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LTTP: Shovel Knight

J

Jonneh3003

Banned
So the retail version of Shovel Knight has been sitting on my shelf since it originally got printed and yesterday I finally decided to give it a go. I think it does everything really well but at the same time... I don't love it. Its like a cross between Mega Man, Ducktales and a bunch of other NES games but I never felt like the game itself had any personality, still its an awesome mix of NES tropes with a beautiful presentation. The game is a tad on the easy side when compared to the Mega Man saga, most bosses can be defeated on your first try just by hopping on their heads a few times and while the stages are diverse I don't particularly find them memorable. Took around 3 hours to beat which is a nice length for this kind of game, nothing felt drawn out.

I loved the Super Mario Bros 3 styled world map and the little things to do on the side but to me Shovel Knight feels like a greatest hits album of games I've already played, that's not a bad thing but I can't really understand why everyone loves it so much.
 
N

Neoleo2143

Member
Shovel Knight is a game where there's no real weaknesses, it's a greatest hits of the NES mechanically but it's matches those classics in almost every way. That way it feels like a game that genuinely knew what ideas to take and what not to take. A homage and an advancement of the ideas of the era.

It's also got a pretty solid narrative. Frankly, I think its highly underrated in that department.
 
O

Opa-Pa

Member
A shame that you didn't feel it has much personality, I thought it was pretty charming and funny, and the music gave it a unique style, but obviously opinions and all.

I agree on it bein a bit too easy, though. But still enjoyed it.

You might want to give the Plague of Shadows DLC (I believe it's included in your copy) a go. The stages are the same but the gameplay is so different that it feels like a completely new game, not to mention it plays great and it's arguably much more original than the main game. Plus the story and protagonist have a different tone because Plague Knight is kind of a prick and it's hilarious.
 
O

OrbitalBeard

Member
No personality? What?!? This game is practically oozing personality!

One of my favorite games of this generation, easily. It's almost perfectly designed. My only complaint is that I wish it were a bit more challenging, but I can understand why they went for a more accessible approach. It walks a fine line between classic and modern design and I think they did a pretty great job overall.
 
R

redcrayon

Member
I love it because Shovel Knight himself is a great character. The inherent ridiculousness of his weapon, combined with a determined animation, victory pose, the chivalric demeanour. A very polite, fundamentally decent hero rather than a tediously edgy badass for a change. All tempered with a sense of melancholy that plays out through the story and minimalist animation/dialogue. Don't really understand how it has no personality, it's cast are all distinct and it's packed with humour and it's own sense of quirkiness. Best new IP this gen for me, the game I've played through the most in a very long time. Even the level design shows plenty of new ideas and exemplary introduction of them in a genre that's been mined to death for thirty years.

Even the music in fantastic, it's just a very strong game across the board.
 
S

Shredderi

Member
Personality is the one thing this game has in spades. I think it's okay to not like it but to say it lacks it seems weird.
 
D

d34thfrom4bov3

Member
I'm playing through the game and I don't want to say anything cause I'm pretty bias as I absolutely love the game. But I can't agree that it doesn't have personality. Even if for some reason you don't think the Shovel Knight story does play through as Plague Knight. His story I thought was absolutely great.
 
L

Lothar

Banned
Jonneh3003 said:
So the retail version of Shovel Knight has been sitting on my shelf since it originally got printed and yesterday I finally decided to give it a go. I think it does everything really well but at the same time... I don't love it. Its like a cross between Mega Man, Ducktales and a bunch of other NES games but I never felt like the game itself had any personality, still its an awesome mix of NES tropes with a beautiful presentation. The game is a tad on the easy side when compared to the Mega Man saga, most bosses can be defeated on your first try just by hopping on their heads a few times and while the stages are diverse I don't particularly find them memorable. Took around 3 hours to beat which is a nice length for this kind of game, nothing felt drawn out.

I loved the Super Mario Bros 3 styled world map and the little things to do on the side but to me Shovel Knight feels like a greatest hits album of games I've already played, that's not a bad thing but I can't really understand why everyone loves it so much.
Click to expand...

I kind of agree. I enjoyed it at first but it is very easy, which feels weird for a game emulating NES games. Feels a little Mega Man wanna-be-ish but not quite as good. Doesn't have the classic music of the MM games or Duck Tales as far as I've played. I don't have a drive to continue playing it. It's okay.

Try out Volgarr the Viking and Rogue Legacy. I bought those three 2D platformer games at the same time during the steam sale and I've spent a lot more time on them. They're hard.
 
B

Beartruck

Member
Lothar said:
Try out Volgarr the Viking and Rogue Legacy. I bought those three 2D platformer games at the same time during the steam sale and I've spent a lot more time on them. They're hard.
Click to expand...
NES games were hard for all the wrong reasons though. Most had difficulty because of poor design or to mask a lack of content.
 
L

Lothar

Banned
Beartruck said:
NES games were hard for all the wrong reasons though. Most had difficulty because of poor design or to mask a lack of content.
Click to expand...

