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[Sub_Level]

Graphically, it's a 3D game, but it really wouldn't be until Snake Eater and Guns of the Patriots that the series would feature 3D GAMEPLAY.

The gameplay in MGS could easily be done in 2D barring the first-person view. Sons of Liberty is similar although less so because it introduced so many 3D features like first-person shooting and featured more multi-level vertical areas such as the Tanker Engine Room or the Strut D Sediment Pool, either of which would be significantly different in 2D.

The rudimentary gameplay of MGS is by no means a weakness. If you ever decide to dabble in the VR missions for either MGS or MGS2, you will find some pretty awesome sneaking mechanics. They're not good stealth showcases in the sense that Thief or Splinter Cell Chaos Theory are; it's all a pretty cartoony affair from a conceptual standpoint what with the limited guard vision cones and lack of shadows, but they're really well done.

 

[Nvzman]

To me, MGS1 was just the start of the amazing game series of Metal Gear "Solid".
MGS2 was pretty damn good, and MGS3 is still my favorite for everything it did. MGS4 was still fuckin' ace, and I just got Ground Zeroes today and already put at least 3-4 hours into it.

Damn Kojima, you're on a roll.

Graphically, it's a 3D game, but it really wouldn't be until Snake Eater and Guns of the Patriots that the series would feature 3D GAMEPLAY.

The gameplay in MGS could easily be done in 2D barring the first-person view. Sons of Liberty is similar although less so because it introduced so many 3D features like first-person shooting and featured more multi-level vertical areas such as the Tanker Engine Room or the Strut D Sediment Pool, either of which would be significantly different in 2D.

It was already done in 2D with Metal Gear: Solid Snake. MG:SS and MGS1 are actually very similar in terms of gameplay.

 

[Sub_Level]

It was already done in 2D with Metal Gear: Solid Snake. MG:SS and MGS1 are actually very similar in terms of gameplay.

Of course. That's what makes MGS very 2D.

Don't think I used the scope ever, nor was the corner view all that useful considering the radar was present. On higher difficulties, sure, the 3D mechanics were more important. The sniper wolf fights would be hard to do in 2D.

 

[Charles Alan Ratliff]

It's probably the game I've beaten the most (10+ times). I plan on beating it again soon when I play through the entire series so I can finally play Peace Walker, Rising, and Ground Zeroes for the first time.

I initially tried it through the demo on a PlayStation Underground disc, not understanding the mechanics of the game and giving up (I couldn't understand how to get the elevator to come down). After talking to my friend during elementary school about it, I retried the demo and made it to the elevator. The sequence that follows, along with everything afterward, made me fall in love with it. I replayed the demo numerous times and eventually got the full game. It's one of the first ones I really got emotionally invested in. The ending credits with that song and all the footage of Alaska totally got me.

Playing the sequence in Guns of the Patriots where

Spoiler

you return to Shadow Moses ten years afterward, which was also ten years in real life since I first experienced MGS

will forever remain as one of those transcendental moments in gaming that I'll always remember.

 

[MormaPope]

Of course. That's what makes MGS very 2D.

Don't think I used the scope ever, nor was the corner view all that useful considering the radar was present. On higher difficulties, sure, the 3D mechanics were more important. The sniper wolf fights would be hard to do in 2D.

That's what makes those difficulties more fun. Soliton radar makes the stealth feel like a really fast paced game of hide and seek. On hard and extreme looking at guards patrol in first person, and then timing your path so you never engage them, is extremely satisfying. Watching the pathing of the guards also makes the game much faster in the future, as you'll be able to run non stop through most of the areas.

 

[Walpurgisnacht]

Mei Ling: SNAKE THATS A LADYS BATHROOM

It's stuff like this that made me enjoy it so much. You just don't see this kind of stuff in other games.

 

[G-Fex]

Usually dialogue from 99 percent of other games I could no fucks about. But MGS conversations always draw me in and I love to hear.

 

[fade_]

It's stuff like this that made me enjoy it so much. You just don't see this kind of stuff in other games.

This too

 

[RedSwirl]

Usually dialogue from 99 percent of other games I could no fucks about. But MGS conversations always draw me in and I love to hear.

I suddenly remembered this when I played the HD collection. It reminded me of how soulless most of the dialogue and characterization in today's action games is. MGS may be goofly a lot of the time, but it succeeds in having a personality. How many other action or military-themed games can you think of that have actual entertaining dialogue? Chaos Theory is the only other one off the top of my head.

 

[Lindsay]

The game's progression is great and it uses backtracking highly effectively to convey a sense of scale that really works in making a fairly small base (and a fairly short game) feel meaty and well developed.

The base is small but super memorable! I hadn't played MGS in a few years but when I jumped into it last month it all came flooding back and I knew what to do an where ta go. It being a small game with high detail an no two rooms alike gives it a nice unforgetable feeling most of the later games lack!

