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New Nintendo patent application - Nintendo NX related?

TheMoon

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Jul 1, 2014
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All of this was kind of believable until it said region free lol.
seriously? the one thing we actually know is a likely feature is what tipped you off as it being fake with all the obvious BS next to it? lol
 

GDGF

Soothsayer
Jun 6, 2004
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I'm gonna take this as a sign that the gamepad is returning as a smaller device with new functionality in the form of scrolling wheels :)
 

TheMoon

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Jul 1, 2014
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Finally Miyamoto has the controller necessary to make F-Zero!
That might actually be more relevant than you (maybe?) intended. Considering how that (depending on final execution) allows for a new interesting way to do the L/R drift.
 

GDGF

Soothsayer
Jun 6, 2004
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Also, while the actual image is just used for illustration purposes and generally has no baring on which features will be used in what quantity (main example being the two face buttons) the fact that the abstract discusses the touchscreen in detailed legalese points to it being included in whatever final form the NX controller takes.

If this is the NX controller, of course.
 

James Scott

Banned
May 24, 2014
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From the NX discussion thread:
I could honestly see those triggers being pretty useful. Switch between main and sub weapons without having to reach the d pad. Use the L wheel to scroll through grenades, mines, C-4, etc while the R wheel scrolls through different kinds of guns.
You can probably of ise to platformers too. I imagine it would be satisfying to use it to rev up (sonic?) or do a spin attack.
Maybe that's the new mechanic the next Mario game will use?
Also, maybe SR (scroll Right trigger) can shoot and you can scroll with the SL to zoom in?
Anyone else got some cool ideas for it ?
Or any other details about the scrollable triggers? I heard some people say it can move on its own and has haptic feedback but I'm not sure if that's true
 

MisterHero

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Jul 24, 2007
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Sounds good and all but we really need a few killer applications for it to take off

Tomorrow's headline:

NINTENDO NX CONTROLLER HAS ONLY TWO FACE BUTTONS AND WILL SHIP IN WHITE FIRST; FLOATING HANDS INCLUDED IN PRO PACK
You laugh but Nintendo once sent me two mannequin hands in the mail
 

E-phonk

Banned
Jan 1, 2006
5,042
0
0
Belgium
In the 90's I had a Sony mobile with scrolling wheel, worked remarkably well as an extra interface input device. This was like 10-12 years before touch screens were the norm, but it worked really well to navigate through menu's. I actually really loved that phone before it's "talkstick" broke. I'm curious how it would work/feel, but i'm optimistic.

Sorry if it's off-topic, but it's the first thing I thought about when seeing the patent.

 
Apr 27, 2011
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Scroll wheel shoulder buttons are something that I'm very surprised that no one has tried before (for gaming devices). Seems like a really usefully addition that won't get in the way, unlike some of their recent innovations.

I keep thinking how great it would be for menus, and selecting items from a hotbar, Monster Hunter especially.
 

Disorientator

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Aug 20, 2009
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Ok so digging a little deeper, and using this patent application's inventor as my lead, I found another interesting patent application.

The assignee/applicant is not Nintendo but Kazutoshi Obana, which Linkedin says he's a Nintendo "Group Chief".

I first thought it could just be a coincidence, but later after checking all the inventors listed it got pretty clear they work for Nintendo.
I think it's just impossible for different teams at different companies to have so many engineers with the same names. (but please correct me if you find some evidence suggesting otherwise)

There is actually United States Patent Application 20150263685 and European Patent Application EP2902879, which look exactly the same.

They both show a tablet-like device (again designs could be just placeholders) with dual vibration sections and interestingly, the European patent application is named "Haptic based information processing apparatus, information processing program, information processing system, and information processing method".

The whole point of the applications seem to be the controllable vibration but I could be wrong.






Didn't want to create a new thread as this one is still moving along rather nicely, and it wouldn't hurt if the sources got cross-checked/confirmed.
 
Feb 5, 2009
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Such a simple yet innovative idea that I wonder why no one thought of this sooner
But we did XD

http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=38268861

refreshment.01 said:
A scroll wheel could prove useful and controllers today have enough space to put one around. Maybe it could be integrated as a bumper scroll wheel hybrid.

