• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Mask Efficacy |OT| Wuhan!! Got You All In Check

Status
Not open for further replies.

All Hail C-Webb

Hailing from the Chill-Web
Excuse me?




I gave Debozo shit on here for being too slow to act, but I had no clue he was saying stupid shit like that in March. Trump was saying stupid shit weeks after that though, and in late March was talking about opening the country up for Easter.

Deblasio is a terrible leader, he was slow to act, he put people at risk with stupid comments, but he came around in the 2nd week of march and has been doing better.
The only difference with Trump is that he was even slower, he cost more lives, it took weeks longer to come around, and he's still making mistakes.
 
Last edited:
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
I gave Debozo shit on here for being too slow to act, but I had no clue he was saying stupid shit like that in March. Trump was saying stupid shit weeks after that though, and in late March was talking about opening the country up for Easter.

I don't understand why you do this... Trump said he wanted to see the country opened up by Easter, but he certainly never said he was going to do so.

Deblasio is a terrible leader, he was slow to act, he put people at risk with stupid comments, but he came around in the 2nd week of march and has been doing better. The only difference with Trump is that he was even slower, he cost more lives, it took weeks longer to come around, and he's still making mistakes.

How was Trump slower...? He had already shut down travel from China, set up a Coronavirus task force, and declared a public health emergency by the end of January.

No one in this country got really serious about locking things down and having people work from home/practice social distancing until that elderly care home in Kirkland, WA announced that they had an outbreak and multiple deaths. No country has responded perfectly and hindsight is 20/20. I would have never believed in 2016 I'd be here actually defending Trump on anything (just check my post history from the time if you're curious), but the insane reaction to his response which has arguably been better than that of many countries is just puzzling to me.

edit: for the record, I'm not going to shit on DeBlasio, either. The advice he was surely getting at the time from his staff did not point to him needing to shut down one of the biggest and most economically important cities in the world. Imagine if he did that and it came out later that the threat really wasn't all that big. He would have been eviscerated. Politics makes it very hard to be proactive in situations like this when the actions required are immensely damaging and unpopular.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

PSYGN

Member
Statistics aren't pointing towards that though, as was my first worry too.

N1844fi.png


(Sources, worldometer and FHM)

Dumb line colorization using slight shade differences and transparency. They should know better.
 
I gave Debozo shit on here for being too slow to act, but I had no clue he was saying stupid shit like that in March. Trump was saying stupid shit weeks after that though, and in late March was talking about opening the country up for Easter.

Deblasio is a terrible leader, he was slow to act, he put people at risk with stupid comments, but he came around in the 2nd week of march and has been doing better.
The only difference with Trump is that he was even slower, he cost more lives, it took weeks longer to come around, and he's still making mistakes.

Holy fucking TDS. Rewrite history harder, please.
 
Maybe AI has already won and it's been manipulating us for a long time and we don't have a clue. :p or :messenger_fearful:

Edit: Maybe I'm ai, and I don't even know. :messenger_open_mouth:
 
Last edited:

All Hail C-Webb

Hailing from the Chill-Web
I don't understand why you do this... Trump said he wanted to see the country opened up by Easter, but he certainly never said he was going to do so.



How was Trump slower...? He had already shut down travel from China, set up a Coronavirus task force, and declared a public health emergency by the end of January.

No one in this country got really serious about locking things down and having people work from home/practice social distancing until that elderly care home in Kirkland, WA announced that they had an outbreak and multiple deaths. No country has responded perfectly and hindsight is 20/20. I would have never believed in 2016 I'd be here actually defending Trump on anything (just check my post history from the time if you're curious), but the insane reaction to his response which has arguably been better than that of many countries is just puzzling to me.

edit: for the record, I'm not going to shit on DeBlasio, either. The advice he was surely getting at the time from his staff did not point to him needing to shut down one of the biggest and most economically important cities in the world. Imagine if he did that and it came out later that the threat really wasn't all that big. He would have been eviscerated. Politics makes it very hard to be proactive in situations like this when the actions required are immensely damaging and unpopular.

