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[darkpaladinmfc]

No, you started that yourself by crying your eyes out over Call of Duty and uhh-ohh how it ruined other games, the genre and it was so bad. Find another game to play if it annoys you, it's so very simple.

I haven't posted very much in this thread actually, I was informing you that people aren't hating CoD because it's 'cool' to do so, but because there are actual legitimate reasons -- but you're just ignoring them. Obviously I am playing other games, but I wish there were more good FPS games, but you're happy with the same shit over and over again, so I doubt you'd understand.

 

[Stahsky]

looks like some of you need a time out

 

[Prophet Steve]

No, you started that yourself by crying your eyes out over Call of Duty and uhh-ohh how it ruined other games, the genre and it was so bad. Find another game to play if it annoys you, it's so very simple.

The thing is, cod influences a lot of titles and I do not want that. A decreasing popularity of cod would be a good thing to happen in my opinion. Also, I support creativity and community support, and cod isn't giving the good example.

 

[Sethos]

I haven't posted very much in this thread actually, I was informing you that people aren't hating CoD because it's 'cool' to do so, but because there are actual legitimate reasons -- but you're just ignoring them. Obviously I am playing other games, but I wish there were more good FPS games, but you're happy with the same shit over and over again, so I doubt you'd understand.

Yet you say you like Halo, a game that has played the same, evolved very little few engine changes in the current-generation of their releases? Same with so many games across the board because people don't want to play a completely different game come sequel release. Now, just because it's Call of Duty, it suddenly becomes a massive issue.

The thing is, cod influences a lot of titles and I do not want that. A decreasing popularity of cod would be a good thing to happen in my opinion. Also, I support creativity and community support, and cod isn't giving the good example.

Then why hate on Call of Duty, why not hate on the developers that copies and are influenced so badly by Call of Duty? CoD series have brought some decent things and some not-so-decent things to the shooter scene but I can't recall a running series that suddenly did a 180 to hit the Call of Duty node and made it so much worse?

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

Yet you say you like Halo, a game that has played the same, evolved very little few engine changes in the current-generation of their releases? Same with so many games across the board because people don't want to play a completely different game come sequel release. Now, just because it's Call of Duty, it suddenly becomes a massive issue.

Well, I haven't played Reach, and didn't like ODST, but there was some obvious evolution across the first 3 (even though Halo CE is still my favourite). Call of Duty isn't the only game that lazily rehashes things, other developers deserve blame too, but those other devs aren't nearly as influential as CoD -- and that is why I dislike it.

 

[Raide]

Yet you say you like Halo, a game that has played the same, evolved very little few engine changes in the current-generation of their releases? Same with so many games across the board because people don't want to play a completely different game come sequel release. Now, just because it's Call of Duty, it suddenly becomes a massive issue.

Not to stray too far in this thread but the change from Halo 2&3 to Reach is pretty big, minaly due to the weapon changes and Armour Abilities. More-so than CoD4, MW2 and BlackOPS.

 

[Sethos]

Well, I haven't played Reach, and didn't like ODST, but there was some obvious evolution across the first 3 (even though Halo CE is still my favourite). Call of Duty isn't the only game that lazily rehashes things, other developers deserve blame too, but those other devs aren't nearly as influential as CoD -- and that is why I dislike it.

Good, finally some nuance in the discussion. I do agree, there is little innovation in the Call of Duty series and it is a big player but it seems like people are completely okay with the mass of other triple-A titles that does exactly the same thing but they're just allowed to fly under the radar and are allowed to do it without repercussions ... Call of Duty on the other hand is the bane of the gaming world, the devil in digital form.

Not to stray too far in this thread but the change from Halo 2&3 to Reach is pretty big, minaly due to the weapon changes and Armour Abilities. More-so than CoD4, MW2 and BlackOPS.

I said current generation. 3 -> ODST -> Reach is just a slight iteration and a new campaign slapped on top, that's how I see it, just like WaW -> MW2 -> Blops. Even Gears of War is doing it, same engine, same gameplay and some new features.

It's what developers do these days! Yet some are allowed to do it, others aren't.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

I said current generation. 3 -> ODST -> Reach is just a slight iteration and a new campaign slapped on top, that's how I see it, just like WaW -> MW2 -> Blops. Even Gears of War is doing it, same engine, same gameplay and some new features.

It's what developers do these days! Yet some are allowed to do it, others aren't.

The problem is, even 3 --> ODST has far more innovation than any recent CoD games.

 

[Sethos]

The problem is, even 3 --> ODST has far more innovation than any recent CoD games.

See, I disagree and feel Call of Duty is far more innovative and then we could just go in ring all day long My point is, lots of major game developers just rehash and release, because it's cost effective - Call of Duty should not be the only game to catch flak for it and other games just breeze by because they aren't as big.

