Support NeoGAF

[mediapulp_wes]

let's hear about this 'more to it' then.

and 'M rated games' are just one flimsy standard. I do not agree with many ESRB ratings. I highly doubt you can show a quantifiable difference between the effect of an M rated COD and a T rated one on children.

I'm in Europe so we have different ratings, but generally, there is a significant difference between 18 and 16 rated games (COD vs Halo). I might let my son play a fantasy game like Halo before he hits age 13/14, but I probably wouldn't let him play the identically rated Medal Of Honor: Warfighter.

 

[plagiarize]

Maybe it does affect the kids negatively. Maybe it doesn't. It depends on the kid imo.

I'd still wouldn't want me 6 year old daughter or my son, who at this age have a difficulty distinguishing reality from imagination to play this kind of games. 6 year old kids don't perceive the world like you or me.

when I was a kid I was much more disturbed by Short Circuit 2 than I was The Terminator. That's why I'll trust parents over the ratings board any day.

I'm in Europe so we have different ratings, but generally, there is a significant difference between 18 and 16 rated games (COD vs Halo). I might let my son play a fantasy game like Halo before he hits age 13/14, but I probably wouldn't let him play the identically rated Medal Of Honor: Warfighter.

for what it's worth, I grew up in Derby, England. Kids don't differentiate between those two types of violence based on all the studies I've read, and it lines up with my own experiences as a child.

 

[Shinta]

Oh, there's a biiiiig difference between letting kids play violent games and letting them do it all the time.

I think that's the sound of a goalpost being moved.

Agreed.

A lot of kids are more vulnerable to the negative impact of games now because they grow up alone, they don't play outside as much, they don't have a lot of "reality" to contrast with the violent game fantasy. When I was growing up, we all still played outside, a lot. We all walked home from school. We played massive games of hide and seek spanning a few city blocks up until we were too old to do it because people would call the cops on us for sneaking around their houses at night. Now kids just stay inside all day and don't do anything else.

I'm less worried about the games than I am worried about the complete breakdown of community in society, and the inability of parents to raise their kids. When I was growing up, every single house on the block was someone we knew and they all kept an eye on us so we would just be outside almost all day. Now kids can't go anywhere because people are afraid of pedophiles.

The last 20 years have really changed things, particularly in the US. I can look back and see all the things that helped me become a decent person, and in many cases, these things no longer exist in society. I'm much more worried about that than games, but that's just me.

 

[Impeccable]

Two things. When was the last time most of you hung out with a SIX year old? I think there is a disconnect mentally with the ability of them.

Secondly, why do we assume every parent is the bastion of successful mentoring and child rearing? Truth is most parents are lazy and unmotivated to raise their kids well. Assuming 'it's okay as long as...' as if every parent would do that is laughable.

 

[RagnarokX]

Two things. When was the last time most of you hung out with a SIX year old? I think there is a disconnect mentally with the ability of them.

Secondly, why do we assume every parent is the bastion of successful mentoring and child rearing? Truth is most parents are lazy and unmotivated to raise their kids well. Assuming 'it's okay as long as...' as if every parent would do that is laughable.

I don't think that's the point. It's ok if the parenting is good enough. If it's not, then no. Most of the time the answer would be "no" because parents tend to suck. OP's dad doesn't sound up to the task.

 

[plagiarize]

Two things. When was the last time most of you hung out with a SIX year old? I think there is a disconnect mentally with the ability of them.

Secondly, why do we assume every parent is the bastion of successful mentoring and child rearing? Truth is most parents are lazy and unmotivated to raise their kids well. Assuming 'it's okay as long as...' as if every parent would do that is laughable.

wake me when the generation of deviants spawned by the 'new thing' that their parents let them have without keeping close tabs actually shows up. wasn't it supposed to happen already?

the truth is most people turn out reasonably well, even when raised by parents who apparently didn't give a shit. I don't know how you can say that the parents of all of the kids that turned out fine wouldn't have raised them differently if their child was starting to go in the wrong direction.

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

I had an endearing moment when my eldest daughter came into the living room while I was playing Splinter Cell CT. I was busy hiding bodies, and she commended me for carrying them off when they were asleep. I'd hate to think of what her thoughts would have been had she understood what I had actually done to those guys.

