DarkMaigle
Member
I like the game a lot, in a vacuum it's pretty great. There's just too many games in the franchise and the genre that are better. Id like to see the devs get another shot at it tho.
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Metroid: Samus Returns |OT| What's past is prologue.
- Thread starter TheMoon
- Start date
SciencePilot
Member
I can't remember the exact section you're talking about, but no, I'm pretty sure you don't need to do that. I don't remember any maneuvers in the game that are that complicated. I can't ever recall bomb jumping being required at all, even.
freeofgreed
Member
Thanks I got it. Funny how right after I post I figure it out. I just had to shot missles at the ceiling tho I swore I tried that before and it didn't work....
panama chief
Member
Thank you.
This has only been the last page or two with the "meh" to negative reactions. The reactions have been largely positive. I still rate it right below Super for 2D games. Undecided on the whole series, but definitely pretty high.
Claude Augario
Member
I actually did exactly what you described only to discover it was a missile block...
Rodney McKay
Member
Haven't played a whole lot of it yet, but that's the feeling I've gotten so far.
I like being able to aim in any direction, the counter mechanic helps keep the combat fresh (usually my least favorite thing about 2D Metroids), and the 3D effect of the backgrounds are nice along with the cinematic camera angles during scenes which is pretty nice.
But I'm a little worried that if I don't binge my way through this game it's going to get lost in the shuffle of so many other games coming out soon.
I finish the game for first time, 100% items, 14 hours in-game, 19 hours tracked by the console lol Fantastic game, there are some problems, mostly things from the original and other because a lack of polished from newcomer devs in the series , but the positive stuff shines more than the negative.
Free-aim is SO AWESOME.
Free-aim is SO AWESOME.
It definitely gets stronger on the back half, though I liked it a lot from get-go so ymmv.
freeofgreed
Member
Lol glad i'm not the only who thought of doing that. But I can't imagine how much of a pain it was to actually pull off.
Finished it.
----------------
I think the game controls well overall outside some annoying stuff like the spider ball that decides to go in a complete different direction at will. Could've been better but it was serviceable overall.
Music is non existant, honestly outside of two or three it felt like there simply was none, they really failed that aspect but personally i think it goes in line with the serie, might be worth posting in the contreversial thread but whatever.
The metroid fights are fine outside of those that change location as they please but they get repetitive really quick, everytime you finally see a new one it just feels like freedom but you know it will be the same shit after like 2 fights of those. It's a flaw of the original game but they could have at least either reduced the numer of metroids or work on more variants and by more variants i mean more than one move that changes. At least the fights are fine, not targeting another remake or anything.
It kinda annoys me because i really love the idea of actually hunting metroids but they really needed to bring the diversity to salvage it, i really wanted to be able to say, metroid 2 is finally the best metroid game as it should have always been, but no it's not and never will (i'm sad). As a result it also hinders the will to explore because going through what seems like the same thing only to be greeted by the same metroid you killed x time is just not motivating.
The boss fights overall are all good but there's not enough, especially when outside of the zeta, omega and the queen the metroid just feels like mini boss the first time you encounter them.
The Diggernaut completely humiliates everything else, to me it feels he escaped from another game that we, mortals, are simply not worthy of playing and blessed metroid sr with his divine presence. Honestly this thing alone made this game worth playing for me. Actually he made me think the following bosses would be of the same caliber but he just ruined them.
There's not enough regular enemies, you'll pretty much be spammed with color swaps really fast and most of them are either dealt with freeze + missile because the regular beam is shit or aeon beam for a few that actually dare resist. Regular attack quickly became a non factor and outside of boss fight countering is counter productive, a waste of time. Just freeze and win.
Most of them are also: shine -> rush at you. It's just boring.
It's badly paced, like seriously you get your power up slowly which is kinda normal, that inroduce you to new puzzles you will quickly get bored of or are underexploited and suddenly in a single chapter they give you like 4-5 and you suddenly turn into a living god, but i'll admit that when it happened my interest kinda sparked again because of all my new toys. This felt wrong, they really REALLY failed on that part.
I loved exploring at first but it kinda became a chore at some point, i think the mix of being greeted by the same metroid or failed attempt at a variant, the samey easy puzzles you need to go through to reach them and get more missiles you already have in more than enough amount is just not helping. It's not really fun after a while. It was pretty apparent because i never wanted to go back to finally open those doors i couldn't beforehand, or get that item that was out of reach but could clearly see. And it proved i was right to think that way when i went for the 100% items and felt happy to end it, not because i did something impressive, but because i finished a chore. Now that i think about it, even the diggernaut chase sequences added some variation that was cruely needed even if it's a pretty common thing to encounter in games. He really was the best robot.
