Holy Order Sol
Member
Combat in this game is snappy as fuck wtf
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Lttp: Shin Megami Tensei Nocturne (I don't like it)
- Thread starter Aters
- Start date
E_Darkness
Member
How anyone could dislike Nocturne's music is beyond me. This is my favourite variation, Town.
I mean a lot of the complaints in the OP seem to be because of how old Lucifer's Call featuring Dante from the Devil May Cry series is. Though I don't know what you mean about it not being that snappy, it felt pretty snappy.
Fusion gets improved a lot over the series, P4G has the best one and then for some reason in SMT4 they... I don't know but they at least tried to fix in Final/Apocalypse by making demons have boosts for certain elements.
I didn't think Nocturne looked bland, I really dig its style. But this is really a personal preference.
It sounds like you're enjoying the game enough to play through more of it mind. It is arguably one of the best MegaTen RPGs and RPG in general. It is a game worth playing.
Strange Journey is a good one too though.
Digital Devil Saga 1 & 2 is better imo
RecursiveFault
Banned
There's no official english release of SMT2 to my knowledge. SMT1 has an english iOS port.
cj_iwakura
Member
Nope, SFC or bust.
They never brought SMT1 to Android, did they? Damn it.
I think I cheesed the whole game with charm bullets anyway.
Barrylocke
Member
There is an Android version in Japan, but for whatever reason that one was never localized. It's awesome that SMT1 has an official localization but since I use Android devices, IDK if or when I'll ever be able to experience it.
cj_iwakura
Member
It's a pretty janky version. I'm glad it happened, but the SFC version is the best, IMO.
Lunarwhale
Member
SFC's the only English option. I prefer the PS1 version aesthetically admittedly, but it plays slower and if you don't know any Japanese or aren't already familiar with the game then you're not gonna have the best time with it.
Also I think this is the first time I've seen anybody criticize Nocturne not having voice acting. I really don't see it working as well with voice acting - the entire game was designed as a bizarre, alien experience in which the player is made to feel as uncomfortable as possible. I get why people wouldn't like it for that reason, I'm just a bit surprised that you think it would have been better with voice acting. I didn't have an issue with the gameplay speed either, I remember the animations being nice and snappy.
Nocturne's tied with the first SMT for being my favorite main series games. Great examples of JRPGs that use narrative-based roleplaying and minimal storytelling to convey an aesthetic experience.
As much as I like that it had an official localization, I (generally) prefer the SFC version. GBA color palette and blur hurt my eyes a bit - really wish they had based it off the PS1 version like they did with if..., even if that means losing the vision items.
.Jonneh3003
Banned
I don't think thats a limitation of the Playstation 2, thats just shoddy art conversion.
While all other points are fair from a subjective point of view I am truly astonished by this one. I found Nocturne particularly great simply because it was visually astounding and made the world so much more interesting to explore since it truly made you feel like you are exploring a weird and different world.
My mind was blown when I first entered the Amala Network since coming to it from other JRPGs that was the point where I really felt like I am playing something far from the regular JRPG experience.
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Truly however that itself is subjective too, I just gotta say I admit I am saddened you couldn't dig the art direction. For me it is particularly one of the best points of the experience that is Nocturne. Although other points you listed did not bother me either this being an issue truly surprised me.
To note on the side, just like with Persona 3/4 auto battle simply just makes everyone do a regular physical attack. It isn't as much an AI issue as the game not being designed to actively allow letting the game play itself for you.
All in all however it's sad you could not get into Nocturne, but I am glad to hear that you enjoyed SMTIV and are currently enjoying Strange Journey. Maybe at some point in the future you will give Nocturne another chance and see it from a different angle. Don't beat yourself up over not liking it though, I mean the thing about preferences is that not everyone shares the same ones.
Finally played Nocturne when it hit PSN(after SMTIV), and I fully agree. Absolutely the best SMT game I have played(the bonus dungeon can get a bit tedious on some floors though).
Most of the OP complaints deal with petty aesthetic nitpicks anyway, his loss...
I started playing this in the (Europe, so really fucking long) run up to SMTIV, I reached the prison, but got sidetracked by the DDS games and then SMTIV. I really want a HD port of this with a few quality of life updates.
Better camera controls, mini-map, fusion search, picking skills during fusion, etc. They could also add more demons that have PS2 models from later games and offer the choice between Dante and Raido.