Anyway, I wonder if games themselves are proof of the weird direction of things? We now have a best selling phenomenon know widely for making entertainment out of remote strikes, and people make funny gifs out of eye-gouging and neck-snapping.

 

[pslayer666]

when I was a kid I was much more disturbed by Short Circuit 2 than I was The Terminator. That's why I'll trust parents over the ratings board any day.


.

which is why i said it depends on the kid.

and then I talked about my kids, which I know would get pretty alarmed by shit like this.

 

[plagiarize]

Agreed.

A lot of kids are more vulnerable to the negative impact of games now because they grow up alone, they don't play outside as much, they don't have a lot of "reality" to contrast with the violent game fantasy. When I was growing up, we all still played outside, a lot. We all walked home from school. We played massive games of hide and seek spanning a few city blocks up until we were too old to do it because people would call the cops on us for sneaking around their houses at night. Now kids just stay inside all day and don't do anything else.

I'm less worried about the games than I am worried about the complete breakdown of community in society, and the inability of parents to raise their kids. When I was growing up, every single house on the block was someone we knew and they all kept an eye on us so we would just be outside almost all day. Now kids can't go anywhere because people are afraid of pedophiles.

The last 20 years have really changed things, particularly in the US. I can look back and see all the things that helped me become a decent person, and in many cases, these things no longer exist in society. I'm much more worried about that than games, but that's just me.

I think the Daily Mail are looking for a US correspondent. You should apply.

 

[Gadirok]

I let my brother play M rated games in moderation, but thats only because he would end up as a social outcast at his junior high if he didn't.

I was very reluctant to let him play CoD, but I felt guilty that he had been asking me for a few years now and he knew I would say no so I ended up purchasing Black Ops II when it released. He digested the campaign in one day and became the first kid at his school to finish Black ops II campaign. Needless to say, it boosted his popularity and self-esteem and he really needs it.

I had been keeping him on games like Littlebigplanet, Dwarf Fortress, Pokemon, Lego Batman, and Mario titles for a few years. He started off with yellow version on my old gbc and Neopets on the computer, but I myself started off within the same area, with Nintendo games and was hoping he would follow suite. He did, and I'm happy to say that even though he did get black ops 2, after finishing the campaign he never bothered to play it again and went back to playing infamous 1.

Hes more of a fan of Littlebigplanet and Pokemon though (and dwarf fortress but my desktop has been cleared out, so thats not coming back soon).

I think you should have a greater influence on your younger sibling or child by giving them diversity in E for everyone games before you throw M rated games at them. Just my 2 cents.

I mean, my brother enjoys Resistance: Fall of man and was asking when we could co-op Resistance 3 together. I even made the choice of letting him watch the first 2 episodes of the Walking dead (video game) while I played, and it didn't really phase him, but he enjoyed it. I didn't let him watch the rest and he was dissapointed.

But yeah, hes been pretty mild, even though I spoil him by getting most of the games he wants on launch day.

Back in early September I asked him if he had to choose between an upcoming game, which would he want? Pokemon Black 2 or Little big planet vita? He said he would rather not choose and would prefer to play both, and didn't give me an answer. Its good to see he doesn't act like the majority of youtube commenters and 4chan's fanbases on the basis of video game company loyalty.

I guess thats the bit I am proud of the most, that he can play and respect games without using that ridiculous brand loyalty, and ever since he was 8 thats a good thing. Someone who can play Dwarf Fortress and enjoy Patapon as much as any mario title, and wants to play infamous and resistance just to see how it is but at the same time check out the newest little big planet and pokemon? Thats how all kids should be.

 

[:Motorbass]

Kids wanna play these games. But I think that they should have the feeling that it is not really okay at that age. And not being encouraged by their parents.

 

[Captain Tuttle]

This was a violent game when I was younger

The big bad thing back then was the movie Faces of Death, my parents wouldn't let me anywhere near it.

FWIW I have a 7 year old and I don't let him play COD, he's happy with Lego games and Mario stuff on his 3DS though.

 

[MIMIC]

A 1st grader playing CoD? Wow.

The first truly violent game that my parents let me play was Resident Evil 2. I was already in middle school by then, so even though they kinda didn't like it, it wasn't that big of a deal; I was at least a teenager (and my grades were really good and I never got in trouble, so they had SOME idea of what kinda head was on my shoulders).

