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Microsoft's cunning plan to save the Xbox from Apple
- Thread starter lighthouse777
- Start date
CosmicQueso
Member
Can't believe (okay I can) that an article about Apple TV turns into a discussion pissing match about PS4 and Xbox One sales figures.
Also can't believe (okay, I can believe this too) that people still doubt Apple's ability to disrupt a static/decaying market.
Reminds me of when the iPod was announced and all the posters on /. were talking about how it was doomed to fail because their PalmPilots and laptops could play mp3's and so much more.
Guessing in 3 hours you'll know.
Also can't believe (okay, I can believe this too) that people still doubt Apple's ability to disrupt a static/decaying market.
Reminds me of when the iPod was announced and all the posters on /. were talking about how it was doomed to fail because their PalmPilots and laptops could play mp3's and so much more.
Guessing in 3 hours you'll know.
You are looking at this from the wrong point of view. I'm not even sure why you keep bringing up the fact that Microsoft will continue making Xbox One games. That's not what I'm arguing.
There is no business that will sell you a $400 box for $300 without assurances that you will only buy things for that box from them exclusively.
That's why Valve isn't subsidizing Steambox. They can't guarantee that people who want to buy a cheap, subsidized computer are even interested in gaming. Ditto for Microsoft and the Xbox One.
They are going to keep you in a walled garden. Windows 10 store with universal apps will be about as open as Microsoft will get with the Xbox One.
Excellent analysis. Keep up the great work.
Anyway, I think MS, out of all the players, is in the best position to weather any storm of change that sweeps through the game industry. I've said for a long time that the traditional model of console gaming is nearing its end - if not this gen, then definitely next generation. Companies are monetizing their games differently and games are becoming platform agnostic. MS can exploit Win10 to transition to this brave new world, if not through Xbox then at least through the PC market.
BeforeU
Oft hope is born when all is forlorn.
Ya I noticed that too. some people cant digest that Xbox One even sells 1 unit apparently.
Anyways, new Xbox One update will be tits, dat cortana and universal apps, and already killer multimedia feature going to put Xbox direct competition to PS4 and Apple TV.
Because it will cover both crowd. People ho wants to play AAA games and also mobile games.
yeh, try and access the folder where the stores apps are installed on your pc, its a real hassle.
If the apple tv was released with a traditional gaming controller, then it would be a huge deal. As it is, I still expect it to make a big impact in the gaming world.
Art Vandilay
Member
One thing is for sure -- I'm actually interested in today's Apple announcement now.
Will it play the latest AAA 3rd party games? No? Then throw it on the pile of scary disruptive devices such as Ouya, Gamestick, Playstation TV, Fire TV, Mojo, Steam Box, etc etc etc.
Not saying it wont sell well, it's just in another market. Like WiiU. It wont make a dent in "current gen" console sales.
Not saying it wont sell well, it's just in another market. Like WiiU. It wont make a dent in "current gen" console sales.
Do you really think MS would let me buy a heavily subsidized device without controls or restrictions on where I buy digital content from? I could conceivably buy this thing and never buy single piece of content from MS...like ever.
It would of course become one of my favorite consoles of all time. I'd call it the "AWESOME BOX".
CosmicQueso
Member
Yeah, if the $150 includes a controller, and if Nintendo shows up to this event things could get real interesting real quick.
Who knows if either of those things will happen, but if they do...
Stage 1: Denial
I expect to see lots of Stage 2's after today's event. Maybe I'm wrong.
"It will drive game consoles out from the living room"
FUCK....THAT.
The last thing I need is a console from a company that doesn't quality control on games, games with bloated micro transactions, copy and paste games, and motion focused games / gimmick based games.
Ugh.. Fuck the Apple TV.
FUCK....THAT.
The last thing I need is a console from a company that doesn't quality control on games, games with bloated micro transactions, copy and paste games, and motion focused games / gimmick based games.
Ugh.. Fuck the Apple TV.
dantevsninjas
Member
I should clarify, I agree completely. I don't think this is a serious, head on push for gaming, I think it'll basically be an apple TV with android console like functionality, but probably better.
Garrett 2U
Member
I think it's pretty obvious that Xbox is going to become multi-platform.
The whole unification of Windows 10 is about designing software to scale to different devices.
The whole unification of Windows 10 is about designing software to scale to different devices.
I'd argue that the Wii and mobile have already disrupted the market. Any effect the Apple TV has won't be disruption. It'll just be speeding along what's already been started.
CraigerGamer
Member
I own about 50 movies through iTunes. I have young kids who like to watch certain movies over and over and over again. My XBOX and PS4 don't really have the capability to provide that kind of entertainment (babysitting?). I use my current Apple TV and PS4 almost every day.