Aspirational is just stupid when it has 0 chance of success. For that to even come out of someones mouth shows that they have no understanding of the virus, or they just don't care if many people die.

I think that Trump banned travel from China because he thought it was a nice retaliatory move against them. It delayed things a little, but he didn't use that time at all, and he talked like someone who thought he had already won.
The Coronavirus task force headed by "lets pray it away" Pence? Pence has actually done a great job in the pressers, and in at least talking to the states, but major preparations were not taken for what was coming.
Trump called it a national emergency, but left most of the work to the states.
If Trump had taken immediate and strong actions, some idiots might have complained, but he would have been proven right in short order, and made himself a hero.

There have been countries with worse responses, and leaders who failed their people in greater ways, but I expect the best from the US, and we haven't been close yet. Deblasio deserves to be shit on for his early response, and he's been awful as a mayor in general. Cuomo was slower to respond than he should have been, and he actually held Deblasio back from doing a full stay at home order by a week. The West Coast have lead the way on this, but there's only so much local government can do to get us through this period.

It's also not hindsight when there were plenty of people who warned us of what was coming. We now know that government agencies were putting out warnings late last year, we know that politicians were worried enough that they decided to sell their stocks on the information they had. I'd love to put it in the past like I did with Cuomo and Deblasio when they started handling things correctly, but Trump isn't there yet and hasn't shown he has that ability at all.
 
Last edited:
Aspirational is just stupid when it has 0 chance of success. For that to even come out of someones mouth shows that they have no understanding of the virus, or they just don't care if many people die.

I think that Trump banned travel from China because he thought it was a nice retaliatory move against them. It delayed things a little, but he didn't use that time at all, and he talked like someone who thought he had already won.
The Coronavirus task force headed by "lets pray it away" Pence? Pence has actually done a great job in the pressers, and in at least talking to the states, but major preparations were not taken for what was coming.
Trump called it a national emergency, but left most of the work to the states.
If Trump had taken immediate and strong actions, some idiots might have complained, but he would have been proven right in short order, and made himself a hero.

There have been countries with worse responses, and leaders who failed their people in greater ways, but I expect the best from the US, and we haven't been close yet. Deblasio deserves to be shit on for his early response, and he's been awful as a mayor in general. Cuomo was slower to respond than he should have been, and he actually held Deblasio back from doing a full stay at home order by a week. The West Coast have lead the way on this, but there's only so much local government can do to get us through this period.

It's also not hindsight when there were plenty of people who warned us of what was coming. We now know that government agencies were putting out warnings late last year, we know that politicians were worried enough that they decided to sell their stocks on the information they had. I'd love to put it in the past like I did with Cuomo and Deblasio when they started handling things correctly, but Trump isn't there yet and hasn't shown he has that ability at all.

And that's what it boils down to: "I think."

You're pitting a fucking guy who had staff threatening to quit over his refusal to close schools in the American epicenter of this pandemic vs Trump right now.

Total denial.
 
Last edited:

All Hail C-Webb

Hailing from the Chill-Web
And that's what it boils down to: "I think."

You're pitting a fucking guy who had staff threatening to quit over his refusal to close schools in the American epicenter of this pandemic vs Trump right now.

Total denial.

No, it doesn't boil down to I think, as that was literally 1 small part of my post.
The purpose of locking down travel from China would have been to buy time, so that we could prepare for what was coming. But we did absolutely nothing with that bought time, and Trump continued to call the Virus nothing for over a month after that.

So my theory as to how Trump failed so miserably in using that bought time is because he wasn't making the move to buy time, but as a move in the trade war. You might theorize that he failed in utilizing that time because all he wanted is to buy time for his friends to sell their stocks? I don't know, but you're free to think that if you want.

Yea, Deblasio sucks, and Hoover II sucks too. Deblasio should have received better guidance from his governor, who should have received better guidance from the federal government. It is a national emergency afterall.
 