Better camera controls, mini-map, fusion search, picking skills during fusion, etc. They could also add more demons that have PS2 models from later games and offer the choice between Dante and Raido.
Eolz
Member
Same!
Would love some real remake later on though, even if that means some big changes in terms of mechanics. SMT2 definitely has the best story of all mainline games.
As others have said, you can rotate the camera, and I honestly never had an issue with it.
Third person combat in this game, and the rapid speed at which it moves, is just one of the reasons why I love it so much. I guess I'm the opposite of you, but I find it really engaging (as opposed to first person combat with little or no animation). Also, auto combat is just a fast way of doing the basic attack with everyone.
This one I completely disagree with. In terms of style I find Nocturne to be one of the best looking games ever. Especially if you can play it on the PCSX2 emulator with widescreen hack, and higher resolution. It's not perfect technically, but the art direction more than makes up for it.
A lot of the things you don't like about the game are also present in the Digital Devil Saga and Raidou games, so I guess don't waste time trying those out. Nocturne is the best game ever in my opinion, and the aforementioned games are not far behind, but if you dislike it that much for those kinds of reasons (Small things I would say), then you would probably find something to dislike about the others as well.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Nocturne - Better graphics, better music, and drastically better gameplay balance than SMTIV. Seriously, SMT4's difficulty was all over the place (hardest for the first few hours than turns into a cakewalk since you can break it so easily). It's not perfect, but most of the issues it has are just because it's an older game. An enhanced port that "HD-ified" the graphics and added some of the later SMT QoL changes would be fantastic.
Your opinion is bad, and you should feel bad about it OP.
The PS2 SMT Trilogy games(Nocturne, DDS, Raidou) are some of the best JRPG's out there on PS2.
To begin with, most of those complaints are super nitpicky, subjective as hell and def not common criticisms.
I understand it not being for everyone, but the quality should be undeniable regardless of that.
The PS2 SMT Trilogy games(Nocturne, DDS, Raidou) are some of the best JRPG's out there on PS2.
To begin with, most of those complaints are super nitpicky, subjective as hell and def not common criticisms.
I understand it not being for everyone, but the quality should be undeniable regardless of that.
witchedwiz
Member
bro.. i don't agree.. but i won't let it get to me..
if you have gripes, you have yet the stealth-god-tier game in smt spinoff...
digital devil saga 1&2..
if you don't appreciate those two, i will send the yakuza of atlus to your house!
Trilogy? Are those games related in some way?
The interface improvements alone make the GBA (and by extension, the iOS) version way better. The gameplay is almost entirely going through menus so it's very important. The PSX version is preferable due to upgraded audiovisual quality, although the vision extras on GBA are pretty cool.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Everything in the OP except the "first run" camera is what makes it work.
You need music that veers from harsh industrial metal to haunting whimsy.
Note the spare use of detail, the brualist, alien art deco, the matte textures that often stick to pure color.
This is how you do styyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyle on a budget folks.
The combat is snappy. Autobattle is you betting your boys are strong enough to smackdown the enemy without problems. And like Atlus' sister series Etrian Odyessey, you pay DEARLY for hubris if you can't.
No voice is good sometimes, or rather, it shows the dark, bleak, Darwinian, empty world even better, letting one's imagination fill in the gaps.
Everything must go into this for this to be the GOAT that it is.
Revel, for this is something us vets wish we could have again, that first run.
No, fusion went to shit and now is being fixed again.
You need music that veers from harsh industrial metal to haunting whimsy.
Note the spare use of detail, the brualist, alien art deco, the matte textures that often stick to pure color.
This is how you do styyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyle on a budget folks.
The combat is snappy. Autobattle is you betting your boys are strong enough to smackdown the enemy without problems. And like Atlus' sister series Etrian Odyessey, you pay DEARLY for hubris if you can't.
No voice is good sometimes, or rather, it shows the dark, bleak, Darwinian, empty world even better, letting one's imagination fill in the gaps.
Everything must go into this for this to be the GOAT that it is.
Revel, for this is something us vets wish we could have again, that first run.
No, fusion went to shit and now is being fixed again.
cj_iwakura
Member
The iOS controls aren't what I'd call optimal, though.
I played Nocturne several years ago, and enjoyed it a lot, but it failed to live up to they hype for me.
