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Mega64 - "CANCEL METROID FEDERATION FORCE IMMEDIATELY!"

A spin-off after 5 years of nothing is a BAD idea and reeks of mismanagement to me.

That's kinda what I mean though by I'm not sure what Nintendo's overall intentions with the franchise are. Like post Fusion and Prime 3 they're sitting on Metroid with the question of "Where do we go next?", and there's three armchair answers from the fans: Metriod 5, Metroid Prime 4, or attempt 3D third person again.

Instead we got:
- Remake/reimagining of the original
- Repackaging of the Prime series
- Narrative heavy, exploration reduced Other M (or fumbled 3D third person attempt, if you prefer)
- Federation Force
 
Metroid's problem, and partly ours too, is that Nintendo is incredibly reluctant to forge ahead with a big project such as a new, dedicated console Metroid without having a solid new concept for it. Like, not being able to show something conceptually new in the series is a real problem for them. And yeah, after a dozen Metroid games, I can imagine that it's going to be hard to come up with something new, particularly something which doesn't upset what has become a very particular and difficult-to-please fanbase. Remember that the N64's advent of 3D polygons and analogue control wasn't enough to inspire confidence in Nintendo to create a new Metroid. It took a team of ex-Turok coders to grow those balls.

Metroid is not a gangbuster franchise. It relies on developer enthusiasm to get made as much as it does fan enthusiasm, and considering that Sakamoto got his dick ripped off by the fanbase in 2010, and that they're still angry at him 5 years later, he can probably be forgiven for not wanting to return to Metroid in a hurry.

That said, I do think that Metroid has ingrained itself enough into the awareness of Nintendo fans over several generations to avoid ever falling prey to franchise death. It's old, it's cool, it's doggedly persistent, and it'll be back in some form.
 
That's kinda what I mean though by I'm not sure what Nintendo's overall intentions with the franchise are. Like post Fusion and Prime 3 they're sitting on Metroid with the question of "Where do we go next?", and there's three armchair answers from the fans: Metriod 5, Metroid Prime 4, or attempt 3D third person again.

Instead we got:
- Remake/reimagining of the original
- Repackaging of the Prime series
- Narrative heavy, exploration reduced Other M (or fumbled 3D third person attempt, if you prefer)
- Federation Force

Well, IIRC, Other M was supposed to change the direction of how Metroid 5 was going to go, but Sakamoto fucked that up royally. So I really doubt you can make a Metroid 5 without it bringing up memories of Other M in peoples' minds, no matter how much it tries to avoid it (It wouldn't).

I think the only legitimate way to go for the series now is a complete reboot and get some new blood on the series, because I don't think the people in charge right now have a clue on how to stay true to what made the series great in the first place.
 
That's kinda what I mean though by I'm not sure what Nintendo's overall intentions with the franchise are. Like post Fusion and Prime 3 they're sitting on Metroid with the question of "Where do we go next?", and there's three armchair answers from the fans: Metriod 5, Metroid Prime 4, or attempt 3D third person again.

Instead we got:
- Remake/reimagining of the original
- Repackaging of the Prime series
- Narrative heavy, exploration reduced Other M (or fumbled 3D third person attempt, if you prefer)
- Federation Force

I feel like Nintendo is incapable of making a good Metroid game at this point. I actually believe that. They lack the ability to be bold with their game designs, bold in the way that would suit a new Metroid game. I think they just ain't got it.

They need to find capable people who know about Metroid and care about Metroid and let them MOTHER FUCKING MAKE A GAME! GRRR!
 
The video is funny. I'm not super mad about federation force really, but I will say this: I'm never buying another Nintendo console until I see a proper Metroid on it. Metroid is by far my favorite gaming franchise, and if it dies, then my consumer loyalty dies as well.
 
Metroid's problem, and partly ours too, is that Nintendo is incredibly reluctant to forge ahead with a big project such as a new, dedicated console Metroid without having a solid new concept for it. Like, not being able to show something conceptually new in the series is a real problem for them. And yeah, after a dozen Metroid games, I can imagine that it's going to be hard to come up with something new, particularly something which doesn't upset what has became a very particular and difficult-to-please fanbase. Remember that the N64's advent of 3D polygons and analogue control wasn't enough to inspire confidence in Nintendo to create a new Metroid. It took a team of ex-Turok coders to grow those balls.

Metroid is not a gangbuster franchise. It relies on developer enthusiasm to get made as much as it does fan enthusiasm, and considering that Sakamoto got his dick ripped off by the fanbase in 2010, and that they're still angry at him 5 years later, he can probably be forgiven for not wanting to return to Metroid in a hurry.

That said, I do think that Metroid has ingrained itself enough into the awareness of Nintendo fans over several generations to avoid ever falling prey to franchise death. It's old, it's cool, it's doggedly persistent, and it'll be back in some form.