Last edited:

Jonsoncao

Banned
Can we acknowledge the fact that both left and right, for whatever reason, were "just a flu bro" before mid-March when numbers started going exponentially?

Personally I feel like the HHS secretary and CDC director are responsible for the US response being so slow as they are briefed by CCP on Jan 3 on this matter.
 

CrapSandwich

former Navy SEAL
No, it doesn't boil down to I think, as that was literally 1 small part of my post.
The purpose of locking down travel from China would have been to buy time, so that we could prepare for what was coming. But we did absolutely nothing with that bought time, and Trump continued to call the Virus nothing for over a month after that.

So my theory as to how Trump failed so miserably in using that bought time is because he wasn't making the move to buy time, but as a move in the trade war. You might theorize that he failed in utilizing that time because all he wanted is to buy time for his friends to sell their stocks? I don't know, but you're free to think that if you want.

Yea, Deblasio sucks, and Hoover II sucks too. Deblasio should have received better guidance from his governor, who should have received better guidance from the federal government. It is a national emergency afterall.

Eh, Trump called for national social distancing on March 16 and has extended that. That was really the main thing to do and it was done. The overwhelming majority of the country is going to get through this without their health systems being overwhelmed, NYC and places in NJ being the hardest hit but even they'll push through. The national response wasn't lacking at the time, but it wasn't exactly prepared, either. The big failings have been the lack of available masks--notice every time you see a picture or video of Asia, they all have masks. We don't. That was a big oversight. The other big problem was the lack of early detection, as in people going to their doctors in January with flu-like symptoms, testing negative for the flu, then their doctors just sending them on their way instead of saying "Hey, wait a minute. This might be that Chinese thing." But we have to go through the infections, if not now then over the next 12 months. Trying to frame things politically will 100% of the time make you overlook the obvious, practical things that could be done. As in, at the moment, April is the time of the year that respiratory infections vanish into thin air, and that could happen with COVID, and locking everyone inside might actually be prolonging the misery.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Aspirational is just stupid when it has 0 chance of success. For that to even come out of someones mouth shows that they have no understanding of the virus, or they just don't care if many people die.

I'm sure he partially said it to gauge the reaction and see if people overwhelmingly wanted more shutdowns than to try to let this thing spread more naturally. Anyway, it's Trump. He's a salesman and is always talking shit, trying to will the things he wants into reality through his words. No, it's not traditionally presidential, but it's who he is.

I think that Trump banned travel from China because he thought it was a nice retaliatory move against them. It delayed things a little, but he didn't use that time at all, and he talked like someone who thought he had already won.

I don't think that makes sense at all. Trade talks with China were going well comparatively. Shutting down flights from any country is going to cause big scares in the stock market, and we know how much Trump cares about the DJI value. I do not think he wanted to shutdown travel to China, but knew that doing so might have a chance of slowing things down enough to not require further major actions in the United States. Given the timeline, it looks like our outbreak (especially on the East Coast) likely came from the strand of the virus that spread from China to Europe and then from there to here.

The Coronavirus task force headed by "lets pray it away" Pence? Pence has actually done a great job in the pressers, and in at least talking to the states, but major preparations were not taken for what was coming.

More preparations certainly should have been done, but it's hard to just blame our federal government, since basically no government around the world was prepared for something like this. As long as this pandemic is in living memory, I think governments will work a lot harder to prepare themselves for the possibility in the future.

Trump called it a national emergency, but left most of the work to the states.

I do not see the problem with this, but I suppose this is more subjective. This is the United States of America and I want states, as much as possible, to be able to handle their own affairs. No one should welcome more federal government intervention in their states than is necessary, in my opinion.

If Trump had taken immediate and strong actions, some idiots might have complained, but he would have been proven right in short order, and made himself a hero.

I do not think this true at all. There's nothing he could have done that would have made him a hero. People already called him a wannabe dictator and if he took strong action on a federal level that restricted people's freedoms before people started dying and cases began growing exponentially, the torches would have been out.

