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New Info: Trump's Ties to Sergei Millian, Russian Intelligence (& Detailed Timeline)

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BowieZ

Banned
UPDATE 2: Wall Street Journal has further investigated these links. New thread here:

http://www.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1337409



UPDATE: A couple of posters have falsely accused this of being fake news. They are mistaken, as the entirety of the information here is simply proven factual information. However, they may be correct in their assertion that my title is misleading, which is unintentional and only a result of limited characters in NeoGAF titles, and perhaps an assumption of my intention to publish lots of little bits of information relating to the subject. Perhaps a better title would thus be: "MotherJones publishes new interview with Sergei Millian, who now dubiously denies having a substantive business relationship with Trump, with detailed timeline for context (to give readers a chance to draw their own conclusions about an important national affair)".


On Thursday, MotherJones reported fresh research into links between Trump and Russia—particularly his mysterious dealings with the evasive Sergei Millian, who in 2011 serviced in some capacity an FBI-investigated Russian Foreign Ministry intelligence-gathering program.

Sergei Millian is an underreported but key link between Trump (and Trump's lawyer Michael Cohen) and Putin's credibly suspected machinations to seek compromising intelligence from Americans.

Expectedly, Millian has in the past half-year attempted to purge his ties to Trump from the Internet but now, this past week, has finally spoken out in a highly evasive, falsifying manner, to categorically deny a rich, decade-long connection that, to the contrary, is categorically borne out by known facts.

I couldn't see this posted yet on GAF. I also did some research and translated some facts and dates from this and a couple of other articles into an exhaustive, cohesive timeline, especially for those who don't have a good grasp of the whole picture. (This took me 7 hours to compile.) I believe that this information is of critical importance in understanding the current known links to potential Russian intelligence-gathering.

If you're already well-informed on this topic, please skip to the 2017 section (second post) for the "new news".


Sergei Millian and U.S. President Trump, 2007

BACKGROUND
Sergei Millian is a player in a larger web of controversial business ties between Trump, the Trump Organization, and Russia. He is president of the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce in the USA (RACC) and the owner of a translation service. Millian's online bio notes he graduated from the Minsk State Linguistic University with the equivalent of a master's degree in 2000. His bio says he is a real estate broker who works in residential and commercial properties in the United States and abroad.[2]

He used to go by the name Siarhei Kukuts (tr: Sergei Kukut)—that's how he's listed on tax returns for the RACC—and it is unclear why he changed his name. Social media accounts on Facebook and Russian social network Vkontakte link him to family by the name "Kukut" in Belarus, and his page on the website for the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce (RACC) gives the name "Sergei Millian" as an alias. “I am US citizen and do not have and never had Russian citizenship. When immigrants arrive to USA, it is a common practice to change their name,” he told The Daily Beast in an email. He is in his late 30s and won't say when he came to the United States or how he obtained US citizenship.[1][2]

Internet posts from Millian’s early years in the U.S. use his former name, and hint as his early role as a Russian-speaking fixer who brokered deals for Russian businesses. “I can recommend a savvy canadian lawyer (speaks Russian), who only for $2500 consulate fees can arrange your immigration to Canada,” Millian boasted in one.[1]

Since first meeting Trump, Millian has built a reputation on a series of exaggerations, to become a cross between a translator, a property merchant, and a pro-Trump spin doctor for the Russian press. In recent years he has evolved into a regular pundit on behalf of Trump, in Russian media, and even to The Daily Beast as recently as July, 2016.[1]
———

1980s
Trump has been seeking opportunities to develop buildings in Russia since the 1980s, during the Soviet era—none of which have been fruitful. However, they have led to a number of business connections.[1]
Trump has been promising to build a Trump Tower or hotel in Moscow for 30 years. He wrote in the “Art of the Deal” in 1987 that he visited Moscow for the first time that year, with then-wife Ivana, to scope out sites for luxury hotels he hoped to build in a joint venture with the then-Soviet government's hotel and tourism agency. He visited again with U.S. tobacco executives in 1996; that deal got far enough that an architect drew conceptual drawings but did not come to fruition.[3][4]

Part of the allure was what Trump and his associates saw as a huge opportunity — the chance to market American-style luxury apartments to the wealthy elite in a place that still mostly offered utilitarian Soviet-style construction.[4]

2005
Trump signed a one-year deal in 2005 with a New York real estate company called the Bayrock Group to try, again, to build a Trump Tower in Moscow. In a 2007 deposition, Bayrock executive Felix Sater (a Russian immigrant with an interesting mafia-related back story) testified that he had located Russian investors for the project, as well as a site, a shuttered pencil factory named for U.S. communists Nicola Sacco and Bartolomeo Vanzetti.
Sater testified that after trips to Russia, he would “pop my head into Mr. Trump’s office and tell him, you know, ‘Moving forward on the Moscow deal.’ And he would say, ‘All right.’ ”
That effort fizzled too.[3]

Trump claimed (in a later court proceeding) that Russian investors were spooked when a 2005 book questioned his net worth.[4]

2006
Partners of one of Trump’s projects then under construction in Panama visited Moscow to sell condos at the building in 2006.[3]

The aforementioned Russian-American Chamber of Commerce (RACC), a nonprofit that Millian started in Atlanta in 2006[2], has survived on shoestring budgets, advocates closer commercial ties between Russia and the United States, and assists US firms looking to do business in Russia. Its website notes that it "facilitates cooperation for U.S. members with the Russian Government, Russian Regional Administrations, U.S. Consulates in Russia, Chambers of Commerce in Russia, and corporate leaders from CIS [Commonwealth of Independent States] countries."[2]

2007
Trump promised, in a 2007 court deposition, that he had not given up on Moscow. “Russia is one of the hottest places in the world for investment. . . . We will be in Moscow at some point,” he said.[3]

Millian's friends had organised a Trump trip to the Moscow Millionaire’s Fair in 2007, where he was promoting Trump Vodka.

According to one Moscow-based American businessman who negotiated with him, Trump’s admiration for Putin was rooted in "pure self-interest".
"He was looking to make friends and business partners” among Russia’s politically connected elite. “Oligarchs aren't going to do business with anyone who bad-mouths the boss,” explains the real estate developer, who requested anonymity because of his ongoing Russian investments.[7]

Trump then allegedly invited Millian to horse races at Gulfstream Park Racing & Casino, in Miami, Florida (pictured above).

That encounter led to a meeting with Trump attorney Michael Cohen (since implicated in the Steele Dossier) and, allegedly, an exclusive contract for dealing Trump properties in Russia and nearby nations. "Later," Millian said, "we met at his office in New York, where he introduced me to his right-hand man—Michael Cohen. He is Trump's main lawyer, all contracts go through him. Subsequently, Trump Organization and The Related Group signed a contract with me[/B] to promote one of their real estate projects in Russia and the CIS. You can say I was their exclusive broker."[1][2] Millian said he had helped Trump "study the Moscow market" for potential real estate investments.[2]

In October, Trump told Larry King on CNN, "Look at Putin -- what he's doing with Russia -- I mean, you know, what's going on over there. I mean this guy has done -- whether you like him or don't like him -- he's doing a great job in rebuilding the image of Russia and also rebuilding Russia period,"[5]

2008
“Then, in the 2007-2008 years, Russians were buying tens of apartments in Trump buildings in the U.S.A.,” Millian bragged to RIA. “But I wouldn’t want to disclose concrete sums or names.”[1][2]

Trump made significant money from one Russian oligarch in 2008, when he sold a mansion in Palm Beach for $95 million to Russian billionaire Dmitry Rybolovlev. Trump had bought the home at a bankruptcy auction less than four years earlier for $41.4 million.[3]

Donald Trump Jr. said, at a 2008 real estate conference in New York, "Russians make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of a lot of our assets." He added, "We see a lot of money pouring in from Russia."[1][2]
The Russian market had “natural strength, especially in the high-end sector." Moscow held special appeal because wealthy people throughout the region wanted to own real estate in the capital city, he said.[4]

