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[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

And $1200 for a TN panel? Really?

http://www.apple.com/imac/specs.html

 

[Finguo]

Reading this thread I get the impression that GAF doesn't know that Direct2Drive and Gamersgate have been offering Mac games for quite some time now.
But of course I admit, Steam is a way better service than D2D (haven't tried GG, though) and you'll get the Source games. So indeed good news for the Apple crowd.

 

[Mifune]

Oh god this is just glorious news.

And I don't even care that much about playing new games. Just give me all the old point-and-click adventure games I can handle!

 

[Dogenzaka]

Valve, company of the forever!

In more ways than one

This is great news. Now, if I ever get a Mac, I won't have to BootCamp

 

[Spotless Mind]

Susch great news. Valve continues to reinforce why i love them so much.

 

[Minsc]

Oh god this is just glorious news.

And I don't even care that much about playing new games. Just give me all the old point-and-click adventure games I can handle!

SCUMMVM and DOSBox both run perfectly under OS X. You don't need steam for anything!

 

[Burai]

brain_stew did get baited a little. Reading a 4850 runs Crysis maxed out at a good framerate on a 27" monitor is pretty :lol

I'd just as soon not have to read anything about people preferring never to boot windows, just as much as other would prefer to never read about things being overpriced or told to use windows.

I don't know. I tend to find myself frustrated in mac/pc threads concerning gaming, so I'm going to try to stay away from them.

Making claims about hardware like that will draw in trouble, and it's not fair to others to lie about performance.

Spoiler

Unless when he said "everything turned up" he meant "turned up past the lowest settings"

I never said maxed out. Not at all. I'll post my settings and actual framerate later when I get a chance to reboot and it's not 11:24 PM.

But this is a discussion typical of a Mac gaming thread though. The same cards that will run Crysis well in the $600 Crysis PC thread are suddenly unable to achieve the same feat whilst in a Macintosh. Why is that exactly?

 

[BothBarsOn]

Why no mention of CS:S in the ads, I wonder. There's no reason why it couldn't be ported as easily as the others, is there? Seems like a huge title to leave out of the initial marketing.

 

[brain_stew]

http://www.apple.com/imac/specs.html

Yeah, I admit I got that part wrong, I remember reading they were shipping TN panels with some of the imacs, didn't know it had changed.

The comment about the GPU absolutey stands. Even at gamer settings, not even a 5870 is going to manage a constant 30fps in Crysis/Warhead at that resolution, nevermind a 4850 which will be approaching single digit performance. For something packing a display that big, it absolutely needs a better GPU if you plan to do any amount of gaming on it at native resolution, it needs something with a 1GB framebuffer at the very least.

 

[Fredescu]

I never said maxed out. Not at all

with everything turned up

How did you expect that to be interpreted?

 

[brain_stew]

I never said maxed out. Not at all. I'll post my settings and actual framerate later when I get a chance to reboot and it's not 11:24 PM.

But this is a discussion typical of a Mac gaming thread though. The same cards that will run Crysis well in the $600 Crysis PC thread are suddenly unable to achieve the same feat whilst in a Macintosh. Why is that exactly?

You definitely did.

Crysis runs at around 30 at full res with everything turned up.

You'd need to be using a combination of low/medium settings to be getting that performance.

The cards featured in those $600 rigs are usually something like a 4890 1GB, 4870 1GB and 5770 1GB (notice a pattern?), both of which are significantly faster than a 512MB 4850 at high resolution and neither of which have I ever recommended for gamers using a 2560x1440 display which is nearly twice as many pixels. They're best for 1680x1050 or 1080p gaming and not above that, I usually recommend 4850 level performance for 1440x900 and below, 1680x1050 at a push. Its wholly inadequate for anything above 1920x1200, that's for damn sure.

Check my post history, my stance has remained pretty consistent on this, heck just check out any 4850 review and watch how performance is pretty much universally below 20fps (and often in the single digits) whenever you try to use it at extreme resolutions. The card was never designed for it, its small framebuffer and decidedly average memory bandwidth, should tell you that. A 5770 really wouldn't be costing Apple any more to include than the current card they're using, it uses a smaller die afterall.