There have been countries with worse responses, and leaders who failed their people in greater ways, but I expect the best from the US, and we haven't been close yet.

The United States is incredible at a lot of things, but decentralized government and freedom are some of the things that many of us value greatly. It comes at a cost, though, as we're seeing with the lack of consistency in our reaction as a country.

Deblasio deserves to be shit on for his early response, and he's been awful as a mayor in general. Cuomo was slower to respond than he should have been, and he actually held Deblasio back from doing a full stay at home order by a week. The West Coast have lead the way on this, but there's only so much local government can do to get us through this period.

There's a ton that local governments can and have been doing, which is a big part of why the numbers are so different across states. I'm sure all politicians will have to answer come election time for the actions they took during these trying months, but I personally find it hard to fault anyone for not having acted sooner. It's political suicide to proactively take freedom-restricting actions when the threat is not apparent.

It's also not hindsight when there were plenty of people who warned us of what was coming. We now know that government agencies were putting out warnings late last year, we know that politicians were worried enough that they decided to sell their stocks on the information they had. I'd love to put it in the past like I did with Cuomo and Deblasio when they started handling things correctly, but Trump isn't there yet and hasn't shown he has that ability at all.

Plenty of people say all sorts of shit. Different experts saying different things. It's only thanks to hindsight that we can point to the ones who were right about it and hold them up as people who should have been listened to.

Anyway, that's my take. I try to look at these things as objectively as I can and not let my dislike of any individual color my opinion of the actions they chose to take in the moment.
 

cryptoadam

Banned
Anyone buying Russia's claims? What are they doing over there?

They say they have done nearly 1.2 million tests, thats 3rd in the world.

Is everything just BS coming from them? I heard they were kicking out Chinese and sending them back to China.
 

Joe T.

Member
Interesting that the guy responsible for the model the White House used to justify the lockdowns can’t explain the situation in Japan which didn’t lock down.

If I was the IHME I'd never let that guy get interviewed again. He comes across like a snake repeatedly avoiding the questions, both about the revised projections and the difference between America's social distancing and Japan's masks.
 

JordanN

Banned
Anyone buying Russia's claims? What are they doing over there?

They say they have done nearly 1.2 million tests, thats 3rd in the world.

Is everything just BS coming from them? I heard they were kicking out Chinese and sending them back to China.
I follow this Russian youtuber who even returned from China at the height of pandemic and filmed his life back in Russia.

In regards to their claims, they seem to continuing life like nothing happened. The country is very massive and apparently Putin did close the borders with China very early so they did contain the virus?

 
Last edited:
I do not think this true at all. There's nothing he could have done that would have made him a hero. People already called him a wannabe dictator and if he took strong action on a federal level that restricted people's freedoms before people started dying and cases began growing exponentially, the torches would have been out.

Can you imagine the twitter/msm outrage if Trump unilaterally shut the country down? In the middle of the Democrat primary season no less? They'd accuse him of staging a de facto coup, at best! Oh my God.. Why do people who hate Trump suddenly want him to act like the dictator they've been scare mongering about for four years? I don't get it.
 

cryptoadam

Banned
Can you imagine the twitter/msm outrage if Trump unilaterally shut the country down? In the middle of the Democrat primary season no less? They'd accuse him of staging a de facto coup, at best! Oh my God.. Why do people who hate Trump suddenly want him to act like the dictator they've been scare mongering about for four years? I don't get it.

It was her turn.
 

cryptoadam

Banned
We have been doing a pretty good job in Canada overall, especially our proximity to New York. Thats most likely why my city and province were hit the hardest. Ontario is doing really well considiring its position in Canada.

And I give the Premiers more credit then Trudeau, all though he has been decent with story time when he comes out of his little house.

All though the situation in our nursing homes is fucked up and it really seems like most of the problems have been pushed into those.
 
We have been doing a pretty good job in Canada overall, especially our proximity to New York. Thats most likely why my city and province were hit the hardest. Ontario is doing really well considiring its position in Canada.