 

[darkpaladinmfc]

See, I disagree and feel Call of Duty is far more innovative and then we could just go in ring all day long My point is, lots of major game developers just rehash and release, because it's cost effective - Call of Duty should not be the only game to catch flak for it and other games just breeze by because they aren't as big.

CoD is by far the worst offender though, especially with a new release every year. There's also a difference between rehashing a bad product and a good product.

 

[Tunin]

There's no comparison between them, they're two different games.
Let me put this way:
In CoD you can play a entire match in a corner and manage to do pretty well.
In BF you just can't

It's not a matter of graphics or performance, in CoD you're one man army and in BF you really depend on your teammates. For me BF wins, is a superior experience in every way and BF3 won't be different.

 

[Sethos]

CoD is by far the worst offender though, especially with a new release every year.

Guess that depends on how much you game, by the time I get tired of the previous Call of Duty, the next one is ready so I don't mind as much but I guess you're right, that is hitting the Sports Game mantra a bit too close. Plus there's no requirement to buy said games, so I'm still in the "Just ignore it" camp.

Guess I'm just very lenient when it comes to all this stuff

 

[OldJadedGamer]

But, but you're pissing and moaning, about me pissing and moaning about others pissing and moaning?


Really ...

Just pointing out that pissing and moaning about others pissing and moaning goes no where. But at least you admit that you are pissing and moaning.

 

[Deadly]

I said current generation. 3 -> ODST -> Reach is just a slight iteration and a new campaign slapped on top, that's how I see it, just like WaW -> MW2 -> Blops. Even Gears of War is doing it, same engine, same gameplay and some new features.

It's what developers do these days! Yet some are allowed to do it, others aren't.

What? While 3-> ODST was more-so of the same (it was meant to be more of an expansion), Reach changed a shit ton of things. If we're talking graphics just check out the faces in 3 and ODST and compare them to the ones from Reach :lol

If you expect sequels to be entirely new and have a new engine all the time not only it'll cost them alot more money but it'll also take more time.

 

[RS4-]

Call of Dat Madden.

That's the yearly CoD stuff really.

 

[TURNCLOAK]

Street Fighter and Tekken are doing crossovers.

Why not Call of Duty and Battlefield?

 

[Mr. B Natural]

The problem is, even 3 --> ODST has far more innovation than any recent CoD games.

There were more changes and ideas thrown into mw2 than there are changes thrown between halo 1 and halo 3 or even ODST. Maybe you didn't like the changes going from mw1 to mw2, but you can't deny the laundry list of things that changed and I'm not talking small crap like the game's pace going up and down a little bit ala halo, I'm talking significantly altering the way you can play the game that, thanks to the class system, can be exponentially shifting.

And I can't think of a single piece of "innovation" for ODST. Not one. Halo 1 was extemely innovative. Halo 2 had matchmaking, but after that, I can't come up with anything.

 

[The Faceless Master]

Street Fighter and Tekken are doing crossovers.

Why not Call of Duty and Battlefield?

how would you balance actually using vehicles vs just calling in perks?

 

[hamchan]

There's no comparison between them, they're two different games.
Let me put this way:
In CoD you can play a entire match in a corner and manage to do pretty well.
In BF you just can't

It's not a matter of graphics or performance, in CoD you're one man army and in BF you really depend on your teammates. For me BF wins, is a superior experience in every way and BF3 won't be different.

Well, I know I've stayed in one spot in BC2 before and have done pretty well in terms of my individual score.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Well, I know I've stayed in one spot in BC2 before and have done pretty well in terms of my individual score.

You aren't doing well in BC2 if you sit in one spot as it hurts your team regardless of what your personal score is at the end. Doing well in COD means playing stingy, playing well in BC2 means helping your team win.

 

[bangai-o]

has there at least been a consensus that both are shit next to Red Orchestra?

 

[Enosh]

There's no comparison between them, they're two different games.
Let me put this way:
In CoD you can play a entire match in a corner and manage to do pretty well.
In BF you just can't

It's not a matter of graphics or performance, in CoD you're one man army and in BF you really depend on your teammates. For me BF wins, is a superior experience in every way and BF3 won't be different.

yes there is no camping in BF

jesus fucking christ -.-

 

[OldJadedGamer]

yes there is no camping in BF

jesus fucking christ -.-

There is, but it's mostly people who have been broken from playing COD and they are the ones who hurt the team the most. There are people in BF that jump around like idiots all the time too... guess what game they came from?

 

[bangai-o]

lol at anyone who is acting like there is no camping in Dice shooters.