 

[BothBarsOn]

How did you expect that to be interpreted?

I smiled when I read this, then I heard it in the voice of your avatar and properly LOLd.

LOLd I say!

 

[Minsc]

I never said maxed out. Not at all. I'll post my settings and actual framerate later when I get a chance to reboot and it's not 11:24 PM.

But this is a discussion typical of a Mac gaming thread though. The same cards that will run Crysis well in the $600 Crysis PC thread are suddenly unable to achieve the same feat whilst in a Macintosh. Why is that exactly?

It's ok, I think it's easy to see where the confusion is coming in. Where you said everything turned up, that's a pretty cheap statement to make if you don't mean turned up to max.

Also, if you aren't running at your native resolution, you should mention that too. That's also a little cheap. I don't know if maybe you can't really tell the difference, but the image quality of running at the native resolution vs dropping down is absolutely huge when it comes to clarity. Textures simply will not look anywhere as sharp if not displayed in the native resolution.

I never got to say, but this is great news for Macs! I'm actually happy for Steam too, they should get quite a hefty jump in their userbase with this, which is typically around 1.5 million users. I think if they get closer to 10 million active users at any given time, we'll undoubtedly see a TON more games hit Steam and the PC/Mac.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

The comment about the GPU absolutey stands. Even at gamer settings, not even a 5870 is going to manage a constant 30fps in Crysis/Warhead at that resolution, nevermind a 4850 which will be approaching single digit performance. For something packing a display that big, it absolutely needs a better GPU if you plan to do any amount of gaming on it at native resolution, it needs something with a 1GB framebuffer at the very least.

Of course, but that would ignore the physical limitations and purpose of the iMac. It's not possible.

If Steam is coming to Mac and Valve really cares about it, their games would be engineered to work on the Macs that exist, just as Blizzard has done with their Mac games forever. So there isn't necessarily a graphical power problem, unless you're some dumbass that bought a Mac to play Crysis at max.

 

[Burai]

How did you expect that to be interpreted?

So if someone asks you to turn the TV up, you turn it to it's maximum volume setting? There are degrees, you know.

I'm just saying that talk of Crysis running in single frames on anything beyond the lowest settings is absolute bullshit.

 

[Zachack]

I think Valve understands the inherent value of sales as a tool to expand their own platform. There is no doubt in the world they will engage in aggressive sales, regardless of how limp the competition on that specific platform might be.

I think they will engage in aggressive sales relative to the existing price-points of the platform. I do not think Mac users will see anything remotely approaching the price bonanza that occurs on the PC, at least not for a while.

They aren't as short sighted as to think they only have to compete with other Mac game outlets. They're competing with every other games platform out there.

I really don't think this is true due to the current situation of Mac gaming. Apple has ignored Mac gaming for too long, and if the games being released now are any indicator, the size of the market of people who want to play PC games but aren't willing to install Bootcamp is near-zero.

This isn't to say that it's not a good idea on Valve's part, but I think the days of OSX-only gamers getting to buy a Bioshock 2 4-pack w/ free giftable copy of Bioshock are a long, long way off. Further, I think the App Store is going to act as a hindrance.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Since this will be announced at Game Developers Conference, I'm going to assume this isn't just a game announcement but a relevant tech announcement for developers.

They have ported Source to OSX, but they'll release the tools to do it for other games for other developers so they can port their games as well.

 

[brain_stew]

Of course, but that would ignore the physical limitations and purpose of the iMac. It's not possible.

If Steam is coming to Mac and Valve really cares about it, their games would be engineered to work on the Macs that exist, just as Blizzard has done with their Mac games forever. So there isn't necessarily a graphical power problem, unless you're some dumbass that bought a Mac to play Crysis at max.

Well the 5770 actually uses a smaller die than the 4850 and has a much lower TDP, it'd make a lot more sense than the 512MB 4850 ever did. Its really an upgrade that needs to happen, especially after word of this news. As it is, any potential iMac buyer that is interested in playing any games on the machine, I'd strongly recommend that they wait until Apple update the GPU in the machine.