Fake edit: forgot about the Mortal Kombat games. They never got it for me but I played it all the time when I was 10, IIRC. I also remember playing Splatterhouse 3. But I honestly think that I was pretty mature for my age and had no trouble distinguishing reality from fantasy.

Personally, I think 6 is too young for a game like that. It's not slapstick violence; they try to make that shit as realistic as possible. And at that age when they're still trying to figure out the real world, letting them play that game might blur the line between what's real and what isn't.

But here's the thing: if you DO let them play it, you should be sitting right there with them WHILE they're playing. If this isn't "just a game" to them, then it's time to take it back.

EDIT: But then there are those people who NEVER grow up....like my 25-year-old brother who describes Need for Speed tactics as if they're something that you should use in real life. (and in my head I go: "not sure if trolling, or just stupid")

 

[mrklaw]

and that's fine, of course. that doesn't automatically mean that anyone who feels differently is a bad parent. and frankly, if a parent isn't really keeping tabs on what their kids get up to, the games they play and the films they watch are quite likely going to be very minor concerns compared to the other stuff they get up to. I just want parents to pay attention. Any parent paying attention I'm going to defer to on whatever level of violence they feel is appropriate for their kids. It's not right for me to see my parents called bad parents, when I've turned out well. That's a parent's job, raising their kid well. If the end result is good I don't think you really get to slander those parents.

and Klaw, I'm not directing that at you.

true. I'd rather a parent know the content that a game/movie has, and be fine with their kids playing it in an informed way (not just going 'yeah whatever its just a game'), than they have no idea what they are playing and don't care.

But I would suggest that the number of parents that actively understand the content of 'M' rated games and have conciously decided that their child is mature enough to deal with it, is relatively low. I hope not, but thats my feeling.

 

[orion434]

My sister let my Nephew play Halo and Call of Duty and he's 7 years old. He was really good at both games, knew the layout of all the maps and weapons. The problem wasn't the violence or blood, but the stimulation of the game... I watched him once and he couldn't sit still while playing... jumpimg around. All he ever talked about was Halo then once he was really bad after playing and my sister hid the games... then he went looking for them, found them and tried to sneak in some game-time. This is when my sister had to destroy the games right in front of him and he couldn't play them anymore. To a 7 year old "Halo is a helluva drug!"

 

[Shinta]

I think the Daily Mail are looking for a US correspondent. You should apply.

I don't know what you mean. Have you ever read about changes in US communities from a sociological perspective?

 

[Jockel]

I don't know what you mean. Have you ever read about changes in US communities from a sociological perspective?

It's the same in Germany, at least where I live. In the school I work at, there's still 6th graders that get picked up by their parents. That's considered normal. In my childhood everybody was going home on their own since 2nd grade. There's a huge difference between 20 years ago and now.

 

[TriangleOfCorruption]

There is an option to turn the blood off.

Is this post a joke? I really can't tell.

 

[Lord Snow]

I grew up playing Resident Evil, Manhunt, The Thing and I turned out fine. Haven't killed anyone yet.

 

[mediapulp_wes]

I grew up playing Resident Evil, Manhunt, The Thing and I turned out fine. Haven't killed anyone yet.

It's only a matter of time.

 

[liger05]

My ex has a 6 year old brother. He was playing MW3 at 5 and guns since he was younger. When his angry he say's things like 'I want to kill you'. It's not good!

 

[Sojgat]

Agreed.

A lot of kids are more vulnerable to the negative impact of games now because they grow up alone, they don't play outside as much, they don't have a lot of "reality" to contrast with the violent game fantasy. When I was growing up, we all still played outside, a lot. We all walked home from school. We played massive games of hide and seek spanning a few city blocks up until we were too old to do it because people would call the cops on us for sneaking around their houses at night. Now kids just stay inside all day and don't do anything else.

I'm less worried about the games than I am worried about the complete breakdown of community in society, and the inability of parents to raise their kids. When I was growing up, every single house on the block was someone we knew and they all kept an eye on us so we would just be outside almost all day. Now kids can't go anywhere because people are afraid of pedophiles.

The last 20 years have really changed things, particularly in the US. I can look back and see all the things that helped me become a decent person, and in many cases, these things no longer exist in society. I'm much more worried about that than games, but that's just me.

You're half right. Children who engage in violent or illegal activity don't do so because they can't tell the difference between the reality of a video game and real life. They do it because they're bored and they don't care that it's wrong. They're raised in environments where that kind of behaviour is all they've ever been exposed to by their parents, and the people around them, not by fucking video games. GTA sure makes a nice scapegoat when the police catch up with them though.

 

[AranhaHunter]

My sister lets my 10 year old nephew play COD and I have a problem with that. I played MK when I was really young too, but I think it's different, the graphics were horrible and doing a scorpion, sub-zero, or raiden fatality was different then than it is now IMO.

EDIT: I don't like him doing it because I think he'll grow up and kill people, I don't. But the fact is that he sometimes he is jumpy and scared for no apparent reason. My only assumption is because he plays these violent games and watch violent movies.

 

[witchedwiz]

at that age he should be playing imaginative games!
colorful if possible, but something stimulating..
what's stimulating for a youngling into being a bloke running with a gun?
nothing...
but that's just me maybe.....

 

[Jawmuncher]

Unlike Halo, I could see COD being a bit more troublesome for a younger age the SP mainly. Some messed up stuff in there. However the MP with parental controls such as muting everyone as what not is basically just playing with GI Joes.

Since people no longer blow up into pieces like in WAW

 

[Captain Bluey]

I dont think this is an easy one to answer. I wouldnt have let my son play COD at 6 years. Way too young and the content is clearly inappropriate at that age.

For me, the broader question is when is it appropriate to let your kids be exposed to this sort of media? Classifications are there as a guide, but I know there are many parents who turn a blind eye.

I did allow my son to play COD with his cousin over Xbox live when he was 9 (He is now 10). It was a difficult decision, but holding him back would have created more problems. He is an only child, and he only really wanted to play the game because his cousin and a mutual friend play it. They are his closest friends. I already had the game.

He was allowed to play it on the condition that he couldnt play the campaign, only multiplayer. And there were other restrictions too - he can only talk to his cousin and friends (not strangers) on the mic. Xbox parental settings help a lot with that.

That being said, the main game he plays with his cousin are Minecraft and Garry's Mod. He also plays a fair bit of Civilisation.

Like any kid, he tries to push the boundaries. He has asked me about playing GTA, FarCry, and others, but I wont cave. The problem is his cousin plays those. So there are boundaries there.

He is a sensitive kid. But he knows the boundaries between fantasy and reality. He loves the Zombies in Blackops. Compare this to the time we walked into a store selling DVD"s and he got really upset seeing the cover of one of them. I dont know what it was, but ever since, he wont go near the DVD section of a shop. The point is that some things affect him, others (eg COD) dont.

My bigger concern is that he doesnt get outside to play much. We make a point on weekends to get outside and do things together as a family. He also does some sports.
But after school (after doing homework, piano), he wants to socialise online with his cousin and school friends. (When I was his age I was riding my bike around our street with my school friends. This doesnt happen where we live). But the condition is that he has to get to bed at a reasonable time and read for an hour each night (something he is quite keen to do).

I share this to make the point that each kid is different, each family is different. And letting your kid(s) be exposed to this sort of media really will depend on the child's personality and the circumstances of each family. My decision to let him play COD was very considered. I still struggle with it, and I will always continue to monitor his console / PC play.

 

[the_prime_mover]

at that age he should be playing imaginative games!
colorful if possible, but something stimulating..
what's stimulating for a youngling into being a bloke running with a gun?
nothing...
but that's just me maybe.....

Probably more than anything, this mirrors my opinion. I think that the casual acceptance of violence is an issue but it is and has always been a major facet of life throughout all ages (and may even be less so in current Western society). However, allowing your children to be raised by such substandard stimulus is just doing them a disservice the least extent of which is becoming desensitized to violence.

It seems that we have proven that video programming, whether TV or Games, is a capable substitute for lax parenting, and I am sure there is no real evidence to suggest that children who are ambitious and self motivated are made significantly less so by exposure to such mediums however, I expect that children who are lazy and lack personal motivation will have their development hindered by exposure to such programming when the programming offers value no greater than the worst junk foods.

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

I played thrill kill when I was 6. I would like to think that I turned out just fine.

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

at that age he should be playing imaginative games!
colorful if possible, but something stimulating..
what's stimulating for a youngling into being a bloke running with a gun?
nothing...
but that's just me maybe.....

