendship opportunities come along.

Are you me?

 

[dskillzhtown]

I only know one person that escaped the friend zone.

I know of a guy that escaped the friend zone. He moved to the married zone and then the divorced zone with the same woman within 5 years. That entire situation was crazy to watch because everyone on the outside knew exactly what was going to happen in the end.

 

[cwmartin]

Sounds like the friend zone is a safe space for the rejected?

 

[blakep267]

I've found that the whole idea of somebody coming to like you over time is BS. Your just gonna be seen as a better and better friend mmbit you aren't going to morph into a love interest

You make your intentions known from the start or your just gonna be her friend. Once your seen a certain way that's not gonna change.

 

[ZackieChan]

Sounds like the friend zone is a safe space for the rejected?

Actually it's the least safe space.

 

[Faiz]

the friend zone is where people with romantic feelings end up when they do not make their intentions known and never make a move, out of fear of rejection. They usually blame themselves and not the other person for that. Lots of way over the top aggressive posts in this thread. I ended up in friendzones plenty of times when I was young, it happens to people with low self esteem, and I learned from it.

You know, sometimes in my past I think it was my fault. Actually twice I KNOW it was my fault becasue it turned out they were interested, I made no move, and then they lost interest. Still friends with both today! They are great people.

But the other times... it wasn't anyone's fault. It just was. That happens. Not their fault they weren't into me. It was sad and it hurt to varying degrees but I dealt with it.

God this debate is making me once again glad I've been out of the dating pool for a decade

 

[norm9]

Avoid the friend zone with expert pua and negging techniques. Also magic tricks too.

 

[Commanche Raisin Toast]

The "friend zone" is basically what happens when your window of opportunity for a romantic and/or sexual relationship closes.

This, and:

I think the longer you know someone the better they get to know you, and they start to see both good things and bad things in you.

If you're romantically involved at the time they start to see those bad things, they're likely to give you a free pass if they're not that big of a deal. However, once that romance window starts to shrink you risk them seeing those bad things as reasons to avoid you instead of simple flaws.

Then in their subconscious they see you as someone that they enjoy the company of but too flawed for anything more than friends.

 

[Air]

I'm at the point where if I ask a girl out and she doesn't show romantic interest, I completely move on.

There's no friendzone if you won't be friends with her.

 

[E92 M3]

I know of a guy that escaped the friend zone. He moved to the married zone and then the divorced zone with the same woman within 5 years. That entire situation was crazy to watch because everyone on the outside knew exactly what was going to happen in the end.

Same underlining cause for him being put into the friend zone initially?

 

[lightskintwin]

Thats true, but I've always thought of the term as never being able to get out of it. A failure to launch into something possibly romantic. Going on a date and having it fizzle out, ultimately deciding lets be friends, at least you had a go at it. To the person that never got that date, they seem perpetually stuck in a what if scenario. At least the date can kill that fantasy if it doesnt work out.

Fizzling out suggests there was something burning in the first place, when it wasn't. The point of dating is to get that fire lit. There are a lot of guys that don't have trouble getting women interested to go on dates, but have massive troubles getting those flames blazing and getting constantly put in the friend zone afterward..

 

[John Kowalski]

I've found that the whole idea of somebody coming to like you over time is BS. Your just gonna be seen as a better and better friend mmbit you aren't going to morph into a love interest

You make your intentions known from the start or your just gonna be her friend. Once your seen a certain way that's not gonna change.

My small life experience has told me this, strong feelings come with discovery, like, meeting someone new, realizing how someone you've known for a while is different from what you thought they were, or that there was more to them, or that you are yourself a new person and discovering something you already knew is experientially the same as meeting someone new.

 

[OrlanisWorks]

The friend zone is born out of the sexist notion that a girl is obligated to repay a man showing basic human decency to her with sex :/

Exactly right. Belief in the friend zone is... Sad? I think that's the descriptor.

 

[Captainbojanglesiii]

I think calling the 'friend zone' sexist is pretty ridiculous when it can happen to either gender. Does it enable some sexism? Sure, but I don't think that everyone in this case just expects sex from the other person. That implies that anyone who wants romantic affection is just in it for sex, which is pretty clearly not true. But maybe I'm wrong. I don't know.