That's true in some cases. Like Karate Kid. The games with 4 levels. But I wouldn't say it was true for the Mega Man series or Castlevania or most good NES games. I like challenge and don't find it much fun when it's just a cakewalk. I want games to make me put effort and feel tense. It felt like you didn't have to put much effort into Shovel Knight. As soon as I put it on, I got sleepy honestly.
 
A

atbigelow

Member
My absolute favorite part of the game is the end boss where
Shield Knight deflects the attacks from the amulet, showing how badass SK is and how great they work together
. There's more storytelling and personality in the last 10 minutes than most of the NES library.
 
G

G0523

Member
I love this game. I'm eagerly anticipating all the new DLC that Yacht Club Games are making. I bought and beat the game on 3DS, Wii U (and bought the amiibo too), and the PSN versions. I'm sure I'll buy it on Xbox One eventually too since that has the exclusive Battletoads level but I can wait till it goes on sale. Lol. I think I've given Yacht Club Games plenty of money so far.
 
V

Voliko

Member
Just beat this one the other day myself. As a a huge retro game fan I was disappointed. Far too easy. There are some genuinely good level design ideas at times- the statue that spits out the rainbow platforms, the wind on the airship level, etc.- but none of them ever reach their full potential because the game is way too easy. I think my biggest problem with it are the modern design philosophies present- unlimited lives, checkpoints, a currency, purchasable upgrades, etc. The invincibility power up and being able to fish for health are both broken.

They should have taken more notes from Castlevania and Ninja Gaiden rather than Megaman and Ducktales

The story, characters, and dialogue range from not notable to cringeworthy
 
O

OrbitalBeard

Member
Voliko said:
Just beat this one the other day myself. As a a huge retro game fan I was disappointed. Far too easy. There are some genuinely good level design ideas at times- the statue that spits out the rainbow platforms, the wind on the airship level, etc.- but none of them ever reach their full potential because the game is way too easy. I think my biggest problem with it are the modern design philosophies present- unlimited lives, checkpoints, a currency, purchasable upgrades, etc. The invincibility power up and being able to fish for health are both broken.

They should have taken more notes from Castlevania and Ninja Gaiden rather than Megaman and Ducktales

The story, characters, and dialogue range from not notable to cringeworthy
Click to expand...

Yeah, if you went in expecting an "NES hard" experience, I can see why you'd be disappointed. This game plays very much like a retro game, but implements plenty of modern design philosophies on top of that. I actually think it works really well, but it's definitely not a very challenging game for us old school players. However, SK seems to be VERY challenging for people who didn't grow up in that era, so I understand why they didn't make it too difficult or its appeal would have been very limited.

If you haven't played Plague Knight's campaign (it's a free update), you should. I found it a fair bit more challenging than the main game.
 
Simbabbad

Simbabbad

Member
Jonneh3003 said:
So the retail version of Shovel Knight has been sitting on my shelf since it originally got printed and yesterday I finally decided to give it a go. I think it does everything really well but at the same time... I don't love it. Its like a cross between Mega Man, Ducktales and a bunch of other NES games but I never felt like the game itself had any personality, still its an awesome mix of NES tropes with a beautiful presentation. The game is a tad on the easy side when compared to the Mega Man saga, most bosses can be defeated on your first try just by hopping on their heads a few times and while the stages are diverse I don't particularly find them memorable. Took around 3 hours to beat which is a nice length for this kind of game, nothing felt drawn out.

I loved the Super Mario Bros 3 styled world map and the little things to do on the side but to me Shovel Knight feels like a greatest hits album of games I've already played, that's not a bad thing but I can't really understand why everyone loves it so much.
Click to expand...
I have the exact same feeling. The game doesn't do anything "wrong", but I played it entirely in autopilot wondering what the fuss was all about until the end. I also didn't find it had any personality, the forced teenage humour being more cringy than anything and the tons of references and borrowed stuff never forming a whole that would be its own thing.

I also don't see how it's supposed to be all that special gameplay-wise. At the time of its release, many retro games with superior gameplay existed already, I never understood the hype.

Deleted it as soon as I finished it, then went on other things and forgot about it.
 
T

Thud

Member
tumblr_o602cme4ud1ucv8jqo1_500.gif
 
A

Adam Prime

hates soccer, is Mexican
Real men play and beat this game on 1%, no relics, no health or magic upgrades. That's where this game really shines in its design.
 
GametimeUK

GametimeUK

Member
One if my favourite games of all time now. I totally love it. I can't understand the no personality comment, but it is what it is.
 
L

lasrmountedmoai

Member
I'm surprised people complain about how easy it is, the game makes it fairly clear that you will be rewarded by destroying checkpoints rather than using them. Once you do it ups the difficulty considerably, and fairly imo.
 
C

Courage

Member
It's a good game, one of the better 8-bit throwback ones. I dug the Souls-esque loot retrieval mechanic after every death, added another layer of challenge that I appreciated.
 