That's not the first time I've heard of this excuse, but I don't really buy it. There are any number of ways you can stick a mechanic into a new item pickup in Metroid. They probably just always appropriate those ideas to other games first.
 
I feel like Nintendo is incapable of making a good Metroid game at this point. I actually believe that. They lack the ability to be bold with their game designs, bold in the way that would suit a new Metroid game. I think they just ain't got it.

They need to find capable people who know about Metroid and care about Metroid and let them MOTHER FUCKING MAKE A GAME! GRRR!
I very much doubt that. Nintendo could make another fantastic Metroid game if they wanted to... emphasis on the word could. The problem more seems to me to be that they just aren't personally interested in making a solid, traditional sidescroller Metroid game for whatever reason nor a game in the vein of Prime or Prime 2.

Instead, noting the trend from Fusion to Metroid Prime: Hunters to Corruption to Other M to Federation Force and from what Nintendo have discussed regarding the future of the series from here it seems really clear that they just care less and less about a game where a lone Samus Aran finds herself in a desperate situation on a hostile planet and manage to fight against the odds to recollect her abilities and escape the planet all by herself, and instead seem fascinated by the idea of making her interact more and more with the Fedeartion, other bounty hunters, and other such NPC characters and an increased focus on direct-storytelling as opposed to discoverable lore, shifting the games from being focused primarily on Samus's/the player's actions at helping her survive to a flat-out narrative and NPC interactions being the primary driving force.

This of course both limits the feel of how isolated the worlds in the game feels and more significantly limits the feeling of how much control the player really has over where they're taking Samus and when as Samus is just being more and more lead around by a plot, limiting the need for exploration and player agency concerning what to do from point to point in the game. These are all naturally rather strong negatives for fans of classic Metroid games, but for whatever reason, especially based on FF and what they've discussed about their future plans for the series at E3, it seems the direction their determined to take the series for the time being, regardless of how far that takes them away from the core Metroid gameplay and the elements that make Metroid games, well, "Metroid."

Now, of course, Nintendo could stop doing at any time. I still fully believe they're capable of making an excellent Metroid game, if that's what they actually wanted to do. There's no doubt in my mind that the studios they have working for them, such as NLG and Retro Studios, are still fully capable of doing that. They're clearly still extremely talented developers and more than capable of developing such a game if that were actually the game Nintendo asked them to make. The problem in my mind is, for whatever reason, they either just don't want to (which seems to be the case, IMO) or otherwise for some strange reason think the path to success for the series (despite the success of stuff like Ori and the Blind Forest and the Bloodstained Kickstarter showing there's demand for 2D Meroidvania games, but Nintendo unfortunately doesn't exactly have a history of being swift in taking note of such things and actually adapting their plans in response regardless) is to try and force more narrative and lore and NPCs and shitty federation friends and stuff in there, despite that... not exactly working so well thus far and doubling down on it anyway. All we can really hope I guess is that whatever it is that's causing Nintendo to think this is a great idea for the series is just for them to get it out of their systems and move on and back to the classic Metroid style, hopefully sooner then later.
 
That's not the first time I've heard of this excuse, but I don't really buy it. There are any number of ways you can stick a mechanic into a new item pickup in Metroid. They probably just always appropriate those ideas to other games first.

I'd say you're right, but that's just a condition of what Metroid is, and how far down on Nintendo's list of priorities it is. Unless it's a substantial, overarching concept which sticks out a mile, it does damage to Nintendo's reputation as an innovator. The bigger the project/budget, the more bold and unique that concept has to be.

We really are dealing with a franchise where it's only going to happen if someone at -or affiliated with- Nintendo has a burning desire to make it. But without the ideas, there's no desire either. I'm sure if Nintendo came up with something like Shinesparking or the X-Ray visor all over again, they'd be falling over themselves to get another project moving.

For all we know, they may already have.
 
I think it's a number of things that angered Nintendo fans in general.

First, it was E3 and not much was shown. Expectations were high but the best reveals were already known.

MS and Sony had incredible shows, even historic in Sonys case. How could comparisons not be made.

Star fox was shown and looked terrible (to a lot of us)

Metroid was shown and looked terrible (to most of us)

I think the 'cancel it' joke is funny for that reason, it's half serious but strikes a sour chord in many of us that wished for so much more from Ninty this E3.
 
The gameplay of Other M is fine. Good even. (Except those stupid pixel hunt moments.)

It's the narrative that's complete garbage.

I genuinely don't understand this defence of Other Mrs game play. It's not good. Not terrible per se, but not engaging in the slightest. The dodge function requires absolutely no skill and is eminently spammable. The intermittent switching to first-person is jarring and just reminds one of how much better Prime was in that respect. The health recharging made the level design revolve around set pieces rather than cohesive areas. I mean, plenty of Nintendo games have had nonsensical to shit stories before without it de facto killing the franchise, but that's exactly what Other M did and that's because it didn't even have the excuse of playing well to hide behind.
 