I can see Metroid Prime 4 making a revolutionary change for FPS games with a controller like this for NX if it pans out. Kinda reminds me of what Valve is trying to do with the Steam controllers only this thing makes way more sense and seems like it would give more accurate control for an FPS or Adventure game with so many more ways to move the camera and the perspective.
Nah, the rotary bumpers alone can't achieve what the Steam controller is doing.

People are selling this short by thinking alone the line of a mouse scroll wheel. This is more like a one axis trackball in functionality.

An interesting use is camera control. An specific case not mentioned yet is complementing motion aiming with the gyro, think Splatton. Tilt is a very easy ann natural to do with a 2 handed controller, however lateral motion in the X axis is a more demanding. So you could use the wheel to control X axis and Tilt to control Y.

i would prefer a track pad for index finger use instead. The advance of haptics and the increase in precision have made trackpads too useful not to have. i do understand you can use the touch screen as a trackpad but i would like a more focused position for one.
 

Snakeyes

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Sep 20, 2009
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865
Ok so digging a little deeper, and using this patent application's inventor as my lead, I found another interesting patent application.

The assignee/applicant is not Nintendo but Kazutoshi Obana, which Linkedin says he's a Nintendo "Group Chief".

I first thought it could just be a coincidence, but later after checking all the inventors listed it got pretty clear they work for Nintendo.
I think it's just impossible for different teams at different companies to have so many engineers with the same names. (but please correct me if you find some evidence suggesting otherwise)

There is actually United States Patent Application 20150263685 and European Patent Application EP2902879, which look exactly the same.

They both show a tablet-like device (again designs could be just placeholders) with dual vibration sections and interestingly, the European patent application is named "Haptic based information processing apparatus, information processing program, information processing system, and information processing method".

The whole point of the applications seem to be the controllable vibration but I could be wrong.






Didn't want to create a new thread as this one is still moving along rather nicely, and it wouldn't hurt if the sources got cross-checked/confirmed.
Nice find! I always felt that haptics would be a perfect evolution of the touchscreen Nintendo introduced with the DS, but I didn't think we'd see it so soon.
 

Clefargle

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Dec 3, 2012
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From the NX discussion thread:

Also, maybe SR (scroll Right trigger) can shoot and you can scroll with the SL to zoom in?
Anyone else got some cool ideas for it ?
Or any other details about the scrollable triggers? I heard some people say it can move on its own and has haptic feedback but I'm not sure if that's true
Map and menu navigation would be easy. Drifting in Mario kart or Fzero would be interesting. Maybe rolling in smash bros? I don't know but it sounds neat.

Nintendo patented a GBA with dual analogue sticks?
Cmon, you aren't even trying
 

Who

Banned
Aug 16, 2014
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Yes but more advanced.
Let me explain (from what i've read)

Its configurable when the scrolling needs to stop : webbrowser if you scroll all done, the scroll will be locked. So you can only scroll up from that moment.

Forcefeedback : shooting an arrow in zelda for example. The more you scroll the harder you need to pull the scrolling wheel. If you let go, it will return to his original position.


Automaticly scrolling without touching : when you move a ball with the scrolling wheel and let go, it will keep rotating until the ball is been stopped by his own.(Also it can rotate automaticly a side to where a secret can be found)

At last clicking the scrolling wheel could also have forcefeedback.
This all sounds incredible
 

ChaosXVI

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May 7, 2012
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I'm extremely excited by the sounds of all of these things. With both the Wii and Wii U, I looked at the big innovation at first while scratching my head, but then learned to love them both later on once the games proved the gimmick to be worthwhile...but I'm loving the sound of these patents right out of the gate, and I really hope these are things that they intend to use instead of just some random stuff never intended to see the light of day.
 

Nostremitus

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Mar 24, 2012
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Not enough reading comprehension either...

OT: interesting development,could serve many a purpose for quick access
That wasn't nice.

I wasn't being all that serious.

But, since you said something, scroll wheel triggers are cool and all, but if you don't have enough buttons for modern games it's pointless. From the Nintendo patents I've seen (which admittedly aren't many) the diagrams seem indicative of what the product will look like. Removal of the X and Y buttons would be a bad thing. Scroll wheels cannot replace that functionality for the same reason the GameCube digital click at the bottom of the analog trigger couldn't replace the missing shoulder button.

Hopefully that's just a placeholder image so that people could recognize it as a controller and the number of buttons shown in not relevant.
 

MrCunningham

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Jan 12, 2012
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Cmon, you aren't even trying
Nah, I'm not. But only having two face buttons does look kind of silly. I get that Nintendo's R&D team is trying to reinvent the should button once again, and they may use a screen with haptic feedback. Which may bring up some interesting new ideas to play with. But on the practical level, I hope the controller is not this minimalistic. I think they should stick too something a little more generic that would please third party publishers.
 

HUELEN10

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Feb 29, 2008
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Clickable shoulder wheels is a genius idea, why hasn't anyone thought of it before?
 
Apr 3, 2009
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Übermatik;179123042 said:
Scroll through menus
Lean left and right from cover
Cycle through weapons/combat modes
Give unit orders
Pan the screen etch-a-sketch style
Increase/decrease speed
Control 'intensity' etc etc.

If they make them click shoulder buttons too, this could bring a whole new opportunity for control.
Yeah, I'm liking this alot.
 

Trevelyan9999

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Feb 8, 2012
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www.nintengen.com
But we did XD

http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=38268861





Nah, the rotary bumpers alone can't achieve what the Steam controller is doing.

People are selling this short by thinking alone the line of a mouse scroll wheel. This is more like a one axis trackball in functionality.

An interesting use is camera control. An specific case not mentioned yet is complementing motion aiming with the gyro, think Splatton. Tilt is a very easy ann natural to do with a 2 handed controller, however lateral motion in the X axis is a more demanding. So you could use the wheel to control X axis and Tilt to control Y.

i would prefer a track pad for index finger use instead. The advance of haptics and the increase in precision have made trackpads too useful not to have. i do understand you can use the touch screen as a trackpad but i would like a more focused position for one.
Are you sure? Sounds like this idea for the patent sounds even better, a previous post did mention:

Originally Posted by Taker666

Going deeper into the patent brings up some interesting things-
So they could use wheels, trackballs or touch panels for shoulder buttons in this patent.
Wouldn't that allow for more freedom of movement for a camera/free look control with the those? In an FPS game you can do all the movement and looking/strafing with one hand, while the other hand can fire, switch weapons etc.
 

James Scott

Banned
May 24, 2014
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Nah, I'm not. But only having two face buttons does look kind of silly. I get that Nintendo's R&D team is trying to reinvent the should button once again, and they may use a screen with haptic feedback. Which may bring up some interesting new ideas to play with. But on the practical level, I hope the controller is not this minimalistic. I think they should stick too something a little more generic that would please third party publishers.
It's likely not going have just two buttons. The patent is just an example
 

OmegaSmash

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Apr 4, 2014
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In the 90's I had a Sony mobile with scrolling wheel, worked remarkably well as an extra interface input device. This was like 10-12 years before touch screens were the norm, but it worked really well to navigate through menu's. I actually really loved that phone before it's "talkstick" broke. I'm curious how it would work/feel, but i'm optimistic.

Sorry if it's off-topic, but it's the first thing I thought about when seeing the patent.

Huh. Reminds me of how MGSV's iDroid "work" in universe.
 

Candescence

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Oct 3, 2013
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Scrollable shoulder buttons ala mouse wheel? That's... That's actually fairly brilliant. I will be most disappoint if this isn't implemented.
 

B-Dubs

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Mar 19, 2012
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Scrollable shoulder buttons ala mouse wheel? That's... That's actually fairly brilliant. I will be most disappoint if this isn't implemented.
Imagine, say, an F-Zero game with those controls. Like each scroll shoulder button controls an engine, so if you want to go through a corner without losing too much speed you just adjust one of the engines and blow through.
 

Terrell

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Apr 1, 2006
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Scroll wheel shoulder buttons sound amazing, if implemented right. Small innovation to a classic feature that really works well, and hard to call a gimmick when there's likely not a single game that couldn't benefit from it in some way and it's such a small thing.

I expect this to be a thing.

Clickable shoulder wheels is a genius idea, why hasn't anyone thought of it before?
I'm sure someone has. If you mean why no one in the industry has? Well... I'll just say that it doesn't shock me that this is Nintendo's patent and leave it at that.
 

Gsnap

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Jun 9, 2013
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Automatic scrolling makes me think of a good implementation for a starfox type of game.

Basic up down left right control of your ship with an analogue stick, but the full left or right lean to get through narrow spaces or make faster turns could be controlled by sliding your finger back and forth on the scrolling shoulder button. And then barrel rolls could be done by just flicking it and letting it spin. You can stop it whenever you want, but if you don't it'll continue until it slows itself down and stops on its own.
 