There is, but it's mostly people who have been broken from playing COD and they are the ones who hurt the team the most. There are people in BF that jump around like idiots all the time too... guess what game they came from?

and any kind of negative gaming styles that are present in BC are in directly the fault of CoD. smh

 

[Stallion Free]

There is, but it's mostly people who have been broken from playing COD and they are the ones who hurt the team the most. There are people in BF that jump around like idiots all the time too... guess what game they came from?

Battlefield 2?

 

[Enosh]

There is, but it's mostly people who have been broken from playing COD

oh bullshit
there were campers in fucking 1942, long before cod even existed

campers exist in every fps beacose in every fps there are people who suck at it and whose only chance to not get totaly destroyed is to camp in a corner

 

[szaromir]

And I can't think of a single piece of "innovation" for ODST. Not one. Halo 1 was extemely innovative. Halo 2 had matchmaking, but after that, I can't come up with anything.

Because you're trolling.

 

[The Faceless Master]

has there at least been a consensus that both are shit next to Red Orchestra?

grown folk are talking, nobody's worried about small time regional franchises like RO, ARMA, Brink, Homefront or ECW.

 

[Tunin]

Well, I know I've stayed in one spot in BC2 before and have done pretty well in terms of my individual score.

Awesome, that's what a sniper or what you do when you're responsible for defending one spot, but it is not a guarantee that you'll be the top player or that you team will win.

Individual score doesn't matter in BF when you're talking about winning matches.

yes there is no camping in BF

jesus fucking christ -.-

Did I mention anything about camping? No.
Campers exist in every FPS out there, but in CoD 'zone control' is actually a strategy used by the top players to stay at the top.

 

[Enosh]

Did I mention anything about camping? No.
Campers exist in every FPS out there, but in CoD 'zone control' is actually a strategy used by the top players to stay at the top.

what?
we talking about map controll now?

Individual score doesn't matter in BF when you're talking about winning matches.

conquest tickets are tied to deaths as are those in Rush oh and squad DM is obvious

score matter a lot in BF, hell I'd say more so than in CoD, since the score in dommination in CoD isn't tied to the kill/death performance of the team unlike in it's BF counterpart

 

[Stallion Free]

Because you're trolling.

WHat are some of the ODST innovations?

 

[OldJadedGamer]

lol at anyone who is acting like there is no camping in Dice shooters.

Campers are a catch 22 when I'm playing BC2. While I love them on the other team as it makes it way easier to win since they are hurting their team, I hate when they are on my team since I have to work that much harder to actually play the game. Most times, I'll just leave games if there are too many campers on my team in BF2 since I hate doing all the work.

It sucks because they are so hard trained to think that's the way you play a game is you wait, camp and snipe, then call in airstrikes for more kills and more for more killstreaks and not help your team at all. I know coming from COD (I was a tenth level prestige) to BC2 it was hard to break those bad habits from being a super selfish player to actually doing everything I could to help my team.

oh bullshit
there were campers in fucking 1942, long before cod even existed

campers exist in every fps beacose in every fps there are people who suck at it and whose only chance to not get totaly destroyed is to camp in a corner

Of course they exist in every FPS but the killstreak bullshit of MW2 and beyond actually promote camping 1000 times more.

 

[Tunin]

what?
we talking about map controll now?

You can interpret my post as much as you like.

conquest tickets are tied to deaths as are those in Rush oh and squad DM is obvious

score matter a lot in BF, hell I'd say more so than in CoD, since the score in dommination in CoD isn't tied to the kill/death performance of the team unlike in it's BF counterpart

Really? Then explain to me why sometimes you manage to do the highest score in the round and still get raped + lose the round.
Score does not win a match in BF, I'm sorry.

 

[hamchan]

Camping existed waaaaaaaay before CoD so it's not exactly fair to blame it all on CoD.

 

[szaromir]

WHat are some of the ODST innovations?

He said there were no innovations to the series after Halo 2. As for ODST's innovations, well it played like H3 for the most part, but I'd say the HUB-level and combat in urban environment was something new in the series (Halo 2 had the same city, but the levels were a lot more corridorish, one might even say call-of-duty-ish).

 

[TheOddOne]

Modern Warfare vs Battelfield vs Halo.

Modern Warfare vs Battelfield vs Halo vs Killzone.

Modern Warfare vs Battelfield vs Halo vs Killzone vs Half Life.

Shits gonna go down, son.

 

[Stallion Free]

He said there were no innovations to the series after Halo 2. As for ODST's innovations, well it played like H3 for the most part, but I'd say the HUB-level and combat in urban environment was something new in the series (Halo 2 had the same city, but the levels were a lot more corridorish, one might even say call-of-duty-ish).

That was a horrible innovation that was poorly implemented. I mean I just felt like I was being trolled by Bungie when they kept putting the waypoints for the next real level on opposite sides of the hub.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Camping existed waaaaaaaay before CoD so it's not exactly fair to blame it all on CoD.