The biggest problem I had with it is oddly the thing everyone praises, the atmosphere. The world is destroyed a few minutes into the game and the main character is turned into a half demon, and all I felt was "well okay". I had no connection with the old world so I didn't care where the new world went, so I went with the True Demon ending since it had some(disappointingly easy) bonus bosses. The lack of technology that the series is known for and the world being one big desert didn't help either.
I played it after I played Strange Journey, Nocturne's dungeons weren't even close to being as interesting as SJ's. That's unfair though, the EO team is unmatched in dungeon design. Sadly, what I remember most about Nocturne's dungeons is that I had to go through a dark subway way too often. I ended up enjoying SMTIV's non-dungeons more than what Nocturne offered because they often felt like real places which added to the atmosphere for me.
There was a couple other really minor complaints, the low number of demons compared to other games, and the way the main character gains skills not allowing us to make any long term plans unless we look up a guide.
Still, I consider it a great game and I'm glad I played it. It just isn't the best mainline SMT game I played, I might give that title to SJ, even if it does have it's own issues.
The biggest problem I had with it is oddly the thing everyone praises, the atmosphere. The world is destroyed a few minutes into the game and the main character is turned into a half demon, and all I felt was "well okay". I had no connection with the old world so I didn't care where the new world went, so I went with the True Demon ending since it had some(disappointingly easy) bonus bosses. The lack of technology that the series is known for and the world being one big desert didn't help either.
I played it after I played Strange Journey, Nocturne's dungeons weren't even close to being as interesting as SJ's. That's unfair though, the EO team is unmatched in dungeon design. Sadly, what I remember most about Nocturne's dungeons is that I had to go through a dark subway way too often. I ended up enjoying SMTIV's non-dungeons more than what Nocturne offered because they often felt like real places which added to the atmosphere for me.
There was a couple other really minor complaints, the low number of demons compared to other games, and the way the main character gains skills not allowing us to make any long term plans unless we look up a guide.
Still, I consider it a great game and I'm glad I played it. It just isn't the best mainline SMT game I played, I might give that title to SJ, even if it does have it's own issues.
??????
Well not in terms of universe obviously. But they all share the same darker tone, created by the same people and basically all share a majority of the same assets, so i usually liken them to a trilogy in succession.
Look at this guy
SatelliteOfLove
Member
He means the EO dungeons, not SJs.
It reads to me like he's saying that SJ was made by the EO team.
It was developed by Lancarse, the EO developers, yes.
It was definitely not designed by them though (which is what he referred to). Lancarse did the technical side of things.
http://www.mobygames.com/game/nintendo-ds/shin-megami-tensei-strange-journey/credits
Thrashinuva
Banned
I can't get myself to finish an SMT game, however...
I do think that Nocturne had the most style. It's the game out of the series that I MOST want to beat. I think if various improvements were made to it, I would take the time to beat it.
But I've really only put any amount of time into Nocturne and IV.... and Imagine.
I understand the love for the series, but it's like Dragon Quest for me. People love that game to death too but I can't bear it. However, all of the other games the SMT team puts out are amazing... except Raidou 1... maybe if it was remade with 2's improvements.
I do think that Nocturne had the most style. It's the game out of the series that I MOST want to beat. I think if various improvements were made to it, I would take the time to beat it.
But I've really only put any amount of time into Nocturne and IV.... and Imagine.
I understand the love for the series, but it's like Dragon Quest for me. People love that game to death too but I can't bear it. However, all of the other games the SMT team puts out are amazing... except Raidou 1... maybe if it was remade with 2's improvements.
Now that I think about it I replayed it for a while some time after finishing SMTIV and I can agree that the battles are waaaaaaay to slow compared to that game.
I love the atmosphere and story tho and while I enjoyed the lack of voice acting since it amplified the isolation feel of the game has going for it I can totally see how some good voice acting could elevate the game.
... and the soundtrack of IV is better than Nocturne. I think that from Nocturne I only remember that glorious intros and start menu music and 1 of the many MANY the battle theme but most of the soundtrack is more ambiem oriented and I am not too hot on that kind of music but It worked for the game at least =P
I love the atmosphere and story tho and while I enjoyed the lack of voice acting since it amplified the isolation feel of the game has going for it I can totally see how some good voice acting could elevate the game.