In his 2008 speech, Donald Jr. announced that he had traveled to Russia six times in the previous 18 months. But, he said, Russia presented enormous challenges.
“As much as we want to take our business over there, Russia is just a different world,” the younger Trump said. “It is a question of who knows who, whose brother is paying off who. . . . It really is a scary place.”[4]

Concurrently, Sergei Millian’s online biography prominently bragged that he had worked “as a broker for projects with Donald Trump.”[1]

2009
In the April 2009 issue of the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce newsletter, Millian, as president, reported that he was working with Russian investors looking to buy property in the United States, and he said, "We have signed formal agreements with the Richard Bowers and Co., the Trump Organization and The Related Group to jointly service the Russian clients' commercial, residential and industrial real estate needs."[1][2]

In 2009, RACC called for the US Congress "to foster necessary political changes to produce a healthier economic environment" and grant permanent normal trade relations status to Russia.[2]

2011
RACC's 2011 tax return reported the group was based in an apartment in Astoria, Queens, where Millian lived[2]—though the group's letterhead that year listed a Wall Street address[2]—and that year it brought in only $23,300 in contributions and grants and $14,748 in program revenue. The tax return noted that the chamber "successfully hosted four universities from Russia in New York City" and hosted a trade mission from Belarus.[2]

In December, Trump praised Putin's "intelligence" and "no-nonsense way" in his book "Time to Get Tough."
"Putin has big plans for Russia. He wants to edge out its neighbors so that Russia can dominate oil supplies to all of Europe," Trump said. "I respect Putin and Russians but cannot believe our leader (Obama) allows them to get away with so much... Hats off to the Russians."[5]

2013
Trump made millions when he agreed to bring the Miss Universe pageant to Moscow in 2013, a deal financed in part by the development company of a Russian billionaire Aras Agalarov, a Putin ally who is sometimes called the “Trump of Russia” because of his tendency to put his own name on his buildings.

("Will he become my new best friend?" Trump asked of Putin in a tweet wondering whether Putin would attend—he didn't but offered him a traditional gift.[6]

At the time, Trump mingled with the Russian business elite at a swanky after-party. “Almost all of the oligarchs were in the room,” Trump bragged to Real Estate Weekly on returning home.[4]

Agalarov told The Washington Post that the project is on hold while Trump runs for president.[3]

Agalarov's son, Russian pop musician Emin Agalarov, said, “He kept saying, ‘Every time there is friction between United States and Russia, it’s bad for both countries. For the people to benefit, this should be fixed. We should be friends,’ ” Emin Agalarov recalled.[4]

The Agalarovs are wealthy developers who have received several contracts for (although not yet made money from) state-funded construction projects, a sign of their closeness to the Putin government. Shortly after the pageant, Putin awarded the elder Agalarov the “Order of Honor of the Russian Federation,” a prestigious designation[4] (an award coincidentally also received by Exxon CEO Rex Tillerson, that same year).[6]

2014
Millian apparently was proud of his association with Trump. In 2014, he posted on Facebook a photograph of him with Trump and Jorge Perez, the billionaire real estate developer in Miami who owns The Related Group. (Pictured above, photographed in 2007)

2015
In 2015, Millian received a Russian award for fostering cooperation between US and Russian businesses.[2]

Putin said in December that Trump was a “colorful and talented” person, a compliment that Trump said at the time was an “honour.”[4]

2016 (April)
On Millian's LinkedIn page, he notes he is also the vice president of an outfit called the World Chinese Merchants Union Association, a group that has only a slight presence on the internet and that seems to have an address in Beijing. According to a LinkedIn post published by Millian in April 2016, he met that month in Beijing with a Chinese official and the Russian ambassador to the Republic of San Marino to discuss industrial and commercial cooperation between China and Russia.[2]

Millian bragged about being an exclusive broker with the Trump Organization to promote their properties in Russia. In a lengthy interview with RIA News, a Russian language outlet, in April, Millian boasted about instantly winning Trump’s affection at the Moscow Millionaire’s Fair in 2007. Millian said he’d been in contact with Trump or an adviser a few days prior.

When RIA News asked him this year about fears that America might go up in flames in the case of a Trump presidency, Millian remained a true believer.
But the April interview was unusual in that it focused on Millian’s supposed personal relationship with Trump. Typically, he’s billed as a political scientist or economics expert when he spins for Trump.
In one article billing him as an “expert,” Millian waxed about how Trump’s economic reform will be based on Americanism, not globalism, and parrotted the Republican nominee’s talk about keeping jobs in the U.S.[1]

In the interview, Millian asserted that Trump would be good for Russia if elected president. Trump, he noted, would improve US relations with Russia and lift economic sanctions imposed by Washington on Russia. He said Trump was interested in doing business in Russia: "I don't want to reveal [Trump's] position, but he is keeping Moscow in his sights and is waiting for an appropriate time." Millian added, "In general Trump has a very positive attitude to Russians, because he sees them as clients for his business. Incidentally, he has done many projects with people from the Russian-language diaspora. For example, Trump SoHo in New York with billionaire Tamir Sapir." (Sapir, who died in 2014, was an American billionaire real estate developer from the former Soviet republic of Georgia.)[2]

The Russian Ambassador to the United States, Sergey I. Kislyak, attended Trump’s April foreign policy speech in which Trump called for ending “this horrible cycle of hostility” between the two nations (breaking from a tradition in which diplomats steer clear of domestic politics).
A spokesman for the Russian Embassy said that the Ambassador's attendance at the Trump speech should not be considered an indication that Russia is partial to Trump. “There is no preference,” the spokesman said.[4]

Emin Agalarov said, "[Trump] keeps underlining that he thinks President Putin is a strong leader. This could be an amazing breakthrough. If he becomes president and actually becomes friends with Putin, we would avoid 10 wars every year at least."

2016 (June)
In another article in June, Millian speaks authoritatively about how Trump’s friendships will dictate his choice of a vice presidential candidate.
“Trump mostly interacts with business or military people,” he said. “That’s why his vice-president will be a representative of one of these two camps: either someone who came from the corporate world, or the military.”[1]

2016 (July)
“Donald Trump is ‘presidential’, powerful, charismatic, and highly intelligent leader with realistic approach towards Russia. I’m am glad to see Donald taking control of GOP,” Millian said last month during the Republican National Convention, after The Daily Beast reached out to the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce.
“I, personally, wholeheartedly support his presidential aspirations. It’s been a great pleasure representing Mr Trump’s projects in Russia
“I think he will be able to improve some processes in the government, because it’s currently very bureaucratic,” he said. “For instance, this concerns medicine. In the USA people smile at you well, but the level of accessibility and wait time here is behind many countries.”
In July, when many in Russia worried Trump’s vice presidential choice in Mike Pence might threaten Trump’s warm embrace of the country, Millian praised the Indiana governor an “excellent candidate.”
“He works well in his post and gets by without scandals,” Millian said then. “Opponents will find it hard to find fault in his reputation and work.”[1]

2016 (August)
With escalating media interest in Trump’s ties with Russia, Millian dismisses his dealings as almost a side gig. Millian told The Daily Beast last week he had not spoken to Trump since 2008.[1]
After inquiries from The Daily Beast, the reference to Trump in his biography was scrubbed.[1]
It also appears that references to the Trump Organization working with the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce in the USA were at some point scraped from its website.[1][2]

He has recently played down his relationship with Trump. There had been “quite negative press related to Russia so I don’t want to be involved,” he told The Daily Beast when first reached by phone. “I didn’t represent him personally ever,” he continued, saying that he had merely worked with him on some projects.
“There are several brokers who work on such real estate projects… I do remember there was a written agreement that authorized me to market one of the projects bearing his name signed somewhere around 2008.”
He praised Trump’s knowledge of other cultures by noting he offered him a glass of champagne upon closing a business deal—a nod to the notion that Russians like to drink.[1]

It was a Trump-like move: brag about ties to a project when it could be advantageous; but then brand it as tangential any link to the project if it starts to show sign of controversy.[1]

2016 (October)
In October, the Financial Times mounted an investigation of him and the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce. It reported:

Most of the board members are obscure entities and nearly half of their telephone numbers went unanswered when called by the Financial Times. An FT reporter found no trace of the Chamber of Commerce at the Wall Street address listed on its website. At the same time, the chamber appears to have close official ties, arranging trips for visiting Russian regional governors to the US. [2]



———
SOME BACKSTORY: YURY ZAYTSEV & ROSSOTRUDNICHESTVO
As part of its inquiry into Millian, the Financial Times pointed to Millian's connection to Rossotrudnichestvo, a Russian government organization that promotes Russian culture abroad. Millian has collaborated with Rossotrudnichestvo.

Through cultural exchanges, Rossotrudnichestvo, which operates under the jurisdiction of the Russian Foreign Ministry, was bringing young Americans—including political aides, nonprofit advocates, and business executives—on trips to Russia. The program was run by Yury Zaytsev, a Russian diplomat who headed the Russian Cultural Center in Washington, DC.

2011
In 2011, Millian (and the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce) worked with Zaytsev and the Russian group to mount a 10-day exchange that brought 50 entrepreneurs to the first "Russian-American Business Forum" in Moscow and the Vladimir region, according to a letter Millian sent to Russian President Dmitry Medvedev after the initiative. In that letter, Millian praised Rossotrudnichestvo, and he added, "My entire staff, fellow participants, and I, here at the Russian-American Chamber of Commerce in the USA, very much look forward to assisting Rossotrudnichestvo with the preparations for next year's trip." (Millian now says, "We are not affiliated with [Rossotrudnichestvo] in any way.")

2013
In 2013, Mother Jones reported that Rossotrudnichestvo was under investigation by the FBI for using junkets to recruit American assets for Russian intelligence.

Americans who participated in the exchange trips and were later questioned by FBI agents told Mother Jones that the agents' questions indicated the FBI suspected Zaytsev and Rossotrudnichestvo had been using the all-expenses-paid trips to Russia to cultivate Americans as intelligence assets. (An asset could be a person who directly works with an intelligence service to gather information, or merely a contact who provides information, opinions, or gossip, not realizing it is being collected by an intelligence officer.)

After Mother Jones published a story on the FBI investigation, the Russian embassy in Washington issued a statement: "All such 'scaring information' very much resembles Cold War era. A blunt tentative is made to distort and to blacken activities of the Russian Cultural Center in DC, which are aimed at developing mutual trust and cooperation between our peoples and countries."

2014
A year later, in November 2014, Zaytsev spoke at a Moscow press conference and said, in reference to the upcoming US presidential elections, "It seems to me that the Russian 'card' will certainly be played out." He added, "I think that this presidential election first of all will very clearly show a trend of further development" in US-Russia relations.
 

BowieZ

Banned
2016 (October cont.)
Toward the end of the presidential campaign, Michael Cohen, the Trump lawyer, told the Financial Times that Millian's claims of working with Trump were "nothing more than a weak attempt to align himself with Mr. Trump's overwhelmingly successful brand." But the newspaper reported that Cohen "did not respond to questions about whether he interacted with Mr. Millian or why Mr. Millian is one of only 100 people he follows on Twitter." (Cohen no longer follows Millian on Twitter.) Hope Hicks, Trump's campaign spokeswoman, told the paper that Trump had "met and spoke" with Millian only "on one occasion almost a decade ago at a hotel opening."


