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New Oboro Muramasa pics! 2D awesomeness! :o
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Valkyr Junkie
Member
GuardianE said:
I'm sure Reggie will do everything in his powers to prevent that.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Lyte Edge said:
Lyte Edge's Quote said:
If this is how you (or they) are playing the game and if this game is anything like Odin Sphere you (or they) are playing it very very wrong.
Kintaro said:I was going to say "Well, we know it looks good, but goes it play any good?" Then the impressions came and the game sounds pretty okay so far. Need to hear more.
It sounds just like Odin Sphere from the impressions.
GrotesqueBeauty said:
Level design in Odin Sphere and Grimgrimoire is about as important as level design in Advanced Wars.
Impressions (played a bit at a friend's house):
The game seems very linear at first, but as you play more and more the world opens up and starts to allow for more non-linear adventuring. Similar to the 2d metroid series in that areas which are inaccesible can later be opened up after beating someone or aquiring the correct item. When looking at the world map as a whole, there really is quite a bit of exploring for you to do.
The game gives you two modes to play the game as, the first mode focues more on RPG elements such as level increasing and weapon forging (which can be done at anytime so long as an enemy isn't present). The second option focuses on battles (and the difficulty is upped).
Each character has a totally different path through the game as well as different bosses.
There are challenge mini-boss arenas. They are these locked huts which require specfic objectives to be met before opening. Once inside, you fight...something. Works great to get exp. points and money. You get unlimited tries however.
At the end of most missions, you fight a huge-ass boss. They are not easy.
The game's action reminds me of a mix of 2d ninja gaiden, and goemon. Maybe go as far as to say a 2D Otogi. You have three main weapons with a health bar. Each weapon clash or block against attacks or projectiles causes a loss of weapon health. When the bar is depleted, the weapon breaks and if you're thrown back (unless you switch in time). If you DO switch in time, you do a special attack and continue fighting uninterrupted. Also, each weapon has different fighting characterisitics (speed, reach, combo, specials).
One cool thing about combat is that you can simply hold attack button down and use the dpad or analog stick for directional attacks. Works really well for chaining and juggling.
Back to forging weapons; it kicks major ass. The map shows you the current weapons you have and the paths they can take for upgrades. I think they're permanent though, so make sure you know what you're getting (we didn't).
ok, that's all I can think of.
The game seems very linear at first, but as you play more and more the world opens up and starts to allow for more non-linear adventuring. Similar to the 2d metroid series in that areas which are inaccesible can later be opened up after beating someone or aquiring the correct item. When looking at the world map as a whole, there really is quite a bit of exploring for you to do.
The game gives you two modes to play the game as, the first mode focues more on RPG elements such as level increasing and weapon forging (which can be done at anytime so long as an enemy isn't present). The second option focuses on battles (and the difficulty is upped).
Each character has a totally different path through the game as well as different bosses.
There are challenge mini-boss arenas. They are these locked huts which require specfic objectives to be met before opening. Once inside, you fight...something. Works great to get exp. points and money. You get unlimited tries however.
At the end of most missions, you fight a huge-ass boss. They are not easy.
The game's action reminds me of a mix of 2d ninja gaiden, and goemon. Maybe go as far as to say a 2D Otogi. You have three main weapons with a health bar. Each weapon clash or block against attacks or projectiles causes a loss of weapon health. When the bar is depleted, the weapon breaks and if you're thrown back (unless you switch in time). If you DO switch in time, you do a special attack and continue fighting uninterrupted. Also, each weapon has different fighting characterisitics (speed, reach, combo, specials).
One cool thing about combat is that you can simply hold attack button down and use the dpad or analog stick for directional attacks. Works really well for chaining and juggling.
Back to forging weapons; it kicks major ass. The map shows you the current weapons you have and the paths they can take for upgrades. I think they're permanent though, so make sure you know what you're getting (we didn't).
ok, that's all I can think of.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Lyte Edge said:And what would be the "right way?"
Kintaro said:
I've already explained it multiple times in this thread. Then again most of those posts are pretty old. In short the game is a tactical game with RPG elements instead of a action game with RPG elements. Now I haven't played this game but it seems similar to Odin Sphere. If so the game does to the action battle systems in JRPG's to what SRPG's did to the turnbased battle systems in RPG's or what Strategy games did to the battle scenes in RTS's. It takes those segments and makes the entire game like that.
Don't think of the levels' as you do in say Castlevania, there is a reason to as of why there is so little interactive points in the environments (at least in Odin Sphere I can't comment on this game) it's because they aren't made for platforming and exploring, they are made to be a giant arena (much of as of why games like Star Ocean and Tales of their battle maps on complete flat lands). That's why the maps are all flat, that's why you have a radar that only displays enemies and items throughout the whole map, because that is all you are suppose to be concentrating on.