Since this will be announced at Game Developers Conference, I'm going to assume this isn't just a game announcement but a relevant tech announcement for developers.

They have ported Source to OSX, but they'll release the tools to do it for other games for other developers so they can port their games as well.

If Steamworks is ported over as well, that'd be a huge win for Mac developers. There's really nothing like that available for Mac developers (that I'm aware of) even if they're willing to pay for it, to be able to have it all for free and be able to distribute your game to millions as well? Yeah, that's huge.

 

[LCfiner]

So if someone asks you to turn the TV up, you turn it to it's maximum volume setting? There are degrees, you know.

I'm just saying that talk of Crysis running in single frames on anything beyond the lowest settings is absolute bullshit.

just to get the obvious out of the way. the vast majority of Macs that Apple sells are laptops.

and most of those are 13” models with 9400M gfx chips. the $2000 15” models get the 9600M.

In other words, Source is pretty much the best possible engine to port to OS X at this point. Spending too much time talking about Crysis is not gonna be constructive

 

[Zachack]

So if someone asks you to turn the TV up, you turn it to it's maximum volume setting? There are degrees, you know.

I'm just saying that talk of Crysis running in single frames on anything beyond the lowest settings is absolute bullshit.

No, you're wrong. You specifically said "full res". As an owner of a 4850, I can play Crysis (after a bit of tweaking) at Gamer (which is not all the way up but still high) at 1440x900 and get a strong framerate. 1650, however, chokes the system. Hard. A lot of games do at that res. Same with Dawn of War 2 and others. I can handle some games at 1650 (Torchlight is fine), but I can usually tell from screenshots if a game needs to be turned down.

 

[V_Ben]

If Steamworks is ported over as well, that'd be a huge win for Mac developers. There's really nothing like that available for Mac developers (that I'm aware of) even if they're willing to pay for it, to be able to have it all for free and be able to distribute your game to millions as well? Yeah, that's huge.

that would be a huge kick up the ass for Mac gaming

 

[rollingstart]

Even though I'm no Mac owner, this is pretty awesome news if only for maybe adding competition to Windows. Between this and OnLive, there could be more support for the computer gaming in the future.

 

[Mifune]

SCUMMVM and DOSBox both run perfectly under OS X. You don't need steam for anything!

Damn, I'm so new to this stuff. Thanks for the info!

Now to track down my old Lucasarts discs.

 

[Timan]

For those curious, just go on youtube and search for "mac cider" you'll see portal and other games already running on the mac. I hope to god valve does more than use a solution like this though.

 

[Fredescu]

I smiled when I read this, then I heard it in the voice of your avatar and properly LOLd.

Oh! Have we got a video

Spoiler

card

!

So if someone asks you to turn the TV up, you turn it to it's maximum volume setting? There are degrees, you know.

There is context you know. In the context of game settings, No one says "everything turned up" if they don't mean "all sliders at maximum".

I do not think Mac users will see anything remotely approaching the price bonanza that occurs on the PC, at least not for a while.

I think only the size of the library will prevent that in the beginning. Steam on the PC went from the occasional deal, to deals every weekend, to a holiday sale, to now having big deals every holiday, as well as multiple midweek and weekend deals. You need a critical mass of software for that to work, so I'm definitely not saying it will jump right into the wallet emptying madness that is Steam on PC today.

 

[brain_stew]

Even though I'm no Mac owner, this is pretty awesome news if only for maybe adding competition to Windows. Between this and OnLive, there could be more support for the computer gaming in the future.

Yep, that's one of the major reasons I like it as well. If OS X actually becomes a worthwile gaming platform, then Microsoft won't be able to treat that aspect of their OS with such contempt without suffering any consequences.

