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Media Create Sales: 01/05 - 01/11
- Thread starter PantherLotus
- Start date
Jaded Alyx
Member
You are weird.Spiegel said:
jeremy1456
Junior Member
Spiegel said:
Actually I'm pretty sure Sugar Village is the labelled correctly - it was announced for PSP a few weeks back.
Jaded Alyx
Member
So you can get your butt kicked online by Wiimote/'chuck adept players. It's like a fetish I suppose.wrowa said:
Spiegel said:
I said the expectation should be 200-300K. At no point did I try to say that was good or bad.
Spiegel said:
Again, I never made such a claim.
Spiegel said:
A major part of the reason that "some" people think the PSP is poised to become a great general software seller is that its hardware sales have been pretty good since the PSP-2000 release. However the actual software numbers point in pretty much the opposite direction with almost a stagnating tie ratio as more systems are sold, indicating that the new system buyers are barely buying as much software per system that the PSP owners did before PSP-2000. Take into account that ~2.4 million of those software sales since PSP-2000 are for a single game, and it looks even worse for general software sales.
Spiegel said:
You don't want to try to compare third-party support for the PSP for its first two years to the Wii.
Spiegel said:
You're funny. :lol
JoshuaJSlone said:
Yes, this is what I'm trying to communicate. Thanks, JoshuaJSlone!
jeremy1456 said:
Sugar Village release is March 19
wrowa said:
The PSP version is half-assed, my ps2 died and the ps3 version sucks.
Jaded Alyx said:
I'm sorry :/
Yes, this is what I'm trying to communicate. Thanks, JoshuaJSlone!
Mario Party 8, Mario and Sonic, Mario Kart Wii, Super Paper Mario, Mario Galaxy, Wii Play, Wii Fit, Wii Sports,.... Am I the only one noticing a trend?
This means that the Mario/Wii _ brand is HUGE in Japan, not that the Wii sells well on a huge variety of genres.
If that were true, PES2009, PowerPro, Tatsunoko Vs Capcom, Klonoa,... (games in genres that Joshua said sell well on the Wii) would be huge sellers but they aren't.
Jaded Alyx
Member
Well that's just not good enough.Spiegel said:
Not out yet. Didn't 2008 do fairly well though? Wasn't that pretty much agreed upon by most of us in here?Spiegel said:
JoshuaJSlone
Member
We make generalizations based on the sales that exist. If I'd been in donny's place I probably would've said 400K, though, as the 300-400K range has a bit more variety to it. Over 400K, though, there's Monster Hunter, Phantasy Star, Dissidia, and Crisis Core, with only Crisis Core being an exception to the "big on local multiplayer" thing.Spiegel said:
BishopLamont
Banned
Ah donnyStern, carrying on a legacy I see.
Spiegel said:
They're either (a) fun to play in groups and competent enough to not piss you off or (b) they're of higher quality than 99% of the other stuff on the system?
PES did pretty well worldwide on the Wii, methinks. Japan is just weird. PowerPro doesn't take advantage of the Wii's unique characteristics, which is vital for attracting the userbase. [Seriously, a baseball game that doesn't allow for motion? On the Wii?] People have a fighter in Smash Bros, plus I'm doubtful TvC was going to do well on any system. And Klonoa? Was this ever really a sales juggernaut? Great game though.
So your argument is PSP's sw sales are generally good because they're better than Wii's?Spiegel said:
Wii has mediocre 3rd party sales, PSP has mediocre 3rd party sales, 360 has mediocre 3rd party sales, PS3 has mediocre 3rd party sales. So yes, when compared to other platforms mediocre 3rd party sales (with two years less on the market), PSP looks just dandy (with two years more on the market). If mediocrity is what you're going for, you've found it.
Spiegel said:
Quality, well developed games with significant and consistent advertising sell a lot.
I think part of our difference on the potential for the Wii in terms of software is that I don't subscribe to the notion that consumers bought these games solely on the basis of Mario/Wii in the title.
Edit:
Vinci said:
That's good, too.
Spiegel said:
If they were selling well, it would be realized potential. I definitely do not think the Wii is currently realizing its potential for software sales in Japan, but the evidence is there (via the Mario/Wii titles you mentioned, among others) that points to significant sales to be had somehow. :lol
Okay, I give up.
My point is: The Wii has yet to prove that it can be a good system for third party games. Selling lots of Nintendo games on a Nintendo console means nothing, jeez even the Gamecube had Mario Kart, Mario Party, Smash Bros, Mario platforming, Zelda, Mario RPG tresspasing the 400k (ahuahua) barrier
The potential can be a good thing but when you have two systems where third parties are doing significantly BETTER (DS) and better in general (psp) it's not that crazy to think that maybe the third party ship will sail before that potential comes to play after so many bombs.