Now the trick part is how the battle system works. In most games action battle systems, like say Star Ocean, the primary focus is just hitting the enemy instead of observing their movements and planning attack which only happens when something serious is going down, in Odin Sphere at least this is the main course. You have to constantly look where enemies are in the map so you can ambush them and plan what attacks to use, what to follow up with, and other strategies such as whether or not to lure them in and the likes. This is also why the combat systems are so simple and why leveling up is a few and far inbetween occurrence, because you are suppose to use your wit and strategy to overcome enemies instead of killer combos.
And no this isn't some "secret way" of playing it. It's how it was made.
Just look at RPGamer's, IGN's, and Gametrailers indepth reviews of the game.
Odin Sphere's gameplay wasn't shallow at all, actually it was quite deep, often a strong praise of the game from most sites that reviewed it. It was just that people were too busy grodging at the incredible graphics instead of trying to understand how to play the game (I mean if you'd just so much as read the mandatory tutorial and take time to comprehend how to play the game should be obvious).
So it shouldn't be just "right,right,right kill, kill,right right" but more so things should be all one motion (much like a battle arena in an action RPG).
rykomatsu
Member
for those that have played this, do you think it's worth grabbing a JPN Wii? Aside from this, the only other game(s) that interest me so far on the system are Fragile (I love Venus Project) and maybe Arc Rise...
enjoyed Odin Sphere, really dig the artwork for OM, and a fan of Momohime's VA too...
Can get a JPN system for about the same as a US console
enjoyed Odin Sphere, really dig the artwork for OM, and a fan of Momohime's VA too...
Can get a JPN system for about the same as a US console
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
rykomatsu said:
The game will be released in the West (both PAL and North America). And it would be far easier (and cheaper) just to get a homebrew program.
Flying_Phoenix said:
Thanks for that. It's obvious you haven't played the game. The enemies and items do not show up on the map screen like they did in Odin Sphere. You move forward and get surprise encounters with enemies, hence my (ACCURATE) first-level description of "move right, move right, kill enemies, move right, kill boss, go all the way back left, doing nothing, 'stage two'." Obviously the best way to play is to kill everything as fast as possible since you get graded on this. That's not the point I was making. It's still got a very basic combat system and repeats "rooms" over and over again; any other game that did not have such striking visuals and did this would be crucified on the spot. I was glad to see things started branching out after that initial first level, however, and am looking forward to playing more.
Look, the game is fun and it's not like I'm trashing it, but it's still a little too basic/repetitive in my eyes and I think that may disappoint people who had similar complaints about Odin Sphere. That's all.
rykomatsu said:
If you can't understand Japanese, you're going to miss out on the storyline. It's also pretty heavy on Kanji. I don't feel that my Japanese is strong enough to get everything out of the game, and if I didn't only have a Japanese Wii, I would have waited for the English release.
If you do get a J-Wii, I'd also suggest the Sengoku Basara 2/Heroes Double Pack and Tatsunoko Vs. Capcom.
Cygnus X-1
Member
Too bad this game will never come out in the west.
Cygnus X-1
Member
Lyte Edge said:
Sorry, but I'll be sure once I see more evidence. And an announce is not evident enough.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Lyte Edge said:
Don't misunderstand me. I never meant to make it sound like you were trashing or trolling the game. From what my impressions were from others it sounded like it played alot like Odin Sphere. I also addressed that I didn't play the game and was assuming it played like Odin Sphere due to impressions and read your post and was assuming that you probably started on the wrong foot. If what you say is true (I.E. Ambushing enemies instead of enemies appearing) then I think I may be pretty dissapointed with this game as basic action games tend to not entertain me.
Kintaro said:
Again from the previous impressions of others it seemed (with many stating) that it plays almost exactly like Odin Sphere but a tad bit more action focused. My mistake.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Mamesj said:
Read the post above you.
Saint Gregory
Member
Was the wall scroll a seperate pre-order bonus or does it come with every copy of the game? I checked both YesAsia and PlayAsia and neither site mentioned it at all. I had decided to wait on the US release but I loved the VA in the videos and figured I'd get a copy of the original just in case XSEED takes Japanese voices out.
Flying_Phoenix said:
Uh, it DOES play like Odin Sphere control-wise, and is more action-focused, but the RPG-style stuff you are talking about is not there, at least not in the action mode. You don't ambush enemies, either. It's more like a random encounter-style battle where you go to an area and the enemies all suddenly appear. Nothing shows up on the map. My biggest issue with this game so far is that looking at it as an action game, the controls are not as smooth as they should be. It feels like there is a slight delay when doing basic attacks, and I'm not a big fan of having jump mapped to up on the d-pad.
On the plus side, you can use any control set-up with the game, be it Wiimote/Nunchuck, Classic Controller, or GC controller.
Cygnus X-1 said:
Wow.
Lyte Edge said:
oh man...one of my biggest fears for the game is happening. I hated Odin Sphere's "hey, it looks and plays like an action game, but we're gonna put this annoying delay in controls to make it less actiony and less fun" style. Blocking in particular was useless since it takes about 2-3 seconds from hitting block to it actually happening.
I hope the reaction time for moves is at least a bit quicker than OS.
rykomatsu
Member
Lyte Edge said:
Native Japanese here so comprehension wouldn't be a problem
The repetitiveness that you mentioned might be a bit of a problem...do you know how long the game is? I've heard numbers ranging from 10~20hrs floating about which generally is shorter than most games I play...if it is indeed that short, then I might be able to get through it even w/ repetitive gameplay.Thanks for your input, though
MisterAnderson
Member
Is this a WiiWare game or retail?
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Lyte Edge said:
There are two modes for the game. Action Mode and another mode which is a RPG Mode. It was announced earlier in the thread. So maybe what I said could be present? (wishful thinking). But yeah keep giving impressions.
EDIT - Yeah there are two modes to the game.
"According to (our iffy translation of) Famitsu, Muramasa: The Demon Blade will be playable in two different modes: "Musou" and "Shura." Musou mode may be best-suited for fans of previous Vanillaware action-RPGs like Odin Sphere: it focuses on character leveling rather than action. Shura mode is all action, with less emphasis on strategy. We don't know how the modes differ mechanically, but it may be as simple as easier enemies in one mode and fewer character customization options in the other."
So I assume the mode you are playing is more action oriented, I'm not saying the game plays like how I assumed in the other mode, but if I'm not mistaken didn't you ask whether there were two modes or not and if so what were the differences a while ago?
Mamesj said:
The reason why the controls were laggy in Odin Sphere was because it wasn't an action game.
rykomatsu
Member
So I cheated a bit and for shits and giggles, tried OM out in Dolphin...surprisingly after a few tweaks, it worked. Played for about 30min and basically decided to buy the actual game regardless of how long/short it may be...trying to find someplace I can get the art scroll with the game (long shot probably). It's a real shame this game only did ~10k (i believe?) on day 1 with MMV coming out and saying they were way below expectation....56k I think was the target LTD sales.
Now just need to decide whether to get a US Wii and homebrew it or get a JPN Wii...
Now just need to decide whether to get a US Wii and homebrew it or get a JPN Wii...
ZealousD said:
Assuming he actually plans on buying it, I wouldn't blame him for pirating to demo it. The console really needs some kind of demo system in place for retail games. More than the 360 and PS3, it's games usually fall into the "aquired taste" category whenever they're skewed towards the hardcore.
Might I recommend Play-Asia btw. It's where my buddy imported his I think. I may do the same, but with the US version confirmed, I may make this part of a wii trifecta software pickup (Punchout and Excitebots are the other two).
vanguardian1
poor, homeless and tasteless
kinggroin said:
The console really wasn't designed to support demos like the mini-pc-ish 360 & ps3 were.
rykomatsu
Member
kinggroin said:
I don't own a wii atm and was deciding whether the game was worth getting a new console for or not so I came across an ISO "accidentally".
I'll probably go with PA if my friend or relatives can't find the first press ltd edition set and just buy the art scroll off ebay ($30 +~$15s/h off ebay...). btw this probably belongs in the homebrew thread, but since I'm already typing here...is there some way to identify if a unit in-store has the most recent update or not? or even with the newest update, is it only time before it can be homebrewed again?
vanguardian1
poor, homeless and tasteless
MightyKAC said:
It doesn't work quite like that.
I'm wiling to accept that you do not like the game, for whatever reason (what that reason is, I do not care -- to each their own), but he is correct in saying that it was not an action game. It was an RPG with action elements, but it was not an action game.Mamesj said:
It is an objective fact that I enjoyed the game regardless of what you said.
rykomatsu said:
There is no way to tell if your Wii has 4.0 firmware on it or not by looking at the box; however, the update was rather recent so I'd imagine that most retail Wii's don't have it. You'd also need a copy of twilight princess in order to install homebrew. And yes, it is just a matter of time before 4.0 can be homebrewed.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Mamesj said:
The controls were delayed to add more strategy to the game so it's just not slash, slash, slash, block, kill. It's the same reason why attack actions in games such as The Witcher have delays.
TheOneGuy said:
Thank you. Honestly people if you want your action sidescroller with exploration elements then go pick up the latest Castlevania. Don't complain about other games because they don't fit your taste.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
HK-47 said:
I assume this is directed at me, but my comments above aren't about Muramasa. And my earlier comments where based on impressions I heard from others. I already apologized for my previous actions, there's no reason to keep beating the horse.