 

[V_Ben]

Yep, that's one of the major reasons I like it as well. If OS X actually becomes a worthwile gaming platform, then Microsoft won't be able to treat that aspect of their OS with such contempt without suffering any consequences.

here's food for thought:

Unreal tech is on the iphone
=
iphone OS is a version of Mac OS
=
Unreal also coming to mac?

that would be just as huge

 

[commissar]

The more the merrier

 

[Tworak]

Yep, that's one of the major reasons I like it as well. If OS X actually becomes a worthwile gaming platform, then Microsoft won't be able to treat that aspect of their OS with such contempt without suffering any consequences.

wow, I didn't think about this.

GO-GO fucking MACKINTOSH you magnificent beast

 

[brain_stew]

For those curious, just go on youtube and search for "mac cider" you'll see portal and other games already running on the mac. I hope to god valve does more than use a solution like this though.

Valve put an end to PS3 versions of their games because they weren't willing to sell a produce with their name stamped on it which didn't meet their quality standards. That coupled with the fact that we know Valve are hiring/have hired multiple OS X programmers suggests to me that this is in house.

 

[celebi23]

that would be a huge kick up the ass for Mac gaming

QFT

 

[V_Ben]

QFT

i meant it in a good way!

 

[The Big Rig]

Yep, that's one of the major reasons I like it as well. If OS X actually becomes a worthwile gaming platform, then Microsoft won't be able to treat that aspect of their OS with such contempt without suffering any consequences.

If history has taught us anything, this competition will mean that Microsoft will try to buy Apple:lol

 

[Keylime]

This would be great news, indeed. Christ this would be great news...

 

[BuddhaRockstar]

What I like about all this is now absolutely no one has an excuse to not play these magnificent games.

 

[Dabanton]

Will it be optimised so it doesn't make my macbook pro heatup like using Steam in bootcamp does?

Or will it be the same because it's got the machine working hard?

 

[The Big Rig]

What I like about all this is now absolutely no one has an excuse to not play this magnificent games.

I can finally convince my friends who have mac books to play HL2. Fuck it, I'll gift some copies to them if I can.

 

[Dr. Zoidberg]

If Mac gaming takes off eventually we will see situations where they might get superior versions of sought-after titles or even exclusives. You could end up having to have both to play the best games in the best ways. Lots of arguments against that happening but you never know.

 

[erpg]

So long as they get decent mice, they're welcome to play TF2 with me.

 

[The Big Rig]

Yeah, Mighty Mouse aint cuttin it

 

[morningbus]

What I like about all this is now absolutely no one has an excuse to not play this magnificent games.

I prefer linux.

BAM.

 

[FrancisH]

Loving the text on that book!

Can't wait for this!

 

[Mihos]

I am all for them getting it with the following caveat:

If there is cross platform play and every fricken discussion turns into a conversation about how sexually attracted you are to your Apple and/or Steve Jobs, I am going back to gaming on my commodore.

 

[VGChampion]

If they get these up to snuff I'll barely ever need bootcamp anymore. Now that Telltale is making Mac compatible games and now Source games coming over, I'm really hoping other big games start coming over.

 

[Eaten By A Grue]

The bigger question is what do we call Mac gamers? There can only be one PC superior master race. Or are we saying PCs encompass Macs as well?

Perhaps: The Mac Slightly Superior, But Inferior To The PC Master Race Race

 

[Always-honest]

great news

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

So long as they get decent mice, they're welcome to play TF2 with me.

I know you're joking, but I hate this stupid assumption. Do Dell and HP owners use the mice that come with those computers? Or if you bought a Dell laptop, do you buy a separate Dell mouse only?

 

[ghst]

The bigger question is what do we call Mac gamers? There can only be one PC superior master race. Or are we saying PCs encompass Macs as well?

Perhaps: The Mac Slightly Superior, But Inferior To The PC Master Race Race

computer gaming.

bringing back the 80's.

if valve have developed some toolset that streamlines pc>mac ports, this could be the start of a glorious revolution.

 

[Anksta]

Wonder if you own the PC version of a game, will you have to purchase the Mac version again? I know its wishful thinking, but I hope you won't have to double dip.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

More competition is always good. This is a HUGE step with the lack of gaming on Macs.