CosmicQueso
Member
Based on everything we've heard so far, comparing the new Apple TV to something like the iPod or iPhone doesn't really seem like a fair comparison. The scroll wheel and capacitive touch were both revolutionary ideas that made previous interfaces look like garbage. We already know the Apple TV's primary focus for games is going to be motion controls, but that isn't revolutionary by any stretch - we've had motion controls in games for almost ten years now. Not to mention that modern consoles don't really have an interface problem - there's nothing that needs to fixed in the same way palm pilots had ugly, obtuse OSes with clunky resistive touch screens that required a stylus.
People also said that Apple Watch naysayers would look like idiots once that came out too, but the Apple Watch hasn't revolutionized much of anything.
inpHilltr8r
Member
You can't un-click it!
JohnSpartanLee
Member
Should DiRT Rally and World of Warcraft work on it I'd finally get an XBone after all.
No I don't believe that's going to happen.
No I don't believe that's going to happen.
Garrett 2U
Member
It's a valid idea, even though his tech info might be a bit wrong.
Universal Windows Platform + Direct3D 12
(both introduced with Windows 10)
LUXURY
Member
I'm not in denial thank you. Since you seem to know what the stages are, what's stage two to you?
Ars technica put xb1 sales pretty damn close to 15 million (14.32) at the end of June so I dont think it's really that far off.
By the end of this month there should be 15 million xbones sold based on ars analysis.
Right. So they're sell-through rate must be >90%. It's like a wasteland out there. No one has really seen an Xbox in retail for quite some time. It's like an urban legend. Does it actually exist? I've heard people wait months just to get on the waiting list.
Justice_Bolt
Member
I'm interested to see Apple announcements today. MS and Sony will be alright.
The article is really stupid, but what's bothering me more is the amount of people that still treat mobile like the Eldorado.
The market is reaching a bubble state where you have 10 or 15 mega games that make huge money and thousands of minor players fighting for scraps.
Just check the top grossing appstore ranking, the newer game on the list is from 2013 (if I remember correctly).
Maybe the big publishers can sustain a successful model (like fallout shelter did), but the market will get crowded like every other really soon.
Edit: And sorry, but I'm not one of the guys that believe that everything Apple do is going to change our life's for ever.
The market is reaching a bubble state where you have 10 or 15 mega games that make huge money and thousands of minor players fighting for scraps.
Just check the top grossing appstore ranking, the newer game on the list is from 2013 (if I remember correctly).
Maybe the big publishers can sustain a successful model (like fallout shelter did), but the market will get crowded like every other really soon.
Edit: And sorry, but I'm not one of the guys that believe that everything Apple do is going to change our life's for ever.
Netherscourge
Banned
How flexible is Windows 10 on Xbox One?
Can you actually use it like a PC? Install anything on it?
Or is it still locked into XBL Gold/ Xbox One games and apps?
Can you actually use it like a PC? Install anything on it?
Or is it still locked into XBL Gold/ Xbox One games and apps?
If MS really makes XBOne a Win10 PC I will buy one. Don't think so, though...
Unless publishers are planning on getting AAA games on Apple devices I don't think anything's going to change. I guess it'll depend on how powerful the A9 chips are. Something WiiU level or above will probably be sufficient for full-on releases, and the potential to not only sell to Apple TV but also to newer ipad owners got to be tempting. The real obstacle is apple themselves, since they've yet to succeed in creating premium tiers for games.
Unless publishers are planning on getting AAA games on Apple devices I don't think anything's going to change. I guess it'll depend on how powerful the A9 chips are. Something WiiU level or above will probably be sufficient for full-on releases, and the potential to not only sell to Apple TV but also to newer ipad owners got to be tempting. The real obstacle is apple themselves, since they've yet to succeed in creating premium tiers for games.
Lol
Cosmic, why do you think consoles are a static/decaying market, when hardware sales have been great and digital sales can account for up to 56% of a company's total sales in a given quarter? (Ubisoft Q1 2015)
I'm just curious what you're seeing and if you would share that.
It's still an Xbox Console in a walled garden, of course, with a good number of features locked behind an Xbox Gold subscription.
UpDownLeftRight
Banned
So what's actually even the big deal with this new TV? Apple finally attempted to catch up with what Samsung and many other tvs have done for years now? But it's revolutionary this time because apple shit solid gold right?
All I'm seeing is another tv, but with a waggle stick like the Wii. What's the selling point? Brand name is all I can find going for it and personally I couldn't care less for brand names. If something else does a better job sooner I'll take that instead.
All I'm seeing is another tv, but with a waggle stick like the Wii. What's the selling point? Brand name is all I can find going for it and personally I couldn't care less for brand names. If something else does a better job sooner I'll take that instead.