... and the soundtrack of IV is better than Nocturne. I think that from Nocturne I only remember that glorious intros and start menu music and 1 of the many MANY the battle theme but most of the soundtrack is more ambiem oriented and I am not too hot on that kind of music but It worked for the game at least =P
Lunarwhale
Member
It's been a while since I played them, but I remembered the Raidou games using entirely different assets. Not to go off on a semantic tangent, I'm just wondering if I was wrong about that and if they just used a different shading/coloring engine or something.
Lord though I want to replay the Raidou games now. Loved the blend of puzzle solving and demon collecting. Combat wasn't excellent but it was serviceable enough and the exploration gameplay was a lot of fun.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Naw, I'm meaning their EO dungeons are wonderful, and SJ's of theirs are only "pretty good" (although its the encounter designa and "GET YOUR ASS BACK IN THE SHIP" every 5 minutes that does some of the damage too).
Vincent Alexander
Member
I don't like Nocturne as much as other SMT games, but it is still a pretty good game. I think my biggest issue with it is that it felt way too empty, and therefore boring because of the lack of interactions. Some of that probably came from having a silent hero, which I hate. And part of the emptiness came from...well...the story. I understand it would have been silly to have a ton of people alive and walking around in a post-apocalyptic world.
Hell yeah. I was like "I thought I remembered the music being great in Nocturne" then pulled this up. I could never get sick of it.
Valid opinion, but the guy I originally replied to was getting things mixed up, as i said.
Augemitbutter
Member
Nocturne is still very good. it lacks a couple qol fixed the later games added that's true, but at the core it's atlus at their prime. the soundtrack, the visual style will be gusto forever. i still prefer DDS and the Raidou games, but i'd probably run to play Nocturne if they decide to do a PS4 remaster with trophies like the other PS2 rpgs.
SMTIV is subpar all around. one of the of the biggest disappointments of this gen.
SMTIV is subpar all around. one of the of the biggest disappointments of this gen.
Characters are not characters. The game never gave me a reason to care about anyone and their ideologies are so dramatized you can't take any of them as serious paths to follow. The world goes to shit within the first few minutes so it's both too late to fix it and too early to care about what happens to it. You character never reacts to anything ever. Dungeons more often than not would rather waste your time than provide an interesting idea [especially those with random teleport spots, it needed more like the Diet or that place with the invisible maze]. Big terminals not offering healing at the terminal is a waste of time. Skill inheritance is a total mess. The phases systems detracts more than it adds. Ambushes/advantages clash with the idea of random battles. It does that dumb thing many RPGs are guilty of in that critical/boss encounters are immune to status afflictions while keeping regular encounters easy enough that attacking/buffing is always better. From the attack animations to the movement speed, everything is slow.
The overworld music is pretty great though. It's not a terrible game but whenever someone says it's the best SMT or one of the best RPGs.....
First Person Mode on Nocturne is so disappointing because it is only first person outside of combat and when engaging an enemy you still have the whole thing in 3rd person without changes so battles are still slow as hell.
It is a nice bonus, I guess.
I'd probably love Nocturne to death if it was my first SMT, but playing it after SMT 4 makes me unable to ignore all the small flaws.
I never said the game is bad, but the little frustration here and there ruined my enjoyment. I won't argue if someone says Nocturne is the best SMT, but I think SMT 4 is the smoother one.
I think that is a good point, I played Nocturne first and I enjoyed a LOT but SMTIV and Strange Journey (and the Persona games =P) introduced so many great features that make going back to Nocturne a little hard to stomach.
It's basically the same thing that happened to the Fire Emblem series: A lot of the older games are incredible (I agree that the Tellius games are indeed amazing) but is hella hard to go back to them after experience all the little QoL improvements brought by the new games (Awakening and Fates) and many fans that only played the new games will be the most "hard blocked" by them.
Yeah, looks like I mixed up how much involvement they had on SJ. I still stand by my statement that the EO team is unmatched and Nocturne doesn't offer anything close to the dungeon quality found in that series. It's the reason SMTIV's lack of dungeons didn't bother me, dungeons less than EO quality don't impress me so I didn't see it as a downgrade from Nocturne.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
SMT IV could have been god tier if Kaneko did the art. Playing Nocturne now made me realize that Doi simply isn't the right man for the job. Also the new demons they added in are the WOAT. Crazy how important art is in these games. It makes it or brakes it imo.
it's ok OP. just finish that and move on to the superior DDS
this is from a guy who has played one SMT game