 

[Chinner]

Even the cutscenes themselves have a tighter pacing style, compared to the sequels. Not a lot of the awkward pauses in conversations or tedious camera lingering you get in MGS2-4.

As a result, most scenes have a snappier flow in MGS1.

The cutscenes in MGS1 are stylish and simple, but confident in what they do.It's straight to the point and you can't fault it. I think the advances in technology allowed Kojima to develop his cinematography skills, but hes gotten into the habit of over-developing scenes and being a little bit fancy for the sake of it.

The C4 scenes in MGS3 are proof of that.

 

[1970 Chevelle SS]

I consider it the pinnacle of Kojimas work. This was the last time he took total control of the entire game. The game has so much polish and as others have described, the atmosphere which is dark,cold and serious blend in perfectly with the soundtrack and the voice acting blast anything else the rest of the series put out. Boss battles were a blast to play and would have been even better if not for the horrible controls.Hearing Vulcan Raven huffing and puffing faster and harder as he suffers more damage is just one heart pumping exciting moment. If i didn't lose my saves to a hard drive failure i would right now jump into that battle.

To me the series starting with MGS3 for lack of better words became more "mainstream" if that makes sense and with some things getting better with each versions, other areas suffered.

It's my favorite game of all time,no question about it. I just think many who don't like it mainly have a grudge about the horrible graphics compared to what we have on our hands today. But to me pixelated faces give your imagination to give the characters your own face based on their dialog.

I'm in love with this game and i doubt very much anything will ever come along and give me the same feelings as i have about this one.

Now im off to play it on my PC.

 

[Tekku]

I don't think it has aged all that well. The backtracking is frustrating and the controls and camera positions can be all over the place. Especially during boss fights.

A masterpiece when it came out though.

 

[SporeCrawler]

still the best in the series storywise

in fact the story was so right compared to all the other stuff that came afterwards that i can gladly look over the tank controls.

i also gotta say that i loved twinsnakes. I occasionally replay the game which cannot be said about the other entries.

 

[hateradio]

I played that game so many times a decade ago, possibly 100s of hours. One of my favorites forever. 💯

 

[encephalon]

I love going back to old games from this era and being impressed with what they were able to do with the limited hardware and expertise. MGS1, of course, is no exception. What a great game.

 

[Jawmuncher]

I can still pop in MGS1 this day and be just as engrossed as the first time I played it. I can't say that about any other game, and it really does make it timeless in my eyes. Everything just blends together so well to make such an amazing and unforgettable experience. That to me Kojima stilll hasn't been able to recapture. Though that doesn't make the latter games any less good though.

 

[Kopite]

Amazing game. I always felt the stealth was a little broken though.

 

[Bishop89]

It really really is.

I LOVE the soundtrack as well...I think that plays a BIG part of why its such a great game.

That Snake vs Gray Fox duel was fantastic,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIW_HG9bzn0&feature=player_detailpage#t=250

 

[DieH@rd]

The best game on PS1. One of the best games I have ever played.

Something else I find really cool: the cinematic framing of the cutscenes and how everything is real time (no FMV).

And even with that kind of approach, Kojima filled two CDs of game data.

 

[offshore]

I don't understand why there has not been a remake, considering what, 70% of the assets were remade for MGS4. Whack in the original V/O (though I guess kinda tricky now Hayter's been fired) and it would have been glorious.

 

[boredandlazy]

Usually dialogue from 99 percent of other games I could no fucks about. But MGS conversations always draw me in and I love to hear.

A mono TV?

 

[strobogo]

I played MGS after I played the HD Collection. I think it could be rereleased with almost no modifications besides updated graphics and still be an excellent game.

 

[G-Fex]

A mono TV?

I just discovered that when knight did a playthrough of MGS1. That's amazing, I never knew it existed.

I played MGS after I played the HD Collection. I think it could be rereleased with almost no modifications besides updated graphics and still be an excellent game.

UNBELIEVABLE. YOURE SUPPOSED TO DO IT FIRST THEN 2 and 3.

 

[NewGame]

I really disliked all the 3D MGS games. Like, they were terribly boring and mechanically 'too easy' offering no depth aside from some sort of superficial play you could pull off with certain items.

But then MGS 3 came along and I gave the series another try. I freaking loved MGS 3! I loved catching food and tending wounds, I wish they made a whole separate IP based on the mechanics in MGS 3.

 

[strobogo]

I just discovered that when knight did a playthrough of MGS1. That's amazing, I never knew it existed.



UNBELIEVABLE. YOURE SUPPOSED TO DO IT FIRST THEN 2 and 3.

Well you ain't gotta get hot about it

 

[G-Fex]

Well you ain't gotta get hot about it

while you were watching your dubya cee dubya in 98, I was fighting revolver ocelot and fist fighting the cyborg ninja.