———
2017
Cohen, Hicks, Sean Spicer, Trump's designated White House press secretary, and the Trump presidential transition team did not respond to a request for information regarding Millian's interactions with Trump and his associates.[2]

Reached by telephone this week, Millian said he would not discuss his relationship with Trump and requested he be sent questions via email. Mother Jones subsequently sent him a list. Millian responded in an email with answers to a different set of questions, and he noted he would not answer any queries about his personal background or provide any details beyond what was in this reply.[2] He said in the email:

"I have a solid reputation with businesses around the world. I have never said that I worked personally for Trump. I said I was a broker for one of his many real estate projects. There are several brokers who work on such real estate projects. I never represented Mr Trump personally and I am not working with Mr Trump.
I have signed an official contract with talks of exclusivity that authorized me to represent Trump name project in Russia and CIS.
I never worked for Russian Government or Russian military as a translator or in any other capacity.
We never got any business with Rossotrudnichestvo.
I'm a member of the Presidential Trust of NRC-GOP and supporter of Mr Trump who contributed to his campaign just the same way as many millions of Americans. I'm proud that Mr Trump became our president. I'm sure he will rebuild our great nation to the highest standards just as he did with his distinguished buildings. We desperately need better infrastructure, airports, railways in this country. Also, high time starting paying off national debts. I feel upset that press tries to distracts him from making our country great again by distributing fake news."


He said he had never been paid by Trump for any work. He maintained that the last time he spoke to Trump was in 2008.[2]

A search of campaign finance records revealed no contribution from Millian to the Trump campaign or the Republican National Committee; a contribution of $200 does not have to be itemized.

Millian's response ignored several questions Mother Jones sent him. He would not say when he left Belarus or explain how he became an American citizen. He would not discuss the details of the deal he previously claimed to have struck with the Trump Organization. He would not say how many times he worked on projects or exchanges with Rossotrudnichestvo. (His response seemed to suggest he had nothing to do with the Russian organization, yet the 2011 letter he wrote indicated his Russian-American Chamber of Commerce had collaborated with Rossotrudnichestvo.) He did not explain why references to the Trump organization had been scraped from the RACC's website and his bio. And he did not answer this question: "In the last year and a half, have you had any contacts with Donald Trump or any of his political or business associates?"

Various media outlets that have examined links between Trump and Russia have focused on Carter Page, a Moscow-connected foreign policy adviser for Trump's presidential campaign (whom Trump spokesman Sean Spicer recently falsely claimed Trump did not know) and Paul Manafort, Trump's onetime presidential campaign manager who had business ties to Russians and Putin-allied Ukrainians. Any official investigators would likely be interested in these two men. They also should schedule a sit down with Millian.

———
[1] The Daily Beast (Tim Mak, Katie Zavadski, September 9 2016)
[2] Mother Jones (David Corn, January 19 2017)
[3] The Washington Post (Rosalind Helderman, July 29 2016)
[4] The Washington Post (Tom Hamburger, Rosalind S. Helderman and Michael Birnbaum, June 17 2016)
[5] CNN (Jeremy Diamond, July 29 2016)
[6] Kremlin.ru - Meeting with energy company heads
[7] Newsweek (Owen Matthews, August 29 2016)
See also: Paul Manafort, Michael Cohen, Rex Tillerson, Igor Sechin, Gen. Michael T. Flynn, and Carter Page
———

On top of all the obvious business conflicts of interest established throughout this timeline, the potential incriminating link is (albeit hypothetically at this stage) thus: that Putin (6 years into his first Presidency) would have instructed Millian to set up the RACC in 2006—and Yury Zaytsev of the Russian Cultural Centre of DC—in order to over time systematically build trust and forge business and cultural ties, which would provide the Russian Foreign Ministry a means to source American intelligence assets who would (unsuspectingly) help develop kompromat (KGB-style blackmail material).
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
I sometimes wonder if these theories sound as crazy to conservatives as the birther movement was to liberals.

I want to believe, but it's just so out there.
 
I sometimes wonder if these theories sound as crazy to conservatives as the birther movement was to liberals.

I want to believe, but it's just so out there.

I think the difference here is that the fact that Russia hacked the DNC to influence the elections was confirmed by the CIA, FBI, and 16 other agencies, including a few private agencies such as CrowdStrike.
 
I think the difference here is that the fact that Russia hacked the DNC to influence the elections was confirmed by the CIA, FBI, and 16 other agencies, including a few private agencies such as CrowdStrike.