If MS continues to make good xbox games would you not buy them just because the system happens to run windows 10? Do you buy xbox games now? An xb live subscription? Maybe ms office? Maybe a few other things here and there from their digital store? I also have an MS Music Groove subscription because it's a compelling product. Maybe if more people had MS branded living room pcs that played xbox games they would make more money from software and subscriptions? It's also a strong possibility that Windows 10 itself adopts a subscription model.
Making it a living room pc is a compelling selling point to move more units, and more Windows PCs, believe it or not, make money for Microsoft. Even $200 laptops. And guess what, MS does subsidize $99 and $199 dell and hp low cost tablets and notebooks. They definitely aren't opposed to doing the same with the xbox.
You're not seeing anything since they haven't even announced anything yet. Be as snarky as you want but at least wait until you actually have a reason to be snarky.
geordiemp
Member
Microsoft and Sony's cunning plan - they made consoles that can run AAA games.
Apples cunning plan....they are making a console with phone like power that can play mobile games....that will bomb hard and nobody cares.
Apple tv is the new Ouya...could give it away for free and nobody will give a shit.
Was the writer a gamer or know anything, he makes Pachter look like a genius.
Wonder if the writer will post in this months NPD...give us a laugh.
Apples cunning plan....they are making a console with phone like power that can play mobile games....that will bomb hard and nobody cares.
Apple tv is the new Ouya...could give it away for free and nobody will give a shit.
Was the writer a gamer or know anything, he makes Pachter look like a genius.
Wonder if the writer will post in this months NPD...give us a laugh.
Ars technica put xb1 sales pretty damn close to 15 million (14.32) at the end of June so I dont think it's really that far off.
By the end of this month there should be 15 million xbones sold based on ars analysis.
These guys just copy what I post here. I mean literally, they copy what I post here and turn it into an article.
Also that's sell in.
I think it's more the poorly written article than anything.
Perhaps if it was better worded I'd take it more seriously.
Netherscourge
Banned
They sorta mentioned DX12, but not sure they included the whole OS in there too.
Bolivar687
Banned
I'm scared.
CosmicQueso
Member
Zhuge has done an excellent job compiling hardware sales over time. While the Core market has indeed remained incredibly loyal to the traditional console model, the mass market has not.
In conjunction with this, you have a rapidly shrinking base of developers and publishers which are producing fewer and fewer packaged titles every year. Yes, many digital titles are being made, and digital is accounting for a greater share of overall software sales. However, the combination of a far smaller average selling price of these digital titles (driven mainly be promotion and/or PS+/GwG offerings) and an increasing tie ratio that cannot keep pace with this downward momentum in price has left a revenue gap.
Combine this with more costly development with a higher risk profile of winners and losers in the software market, and all of a sudden making games for the Consoles becomes far too risky for many investors.
This will result in the trend of fewer developers, publishers and then titles on traditional Console platforms continuing. There's really no stopping this at the moment.
Of course, this will result in even further homogenization of software offerings, catering more to a shrinking niche of core market buyers. And, at some point, the Consoles will not be able to supply enough of a variety in software offerings to not only not drive mass market adoption, but limit Core adoption as well. (Perhaps not this generation, which has an established base of demand, but one that will clearly be smaller than the last couple generations, particularly with the demise of the dedicated handheld market).
One way to offset this is to remove hurdles for mass consumers. Lower the entry price, make platforms more open, attempt to lower development cost and risk by increasing the potential audience and finding development efficiencies.
The funny part is, none of these are bad things. But the market must evolve. There's not enough core market to keep things going as they are with the increase in costs and risk. Lower the entry price for people, lower prices overall, make acquiring great content more accessible and everyone benefits.
I could be wrong.
Well sure, the article's pretty dumb.
Lionel Richie
Member
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Wat. And here I thought you could already play Arkham Knight on XBO. Or I just don't understand what they're saying. Because it makes no sense.
Polip Fawn
Banned
The part about Xbox one being a PC may be true in some form if the Windows 10 update gives it continuum like the Windows Phones (some of them) will. Which allows you to take your phone as use it as a tower for any screen so you basically have a portable computer. If they give it to Xbox then it'll be kind of like their own PC manufacturing, kind of.
This article sounds like bits and pieces of three different and unrelated articles, none of which were worthy of publishing. The only reason this one exists seems to be to salvage what little was worth keeping out of those original pieces. None of the article's many conclusions arise from established facts therefore it doesn't contain anything worth discussing.
Hey, that means that you're internet-famous!
There's no chance that you'll be able to install Windows 10 on an Xbone.
Apple has been "turning the Apple TV into a games console" every at their September iPhone event for the last 3 or so years. At this point, it's more of an wishlist for analyst than an actual product Apple will focus on. Kind of like that mystical Apple a la carte tv subscription for said Apple TV