HURT ME MORE STRO

 

[strobogo]

while you were watching your dubya cee dubya in 98, I was fighting revolver ocelot and fist fighting the cyborg ninja.

HURT ME MORE STRO

Sorry, dingus, but I never played a MGS game until the HD Collection. I wasn't interested, but now I've seen the error of my ways.

 

[Marjar]

I played it for the first time last year and while the story was enjoyable I just couldn't get into the gameplay at all. I really had to force myself to complete it.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

It was already done in 2D with Metal Gear: Solid Snake. MG:SS and MGS1 are actually very similar in terms of gameplay.

MG2:SS is like 90% MGS1 prototype.
Even playing it for the first time after MGS1,2 and 3 I enjoyed it the most of the entire series and its actually my favorite game of all time.

Its kinda funny because its basically identical yet doesn't have most of what made Solid amazing(Voice acting, Foxhound, graphics, updated mechanics)
Yet easily topped MGS1 for me.
I can't even imagine had I played it when it actually released and not 15 years later.

 

[Batzi]

Totally agree!

 

[chogidogs]

Never experienced anything like it when I first played it. Stuff like that will forever be a part of my favorite gaming memories.

 

[Agnosia]

That's you changing, not the game. You age. The game does not age. Why would someone be afraid to say, "My expectations have changed"? I think it makes people appear less self centered.



So...again, you changed. The areas where you think the game is clunky have always been that way.

That argument is a dead-end. If you apply that logic to shitty games then suddenly they are good now because it's all relative, it's all about expectations.

Games do age, or more precisely, the impression they can produce in the player, which for all intents and purposes translates to the game itself since you can only play it in the present. If someone plays MGS1 in 2014 then MGS1-2014 will be MGS1 for him, not the MGS1 from 1998. The game might be the same but the context is not. GoldenEye was fucking awesome in the late 90's, but if you play it now after having played FPS games from the 2000's and 2010's it's god awful, its effect is not powerful now. The reason why old MGS games still hold up well today is because most of their good assets aren't technical (gameplay, graphics) but artistic (story, dialogue, characters, atmosphere, music, art direction) and those age way slower because of their emotional nature; a story from a hundred years ago can still be good nowadays, but you cannot say the same about a game whose stronger assets are technical, like gameplay mechanics or graphics, which will be pretty much obsolete by that time.

That's why games like Doom 3, Crysis and any other game whose biggest selling point is their technical achievements are condemned to oblivion way faster than say Ocarina of Time or MGS since they base their substance on technical aspects that improve every year no matter what. Gameplay mechanics are a little more flexible than graphics though, if you nail them and become the pioneer that everyone else follows and if gameplay isn't affected much by upcoming technological advances then the context will remain more or less the same and your games will remain powerful for longer, like Mario games, but you have to really hit it big; nailing the mechanics for the time is not enough, as GoldenEye shows.

 

[Broken Joystick]

I'd like to read that theory. Do you know where to find it?

For the life of me I can't find it any more, it was really clutching at straws (well, as much as you can with a theory lol) but this one makes more "sense":

Nah, you got it all wrong. MGS1 is the real Shadow Moses incident as played in real time by Solid Snake. Twin Snakes is actually you playing as Raiden, playing a simulation of the Shadow Moses incident.

http://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/comments/196c67/twin_snakes_idea/

 

[Y2Kev]

That argument is a dead-end. If you apply that logic to shitty games then suddenly they are good now because it's all relative, it's all about expectations.

I think I addressed this already: if you are saying a game is poor at the time in which you play it, then it is poor. The game's age has nothing to do with the actual content of the disk.

My argument is not relative at all. Something X will be something X ten years later. You keep talking about context and relativity, but again it is all relative to the player and not to the game (or to other games).

Games do age, or more precisely, the impression they can produce in the player, which for all intents and purposes translates to the game itself since you can only play it in the present.

No, I don't agree with this. A game aging and someone's impression of a game changing over time are two very different things and are the core of the argument I am making right now. They are plainly not the same thing; one is clearly game-centric and the other is player-centric.

Games like Doom 3 (I'm not going to engage you on Crysis. That game has fantastic gameplay.) were evaluated critically at their time of release by intelligent tastemakers who knew at the time that it was a shallow, repetitive, overlong game with pretty graphics. There were plenty of people saying that on day one; it has little to do with the reflective capabilities of time.

 

[strobogo]

It's kind of weird how many games from the PS1/N64 era have aged so poorly, but how many games from the NES/SNES/Genesis era are still fun and great to play.

 

[Betty]

It's kind of weird how many games from the PS1/N64 era have aged so poorly, but how many games from the NES/SNES/Genesis era are still fun and great to play.

Not really when you think about it, PS1/N64 was the first real shaky steps into 3D game worlds for many console developers, so as good as the games were they've been outclassed in terms of camera and character control since then.