Amazing video.
Some people have turn stupid trying to cancel (or even worse) grt devs fired forthis game.
As someone who loves NLG and the idea of the game, but absolutely not the execution, i will just not buy it if it gets like all what i saw in treehouse on the stores, and go my merry way.
Will be sad about NLG and their probably bomba, but it would be stupid to do anything some of this detractors are doing.

The only issue would be finding people that actually LIKE Other M.

Like that thread where there was a do you like other m yes or no vote and there was a majority of yes, amirite?
That was a fun salty thread of people who were mad that their views were not the majority like they thought.
Another similar case? Bioshock Infinite. You would think that the game is absolutely hated woth all those hate threads that pop up on neogaf once in a while. But in reality, theres a big majority of people who loved that game and even got second at gaf's own goty awards.
Or, even if i dont like it. MGS4. That won goty 2 times because salty people wanted a recount years after...
 
Like that thread where there was a do you like other m yes or no vote and there was a majority of yes, amirite?

That wasn't actually the case.

The OP of that thread was extremely biased and counted anything besides "I hate Other M grrrrr death to Sakamoto" as a "yes" or in the worst case as "unsure". It should ring a bell when that OP lists his results and splits them up into "Team For" and "Hater Club".

So it was somewhat like in the Mega64 video, but the opposite of that.

It doesn't even make sense to ask such a dumbed down question. There may be people, who liked the Ninja-style gameplay, because they like Team Ninja games, although that has nothing to do with Metroid, but still didn't like the terrible story and dialogue. As what do you count someone like that? There were also people who said "it wasn't that bad, but it was a terrible Metroid game". Is that a yes or a no?

Also what's really telling is that most "haters" actually explained what they thought was wrong and bad in great detail. I'm personally a fan of Metroid right from the first game. That's WHY I was so pissed about Other M. The other side was basically full of "it was ok" posts.

It's quite telling that Nintendo hasn't done anything with the Metroid franchise until now and that Other M dropped in price that fast. The majority of players didn't like it. Otherwise the behaviour of Nintendo wouldn't make sense.
 
Metroid fans are worried they're turning into the next Earthbound or Chrono fanbase.

It's been long enough that Earthbound and Chrono fans have accepted the state of their favorite franchises. Metroid fans still have reason to hope, but spin offs like these create the risk it sells poorly and finishes off the franchise, or sells well and replaces it.
EarthBound would be lucky to get any spin-offs whatsoever.
 
It's not a 'new" cycle. The arguments about Fusion's linearity doesn't magically disappear because time has passed. Other M's terrible plot and linearity doesn't go away with time either.

You're just looking for an argument, dude. I meant like a 'new cycle' in general. Like in a series that's never had one before.
 
Gamer-many-lives-300x230.jpg
Haha this picture is the worst
 
I feel like Nintendo is incapable of making a good Metroid game at this point. I actually believe that. They lack the ability to be bold with their game designs, bold in the way that would suit a new Metroid game. I think they just ain't got it.

They need to find capable people who know about Metroid and care about Metroid and let them MOTHER FUCKING MAKE A GAME! GRRR!
Funny enough, I think Federation Force IS bold. TOO bold. It's creating a Metroid game in a new style without Samus focused on cooperation, teamwork, and mission-based goals. It's an idea that so many don't like precisely because it is too different and too fresh, instead of a reheated Super Metroid or Prime (note: I still want more Super and Prime style games BADLY).

And the reason it's being made is the Prime series's creative director WANTS to make it, and was passionate about making a game that in his own words "fleshes out" the Metroid universe by doing a side-game about the oft-ignored Federation.

it's an original Metroid with an original premise with an original play structure made by a talented developer and directed by the guy who helped birth the Prime series... But it's not the exact game the majority was clamoring for.

Eh, still going to buy it, most likely. No way can it be worse than Other M (knock on wood).
 
Funny enough, I think Federation Force IS bold. TOO bold. It's creating a Metroid game in a new style without Samus focused on cooperation, teamwork, and mission-based goals. It's an idea that so many don't like precisely because it is too different and too fresh, instead of a reheated Super Metroid or Prime (note: I still want more Super and Prime style games BADLY).

And the reason it's being made is the Prime series's creative director WANTS to make it, and was passionate about making a game that in his own words "fleshes out" the Metroid universe by doing a side-game about the oft-ignored Federation.

it's an original Metroid with an original premise with an original play structure made by a talented developer and directed by the guy who helped birth the Prime series... But it's not the exact game the majority was clamoring for.

Eh, still going to buy it, most likely. No way can it be worse than Other M (knock on wood).

It's hard to look at something which strips a franchise of everything that makes it unique, and stuffs it into yet another space marine co-op shooter as "fresh". The only thing fresh about this particular space marine co-op shooter is it's on the 3DS, a system that's extremely poorly fit for co-op shooters.
 
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