Trump also acknowledged that the DNC was hacked.
 
I think the difference here is that the fact that Russia hacked the DNC to influence the elections was confirmed by the CIA, FBI, and 16 other agencies, including a few private agencies such as CrowdStrike.

And the "Russia-Trump Connection" is considered valid enough that not only US, but foreign intelligence agencies are investigating it. The "Birther Movement" was only considered valid by racist hacks and deluded conspiracy theorists, much like "PizzaGate".


Also, nice piss-yellow tie on Trumpster Fire there. :p
 

lemmykoopa

Junior Member
I'm getting tired by the flood of Trump topics on the forum. Can't we get a separated board only for Trump related discussions?
 

BowieZ

Banned
OP, whos article is that?
I compiled the whole thing from the various referenced articles.

As I said, it took 7 hours, and it was my post traumatic shock response to Spicer's propaganda diatribe.

I really hope the mods don't lock it out of "Trump fatigue".
 

devilhawk

Member
Seems like a bunch of smoke. We're still missing a gun. That gun has to be blatantly apparent to afford Congress the public mandate to get him out.

Remember, you need 67 votes in the Senate.
 

Raiden

Banned
Nobody cares. And for Trump supportets its too much hassle to comprehend.


Nixxon would have been publicly hanged if they found out about this. I swear the stuff this man gets away with..
 

Juicy Bob

Member
I'm getting tired by the flood of Trump topics on the forum. Can't we get a separated board only for Trump related discussions?
Nah son. This shit's too important to ignore. It needs to be as visible as possible as it will affect all of us - and this is coming from someone in the UK.
 

BowieZ

Banned
Can someone give me the tl;dr?
Last para (second post). ;-)

Essentially Trump, most likely, dealt intimately with a Russian pawn who, most likely, was involved in procuring intelligence assets (in the form of unsuspecting American businesspeople), possibly knowingly, but either way as part of an insidious, carefully devised long con by perpetual President Putin.

The second post is the most meaningful right now, but the whole thing forms an incredibly rich tapestry that at the very least proves Donald Trump to have risen to the Presidency to help unlock business potential in Russia and the East Bloc... a mutual benefit to Putin, of course, who most definitely ordered the hacks.
 

BowieZ

Banned
Thanks for the great effort OP, real nice to have this all in one place. Bookmarking this thread for myself.
There's so much more to the story, of course, though... especially when you start delving into the sinister ties between Putin and Trump's other cabinet picks/former campaign staff/Giuliani. But all of that has been covered in other threads and it's just too daunting a task to piece together.
 

HotHamBoy

Member
Last para (second post). ;-)

Essentially Trump, most likely, dealt intimately with a Russian pawn who, most likely, was involved in procuring intelligence assets (in the form of unsuspecting American businesspeople), possibly knowingly, but either way as part of an insidious, carefully devised long con by perpetual President Putin.

The second post is the most meaningful right now, but the whole thing forms an incredibly rich tapestry that at the very least proves Donald Trump to have risen to the Presidency to help unlock business potential in Russia and the East Bloc... a mutual benefit to Putin, of course, who most definitely ordered the hacks.

Yikes.
 

Famassu

Member
I'm getting tired by the flood of Trump topics on the forum. Can't we get a separated board only for Trump related discussions?
Ignorance is the way these motherfuckers win. This shit needs to be as visible as possible.

Just because you're so pathetic that you'd rather ignore all the shit that Trump is doing doesn't mean that it should be hidden from other people.
 

amar212

Member
I compiled the whole thing from the various referenced articles.

As I said, it took 7 hours, and it was my post traumatic shock response to Spicer's propaganda diatribe.

I really hope the mods don't lock it out of "Trump fatigue".

You did amazing work there, congrats!
 
Good job on the summary, OP - much thanks.

If this is what you can piece together from Open Source Intelligence, the security services should have a ton more from protected assets.

This is going to blow up. Question is, will the US democratic system be resilient enough to handle it?
 