Took me 8 hours to finish it at 100%, overall i can't say i hated it even if it seems really negative, i could still play a long time without stopping or even wanting to, but for me the game as clear flaws it heritates from the game it originates from, which they should have tried to improve and kinda failed. Honestly even with that current level design, if they actually worked on let's say 20 good metroid variants, the game would have been far better, just knowing you went through all this to fight a new metroid with some old and new moves, or a new form would have made everything better. Or simply reduce the amount radically and introduce some other bosses instead.
It's a serviceable game but that's really it.
----------------
I think the game controls well overall outside some annoying stuff like the spider ball that decides to go in a complete different direction at will. Could've been better but it was serviceable overall.
Music is non existant, honestly outside of two or three it felt like there simply was none, they really failed that aspect but personally i think it goes in line with the serie, might be worth posting in the contreversial thread but whatever.
The metroid fights are fine outside of those that change location as they please but they get repetitive really quick, everytime you finally see a new one it just feels like freedom but you know it will be the same shit after like 2 fights of those. It's a flaw of the original game but they could have at least either reduced the numer of metroids or work on more variants and by more variants i mean more than one move that changes. At least the fights are fine, not targeting another remake or anything.
It kinda annoys me because i really love the idea of actually hunting metroids but they really needed to bring the diversity to salvage it, i really wanted to be able to say, metroid 2 is finally the best metroid game as it should have always been, but no it's not and never will (i'm sad). As a result it also hinders the will to explore because going through what seems like the same thing only to be greeted by the same metroid you killed x time is just not motivating.
The boss fights overall are all good but there's not enough, especially when outside of the zeta, omega and the queen the metroid just feels like mini boss the first time you encounter them.
The Diggernaut completely humiliates everything else, to me it feels he escaped from another game that we, mortals, are simply not worthy of playing and blessed metroid sr with his divine presence. Honestly this thing alone made this game worth playing for me. Actually he made me think the following bosses would be of the same caliber but he just ruined them.
There's not enough regular enemies, you'll pretty much be spammed with color swaps really fast and most of them are either dealt with freeze + missile because the regular beam is shit or aeon beam for a few that actually dare resist. Regular attack quickly became a non factor and outside of boss fight countering is counter productive, a waste of time. Just freeze and win.
Most of them are also: shine -> rush at you. It's just boring.
It's badly paced, like seriously you get your power up slowly which is kinda normal, that inroduce you to new puzzles you will quickly get bored of or are underexploited and suddenly in a single chapter they give you like 4-5 and you suddenly turn into a living god, but i'll admit that when it happened my interest kinda sparked again because of all my new toys. This felt wrong, they really REALLY failed on that part.
I loved exploring at first but it kinda became a chore at some point, i think the mix of being greeted by the same metroid or failed attempt at a variant, the samey easy puzzles you need to go through to reach them and get more missiles you already have in more than enough amount is just not helping. It's not really fun after a while. It was pretty apparent because i never wanted to go back to finally open those doors i couldn't beforehand, or get that item that was out of reach but could clearly see. And it proved i was right to think that way when i went for the 100% items and felt happy to end it, not because i did something impressive, but because i finished a chore. Now that i think about it, even the diggernaut chase sequences added some variation that was cruely needed even if it's a pretty common thing to encounter in games. He really was the best robot.
Took me 8 hours to finish it at 100%, overall i can't say i hated it even if it seems really negative, i could still play a long time without stopping or even wanting to, but for me the game as clear flaws it heritates from the game it originates from, which they should have tried to improve and kinda failed. Honestly even with that current level design, if they actually worked on let's say 20 good metroid variants, the game would have been far better, just knowing you went through all this to fight a new metroid with some old and new moves, or a new form would have made everything better. Or simply reduce the amount radically and introduce some other bosses instead.
It's a serviceable game but that's really it.
Things are really picking up now. Have about 8 hours at 30%. A few hours ago, I was starting to lose interest, but it's neat how a single power-up can change the game completely in terms of ease of traversal.
As someone who has only ever finished Zero Mission, I'm really liking this. It will be interesting to play the rest of the series, which I plan on doing after I'm done with this.