Yeah... I mean, why would you really want your kid to deal with the shit that a game like COD throws at you anyway? There's nothing beautiful about the game, no sense of creativity or wonder about the game world. It's a hell of a lot more warming to watch the kid romp around with Yoshi on some crazy planet, that's for sure. I let my kid play Crackdown because she wanted to jump over buildings and drive cars around, but then there was the shooting, cartoony though it may be.

So, back to Banjo N&B real quick. Which was a free-roaming game, with a creative touch. More games like that, please!

 

[Magypsy]

I used to play Carmageddon when I was young. Now I run over people all the time.

But seriously, if the kid can distinguish Blops from real life, then all is fine if you ask me.

I work in a game store and I see little kids buying violent games (most of the time it's COD or GTA) all the time. I find it worse that they don't want to try something else, like Street Fighter or Super Mario Galaxy. I do like recommending them Just Cause 2 though.

 

[May16]

The kid probably watches worst things on TV.

Are you meaning to imply that allowing him to play Call of Duty is therefore okay, or what?

Whether you are or aren't, I'd say the two aren't the same. TV is merely watching (still not okay with at age 6, but anyway), but games are interactive. You're pulling the trigger and killing people instead of just watching them be killed.

 

[Massa]

Are you meaning to imply that allowing him to play Call of Duty is therefore okay, or what?

Whether you are or aren't, I'd say the two aren't the same. TV is merely watching (still not okay with at age 6, but anyway), but games are interactive. You're pulling the trigger and killing people instead of just watching them be killed.

Not really, my point is that kids are going to be exposed to "inappropriate" shit no matter what. I think it's more important to teach them well how to deal with it than just trying to ignore and hide it until a random age, because if you take that approach you will fail no matter what.

I also disagree with your comment about games being interactive making things any different.

 

[peronmls]

I'm not sure if I would let him play single player but I definitely wouldn't let him play online.

 

[Ravensmash]

My parents were pretty lax when it came to video games, I didn't really have any restrictions. I recall playing GTA3 and the like at an early age and I don't consider myself to be a violent person at all.

That said, violent games get much more graphic as we move through the generations. What was perceived as mind-numbing or outrageous a decade ago is considered tame by today's depictions of violence - but that comes with the territory of improving technology.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but CoD is quite tame in depicting graphic violence (although single player can be quite edgy, but I presume the kid is playing multiplayer primarily) - the bigger worry would be the community that a huge game like that can harbour with the racism, homophobia and other negatives that come with online communication.

 

[moonbox]

My parents were pretty lax when it came to video games, I didn't really have any restrictions. I recall playing GTA3 and the like at an early age and I don't consider myself to be a violent person at all.

That said, violent games get much more graphic as we move through the generations. What was perceived as mind-numbing or outrageous a decade ago is considered tame by today's depictions of violence - but that comes with the territory of improving technology.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but CoD is quite tame in depicting graphic violence (although single player can be quite edgy, but I presume the kid is playing multiplayer primarily) - the bigger worry would be the community that a huge game like that can harbour with the racism, homophobia and other negatives that come with online communication.

Definitely this.

 

[ROBOKITTYZILLA]

I remember going to an art exhibition a couple of years ago and there was an outdoor park nearby. There was a bunch of kids playing and I heard one of them say, "Let's play Call of Duty!" and then they all started pretend shooting each other. None of them were over the age of 8. I wept for humanity.

 

[Seanspeed]

Two things. When was the last time most of you hung out with a SIX year old? I think there is a disconnect mentally with the ability of them.

Funny enough, last time I was talking to one, it was about Call of Duty.

 

[Shig]

Multiplayer CoD's fine. It's practically cartoon violence the way people just die, respawn instantly, die again, repeat.

The campaign, though? Much too young for that. Expletives everywhere, sequences tasking you with grabbing someone from behind and slitting their throat in up-close detail... That ain't kid stuff and it's a far cry from the Mortal Kombat and Wolfenstein examples people are trying to correlate here.

Any former kid should probably appreciate that a kid's yearning to "be grown-up" is kind of a misguided goal. Being a kid is a sweet gig. I don't trust any parent that doesn't want to make sure their kid has a nice long run of just being a damn kid, and just steps aside at the least bit of resistance.