_Clash_

Member
Putin rolled a 20 when Trump strolled in begging like a dog for Russian money back in 04.

Whodda think he'd be president. Truth is stranger than fiction
 

Beartruck

Member
Op just put in more work than any US intelligence agency probably will.

Edit: You really need to send this collected info to a news agency. Keep it in the public eye so that intelligence agencies can't just hope it goes away.
 
Op just put in more work than any US intelligence agency probably will.

Edit: You really need to send this collected info to a news agency. Keep it in the public eye so that intelligence agencies can't just hope it goes away.
He compiled these from various news agencies. There is nothing in here that the intelligence community wouldn't be aware of.

Honestly, I want some real evidence so we can get this guy out of here, but I read the OP and don't see anything really new. This one guy the OP focuses on seems to be attempting to distance himself from Trump which is not surprising.
 
I sometimes wonder if these theories sound as crazy to conservatives as the birther movement was to liberals.

I want to believe, but it's just so out there.

They are crazy, but many are blinded for their hatred of Trump to accurately access that most "news" we've been getting concerning Trumps ties to Russia are mostly conspiracies and many others unsubstantiated claims. It's getting out of hand, I fully expect to hear how Trump is Russian soon.
 

Gutek

Member
That Millian dude seems like a self aggrandizer that idolizes Trump. Personally, I don't there's anything there beyond that.
 

Polari

Member
I guess we're creating our own fake news now?

This is some birther-level nonsense. But hey - I guess it worked out for the last guy. T-minus 2 now though, surely.
 

BowieZ

Banned
I guess we're creating our own fake news now?

This is some birther-level nonsense. But hey - I guess it worked out for the last guy.
Please elucidate how reporting the known facts in the OP is "fake news" and "birther-level nonsense".

Every single entry in that timeline is a proven fact. Trump's business ties to Russia are well documented, and yes the ancillary connection to Russian intelligence gathering is tenuous, but here is all the data so you can draw whatever conclusion you like from it at this early stage. This isn't a baseless accusation. This is simply a timeline of proven connections, given at a time when provable facts are now questioned.
 
I guess we're creating our own fake news now?

This is some birther-level nonsense. But hey - I guess it worked out for the last guy. T-minus 2 now though, surely.
Hardly Untrue when the facts in the OP can be sourced to multiple points of reference.

I give your shitpost a 3/5, or a 6/10 if the math works out for you.
 

benjipwns

Banned
He used to go by the name Siarhei Kukuts (tr: Sergei Kukut)—that's how he's listed on tax returns for the RACC—and it is unclear why he changed his name.
Lots of people in the Soviet Union did this when it fell.

You needed alternate identities when it existed in order to do certain things, especially on the gray and black markets. When it collapsed and new countries were coming out of it, it was an easy way to "disappear" and "reappear" under one of your aliases and a new clean slate.

The same thing happened after the Iranian Revolution, the fall of Saddam, etc.

Happened during the original revolutions that led to the Soviet Union too. A British Naval attache to the Russian government completely disappeared for like five years because he had adopted another identity in order to stay in the country while the Soviets were murdering everyone with ties to the old regime. Then he suddenly reappeared just in time to make the boat out of the country when the Soviet government agreed to allow a number of British citizens to leave. Meanwhile the "Ukrainian" dude who had been wandering around Moscow for five years was never seen again.

edit: Many of them probably were involved in espionage, for everyone and anyone. Couriers, etc. You don't have to be James Bond to be on a list that a new regime decides has to be liquidated. Many Iranians who do "legitimate" and "illegitimate" business are used as ways to pass messages between intelligence agencies. Etc.
 

rjinaz

Member
I guess we're creating our own fake news now?

This is some birther-level nonsense. But hey - I guess it worked out for the last guy. T-minus 2 now though, surely.

Curious why you didn't post in the Trump press thread, where he sent his guy to deliberately send out fake news. No harsh words or even a constructive criticism. Glad to see you here calling out fake news from a random neo gaffer and not the President of the United States though.
 
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