My point is: The Wii has yet to prove that it can be a good system for third party games. Selling lots of Nintendo games on a Nintendo console means nothing, jeez even the Gamecube had Mario Kart, Mario Party, Smash Bros, Mario platforming, Zelda, Mario RPG tresspasing the 400k (ahuahua) barrier
The potential can be a good thing but when you have two systems where third parties are doing significantly BETTER (DS) and better in general (psp) it's not that crazy to think that maybe the third party ship will sail before that potential comes to play after so many bombs.
Spiegel said:
2 points
1- Most of the GC franchises are doing significantly better on Wii. That tells me there is a bigger audience.
2-What Wii's overall/1st party software sales tell me is that Wii owners *do* buy software. Now, its mostly 1st party software at the moment, but at least companies know that the install base will buy games, its just their job to figure out how to tap into that audience.
Regardless of the futile PSP/Wii third-party debate, I'm pretty pleased that we already get 4 decent PSP announcements at the beginning of the year (Gundam arcade, Disgaea 2, .hack and Persona). It's a good indication that, as I said before, PSP 3rd party interest has most likely picked up.
schuelma said:
Yep. There's no point in differentiating first and third party games. The general consumer is not that aware of companies. They just buy what they think will be fun. Nintendo knows what the consumer wants because they actually make games with the general consumer in mind. They have always been a huge salesforce in Japan.
ksamedi said:
I think its valid to differentiate them- there is a built in Nintendo audience that makes software like Mario Party sell like it does. But I do think its pretty disengenuous to just totally ignore huge software just because it is 1st party. Don't see very many here downplaying WKC because its published by Sony..
charlequin
Banned
HK-47 said:
Well, what's your alternate interpretation? That Wii owners just hate games?
In general, the performance of software combines factors of timing, marketing, characteristics of the userbase, and characteristics of the software itself. By calling these "excuses," you're saying that Vinci is attributing these poor sales to characteristics of the software when actually it's the userbase that's hurting them, right?
I've gotten yelled at in these threads a lot for talking shit about Nintendo's third-party strategy and the success level of Wii titles, but I don't actually think the case to be made against the Wii userbase is that strong, simply because I don't think people have proposed a coherent model for why so many people are buying Wiis but don't want to buy software.
Just as I've been typing this, actually, I've been putting together a new alternate theory (just an idea, so far, not anything I want to defend strongly yet):maybe the fairly consistent B- level of software on Wii may be depressing software sales across the board as people feel like they'd rather buy nothing for their Wii rather than make their only purchase something niche and marginal.
ksamedi said:
I disagree. The general consumer isn't completely brand-agnostic; they tend to have some awareness of big brands (Nintendo, Square-Enix, Capcom, Konami), but not be tremendously clear on the distinction between publisher and developer, or be cognizant of smaller developer names.
People do have broad concepts like "this is a Nintendo game," though, especially since Nintendo does a lot of cross-marketing (things like Smash, which helpfully tells people exactly what games qualify.) There are definitely consumers who will buy something that has Mario in it, or is otherwise somehow clearly identified to them as "a Nintendo game," partially out of brand trust.
jeremy1456
Junior Member
Weisheit said:
Selectively removing companies can help numbers look better on either side.
Like, say if you were to remove Capcom sales from the PSP. The outlook of software sales would not be good...
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Fixed that for you.Kittonwy said:I'm glad WKC is still hanging in the top 10 after 3 weeks
schuelma said:
But the Wii is selling much much faster than the Cube. The cube had only one million seller. Where was this Nintendo fanbase then? Their probably is a core Nintendo audiance. But I don't think that they make that big of a difference in the sales of games like Mario Party. Mario Party is fun to play for everyone. It totally deserves its sales. I'd also like to point out that there is no reason for this Nintendo audiance to dislike third party software.
charlequin said:
I agree with what you say. What I was trying to say is that I'm not sure if brand loyalty to Nintendo is the reason certain third party software is failing. software sales should be much higher even with the huge first party succeses. I think shuelma is right here, big games build the userbase and apatite for other kinds of software as well. What the Wii misses are big third party games. Nintendo has built the userbase for their own kind of games with releaing quality product. We have yet to see this from other companies. This is also in line with your theory.
jeremy1456
Junior Member
ksamedi said:
I think a big part of it is that most 3rd party games on the Wii seem to get little to no advertisement.
Liabe Brave
Member
But aren't you just reinforcing Spiegel's point about too-high expectations (though not his conclusions drawn from that)? Your list indicates that the only system with non-mediocre third-party sales is DS. . .Japan's highest-selling video game system ever. What's the paradigm case, PS2? Japan's second-highest-selling video game system ever? Defining "mediocre" so it applies to nearly everything seems like an abuse of the term.Weisheit said:
Given how many consumers there are for them, 360 and PS3 third-party games sell pretty well, actually. It's just that devs have to be realistic about absolute sales numbers: a blockbuster success on 360 isn't going to sell what a comparative success on PS3 would, which in turn will sell much less than a comparative success on Wii. The difference is that, like donny2112 said, on Wii third-parties aren't living up to their potential; on the HD consoles I'd argue they are, even though the unit numbers of that potential are lower.