G

ghibli99

Member
SK was one of the best games I played back in 2014. Also, how people can call the music overrated kinda boggles the mind... must be the same who think Asgore and Battle Against A True Hero from Undertale are boring too.
 
letmetrythisname

letmetrythisname

Member
I tried it on my friend's Wii U a few weeks ago expecting a generic indie side-scroller because I'm a jerk. It ended up being really good from what little I played of it.
 
Bakkus

Bakkus

Member
Not a fan of the music example mentioned above. Also, ghibli, I really like Asgore, not so much True Hero, but still good. Undertale has a fantastic soundtrack anyways.

RangerX said:
Have to disagree here, the music is phenomenal. Especialky Spectre knights stage.
Click to expand...

OrbitalBeard said:
oh COME ON
Click to expand...

The music really pales in comparison to the games it's trying to imitate imo. I can for example name tons with a better stage 1 theme. Only themes I even remember clearly is the aforementioned stage 1 and that wind stage, I liked that one.
 
W

World SkiFree

Member
One of the few "high profile" indies I haven't bought on Steam due to my huge backlog and the game never hitting the sweet sale spot.

I never realized it was deemed easy by most; that is actually good news for me.

I love Volgarr but game is so hard. Rogue Legacy seems okay but I can't quite get a feel for its grindy set-up.
 
N

Napalm_Frank

Member
It's pretty good. Sadly Plague of Shadows wasn't that fun to play. Even with all the customization the attacks never felt fun to use.
 
H

Hero

Member
Voliko said:
Just beat this one the other day myself. As a a huge retro game fan I was disappointed. Far too easy. There are some genuinely good level design ideas at times- the statue that spits out the rainbow platforms, the wind on the airship level, etc.- but none of them ever reach their full potential because the game is way too easy. I think my biggest problem with it are the modern design philosophies present- unlimited lives, checkpoints, a currency, purchasable upgrades, etc. The invincibility power up and being able to fish for health are both broken.

They should have taken more notes from Castlevania and Ninja Gaiden rather than Megaman and Ducktales

The story, characters, and dialogue range from not notable to cringeworthy
Click to expand...

If you had such an issue with checkpoints, why didn't you break them instead of using them? Or not purchase the health and magic upgrades. Or not use the power ups?

Like those things in the game are in there for a more casual crowd but you can make the game more challenging if you want it to be. It was never supposed to be Castlevania or Ninja Gaiden hard, so maybe you should check your own expectations. Honestly this is one of the crazier posts in this thread next to the "soundtrack is garbage" comments.
 
D

DarkConfidant

Member
I thought the game did a great job at being a NES game, rather than just referencing them.

Played great, was simple yet challenging, like an old game. Had a kickass soundtrack and a cute world.

The gameplay was solid as fuck. Few games today, often due to mechanical/controls complexity, can have that said about them.

My only complaint was that it was a little too easy.
 
A

Ansatz

Member
Shovel Knight is a textbook example of how to execute level design. Each stage has its own mechanical twist with interesting challenges and puzzles built around it, teaching you the concepts organically through play without any hickups. In fact it's so perfect in the way it introduces ideas and ramps up the complexity that the experience becomes entirely frictionless: there's never any sudden spike (neither easy nor hard) and is always fair in what it asks from the player. Maybe this is what some people mean by easy? It gets harder, but you also get better at an even pace.

The levels are filled to the brim with subtle ideas without any filler content, making it an extremely dense gameplay experience. No idea is re-used and every level has its own gimmick. I also enjoyed the risk vs reward system involving checkpoints: break the glass ball and they give you gold. The presentation is on point, the up-beat and exciting soundtrack is amazing and overall conveys the perfect tone for a game that is all about fast-paced sidescrolling action that isn't trying to be ground-breaking innovation. The game also features one of the few hubs / video game towns that doesn't feel like a chore to visit. NPCs had just the right amount of sentences to say and ooze charm and personality. In particular the walking horse ladies and their proud attitude destroyed me. I can just go on... but yeah easily one of the most enjoyable gaming experiences of the generation.
 
poodaddy

poodaddy

Member
GametimeUK said:
One if my favourite games of all time now. I totally love it. I can't understand the no personality comment, but it is what it is.
Click to expand...

Yup this is my sentiment exactly; I don't think I've ever played a game with more personality. It's fine to dislike a game but to say this one lacks personality is objectively false and bordering on shit in my pants crazy.
 
B

Brakke

Banned
Game is basically perfect, it just nails everything it sets out to do. I really liked achievement-chasing with it, too. Some solid little challenges in there, like beat a mission without getting any money, beat the game without using relics, etc.
 
G

GCX

Member
I hope everyone plays the Plague Knight campaign too, it adds so much to the game.

Bakkus said:
Good but not great. There are like at least 25 songs from 8-bit Mega Man which are easily better.
Click to expand...
Oh come on, that's like saying "yeah the music is really good but Mozart has a couple better songs so it's not that great".
 
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