Again, the killstreak aspect promotes camping. What game had killstreaks waaaaaaaaaaay before COD? The perfect COD gametype to me? One that eliminates the killstreaks totally. They were nice and balanced in COD4 then they jumped the shark with them in MW2 with stupid shit like the nuke.

 

[Stallion Free]

Again, the killstreak aspect promotes camping. What game had killstreaks waaaaaaaaaaay before COD? The perfect COD gametype to me? One that eliminates the killstreaks totally. They were nice and balanced in COD4 then they jumped the shark with them in MW2 with stupid shit like the nuke.

Conquest and rush in BC2 massively promote camping as a defenders tactic.

 

[szaromir]

That was a horrible innovation that was poorly implemented. I mean I just felt like I was being trolled by Bungie when they kept putting the waypoints for the next real level on opposite sides of the hub.

That doesn't matter, innovation is innovation. One can argue that perks and EXP in COD4 were a poor innovation, but it's still innovation.

 

[Stallion Free]

That doesn't matter, innovation is innovation. One can argue that perks and EXP in COD4 were a poor innovation, but it's still innovation.

Well one stayed present in the series and the other was dropped from the other series.

I wonder which was actually a success. And I think innovation only matters if it is a success.

 

[Jim E. Rossler]

Conquest and rush in BC2 massively promote camping as a defenders tactic.

That's not camping. or do you "defend' an objective by running into their spawns?
Defenders 'defend' from set points usually, attackers know those and try to flank around or suppress them temporarily to get the objectives planted/taken.

 

[szaromir]

Well one stayed present in the series and the other was dropped from the other series.

I wonder which was actually a success.

ODST and Reach were developed at the same time. The point is Halo games do change.

 

[Kinyou]

I play CoD when I want a quick and fun mp session and I play battlefield when I want a long, intense and strategic mp session.

- Case solved

 

[Stallion Free]

That's not camping. or do you "defend' an objective by running into their spawns?
Defenders 'defend' from set points usually, attackers know those and try to flank around or suppress them temporarily to get the objectives planted/taken.

No in the game it actually ends up being how many cheap ass bullshit spots can defenders hide out in to get cheap kills on the attackers.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

conquest tickets are tied to deaths as are those in Rush oh and squad DM is obvious

score matter a lot in BF, hell I'd say more so than in CoD, since the score in dommination in CoD isn't tied to the kill/death performance of the team unlike in it's BF counterpart

Conquest tickets are tied to deaths but when playing a medic (and not a shitty sniper) you can bring teammates back to life and get your tickets back. Not only that, once you secure points the opposing teams tickets go down way faster regardless of how many people that camper in the back of the map is killing.

The thing I like about BC2 the most is that it awards you with more points for helping your team (like bringing someone back to life) than it does for killing someone on the other team.

 

[Jim E. Rossler]

No in the game it actually ends up being how many cheap ass bullshit spots can defenders hide out in to get cheap kills on the attackers.

Smoke grenades, friend
Smoke grenades.
have some snipers call down artillery on the hotspots to get them to take a bit of cover
a couple of snipers can do a great job of picking off the lmg 200 round sprayers that wont let you through
some engies to maintain tanks while you punch through
As long as everyone isn't trying to be one class and just randomly running up to the points, you can get great comebacks
If your team isn't getting shit done, get in a jeep with your 3 buds, drive up to the base, have 1 guy camp out and be basically a spawnpoint to spawn behind enemy lines while the other 3 keep attacking points.
Eventually the focus will be on the invaders in the base and your sucky teammates will have a chance to move up, unless they REALLY love to camp.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Conquest and rush in BC2 massively promote camping as a defenders tactic.

And 90% of time is useless against a well organized team..., camping give more results in conquest, in rush...you're fucked with a decent team playing against you.

score matter a lot in BF, hell I'd say more so than in CoD, since the score in dommination in CoD isn't tied to the kill/death performance of the team unlike in it's BF counterpart

How is that?, there's a dozen ways to get more points than just inflating your K/D ratio.

You can get 2x or 3x more points repairing a tank than killing 2 guys.

 

[Arnie]

Well one stayed present in the series and the other was dropped from the other series.

I wonder which was actually a success. And I think innovation only matters if it is a success.

Completely wrong. Both games were developed simultaneously, ODST used the Hub and Spoke model to tell a specific type of story with ODST, it fit the style of game. Reach on the other hand benefitted from the traditional mission structure of the previous games for obvious reasons, such as having to move to many different areas across the planet Reach. The hub wouldn't have worked in Reach.

 

[pieatorium]

There is, but it's mostly people who have been broken from playing COD and they are the ones who hurt the team the most. There are people in BF that jump around like idiots all the time too... guess what game they came from?

Counterstrike, Quake, UT or RTCW : ET?