NES/SNES/Genesis was mostly side scrolling titles, which the industry had practically perfected by that point.

 

[R-User!]

Totally agree!

In short, so do I - and I love this thread!

 

[Mman235]

Games like Doom 3 (I'm not going to engage you on Crysis. That game has fantastic gameplay.) were evaluated critically at their time of release by intelligent tastemakers who knew at the time that it was a shallow, repetitive, overlong game with pretty graphics. There were plenty of people saying that on day one; it has little to do with the reflective capabilities of time.

Yeah listing Doom 3 as a game that's "aged badly" pretty odd, as most of the complaints I see about it today are exactly the same as the ones many people had with it when it came out, and I say that as someone who likes it.

 

[Fancy Clown]

What I think makes this particular Metal Gear game so much better is its story pacing. The whole game takes place in one location over the course of a single night. Narratively, this keeps Kojima on somewhat of a tight leash. Characters aren't able to globe hop at their convenience, and very little can happen behind the scenes without the player knowing. A small time frame allows for easier management of all the pieces and makes the build up of tension both more natural and simpler. A good example of this is the original "Die Hard." Look at how tight the movie is from a narrative point of view, then compare it to "Live Free or Die Hard."

The pacing is great...except for the two instances of backtracking that bring the game to a grinding halt. "Oh you want to save Meryl and kick this sniper chick's ass? Well too bad, you have to go back to almost the beginning of the game first". "You want to stop the bad guys and beat this game? too bad you have to backtrack, come back, back track again, and then come all the way back again".

At least the quest for the sniper rifle had new areas and challenges for you to go to, and it was satisfying to come back to finally get the battle started, but their's no excuse for the key card backtracking, it's utterly pointless, time-wasting filler, and the biggest flaw in an otherwise great game.

 

[G-Fex]

For the life of me I can't find it any more, it was really clutching at straws (well, as much as you can with a theory lol) but this one makes more "sense":





http://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/comments/196c67/twin_snakes_idea/

Interesting thing I learned on stream from watching and hearing commentary from like metal gear experts practically.

Colonel tells Raiden that this is the first time he'll get to use first person mode to shoot and talks about hanging too. And he points out these things that he couldn't do in the simulation which means that while Raiden did go through a re-enactment of shadow moses, it was more or less like MGS1 and the other training was VR-Missions since it's brought up in video.

So Raiden didn't try these abilities out prior to MGS2 Plant mission.

If he did do a simulation of the Tanker mission, then it was on the MGS1 engine oddly enough.

It's strange but that's what I got from it.


In my mind: Twin Snakes is the movie based on In the darkness of Shadow Moses.

 

[Abounder]

It made me buy a Playstation and the rubbery Todd McFarlane action figures.

The atmosphere and overall tone and direction in that game was phenomenal. Even the small stuff like the death title animation was fun to see. The characters, music, art style, story, and boss fights are as great as it gets for gaming.

 

[dc89]

I love everything about it. Even this gets me excited:

http://youtu.be/NImW-Rs8eK8

I love it when Uknighted streams MGS and the twitch chat join in with this.

 

[G-Fex]

I love it when Uknighted streams MGS and the twitch chat join in with this.

how about that TPP trailer?

 

[Freeman]

In my mind: Twin Snakes is the movie based on In the darkness of Shadow Moses.

I like this line of thought, maybe its Raiden going through it in VR.

 

[NIGHT-]

Easily the best of the MGS games. The only one I could play without shaking my head to the nutty plot. Game still holds up wonderfully! One the best games ever

 

[GameAddict411]

It certainly plays nice and smoothly. I think the Big Boss storyline is completely, 100% exhausted and Kojima is only bound to screw stuff up by sticking in that period. On top of that, the characters introduced in Peace Walker are absolutely dreadful (Paz, GTFO) and i don't really like that he's continuing down that path.

The writing in the game seems stilted and unnatural.

i agree, here is a video that perfectly explains why kojima should have went with a new story, plot, characters:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OABF4AsUec

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

One of the greatest of all time even now. That was a nice write up Kev, I love reminiscing about MGS.

Funny enough MGS4 got me to go back and play the original immediately after finishing it. The Shadow Moses level in MGS4 tugged at all my emotional chords of nostalgia. Even playing it right on the heels of the most advanced entry in the series yet MGS still felt just perfect for its time and a game that still holds up remarkably well for all the reasons you listed. I also feel it is the only MGS to have a story that was grounded enough that I could become emotionally involved in all the characters.

 

[dc89]

how about that TPP trailer?

Haha. Brilliant communit, the chat is great every time.

 

[LostAnkh]

I finally finished the game a few weeks ago, and I loved it. But I don't know when I'll get to the 2nd one, as I've still got a backlog of games to play.