At very least, put up a fight. That way, the kid gets the added thrill of feeling like they're getting away with something whenever you relent.

 

[Seanspeed]

At very least, put up a fight. That way, the kid gets the added thrill of feeling like they're getting away with something whenever you relent.

And will think that they can always get what they want if they whine about it enough.

 

[teruterubozu]

Everyone sounds like they're under 10 years old online. Seriously.

 

[Shig]

And will think that they can always get what they want if they whine about it enough.

I'm not saying to always relent.

 

[Esura]

I remember going to an art exhibition a couple of years ago and there was an outdoor park nearby. There was a bunch of kids playing and I heard one of them say, "Let's play Call of Duty!" and then they all started pretend shooting each other. None of them were over the age of 8. I wept for humanity.

When I was a kid, me and the neighborhood kids would go "Let's play Dragon Ball Z!" and we would proceed to beat the shit out of each other until we cried quits and pretend to do Kamehamehas and Spirit Bombs on each other until our parents called us in the house. The good days.

I don't see the issue. Kids being kids.

 

[Seanspeed]

I'm not saying to always relent.

Dont need to. Its kind of like begging dogs. You dont always have to relent, but they will always beg. Why? Cuz you gave in one time. After that, they always know there's a chance.

 

[Shig]

Dont need to. Its kind of like begging dogs. You dont always have to relent, but they will always beg. Why? Cuz you gave in one time. After that, they always know there's a chance.

So then you're saying never give kids anything they want, ever? That's realistic.

 

[Sub_Level]

I played through Duke Nukem 3D at 6.

If your little bro starts swearing or playing for more than an hour or so a day, then it's a problem. If you see him start acting out what he sees in the game, then it MIGHT be a problem (but probably just a little boy being a little boy). Otherwise, I would say it's fine until you see negative effects (some kids take what they see in games way too seriously, their brains are like sponges lol)

You and your dad (and mother I presume) are the ones who need to reinforce the ideas, either by dictation or by example, on what is the proper way to act in society.

For a specific recommendation, I'd say let him only play on the weekends or on days he has no homework.

Multiplayer CoD's fine. It's practically cartoon violence the way people just die, respawn instantly, die again, repeat.

The campaign, though? Much too young for that. Expletives everywhere, sequences tasking you with grabbing someone from behind and slitting their throat in up-close detail... That ain't kid stuff and it's a far cry from the Mortal Kombat and Wolfenstein examples people are trying to correlate here.
.

Yeah, the campaign is definitely too gritty for a 6 year old. Duke 3D at least had a parental lock that censored the language, blood, and tits. Black Ops 2 might have a blood option and that's about it.

EDIT: Apparently there is an option for somewhat reduced content in Black Ops2. Main Menu -> Options -> Graphic Content -> Reduced

 

[Seanspeed]

So then you're saying never give kids anything they want, ever?

If they want something and you're ok with them having it, then dont put up a fight is what I'm saying.

 

[ozfunghi]

When i was that age, all i could play was Pango, Paratrooper, Lode Runner, Digger (lol, my 18-year-older sister used to stress out on that one) etc... When i was 10, most violent games i could play was Police Quest, Operation Wolf etc. Got Street Fighter II as soon as it was released on the SNES, age 13. So i can't really compare my own situation.

But do i think it's bad for a 6 year old to be investing himself in an interactive world where graphics are rather lifelike in an environment of kill or be killed? Yes i do. This is in no way to be compared to a child running around in the backyard with a stick pretending it's a gun. It's natural for the kid to want something that is meant for adults, but parents should know better. Also, if you let your kid have anything he wants at this age, good luck having some kind of leverage over his upbringing the coming years.

I'm 33, father.

 

[scar tissue]

Buy him Gears of War, it's superior gameplay-wise and graphically.

 

[Arcteryx]

I don't think I even started playing PC games really until maybe 8-9, and then the only "violent" ones were Wolf3d or Duke.

I'd be more worried about a 6 year old listening to 15 year olds constantly yelling you know what on the mic. The violence in those games is fairly PG material(outside of CoDW@W which had limb dismemberment).

 

[Jacobi]

I USED TO PLAY BARELY RECOGNIZABLE VIOLENCE GAME WHEN I WAS 6 THAT'S NOT MUCH DIFFERENT FROM MODERN GAMES