As someone who has only ever finished Zero Mission, I'm really liking this. It will be interesting to play the rest of the series, which I plan on doing after I'm done with this.
The final boss is garbage. Actually, the entire game's approach to difficulty is garbage. Let's just make everything do an obscene amount of damage! Then no one will notice how limited in scope the battles really are!
At least the diggernaut fight was interesting. But I'm not touching the game again after this.
At least the diggernaut fight was interesting. But I'm not touching the game again after this.
Holy shit, I just got to Area 7, the
The music has left me with chills. It feels like it could play in the final act of the last Metroid game ever and it would be appropriate. I think I will hold off and finish the game tomorrow, even though the music has me hyped up.
Chozo Laboratory.
I tried a search but didn't come up with anything. Has anyone encountered a map completion glitch in Area 5? There is a power up that I have already collected towards the middle of the are but my map still shows the open circle symbol on that space. I found a gamefaqs thread discussing the issue but a few posters said that reloading or leaving the area and coming back fix it. Unfortunately this has not helped in my case. If anyone else had encountered this were you able to fix it? I'm worried that I will lose out on a 100% this run due to the this glitch.
Hey, yeah, I did actually. See here:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=249273258&postcount=1839
Had me pretty annoyed but it did appear after going back to it enough times and reloading the game. I think it might be related to use of Power Bombs/Aeion Pulse in nearby rooms affecting it, because I was spamming them everywhere around it on the map to make the dang thing appear, when I finally got it I just rushed directly to the spot without doing any of that.
I think the problem with this game, which is what AM2R did (with a different angle), is that they mostly tried to turn Metroid 2 into Super Metroid. A lot M2's uniqueness in feeling and atmosphere is lost. It felt a bit creatively bankrupt to just reuse the Norfair and Red Soil music. Too many of the areas blended in together.
I really enjoyed it (just finished getting 100% last night), but wished they had gone further. What we ended up getting was Super Metroid with polygons and without its own voice. Even down to reusing the same tunes (even though they do sound great and I love them).
I did like some of the new uses for existing Metroid staples: the
. The Prime games did a much better job at introducing new and different powerups. 2D games seem intent on giving you the Gravity Suit in every game possible.
I really enjoyed it (just finished getting 100% last night), but wished they had gone further. What we ended up getting was Super Metroid with polygons and without its own voice. Even down to reusing the same tunes (even though they do sound great and I love them).
I did like some of the new uses for existing Metroid staples: the
power bomb blast and grapple blocks
StarCreator
Member
... how was I supposed to figure this out? I don't think I ever would have stumbled upon performing that combination of actions on my own.
I think the part that is really silly is the requirement of being in spider ball mode even when it's not necessary. I can understand when being launched horizontally from a wall, but for the ones that are vertical on flat ground it makes no sense. At that point it's not a puzzle at all. There's no logical reasoning behind it.
I was looking out for a boost ball when I saw those spaces. The idea to power bomb to launch myself from spider-ball came to me as a possible way to achieve a boost ball.
About on the ground--it works similarly to the old super jump, where you crouch and then jump. It made sense to me as hugging myself close to the blast. Honestly never thought to try it without spiderball.
But yeah I did do it first from a place I needed to cling to the wall.
Also, it'd be problematic if it didn't require spider ball. It'd mean if you just didn't leave where you put it you fly crazy far. The spider-ball requirement makes the thing more intentional.
At the same time I get it perhaps doesn't seem intuitive.
About on the ground--it works similarly to the old super jump, where you crouch and then jump. It made sense to me as hugging myself close to the blast. Honestly never thought to try it without spiderball.
But yeah I did do it first from a place I needed to cling to the wall.
Also, it'd be problematic if it didn't require spider ball. It'd mean if you just didn't leave where you put it you fly crazy far. The spider-ball requirement makes the thing more intentional.
At the same time I get it perhaps doesn't seem intuitive.
SomewhatGroovy
Banned
It's a very subpar entry into the genre in a day and age when Games like Hollow Knight and Ori and the bLind Forest have came out. There's nothing new or refreshing here that we haven't seen before. Two things can be true though and it can also be fun. For me, it's an experience I won't remember a week out from beating it though. Don't be baffled by others reactions. That makes no sense.
Except for the first 2D Metroid game in well over a decade?
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
That has nothing to do with the quality of the game, itself, though.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
There's only so much you can do with the skeleton structure of an obtuse, black sheep entry in the franchise that was confined to the original Game Boy. It's a "new" Metroid, but it's also not, which I think people keep forgetting.
That said, I share many complaints (mostly about it trying too hard to recapture the feel of Super Metroid). But at the end of the day, this is a damn good game, a worthy entry in the series, and has a lot of uniqueness for a remake (free aim is great!!)
That said, I share many complaints (mostly about it trying too hard to recapture the feel of Super Metroid). But at the end of the day, this is a damn good game, a worthy entry in the series, and has a lot of uniqueness for a remake (free aim is great!!)
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
How is what I said a blanket statement?
GodParticle
Member
Starting to see the repetitive complaints. Same enemies and the environments kind of run together. I like the hot zone how it plays that oppressive music when the door opens heh
I dunno, I haven't played a game like this before that had counters with long ranged weapons or that kind of free aiming, and that's considering the Metroidvania gente which I don't even agree Metroid is part from. Hell, I had never played a 2D action game with this kind of combat at all, which is pretty noteworthy (feels kinda like Contra on steroids but not quite).
And I agree that so much SM in the soundtrack was lame, just as using Prime sound effects, but saying it was trying to be SM altogether... I dunno, it feels very different (and even superior in places), and I don't really get the vibe they tried that like ZM did.
Also I'm not sure it's fair to ask the remake from a GB game that's trying to stay as true to the original as possible while adding some new stuff to revolutionize the genre either, let's wait for Metroid 5 for that. The game was clearly shackled by its roots and it's very deliberate as Nintendo and Sakamoto probably wantef MS to prove themselves in a "safe" way.
And I agree that so much SM in the soundtrack was lame, just as using Prime sound effects, but saying it was trying to be SM altogether... I dunno, it feels very different (and even superior in places), and I don't really get the vibe they tried that like ZM did.
Also I'm not sure it's fair to ask the remake from a GB game that's trying to stay as true to the original as possible while adding some new stuff to revolutionize the genre either, let's wait for Metroid 5 for that. The game was clearly shackled by its roots and it's very deliberate as Nintendo and Sakamoto probably wantef MS to prove themselves in a "safe" way.
SomewhatGroovy
Banned
I get what your saying here but as one of the few lunatics who has beaten M2 twice, I don't know if I can meet you halfway here on account of this game and the source material it takes inspiration from have very little in common outside of a common goal to hunt metroids to unlock new areas. Everything else is mechanically so different that it feels entirely like new game. My impression , rightly or wrongly, playing this was MS was given a lot of creative freedom.
And while I do love the combat, the ergonomics of the 3DS itself betrays it particularly with the last two fights where my only challenge wasn't what was on screen, but the cramps on my right hand. Outside of the boss fights, far little variety in how the combat was exercised.
Oh I'm not saying that SR recreates RoS to a T, but that the most prominent elements, segmented world and repeated boss battles, were a must and that they affect and limit the design of the game a lot. I wish this had been a somewhat smaller yet fully interconnected world, for example, but given how they decided to stick to the general structure of the world and keep the segmented aspect, that was impossible, so they opted for huge separate maps instead.
It's stuff like that what I mean. Now, things like that don't excuse all of its flaws either (like how bizarrely samey the firsg areas are), but they definitely must have affected the scope and freedom of their vision when making the game.
In my case I enjoyed the combat all the way through, it kept me on my toes and made the moment to moment gameplay far more enjoyable than I expected, but I'll admit enemy variety hurts it a lot.
And I'm quite the fan of RoS myself! Although I've only beaten it thrice haha
but the way I see it is that they hit a fantastic balance between recreating parts of the original and adding fresh stuff to the series, which to me is far more than I expected as a fan, and AM2R had already been a treat last year.
It's stuff like that what I mean. Now, things like that don't excuse all of its flaws either (like how bizarrely samey the firsg areas are), but they definitely must have affected the scope and freedom of their vision when making the game.
In my case I enjoyed the combat all the way through, it kept me on my toes and made the moment to moment gameplay far more enjoyable than I expected, but I'll admit enemy variety hurts it a lot.
And I'm quite the fan of RoS myself! Although I've only beaten it thrice haha
but the way I see it is that they hit a fantastic balance between recreating parts of the original and adding fresh stuff to the series, which to me is far more than I expected as a fan, and AM2R had already been a treat last year.Area 7 so far, this is definitely one of my favorite 3DS games
I'm really realy liking it a lot even though I can see why some of you don't enjoy certain aspects of it, starting with just how different it is to other 2D Metroids in terms of design, for example.
The complaints about animation, enviroments and music, though? I completely disagree
I'm really realy liking it a lot even though I can see why some of you don't enjoy certain aspects of it, starting with just how different it is to other 2D Metroids in terms of design, for example.
The complaints about animation, enviroments and music, though? I completely disagree
I really enjoyed it. While I don't see myself playing it once a year like I do Super, I think it is a welcome addition to the franchise.
Regarding the level design, I actually like that it feels like a cavernous dive deeper and deeper into the planet. Aside from a couple of big background vistas it feels a lot more claustrophobic than the previous 2D Metroids, almost like Samus spelunking edition. It's certainly not on the level of Super in terms of layout and design, but I'd argue even with some decent modern Metroidvanias the only ones close to it are SotN and Metroid Prime.
The controls feel good for a 3DS game (and some of the quickest and most agile in the series), but the system itself is the limitation - playing it on a pro controller for example would be a lot more comfortable.
Music was a bit of a disappointment - I understand what they were going for atmosphere wise but I think most Metroid fans expect some catchy tunes while traversing. That the highlights of the music are the times when the old tunes pop in says it all I guess.
The graphics were decent for a 3DS game, and probably the best use of 3D on the system so far. I can kinda see where some people are coming from with the "samey" complaints between areas, but I mostly put this down to the 2.5D, low poly nature of it. If you keep an eye out on the background there's some really nice looking, and different, locations.
All in all, even though it's obviously very different from Metroid 2, it really does feel like a modern reimagining of that game. It sits pretty well with Zero Mission and Fusion to me - they all have their own highlights with some lowlights that keep them from reaching Super.
Definitely makes me optimistic about the future of the series.
Regarding the level design, I actually like that it feels like a cavernous dive deeper and deeper into the planet. Aside from a couple of big background vistas it feels a lot more claustrophobic than the previous 2D Metroids, almost like Samus spelunking edition. It's certainly not on the level of Super in terms of layout and design, but I'd argue even with some decent modern Metroidvanias the only ones close to it are SotN and Metroid Prime.
The controls feel good for a 3DS game (and some of the quickest and most agile in the series), but the system itself is the limitation - playing it on a pro controller for example would be a lot more comfortable.
Music was a bit of a disappointment - I understand what they were going for atmosphere wise but I think most Metroid fans expect some catchy tunes while traversing. That the highlights of the music are the times when the old tunes pop in says it all I guess.
The graphics were decent for a 3DS game, and probably the best use of 3D on the system so far. I can kinda see where some people are coming from with the "samey" complaints between areas, but I mostly put this down to the 2.5D, low poly nature of it. If you keep an eye out on the background there's some really nice looking, and different, locations.
All in all, even though it's obviously very different from Metroid 2, it really does feel like a modern reimagining of that game. It sits pretty well with Zero Mission and Fusion to me - they all have their own highlights with some lowlights that keep them from reaching Super.
Definitely makes me optimistic about the future of the series.
Vampirolol
Member
As much as I liked the game, I'm hoping for big changes in the next 2D Metroid regarding powerups.
No, there is a Metroid skin near each fight and before the fights (even in Area 3). Sometimes you can find a skin just after the fight, but it's very rare. I talk about the original Metroid II, because I'm not so sure about AM2R (but I think it is the same from what I remember).
About the rooms where we fought the Metroids, I agree with you : they were more surprising in Metroid II (their "chaotic" level-design made me tense because I didn't expect to fight a Metroid in such an "inappropriate" room), and more predictable in Samus Returns (for now, I just finished Area 3, maybe it changes after, but I doubt it). It's my only regret about the Metroid fights in Samus Returns, but maybe these fights would have been too "impossible" because the Metroid's patterns are far more advanced than in Metroid II. So now, the game tries to surprise the player by giving him several variations for each Metroid mutation (it replaces the room's variations in Metroid II, more or less).
TheMoon
Member
I have some thoughts on Metroid: Samus Returns.
The atmosphere is nonexistent
Which is weird as hell for a Metroid game. I honestly can't tell you what the difference is between any two areas in the game. They're all the goddamn same. The backgrounds look nigh identical, the enemies are mostly palette swaps, and there's no variety in the challenges any given environment presents. It'd be one thing if the areas at least looked cool, but can anyone honestly tell the difference between what we have here and what's in any given sci-fi-themed shovelware launched on Steam last month?
Super Metroid owed a huge amount of its success to the strength of its atmosphere. Remember when you were in Brinstar, and then entered the red soil area, and the creepy music kicked in? And then you got to the tubes that eventually lead to Maridia, and you realize that it's gotten super dark, and you start noticing all the subtle details like the glow of Samus' visor that's illuminating your way. It's moody, it's evocative, and this sort of feeling permeated the entire game. Reaching a new area was exciting, because you had no idea what was around the corner, but you knew it was going to be new and exciting. That is what gave Super Metroid such a satisfying sense of progression.
Samus Returns has precisely none of that.
The music is terrible
Which kind of goes hand-in-hand with the lackluster atmosphere. It's not aggressively bad; it's arguably worse -- just plain boring. It's generic, "atmospheric" schlock that adds precisely nothing to the proceedings. The lone exceptions are the the Norfair theme and thelater in the game, because they have some actual musical merit. Unfortunately, somebody else wrote those songs decades ago, so I'm not giving credit to whoever lead the charge here.red soil theme
I was thinking back to that story about how that deaf guy at Capcom wrote the soundtrack for Resident Evil: Dual Shock, and that's why we had that basement theme that sounded like somebody farting in a circus. That was terrible music, too, but at least I remembered it.
The controls are clumsy as hell
I did not feel like I had adequate precision at any point in the game. There are a lot of things contributing to this. Being forced to use the circle pad in a 2D games is just nonsense, and the 3DS' uncomfortable form factor doesn't exactly make dealing with it any easier. But then, there's the myriad smaller problems like the delay between when you can shoot and use your counter attack, the clunky touch interface for swapping weapons, the spider ball randomly changing directions on you in tight spaces, the needlessly difficult-to-aim grapple beam, etc. Then you factor in the 30fps frame rate in what's otherwise a fast-paced action game. It adds up, and feels like a mess in those dicier segments where you really need to be in command.
The power-ups are lame
Really, this was just the worst batch of abilities I could imagine. The ice shot is annoying, because you'll end up freezing most enemies, rather than killing them, so they just become an obstacle. The Aeion lightning armor ability is a waste of everyone's fucking time -- you use it to move past those red plants, and that's uh... it. It has no practical use outside of that. The beam burst just makes me angry. It's a more powerful shot that can actually kill shielded enemies, but isn't that why I have missiles?
Wait, why are the missiles so useless, anyway? It looks like you're firing a pea shooter when you use them, and they don't hurt like... any of the armored enemies you would actually hope to kill with them. And they give you so damn many of them -- there's this wild imbalance when scavenging for new items where I would constantly find more missiles, but no energy tanks. But I actually wanted energy tanks, whereas if I had the stock 30 missiles or whatever it was that you start the game with, I would've been just fine. But now, I have more than 100, but no energy for the beam burst that actually hurts enemies. Mother. Fuck.
Anyway, pretty much all of the abilities you get in the game are basically just keycards for locked doors. You'll use them to get past one obstacle, but they rarely increase your ability to explore the world, and they generally don't do much to aid you in combat. It's woefully unsatisfying, and after a while, I lost any enthusiasm for finding new gear, because, well... who cares? That feeling was only amplified once I realized that...
The exploration is a scam
Samus Returns is an illusory Metroid game. It is, for all intents and purposes, a completely linear experience. You trudge through an area, kill the requisite number of Metroids, return to the statue, and move onto the next level... and that's kind of it. There's little to no incentive to return to previous areas once you've finished them, even after you've obtained a bevy of new abilities. You're not going to go back to a previous area and uncover a swath of new territory to explore or some nifty secrets. There are no tantalizing, just out of reach areas to pull you back, and you know in the back of your head that all you're really going to find is more goddamn missiles (which, fuck's sake, nobody really needed or wanted more of, ever.) Samus Returns' idea of exploration is backtracking to open a different colored door. Whoopty fucking doo.
Problem is, this is Metroid's fucking wheelhouse. That's why people have so much reverence for this franchise. It's because the more you play, the more freeing it is. You realize, "oh yeah, I can get through that earlier area now," so you head back. But on your way, you'll realize that the ledge you couldn't reach is now accessible, that the other power-up you got lets you break through that wall you totally forgot about, and then you get sidetracked by this totally different thing that you never expected to pop up. There's cool shit to find and meaningful new spaces to explore just by randomly going off the beaten path.
And hey, I get it -- that's tough to do. That's why so many have aspired to Super Metroid's level of design and fallen short. But you have to at least try, right? That's why the exploration in Samus Returns falls flat. There is no sense of discovery, and even if there was, there would be nothing interesting to find, given how the game doles out its power-ups.
The counter attack was a mistake
Okay, so the counter attack was kind of a cool idea, and the first time you do it in-game, it's pretty slick. By the 3rd or 4th time you do it, it's not. It's fine to give a Metroid game some sort of twist, but when the execution is just "enemies dive bomb you a lot, and you can't really do much about it," you should probably reevaluate. The melee attack shtick gets old in a hurry, and in a Metroid game, I really just want to shoot enemies. I'm a simple man.
I think the developers must've realized this at some point, too, so their solution was to give almost all the enemies armor, so that your guns are pretty much useless. So now, when you encounter an enemy, you should stop, wait for them to come to you, counter them, and then shoot them... like I wanted to do in the first fucking place. It's functional, but it comes at the expense of flow. And it doesn't even work very well, thanks to the clunky controls. You can't counter an enemy on the other side of you by simply hitting the button, but turning around and then countering can take too long. You can't cancel out of shooting to counter, so being logical and firing your weapons to weaken the enemy and countering to finish them off isn't really a viable tactic. The delay after performing a counter, and then using it again takes too long, making it impossible to dispatch two enemies who decide to dive bomb you at the same time. It's a lot of small problems that make the whole thing feel woefully unpolished. Past a certain point, I just wanted to run past enemies instead of getting caught up in their passive aggressive bullshit, but you kinda can't do that, either.
It's one thing to introduce a new combat mechanic into the game, but it's another thing entirely to force me to rely so heavily on it; particularly when it cuts against the the rest of the game's design.
The enemies are annoying and shitty
Which is I'm pretty sure, the direct result of wanting to put the counter mechanic front and center. Your weapons, particularly early on, are just not powerful enough, and then there's all the armored foes that you basically have to counter in order to kill. But did they have to be so goddamn obnoxious, even beyond that? There are slugs that leave behind some green goo that hurts you if you step in it, so they'll randomly block off areas you want to go until you kill them and wait for the green stuff to disappear. Oh, and they're armored, so... deal with that, too. The masses of mosquitoes take an eternity to kill, and damage you quite a bit. You're supposed to use the beam burst to kill them, but honestly... how does that make it any more fun or challenging? The jellyfish looking things that are basically just cannon fodder eventually electrify entire platforms at random, which makes getting from point A to point B in certain rooms a complete pain; again, without adding any fun or challenge.
And then, there are the Metroids. I know they based this on Metroid II, where you had to kill 40 Metroids, but holy shit, it did not have to be this repetitive. There's nowhere near enough variation on the Metroids' attack patterns to justify fighting 40 fucking Metroids. You'll fight one that has the power of electricity, and then you fight one with the power of fire, and... they're the same damn fight. Nothing changes, and there is nothing unique for you, the player, to experience. Eventually, you'll encounter more "sophisticated" Metroids that scurry away to a different room after you damage them, so you have to find them again and restart the fight. I'm guessing the developers played Monster Hunter, saw that they did that exact same thing, and were like "us, too -- we can do this!" Except, it makes no fucking sense here, and makes 40 Metroids feel like 400.
Holy hell are the graphics bad
I mean, just fugly. Art design is subjective, sure, but Jesus, it just looks like crap. Why all the bizarre color palettes? So many sections just seem to use a million different shades of brown and orange, which not only looks like garbage; it results in enemies getting lost in the background. That's just amateurish. The whole game looks painfully low-rez, too, probably because it is, and the gaudy bloom lighting only makes the game more of a hazy, blurry mess. And this runs at an unstable 30fps? Really? If that's the best they can do with the tech, they should've gone back to the (literal) drawing board.
Here's the thing. Super Metroid came out 23 years ago. It looked great at the time, and it looks great now. It runs at basically the same resolution. Samus Returns should've been sprite-based, particularly in light of the hardware constraints. There's always some goober that raises the point that, "well, 2D sprites are expensive, an indie studio like Nintendo can't afford that!" Fuck you. I don't care if it's expensive, I care about the end product... and frankly, that's Nintendo's problem to solve anyway. All I see is this:
You're telling me that more than 2 decades of tech and design advancement lead to that? And that's without factoring in how much more smoothly Super Metroid runs. We could do this same experiment with Metroid Fusion from 2002 or Zero Mission from 2004, and the result would be the same. It's shit.
So, uh...
Yeah. The game has some serious fucking problems. I think it's worth playing for Metroid fans, but I think the only 2D Metroid worse than it is... *shock* Metroid II. If you stripped away the Metroid veneer, you'd be left with another passable indie game where the developers were obviously inspired by Metroid, but clearly didn't get what made it good.
I've only read the headers since I'm not done with the game yet but damn, I strongly disagree with every single one of them already.
forknknife
Banned
I understand criticising many things about this game but the controls??? That I just can't...
Mechanized
Member
This game is a modern classic. It's amazing how Mercury Steam went from that portable LoS game to this. Holy shit. I want them to make more of these, with continued direction from Nintendo of course. lol
That's one of my biggest complaints actually. The morphball thing is so goddamn annoying. Sometimes jumping, going to morphball, and spiderballing to a wall given the inputs and issues with the 3DS ergonomics made me want to scream at times.
I finished the game. I think it's not a bad game but I don't think it's a great game. Probably some degree of Metroid starvation helps it. The game design just isn't enjoyable to me.
Reading so many complains about the morph ball input, im starting to believe im blessed with a great circle pad. Never had a problem jumping and going into morph ball and then spider ball only using the circle pad.
Then again, the d-pad and c-stick of my new 3ds are completly shit, the d pad sometimes requires a few presses before it starts registering the down input and the c stick also have similar problems. Makes it very annoying to go into the 4th aeon ability.
I bet if I playd this game with my og 3ds I would have the same complains, I had to replace the circle pad on that unit because it broke .
Just finished getting 100% completion! I think I'm going to take a break from the game for a while before I try to speedrun it, but overall I had a pretty good time rounding up the missing items.
There is one thing I noticed though that I absolutely have to speak my mind on. (late game power-up spoilers)
There is one thing I noticed though that I absolutely have to speak my mind on. (late game power-up spoilers)
How the fuck was I supposed to figure out that I need to use the spider-ball plus powerbomb to launch me through red spikes!? I don't remember whether the powerbomb ever did that in previous games, but it was the most obtuse thing ever to the point I had to look online after trying literally everything else.
Nocturnowl
Member
Definitely, my feelings when finishing this game was "that was a another great slice of Metroid after all this time, but it probably wont crack my top 10 this year".
It's exactly what it needed to be, as a reintroduction for the series after some shaky years as well as an updated take on Metroid 2, it does its job very well.
But there's this feeling of the experience being overly familiar, because not only is the Metroid item formula well tackled at this point within its own series but also the prevalence of modern games paying tribute to it.
I recall what really impressed my about Axiom Verge is how its world looked to have all the pieces of Metroid progression (a small gap? time for the morph...crawl?) but then managed to turn my expectations on their head with some more unique tools for progression.
Metroid 5 will hopefully be a chance to shake up some of that reliability on legacy items, Samus Returns begins to plant the seeds of more with the Aeion abilities and additions like counter and free aim, but maybe it's time for more of a shakeup and less bombing corners to see a missile block etc
Yeah I actually:
a) liked the original Metroid II when I've played it (twice, but quite some time ago)
b) have some pretty serious issues with both ZM and Fusion, particularly the latter.
So I don't hate the game elements associated with being a Metroid II remake and what issues I do have are contexualized among a bunch of Metroids I have similar issues with.
I like those games (well...I like Fusion when either I haven't played it too much or I'm in a loving mood) and I like this one.
I think they're all clearly worse than SM by a healthy margin, though. The thing is, for me, you can still be a good game and be that.
Of course, I'd rather M5 be better than SM.
a) liked the original Metroid II when I've played it (twice, but quite some time ago)
b) have some pretty serious issues with both ZM and Fusion, particularly the latter.
So I don't hate the game elements associated with being a Metroid II remake and what issues I do have are contexualized among a bunch of Metroids I have similar issues with.
I like those games (well...I like Fusion when either I haven't played it too much or I'm in a loving mood) and I like this one.
I think they're all clearly worse than SM by a healthy margin, though. The thing is, for me, you can still be a good game and be that.
Of course, I'd rather M5 be better than SM
.A lot of missiles. There's a more convenient way to kill them using the first power-up you obtain in the Area.