Do I think the friend zone is a thing? I mean, kind of. For whatever reason, the other person doesn't see you as a romantic partner, but cares enough about you to have you as a friend. I mean, that does happen, but I think going around saying "Oh, she put me in the friend zone' makes you look like either: a) A loser, or b) A tool. I mean it's just as easy to say "Nah, she just doesn't see me that way."

Now I think saying you're in the friend zone without even asking them how they feel is crazy. If the person was into you, they'd probably drop some hints, sure, but if you aren't gonna make moves, you can't really expect the other person too either.

 

[Zaru]

But again, it's a bit unfair to assume, that all dudes just want to put their dick in the girl without any romantic feelings / true love, this dumb as well.
And this is usually one given premise of the people who call the term "friend zone" sexist and if you look at it, this premise is sexist as well.

Most of the time when I see anything in relation to the "friendzone", it's people lashing out at and making fun of men for showing negative reactions to implicit or explicit rejection by a woman they're some level of friends with.
Many women in particular are VERY quick to jump to the "he expected sex in return for being nice", "he broke off the friendship after finding out she would never date him, that means he only wanted to fuck her!" and similar accusations, clearly unable to imagine that a guy has genuine feelings that can be ... hurt. That a guy wants some distance from someone that they like but won't like them back in the same way. That not every guy is a dirtbag orbiter only waiting for his chance at getting his dick wet.

 

[kirblar]

I've found that the whole idea of somebody coming to like you over time is BS. Your just gonna be seen as a better and better friend mmbit you aren't going to morph into a love interest

You make your intentions known from the start or your just gonna be her friend. Once your seen a certain way that's not gonna change.

The big issue is that young guys don't know this due to lack of experience. They treat it like you'd treat a regular platonic friendship (where the slow burn is generally how things go) and it completely doesn't work like that.

 

[StanleyStutters]

If a straight guy is friends with another straight guy and they're not having sex are they in the friend zone?

Yes, and the only way to escape the bro friend zone is via bro jobs.

 

[Host Samurai]

Mean's you're not hot enough or you're a stepping stone.

 

[chrizzz09]

Well thats it with "internet created social terms", there are a thousand definitions and notions about a term.

Me and my friends circle think that the term "friend zone" refers to the "place" you put yourself in, after you have gotten rejected by someone, and then you hope that you can still achieve your goal of getting together with the person by staying long enough friends with them.
Hoping to be the "one" who always stayed by their side, when they needed you, so that the other person might finally acknowledge your "worthiness", and thus achieving your original goal because of your "persistence" or "loyalty", "showing that you truly treasured the person" and so on...

Personally, I don't think somebody else can "friend zone" you or put you in the friend zone.
There is either attraction between the two of you and you get together or there isn't attraction, so you had no chance to begin with.
The in-between is, that you get to know each other better, while for one person (or sometimes for both) the initial (physical) attraction fades, because of a personality/interest mismatch. In rare cases the reverse of this can happen, too: No attraction at all, but after getting to know each other, the attraction grows.

Oh and like some other people said, there is no "window of opportunity" or " limited timeframe" as long as the other person is attracted to you. So don't believe the bullshit of "You need to act fast or she put's you into the friend zone!"

 

[liquidtmd]

A different take.

I was with a girl in Newcastle a few years ago. The initial two weeks of us meeting, there was a chemistry and flirting that in any other instance you'd think from an outside view we would have taken things further. Then...We didn't. We were on a night out and we talked and talked and...We both happily left separately for the night. After that something changed. We clicked in a different way and that initial 'frisson' became something else and i cant put my finger on it. We became great mates who laughed at lot but it never went further. I guess we friend zoned each other.

A year later, we lost touch after I moved. A few years later she happened to move nearer to my local area, we reconnected and now we're married.

Sometimes men just want to get laid sure, but I also interpret the friend-zone as a potentially valid moment a guy or girl or both can say 'I thought there may be something but nah'. Making broad assumptions should be cautious.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

friend zone is ok. it allows you to know your enemy and manipulate back

 

[blame space]

married zone and divorced zone are some next level shit

 

[snacknuts]

These two don't go together. I'm missing something.

Well, I happen to think the second guy is wrong. The friend zone is not exclusively habitable by men.

 

[Puck Beaverton]

I wonder what friend zoning someone feels like.