I don't think PSP can be separated from Wii in this perspective. But I think there's a clear group of those two systems versus the rest.
charlequin
Banned
donny2112 said:
Similar! (And I do more or less agree with schuelma's position on that.)
Let's say I'm one of the hypothetical "bweeeah DUST GATHERING" Wii owners, right? I bought a Wii because I expected it to win (which it did) and for it to therefore get lots of games in many genres as befits a market leader (which it didn't.) Hypothetical-me is a pretty serious gamer, owns 30+ games for PS2 including some weird niche stuff, has a DS and maybe a PSP too so isn't at any real loss for software to buy...
When I hear that something like TvC or Fragile or whatever is coming out, what do I see? A lot of people who are desperate for something, anything to play on their system overhyping it, probably a lack of the kind of honest attention a niche game could get on a system with a healthy ecosystem. I can't rely on a mass of other gamers to sort out my Katamari Damacys and my Devil Dices from my Okage: Shadow Kings and my Ephemeral Fantasias -- so I just skip the game and buy one of the ten good games coming out on DS instead.
ksamedi said:
I agree that first-party successes don't cause third-party failures but not that the Nintendo brand isn't helping to elevate first-party titles. Titles like Mario Party have a pre-built audience from the GameCube era that they've added to with people who tried them the first time on Wii, which is why they're selling better than they used to; many other kinds of games, though, don't have any pre-build audience because no such audience carried over from the Cube and no publisher has gone in and built such an audience with a high-profile title.
Kurosaki Ichigo
Member
If anyone could take a short break from the thread Wii cock-licking to tell why Media Create numbers are so different between those from Panther OP and those from bttb from previously legit dblog site I'd appreciate it.
Kurosaki Ichigo said:
1) Thank you for pointing that out.
2) This probably means thedrill.no-blog is now unreliable, either through his own attempts at obfuscating the numbers or possibly MC's attempts at tracking down a leak.
3) That could be part of the reason that 1-20 were posted when it was usually 1-10 + a few extra sometimes.
4) Crap.
Jaded Alyx
Member
Uh oh.
test_account
XP-39C²
You are right that the total Wii software sales is better than the total PSP software sales. The Wii and the PSP has sold about as much software each, but the PSP has been out for maybe around 1.5 years longer or so compared to the Wii. So looking at the total software sales compared to how long these 2 systems has been on the market, the total Wii software sales are better indeedWeisheit said:
But in this recent discussion, wouldnt it be more correct to compare the more recent PSP and Wii software sale? I havnt followed this discussion too much, but i think it was about if the developers should choose to develope on the Wii or on the PSP in the upcomming future, if i am not mistaken? If that was the case, then i dont think it matters too much how the software sales were in for example 2007, because i think that the developers (or maybe more the publishers) are looking on how the software sales is in more recent times.
Indeed, or if you remove the Wii games that are made and/or published by Nintendo themself from the Wiijeremy1456 said:
(i know it might not be a too fair comparison to remove many Wii games and just 1 PSP game though, but do you see what my point is? ).That is an interesting question i think, why does it seem that relatively few 3rd party Wii games doesnt get much adverticing? Does anyone have any idea? I would assume that when you use maybe 1-2 years (or how long it takes) to develope a game, that you would like your game to sell. If you dont advertice the game at all, then there might be a less chance for the game(s) to sell well. Adverticing might be expencive, but still :\jeremy1456 said:
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
HK-47 said:
TvC was a budget game for Capcom as Tatsunoko asked Capcom to make the game not the other way around. I mean there is a reason why the gamewas lowkey both on the Wii AND the arcades.
test_account
XP-39C²
How much did it cost to make TvC?Flying_Phoenix said:
http://dol.dengeki.com/soft/ranking.html
Dissidia: 50K / 825K (Crisis Core LTD: 824K)
Wagamama Fashion: 31K / 651K
Rhythm Tengoku Gold: 31K / 1514K (GBA ver.: 307K LTD)
MHP2G Best: 30K / 290K
Wii Fit: 29K / 3078K
WKC: 26K / 292K
DSi 11th week: 150K / 1,530,000
DS: 6,530,000
DSL: 11th week: 149K / 17,280,000
DS HW Total: 25,340,000
Dissidia: 50K / 825K (Crisis Core LTD: 824K)
Wagamama Fashion: 31K / 651K
Rhythm Tengoku Gold: 31K / 1514K (GBA ver.: 307K LTD)
MHP2G Best: 30K / 290K
Wii Fit: 29K / 3078K
WKC: 26K / 292K
DSi 11th week: 150K / 1,530,000
DS: 6,530,000
DSL: 11th week: 149K / 17,280,000
DS HW Total: 25,340,000