And I give the Premiers more credit then Trudeau, all though he has been decent with story time when he comes out of his little house.

All though the situation in our nursing homes is fucked up and it really seems like most of the problems have been pushed into those.

We have no idea how bad Covid is in Ontario because the testing has been a joke.
 

JordanN

Banned
NDP Leader Jagmeet Singh wants to make Canada's CERB universal.

On one hand, giving every Canadian $2000 bucks for 4 months is going to increase our debt proportionally and may even trigger inflation.

On the other hand, why should I bust my ass at work and risk getting sick when my neighbor sits at home collecting his gibsmedats?


Decisions, decisions.

Edit: You know what I would do? Give Canadians the money and demand the government force China to pay for it. Let them carry the burden for this economic meltdown, not the workers who are forced to put up with this crap for minimum wage.
 
Last edited:

DragoonKain

Neighbours from Hell
A Jehovah’s Witness went door to door on my street yesterday wanting something and no one answered their doors for them lol. It’s not like there’s anything going on in the world that would prevent people from opening their doors to strangers and talking to them or anything.
 

sinnergy

Member
Interesting that the guy responsible for the model the White House used to justify the lockdowns can’t explain the situation in Japan which didn’t lock down.
Japan is locking down now ... weeks late. At least Tokio is. This virus will spread like wild fire if you don’t.
 
Last edited:

squallheart

Member
A Jehovah’s Witness went door to door on my street yesterday wanting something and no one answered their doors for them lol. It’s not like there’s anything going on in the world that would prevent people from opening their doors to strangers and talking to them or anything.

WTH o.o they are not supposed to be out preaching. All of them have been told not to preach or gather. Wonder if it's the rebels 🤔
 

SushiReese

Member
Interesting that the guy responsible for the model the White House used to justify the lockdowns can’t explain the situation in Japan which didn’t lock down.
Both South Korea and China media heavily suspect Japan government originally under-reported cases to keep Tokyo Olympic going through and did not conduct enough tests. By comparison, Japan only conducted 1/10 of South Korea's test number. It's difficult to get tested in Japan even before late March. If you look into the graph, after Abe postponed the Olympics in March 24th, the new reported cases started to soar and increased 10-30% every day. Now Japan is partly also locked-down.
 
Last edited:

rofif

Banned

That's understandable and relateable but at the same time - It's not easy to be a health worker and it's a life You have to choose. Especially if You are a doctor, You know what You were getting into (just like a soldier). But a nurse get the wrong end of the stick as they do not get the benefits of this career paths but only crap
 

MadAnon

Member
I follow this Russian youtuber who even returned from China at the height of pandemic and filmed his life back in Russia.

In regards to their claims, they seem to continuing life like nothing happened. The country is very massive and apparently Putin did close the borders with China very early so they did contain the virus?



Doesn't seem like it when even russian propaganda news agency reports this.
 
Last edited:

holygeesus

Banned
Interesting (and emotional) read over on the BBC, where a wife of a victim, discusses how the disease progresses, if you are unlucky enough to have the most serious reaction to it.


What disturbs me, is you remain aware of what is happening to you, pretty much to the end. You know they are putting you in a coma and you will likely not wake up again. Chilling.
 

eot

Banned
Interesting (and emotional) read over on the BBC, where a wife of a victim, discusses how the disease progresses, if you are unlucky enough to have the most serious reaction to it.


What disturbs me, is you remain aware of what is happening to you, pretty much to the end. You know they are putting you in a coma and you will likely not wake up again. Chilling.
These stories are haunting to read, I hope it recovers however unlikely that may be.
He clearly has comorbidities, but they're things that modern medicine lets us manage. This disease isn't simply killing frail people, it's also killing people who clearly have many years of a fulfilling life left to live.
 

nush

Gold Member
This disease isn't simply killing frail people, it's also killing people who clearly have many years of a fulfilling life left to live.

Who would probably stand a decent chance at recovery if the health service was not overloaded.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom