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[Audioboxer4]

Your adblock on the 360 is to simple move the joy stick up once and hey no ads, you're on My XBOX and you're ready to go.

Arguments that you shouldn't have to hit a button to get away from the ads are just idiotic since you're going to be using the joystick in some fashion already it's not beyond anyone to just flick it one extra time.

Hardly anyone is going to complain about how long it takes for your brain send a message to your thumb to flick a piece of rubber/plastic and move you off the advertisement. It's an inconvenience, but not a major issue. As others point out you're not forced to watch it.

The main arguments are about perception of what you pay for. People feel their money is being disrespected by them getting fed non-gaming advertisements through a service they already pay for. Most subscriptions tend to exist to fund a service through the revenue that would other wise be obtained from ads. Therefore when you subscribe you don't see ads.

An ad telling you the new COD map pack is out is directly useful to a large % of Xbox owners, Telus telling us how good their mobile network is of little fucking use. Regardless of what tab it's on within the dashboard, it's on the dashboard and many perceive the dash to be their space, it's the main portal to all their applications/3rd party content. Ads would be better suited within those applications and 3rd party content, not prior to entering them.

XBL is seen as a premium high quality service, the best in the industry, therefore one which people happily pay for with actual money. So they're asking why do MS still need subsidized off ads when they're getting paid for the service?

As I've said before restrict non-gaming ads to Silver and a lot of this stops. Issue for MS there is many Silver users don't have their 360 hooked up to the internet, or only go online occasionally to get game updates/buy something off XBLA, therefore crunching down on advertisement efficiency.

The above is just a view on my analysis of the nature of why we get some of these complaints. If people want to respond to this with the laughter face or "im so angry you're complaining im going to complain about your complaint", I'm sorry but I can't really answer back to that. If anyone wants an actual discussion I'll be happy to follow up.

 

[rnwd]

XBL is seen as a premium high quality service, the best in the industry, therefore one which people happily pay for with actual money. So they're asking why do MS still need subsidized off ads when they're getting paid for the service?

Because they realized they could, and no company is going to leave money on the table when they're guaranteed that they can make it if they stay the course.

 

[HurricaneJesus]

That telus ad pissed me off yesterday. Fucking lame as hell. Might not renew my XBL subscription when it runs out. Paying to have ads shoved in my face is bullshit.

 

[Audioboxer4]

Because they realized they could, and no company is going to leave money on the table when they're guaranteed that they can make it if they stay the course.

Well of course that's the reason MS do it.

The complaints are coming from the end users though, not business men or shareholders.

It's not a case of finding out why MS actually do it (that's obvious to most, fund their business model), it's people asking a rhetorical question of "I pay for this service why do I get non-gaming ads?" These people don't expect a business related answer that's going to enlighten them, it's a more of a statement questioning how they feel MS value their monthly sub.

It's actually a good move from a business point of view that MS do this, they're making money out of it. What's a good business move mean to me and you though? I play my Xbox 360, I don't play the business behind it, therefore I may share a difference of interests over ads than MS.

 

[UltimaPooh]

An ad telling you the new COD map pack is out is directly useful to a large % of Xbox owners, Telus telling us how good their mobile network is of little fucking use. Regardless of what tab it's on within the dashboard, it's on the dashboard and many perceive the dash to be their space, it's the main portal to all their applications/3rd party content. Ads would be better suited within those applications and 3rd party content, not prior to entering them.

The majority of the time it is all gaming ads. Yes once in a while one ad that has nothing to do with gaming is on there. I can't imagine them making huge bank off of that single ad.

I can see where people have a problems with ads, they're a means to get people to buy stuff and people don't like being manipulated. Of course advertising is any product you buy now-a-days. You can't escape it no matter how much of a premium you pay.

I just don't think there is an argument there anymore to complain about advertising when it's so prevelant in our society.

 

[gofreak]

So is everyone in here against product placement in movies and games as well?

This isn't product placement.

But since you mention it, I think it depends on how it's done.

Resse's Pieces in ET? That was cool. It made sense, and it formed part of the narrative. It was a win win all round. Product placement like that is way more powerful than regular commercials these days.

Casino Royale or Die Another Day? Not so much.

 

[DangerousDave]

Why Microsoft needs to fill the interface with ads, if already get plenty of money from the Gold accounts? I would found more normal if PS3 or Wii used ads in their interfaces, but it's the other way around.

 

[M°°nblade]

Why Microsoft needs to fill the interface with ads, if already get plenty of money from the Gold accounts? I would found more normal if PS3 or Wii used ads in their interfaces, but it's the other way around.

Why fill the interface with ads and not the games?

They could introduce small commercials in games, let's say ... hmm every 30 minutes.










*runs away, really hard*

 

[Happy.Neko]

NXE is slow.
I hope these ads does not make it even slower.

 

[UltimaPooh]

This isn't product placement.

True, it's not, but it is similar. You pay to go see a movie not see advertisements just like you pay to have an online service and not pay for advertisements.

But since you mention it, I think it depends on how it's done.

Resse's Pieces in ET? That was cool. It made sense, and it formed part of the narrative. It was a win win all round. Product placement like that is way more powerful than regular commercials these days.

It could have easily been a pieces of chocolate candies instead of showing that they were Resse's Pieces and have gotten the same emotional impact.

 

[chubigans]

Updated OP. That ad is kinda annoying. :\

 

[Nif]

That's not silverlight, dude

 

[gofreak]

It could have easily been a pieces of chocolate candies instead of showing that they were Resse's Pieces and have gotten the same emotional impact.

Of course, but the script naturally called for the use of candy. It was a pretty key part of the movie, and it was a natural promotional opportunity that was executed on well vs the contrived placements you see in a lot of movies now. It didn't feel like any shot was wasted, whereas now you see lingering shots on vaios and references to 'vintage 2004 converse shoes' that are totally shoe-horned in and wasteful of your attention in the film. A good movie should use every shot, every line carefully and each shot and line etc. should have a purpose in the narrative. If a shot or line seems purely for commercial messaging its hard not to feel sold out. I don't feel that about the candy scene in E.T., but I feel it about a lot of others.

 

[Malvolio]

Paying to view ads. Neat. Any desire I had to get a 360 is quickly fading away.

 

[BeOnEdge 2.0]

That telus ad pissed me off yesterday. Fucking lame as hell. Might not renew my XBL subscription when it runs out. Paying to have ads shoved in my face is bullshit.

seriously? you guys act as if the moment you power up your 360 a gang of winged monkeys busts down your door, straps you down to your couch, pins your eyes open and force you to sit at the first screen and watch while one winged monkey
pisses on your forehead and another stands off to the side of your head banging a set of cimbals together. it's really not that serious.

 

[Cynar]

seriously? you guys act as if the moment you power up your 360 a gang of winged monkeys busts down your door, straps you down to your couch, pins your eyes open and force you to sit at the first screen and watch while one winged monkey
pisses on your forehead and another stands off to the side of your head banging a set of cimbals together. it's really not that serious.

:lol do you work for an advertising company or something? I'm sorry that I'm paying for shit and don't like receiving ads. The ad I saw yesterday really pissed me off. I seriously asked myself why am I paying for them to sell me ads.

 

[AlphaTwo00]

Updated OP. That ad is kinda annoying. :\

Meh, I saw it, didn't really care, and launched the game directly.

Hey, if that's how they're going to pay the bills for 1 vs 100 in Canada, so be it.

EDIT: So clearly, after scanning the back pages, no one who's bitching has actually clicked on the ad:

Telus may be sponsoring Live up there in some way...perhaps being a part of MS' Live infrastructure up that way?

THIS.

If you click on it, that's the screen that enters the 1 vs 100 page for Canada. 1 vs 100 in Canada is now "Sponsored by Telus".

 

[BeOnEdge 2.0]

no i dont but i really just cant understand the outrage. especially when again getting away from the ads is quicker than actually saying the word "up" and if you turn on your 360 more than once a month it really is something that you do without even thinking.

also there are far more intrusive ads in everyday life. you have to navigate and sometimes tackle the x button on web ads, you'd probably have to press up a million times in the amount of time it would take to find and install an ad blocker on a pc, turn on your cable box with certain providers (fuck you time warner) and you are bombarded with worse and pay MORE, cell providers text ads, there's junk mail, spam, billboards, telemarketers, porn passers in vegas...just so many more things i can think of in life that interrupt you more than simply pressing UP.

 

[TheGreatDave]

I press up then A before I even switch to the 360 on my TV. Problem solved?

GAF is filled with a bunch of drama queens.

 

[goldenpp72]

Paying to view ads. Neat. Any desire I had to get a 360 is quickly fading away.

Im glad most of the world isn't as much of a bitch about stupid crap as this. Ones desire for a console should be based on the games, nothing more.

 

[HarrisonBike]

One ad on one tier of the NXE, and it is incredibly easy to either pass by it without triggering it within the Showcase tier. Not to mention most people just press up to go to My Xbox. It really is not a problem at all.

Paying to view ads. Neat. Any desire I had to get a 360 is quickly fading away.

That's just stupid. Grow up.

 

[BeOnEdge 2.0]

I press up then A before I even switch to the 360 on my TV. Problem solved?

GAF is filled with a bunch of drama queens.

now that you mention it isnt there a setting that even lets you automatically launch whatever game is sitting in the disk tray? holy shit at the whiners if that option is still there. i turned it off long ago cuz i actually like perusing thru the market place and friends and such.

 

[Iknos]

Paying to view ads. Neat. Any desire I had to get a 360 is quickly fading away.

So I'm guessing you don't have Satellite or Cable?

 

[freethought]

So I'm guessing you don't have Satellite or Cable?

Except in these services the subscription goes toward the infrastructure and the ads go toward content. If having ads on XBL meant every Arcade game was free, I doubt anyone would be complaining. It's obvious that without advertising, the subscription you pay for satellite or cable would be nowhere near enough to produce or license the kind of programming you have available. On XBL, there's no absolutely no evidence that the advertising revenue is necessary for the what you're getting. Hell, it's hard enough to justify the subscription.

 

[Woo-Fu]

Why Microsoft needs to fill the interface with ads, if already get plenty of money from the Gold accounts?

There is no such thing as too much profit or too much revenue. Until all of your disposable income goes to Microsoft products they still have work to do. That is just the nature of the business, particularly when you've got investors who expect stock prices to magically increase indefinitely, regardless of what is actually happening in the real world.

While it isn't common to be subject to ads when you pay for electronic media, it isn't unusual everywhere. People have been buying magazines for decades, magazines which are often more ads than content.

Simply put, if the ads outweigh the benefits, don't renew your Live subscription. Microsoft can do the math as well as anybody else and if you show them it is hurting their bottom line they'll stop. I don't think it likely that enough people will cancel simply over ads, though, not when you consider that people actually spend real money on worthless junk like gamerpics and themes.

 

[Iknos]

Except in these services the subscription goes toward the infrastructure and the ads go toward content.

This ad IS paying for free content. Click on the "ad" and it takes you to a free to play game.

 

[Mik2121]

Wait, 360 has ads!!? :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[freethought]

This ad IS paying for free content. Click on the "ad" and it takes you to a free to play game.

Hey, I have no problem seeing some ads when I'm playing 1v100. That's a great model and one I very much support. Don't get me wrong, I'd prefer it without ads, but I also like free. At least with 1v100 you can poiint to it and say without doubt; "this would not be free without ads". I'm cool with it. But why is that ad in the NXE? Are they going to start paying everyone's XBL subscriptions? Somehow I doubt it.

edit: I'd just like to say that I wasn't referring to any specific ad anyway. Just talking about the situation in general.

 

[BenBen]

I don't understand why people get so upset about ads. Our world is full of advertising--you can't drive down the road, turn on a TV, or turn on the radio without being exposed to them. With all that exposure I've never had a problem tuning them out.

And on the other hand I like that the NXE dashboard is dynamic and occasionally I find out about games in the ads that I had no idea about before. They are generally well targeted.

And another thing--don't argue about the "principle" of paying to view ads, all of the revenue sources contribute to make Live what it is.

 

[Crag Dweller]

I don't understand why people get so upset about ads. Our world is full of advertising--you can't drive down the road, turn on a TV, or turn on the radio without being exposed to them. With all that exposure I've never had a problem tuning them out.

And on the other hand I like that the NXE dashboard is dynamic and occasionally I find out about games in the ads that I had no idea about before. They are generally well targeted.

And another thing--don't argue about the "principle" of paying to view ads:

1. All of the revenue sources contribute to make Live what it is.
2. You're not entitled to an ad-free environment just because you pay a nominal subscription for Xbox Live.

I'm guessing that most here are in a certain age group, and because of that most ads are targeted toward them, i.e. your not cool if you don't use our product, all the girls will love you if you use this etc. I remember myself when I was in that age group, and I got annoyed being targeted by every entertainment outlet too.

Now however, there are only two products targeted to my age group. One to keep your dick hard and the other if you are peeing too much. So my advice is to just ride it out. Eventually you won't be the most important demographic out there and the few ads that do target you won't feel like such a big deal. All they'll be concerned about will be your dick.

 

[BenBen]

I'm guessing that most here are in a certain age group, and because of that most ads are targeted toward them, i.e. your not cool if you don't use our product, all the girls will love you if you use this etc. I remember myself when I was in that age group, and I got annoyed being targeted by every entertainment outlet too.

Now however, there are only two products targeted to my age group. One to keep your dick hard and the other if you are peeing too much. So my advice is to just ride it out. Eventually you won't be the most important demographic out there and the few ads that do target you won't feel like such a big deal. All they'll be concerned about will be your dick.

It's not even that though because most of the ads are for games. I like game advertisments--and without the ad on the NXE last week for the N+ sale I wouldn't have been aware of it.

 

[Opiate]

It's a smart move by Microsoft.

Most of the people with greivances in this thread (including me) are simply going to be washed over. Despite your protestations, few if any of you will take real action about this, because you're already substantially tied in to XBL. Microsoft knows this.

They know just how much they can get out of you, and they will do it, because they aren't dumb and their goal is to make money off of you.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Why O Why isn't XBL free?

 

[Dabanton]

Paying to view ads. Neat. Any desire I had to get a 360 is quickly fading away.

If ad's which you don't even have to look at were the biggest hurdle to getting an Xbox 360 i doubt you wanted one anyway.

 

[BeOnEdge 2.0]

Why O Why arent the other 2 console services as good as XBL?

fixed.

 

[X26]

I have gold, and it's not worth the money

I still pay for it though :?

 

[Opiate]

fixed.

Sure, but then the PC online experience is vastly superior to XBL, and is free. But of course, that doesn't count because the PC is a magical platform you can't compare to the 360, apparently.

The real reason that Microsoft should charge for XBL -- and they should -- is not that it is so totally awesome. It's that it makes fiscal sense. Let's just assume that there are, oh, 9-10 million gold members by the end of this year. That would equate to ~500 milion dollars in revenue per year that Nintendo and Sony have no answer for. 500 million! Look at the PS3 in particular: Both services essentially make money off DLC + Downloadable games + other media like downloadable movies. At their basic level, their revenue streams are the same so far.

Except... Microsoft gets an additional 500 million from subscriptions, while Sony gets a big fat 0. Now, remember that Sony is drowning in red ink thus far this generation, and Microsoft is starting to tread water. It's not unreasonable to assert that the subscriptions are the difference between "doing okay" like Microsoft and "bleeding hundreds of millions" like Sony.

 

[Sean]

The ads on NXE don't bother me much at all. They were much worse on the old "blades" interface as the ads took up like 50% of the screen real estate at times and often caused the navigation to be terrible (leaving space for just 3-4 lines of text which meant lots of stuff buried under submenus etc).

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/12/xbox-360-fall-07-update-06.jpg
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/12/xbox-360-fall-07-update-24.jpg

With NXE the ads are much easier to ignore, you can simply scroll right past them.

 

[_sgray]

I miss the blades.

NXE is the worst and slowest thing ever.

 

[BeOnEdge 2.0]

Sure, but then the PC online experience is vastly superior to XBL, and is free. But of course, that doesn't count because the PC is a magical platform you can't compare to the 360, apparently.

The real reason that Microsoft should charge for XBL -- and they should -- is not that it is so totally awesome. It's that it makes fiscal sense. Let's just assume that there are, oh, 9-10 million gold members by the end of this year. That would equate to ~500 milion dollars in revenue per year that Nintendo and Sony have no answer for. 500 million! Look at the PS3 in particular: Both services essentially make money off DLC + Downloadable games + other media like downloadable movies. At their basic level, their revenue streams are the same so far.

Except... Microsoft gets an additional 500 million from subscriptions, while Sony gets a big fat 0. Now, remember that Sony is drowning in red ink thus far this generation, and Microsoft is starting to tread water. It's not unreasonable to assert that the subscriptions are the difference between "doing okay" like Microsoft and "bleeding hundreds of millions" like Sony.

so the pc has a service that works across all games? that any user playing such games can use without having to load up or find and download it or whatever? and also hop within that same service to download arcade games and movies and such? and its free? and as easy and convenient? wasnt aware sorry.

MS doesnt force anyone to get xbl. people buy it because of how well it works. you can babble all you want about how it "should" be free. water should be free too but that doesnt stop people from drinking bottled water. it just tastes that much better. And just as there are deals on that delicious aquafina, savvy shoppers rarely pay full price for xbl anyway. I think i'm on my 3rd year now at $25 cuz i stacked cards when someone had em on sale.

YES the bottom line is that MS looks at LIVE as revenue but its complete bullshit that people still act as if you get nothing for the price of the subscription.

 

[Opiate]

so the pc has a service that works across all games? that any user playing such games can use without having to load up or find and download it or whatever? and also hop within that same service to download arcade games and movies and such? and its free? and as easy and convenient? wasnt aware sorry.

Wait, downloading is a bad thing now? That's considered a negative quality? What a bizarre claim. And the answer is yes, obviously. Steam and several others fit the bill. Good old Games. Stardock.

MS doesnt force anyone to get xbl. people buy it because of how well it works. you can babble all you want about how it "should" be free.

Didn't I just explain that it shouldn't be free? I had two large paragraphs dedicated to it. I went in to great detail about why it should not be free. In the previous post, I went in to detail about why the advertisements are a smart move. It's as if you didn't even read my post.

 

[bhhawks78]

Why O Why isn't XBL free?

Because myself and many others find it a great value especially when you can just pay 25-30 every 13 months if you buy cards from EBAY.

Would use my wii and ps3 alot more and would pay the same price if they charged + made the same service essentially.

As long as they aren't like unskippable videos or some crap like that they are a-ok in my book. if that's what it takes to afford exclusive/earlier DLC/not charging devs for each gig downloaded i can't blame them

 

[RBH]

I press up then A before I even switch to the 360 on my TV. Problem solved?

GAF is filled with a bunch of drama queens.

.

 

[yoopoo]

Why O Why isn't XBL free?

Well its free on the pc http://www.microsoft.com/games/en-us/live/pages/liveconnect.aspx :lol

 

[K' Dash]

The ads on NXE don't bother me much at all. They were much worse on the old "blades" interface as the ads took up like 50% of the screen real estate at times and often caused the navigation to be terrible (leaving space for just 3-4 lines of text which meant lots of stuff buried under submenus etc).

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/12/xbox-360-fall-07-update-06.jpg
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2007/12/xbox-360-fall-07-update-24.jpg

With NXE the ads are much easier to ignore, you can simply scroll right past them.

I miss the old blades

 

[Majora]

:lol do you work for an advertising company or something? I'm sorry that I'm paying for shit and don't like receiving ads. The ad I saw yesterday really pissed me off. I seriously asked myself why am I paying for them to sell me ads.

Nobody is FORCING you to watch it. That's the whole point. If they were forced ads I could understand the moaning but they're not. If it really bothers you that much then set your xbox to launch games automatically and use the pop-up guide to access everything like friends lists. You can even jump straight to the marketplace from the pop-up guide.

But no, GAF would rather bitch and bitch about something that takes less than half a second to avoid.

 

[Grimm Fandango]

I haven't even noticed the ads yet. Like others have said, I just press "up" at least once.

 

[BeOnEdge 2.0]

Wait, downloading is a bad thing now? That's considered a negative quality? What a bizarre claim. And the answer is yes, obviously. Steam and several others fit the bill. Good old Games. Stardock.



Didn't I just explain that it shouldn't be free? I had two large paragraphs dedicated to it. I went in to great detail about why it should not be free. In the previous post, I went in to detail about why the advertisements are a smart move. It's as if you didn't even read my post.

its not a bizarre claim. its comparing something thats built in right out of the box with something you have to jump thru hoops to get running. and does steam work with all games? and have something similar to xbl arcade?

i mean if pc gaming is your thing then hurrah. but not everyone likes it because of all the hoops you have to jump thru to get something going. i like my simple and easy console gaming.

Well its free on the pc http://www.microsoft.com/games/en-us/live/pages/liveconnect.aspx :lol

and i'm sure that free pc version has set the world ablaze hasnt it. again just like pc's free online, just like wii and just like psn, they may be free but they aren't xbl. the people have voted with their wallets and xbl isnt going anywhere anytime soon.

 

[X26]

YES the bottom line is that MS looks at LIVE as revenue but its complete bullshit that people still act as if you get nothing for the price of the subscription.

All I see my gold really buying me is overpriced p2p gaming. XBL arcade games cost seperately, DLC costs seperately, demos are free for everyone and the time release thing between gold/silver is jsut a sa and needless gimmick.

 

[Woo-Fu]

its not a bizarre claim. its comparing something thats built in right out of the box with something you have to jump thru hoops to get running. and does steam work with all games? and have something similar to xbl arcade?

i mean if pc gaming is your thing then hurrah. but not everyone likes it because of all the hoops you have to jump thru to get something going. i like my simple and easy console gaming.

Hoops is an exaggeration, and you're assuming that every pc game needs all features of Live, and/or that every pc gamer finds all the features of Live desirable in all games. That is a bad assumption.

...and I think the comparison is silly anyways. The only reason the you get services like this for free on PC is competition. What service can you use on a 360 besides Live Gold or Silver? None, so the comparison might as well stop there.

The flipside though is that people like to say that Live is better than every other service and that it is better because people pay for it. I think that argument has the cart before the horse. The real reason Live is better than what is on PS3 or Wii is because it started back on the xbox. For my purposes of multiplayer gaming the only real difference between Live Gold and PSN is that one costs money.