Mr_Antimatter

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Feb 5, 2013
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mouse wheel shoulders? could work, really depends on how clicky they are. Too easy to rotate and you risk triggering some other action in the head of the moment.
 

Nemecyst

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May 7, 2014
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Drifting in racing games would be so fun with these. Variable dodging distances in action games is another use. Could be more accurate than an analog face button.
 

KingSnake

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Jan 9, 2013
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0
A barrel roll done with scrolling shoulders is like the easiest use of this. Or rolling on the ground in action games.
 

MCN

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Sep 4, 2012
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Once again, Nintendo take an existing technology and turn it on its head. God I fucking love those guys.
 

Nemecyst

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May 7, 2014
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Fast target selection in rpgs like xenoblade would be a qol improvement. Honestlt, i just want to see what could be done in a new Cooking Mama.
 

jeffers

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Nov 18, 2012
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So anyone know of pairing a motor with a scroll wheel? Would be easy to mockup and see how well it works, worth checking current draw too. Would you use a dc motor or stepper?
 
Jan 18, 2012
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You're piloting a damaged plane in an adventure game, the wheels start to turn as your plane starts to lean to the left or right as you start to lose altitude, you must turn the wheels to their previous position to steady the plane and keep it in the air.

Or

Same scenario but it's a WWII era B52 bomber and the engine stalls, turn the wheels to kick start the engines on their respective sides of the plane.
 

L Thammy

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Nov 4, 2012
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Here's an idea. Thumb wrestling game by Next Level Games. It's a spiritual sequel to Punch Out Wii, just like how Arm Wrestling for the arcade was a spiritual sequel to Punch Out. The wheels automatically turn at a different speed for each wrestler and you have to fight back.

 

Clefargle

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Dec 3, 2012
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I REALLY want to try advanced scroll wheel drifting in Mario Kart and Fzero. Could be incredible, especially if there is force feedback and analog triggers. Imaging the feedback changing depending on the speed coming into a drift, the angle of approach, and/or the terrain type. It would be great if a jump or a puddle pushed back more than flat road. Also having the scroll wheels counter rotate slightly against you while you modulate drifting with the stick. Like making you struggle slightly with keeping the drift going by pulling the opposite way from the stick direction. Sounds super immersive and if it includes (analog?) zl and zr could be a really cool handheld/controller. I'm also wondering about rolling in fighting games like smash. Having variable roll distances could be neat. I like this idea, hoping to see it implemented next year!
 

OmegaSmash

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Apr 4, 2014
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For Mario Kart, I see the wheels being use for switching held items (if the bring that back and let you hold more than 2) and directing where the item would fall. Like dropping a banana to your side instead of just in front or the back.
 

Clefargle

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Nah, I'm not. But only having two face buttons does look kind of silly. I get that Nintendo's R&D team is trying to reinvent the should button once again, and they may use a screen with haptic feedback. Which may bring up some interesting new ideas to play with. But on the practical level, I hope the controller is not this minimalistic. I think they should stick too something a little more generic that would please third party publishers.
I think the Wii U and the N3DS are showing the evolutionary path the next controller will take. I'm guessing we get abxy, dual analog (top oriented, circle pads on the handheld), touch screen, Scroll L&R, and ZL ZR (maybe analog). Then add in newer versions of the motion stuff used in Splatoon, special haptic rumble, and the three home/start/select row.
 

PsionBolt

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Oct 24, 2012
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Scroll wheel shoulder buttons... Holy cow. How have I never thought of this? Replace L and R with a clicky mouse wheel. So simple, so smart.

A lot of people are talking about this on a controller, but much more exciting to me is how this could solve the ergonomics problem of multiple shoulder buttons on a handheld. A scroll wheel can be roughly the size of one normal shoulder button, but allows at least two extra inputs (scroll right and scroll left, in addition to click in). One on each side, and suddenly you have access to four more inputs without increasing the size of the device at all. And in a really intuitive, user-friendly form, too. That's amazing!

Haptic feedback stuff is whatever, though.
 

MCN

Banned
Sep 4, 2012
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I love how most of the responses in this thread are along the lines of "That's so obviously brilliant, how did nobody else think of this?"

Nintendo, folks.